Topics

Heavy Ten conversion to L00


wlw19958
 

Hi There,

I am going to convert/update a Heavy Ten (10R) to an L00 spindle.
I have the spindle and most of the parts I need but I need some
dimensions and some photos of the location of the wedge pivot
would be most helpful.

A couple of the questions I have are:
(1) Where is the location of the wedge pivot screw?
(2) What is the thickness of the spacer that goes under the wedge?
(3) Is the headstock casting spot faced under the spacer?

Thanks in Advance for any help anyone can provide.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


Jim V
 

just researched the L00 chuck.  I found this video which just might have a useful tip or 2



On Sunday, November 24, 2019, 08:56:48 AM CST, wlw19958 <wlw-19958@...> wrote:


Hi There,

I am going to convert/update a Heavy Ten (10R) to an L00 spindle.
I have the spindle and most of the parts I need but I need some
dimensions and some photos of the location of the wedge pivot
would be most helpful.

A couple of the questions I have are:
(1) Where is the location of the wedge pivot screw?
(2) What is the thickness of the spacer that goes under the wedge?
(3) Is the headstock casting spot faced under the spacer?

Thanks in Advance for any help anyone can provide.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


david.french@...
 

I don't have time at the moment to give exact dimensions; I will get dimensions within a day or two. Here are two photos. My Heavy 10 is currently apart after having the bed and saddle machined and fitted. Notice the how the pin provides a stop in the open position.



Dave in Lake Stevens WA


wlw19958
 

Hi There,

I appreciate the responses so far.  Jim, I'll check out the video
later.  I am experienced with mounting L00 chucks.  I have a
11" Logan and two Clausings with L00 spindles.  I have a
significant number of chucks that are L00 for those lathes and
it would be convenient if the South Bend could use them too.
Plus, up grading from the 1-7/8" X 8 tpi spindle to the larger
L00 will give me 5C collet capability too.

David, when you have a chance, if you could get some
measurements of the location of the pivot screw,  I would greatly
appreciate it.  Also, the height of the spacer would be nice too. 
A while back, I picked up a NOS wedge kit that is for the 13" through
16" SBL's so the spacer is too tall and so is the pivot screw (but
once I know the correct spacer height, I can figure the correct
dimensions for the pivot screw). 

Thanks Again for the Help!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


david.french@...
 

Hi Webb,

I've attached a sketch showing the location of the 0.250 dia steel pin and the attach screw that has a head diameter of 0.500 inches. I tried to measure from known features to make it easier to interpret (see the photo for detail). Notice that when the hook is pushed back and away from the spindle it sits on the pin, with the bottom of it parallel to the bottom of the headstock.

The thickness of the shim between the headstock casting and the hook is 0.300 inches. The casting surface does not appear to be faced around the pin or the screw, but I was not able to remove the screw to perform a detailed inspection. I was going to do a nice SolidWorks sketch for you except I am having issues with my latest license not installing properly.

Let me know if you need additional measurements or if you need help interpreting my sketch.

Dave


wlw19958
 

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the measurements!  I have the headstock
currently set-up on the mill  and I have been "eye-ballin'"
the placement of the fulcrum and pin from your pics.  I
figure that I will have the necessary holes drilled and tapped
later this evening.  I'll make the necessary adjustments to
my "eye-ball" set-up based on the information you supplied. 

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


david.french@...
 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


John Dammeyer
 

Could I perhaps ask a really dumb question.

I've got a South Bend Heavy 10L lathe.  Spindle is threaded for the chucks and faceplate.

 

What's an L00 and why convert?

 

Thanks

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of david.french@...
Sent: November-27-19 8:48 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


Steven H
 

Suggest you google ‘L00 lathe spindle nose’ and you will find chart with dimensions and a cross section. The chuck fits onto a male taper, is driven by a key, and there is a locking ring that gets secured on the back of the chuck with a spanner wrench. I think it allows the spindle to be run in reverse without fear of a chuck or faceplate coming loose as is the case with a plain threaded spindle nose.

Steve Haskell


On Nov 28, 2019, at 12:59 AM, John Dammeyer <johnd@...> wrote:



Could I perhaps ask a really dumb question.

I've got a South Bend Heavy 10L lathe.  Spindle is threaded for the chucks and faceplate.

 

What's an L00 and why convert?

 

Thanks

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of david.french@...
Sent: November-27-19 8:48 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


wlw19958
 

Hi There,

There have been several types of spindles developed to
mount tooling (chucks and faceplates) onto them.  The
earliest was the threaded type.  This type is straight
forward but has the disadvantage in that it can un-thread
if the spindle is rotated in the reverse direction.

To address this problem, there have been some different
spindle mounting systems, Type D - Camlock, Type A1 -
Short Taper, Type A2 - Short Taper and Type L - Long Taper.

Type D - Camlock seems to be the most popular of these
different types.  In my case, I own a couple other lathes
that have the Type L - Long Taper spindles.  In each type,
there are different sizes starting with L00 and go up to L3.

The chuck is drawn onto a large taper that centers the chuck
on the spindle and there is a longitudinal key that prevents the
chuck from slipping while on the spindle.  This allows the spindle
to turn in either direction without the risk of the chuck coming
loose.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


wlw19958
 

Hi Dave,

Here is the progress so far:

Thanks Again for the help!
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


John Dammeyer
 

Thanks for the link Steve.  I've seen those drawings before.  But I don't understand why the photos show that hook that pivots.  If the L00 just has a nut that is turned onto the threaded part of the chuck to pull the chuck tightly onto the taper, what's the hook for?

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of Steven H via Groups.Io
Sent: November-27-19 10:27 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Suggest you google ‘L00 lathe spindle nose’ and you will find chart with dimensions and a cross section. The chuck fits onto a male taper, is driven by a key, and there is a locking ring that gets secured on the back of the chuck with a spanner wrench. I think it allows the spindle to be run in reverse without fear of a chuck or faceplate coming loose as is the case with a plain threaded spindle nose.

Steve Haskell

 



On Nov 28, 2019, at 12:59 AM, John Dammeyer <johnd@...> wrote:



Could I perhaps ask a really dumb question.

I've got a South Bend Heavy 10L lathe.  Spindle is threaded for the chucks and faceplate.

 

What's an L00 and why convert?

 

Thanks

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of david.french@...
Sent: November-27-19 8:48 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


Guenther Paul
 

Why would one  waist all the this time to convert. I bean in machining over 50 years never had a chuck come of in reverse. Yes i machined in reverse many times never had a problem. The chuck was installed properly. 

GP


On Thursday, November 28, 2019, 1:27:31 AM EST, Steven H via Groups.Io <stevesmachining@...> wrote:


Suggest you google ‘L00 lathe spindle nose’ and you will find chart with dimensions and a cross section. The chuck fits onto a male taper, is driven by a key, and there is a locking ring that gets secured on the back of the chuck with a spanner wrench. I think it allows the spindle to be run in reverse without fear of a chuck or faceplate coming loose as is the case with a plain threaded spindle nose.

Steve Haskell


On Nov 28, 2019, at 12:59 AM, John Dammeyer <johnd@...> wrote:



Could I perhaps ask a really dumb question.

I've got a South Bend Heavy 10L lathe.  Spindle is threaded for the chucks and faceplate.

 

What's an L00 and why convert?

 

Thanks

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of david.french@...
Sent: November-27-19 8:48 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


ww_big_al
 

Interesting project. Wonder how you came up with the  idea to convert to a L00 spindle.

Al

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io <SouthBendLathe@groups.io> On Behalf Of wlw19958
Sent: Thursday, November 28, 2019 1:56 AM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Dave,

Here is the progress so far:

Thanks Again for the help!
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


wlw19958
 

Hi There,

Despite anecdotal tales to the contrary, threaded chucks do
come loose.  This is especially true if one has an instant
reversing motor.

To reiterate, for the third time, all my other working lathes have
L00 spindles.  Rather than buying more chucks, I decided to
convert this Heavy Ten over to L00 for uniformity.  Also, this
particular Heavy Ten is a 10R (with the 1-7/8" spindle) and
there is something wrong with the threaded end of the spindle.
Tooling doesn't want to thread on.  Also, the smaller 1-7/8"
spindle cannot take 5C collets. They used the smaller 2A
collets (max size 11/16").  The L00 has the larger spindle
through hole and can accept 5C collets (hence 10L).

If you are happy with your threaded spindle, by all means
keep using them.  I've owned over a dozen lathes in my
life and most had threaded spindles.  After using the L00
spindle for the last 20 years, I have a preference for them.
Remember, I'm doing this to please me and I don't care if
you don't agree.  You be happy with your threaded spindle
and I'll be happy with my L00.  That's all that matters.

I do thank Dave for going to the trouble of making the measurement
and taking pictures so that my conversion went as smoothly
as it did.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


Good Luck!


Guenther Paul
 

I never had a chuck come loose if they are seated properly. You are just wasting your energy. Its your lathe and if you like to install a more sure to you
Chuck fastening system go for it. You will also loose some bed working lenght.

GP


On Thursday, November 28, 2019, 10:24:44 AM EST, wlw19958 <wlw-19958@...> wrote:


Hi There,

Despite anecdotal tales to the contrary, threaded chucks do
come loose.  This is especially true if one has an instant
reversing motor.

To reiterate, for the third time, all my other working lathes have
L00 spindles.  Rather than buying more chucks, I decided to
convert this Heavy Ten over to L00 for uniformity.  Also, this
particular Heavy Ten is a 10R (with the 1-7/8" spindle) and
there is something wrong with the threaded end of the spindle.
Tooling doesn't want to thread on.  Also, the smaller 1-7/8"
spindle cannot take 5C collets. They used the smaller 2A
collets (max size 11/16").  The L00 has the larger spindle
through hole and can accept 5C collets (hence 10L).

If you are happy with your threaded spindle, by all means
keep using them.  I've owned over a dozen lathes in my
life and most had threaded spindles.  After using the L00
spindle for the last 20 years, I have a preference for them.
Remember, I'm doing this to please me and I don't care if
you don't agree.  You be happy with your threaded spindle
and I'll be happy with my L00.  That's all that matters.

I do thank Dave for going to the trouble of making the measurement
and taking pictures so that my conversion went as smoothly
as it did.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


Good Luck!


Bill in OKC too
 

I've been machining since 1973, with some gaps. Like 35 years, gap. But I'm pretty sure ONE TIME having a chuck spin off would be quite enough. ;)

I'm sort of planning, i.e., lightly thinking about, modifying my existing chucks to have lock screws at 120 degree angles from one another to lock the screw-on chucks in place. I'll need something to let me both angle and drill and index, which so far my shop lacks.

If I were to change a spindle, I think I'd go for the D-series spindle, just because such chucks are easy to find now. Though, if like the OP, I already had chucks of the long-taper type, it would make sense to go there.

YMMV, as they say.

Bill in OKC

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion,
butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance
accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders,
give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new
problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight
efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
LAZARUS LONG (Robert A. Heinlein)

On Thursday, November 28, 2019, 6:09:14 AM CST, Guenther Paul <paulguenter@...> wrote:


Why would one  waist all the this time to convert. I bean in machining over 50 years never had a chuck come of in reverse. Yes i machined in reverse many times never had a problem. The chuck was installed properly. 

GP


On Thursday, November 28, 2019, 1:27:31 AM EST, Steven H via Groups.Io <stevesmachining@...> wrote:


Suggest you google ‘L00 lathe spindle nose’ and you will find chart with dimensions and a cross section. The chuck fits onto a male taper, is driven by a key, and there is a locking ring that gets secured on the back of the chuck with a spanner wrench. I think it allows the spindle to be run in reverse without fear of a chuck or faceplate coming loose as is the case with a plain threaded spindle nose.

Steve Haskell


On Nov 28, 2019, at 12:59 AM, John Dammeyer <johnd@...> wrote:



Could I perhaps ask a really dumb question.

I've got a South Bend Heavy 10L lathe.  Spindle is threaded for the chucks and faceplate.

 

What's an L00 and why convert?

 

Thanks

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of david.french@...
Sent: November-27-19 8:48 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Webb,

Let us know how it turned out!

Dave


John Dammeyer
 

But what is the hook for?

John

 

 

From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of wlw19958
Sent: November-27-19 10:56 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

 

Hi Dave,

Here is the progress so far:

Thanks Again for the help!
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb


m. allan noah
 

The hook fills the space behind the take-up nut, so that it can be
used to push the chuck off when loosening.

allan

On Thu, Nov 28, 2019 at 11:51 AM John Dammeyer <johnd@autoartisans.com> wrote:

But what is the hook for?

John





From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On Behalf Of wlw19958
Sent: November-27-19 10:56 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00



Hi Dave,

Here is the progress so far:

Thanks Again for the help!
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

--
"well, I stand up next to a mountain- and I chop it down with the edge
of my hand"


John Dammeyer
 

Ah. So if you just loosened the nut you're still left with the chuck stuck onto the taper. If the hook is flipped up behind the nut then the nut can't move towards the headstock so it pushes the chuck towards the tailstock. And that releases it from the tape.
Got it!
Thanks
John

-----Original Message-----
From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On
Behalf Of m. allan noah
Sent: November-28-19 11:43 AM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00

The hook fills the space behind the take-up nut, so that it can be
used to push the chuck off when loosening.

allan

On Thu, Nov 28, 2019 at 11:51 AM John Dammeyer
<johnd@autoartisans.com> wrote:

But what is the hook for?

John





From: SouthBendLathe@groups.io [mailto:SouthBendLathe@groups.io] On
Behalf Of wlw19958
Sent: November-27-19 10:56 PM
To: SouthBendLathe@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] Heavy Ten conversion to L00



Hi Dave,

Here is the progress so far:

Thanks Again for the help!
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb



--
"well, I stand up next to a mountain- and I chop it down with the edge
of my hand"