Topics

my not so Rusty 'Ol Cross Slide-cross slide lock?


Dave
 

Good morning.
The saddle-apron-cross slide assembly is out of the electrolyte
bath, and on the surface anyway, is quite rust free! The cross slide is
still frozen on the compound rest and on the saddle. While I was trying
to free up the compound rest swivel-I found the two allen head lock
screws that keep it in place, loosened them, and with a few taps of a
hammer, loosened and lubed and it swivels freely.
There must be some kind of locking mechanism on the compound rest
to keep it from sliding on the swivel and a lock on the on the base
too, right? It's difficult to tell from the parts diagram in the Army
manual,but it looks like the screw on top of the compound rest base
bears down on the cross-feed screw and that locks it in place on the
saddle, or the screw in the graduated collar?
I don't see anything on the compound rest except a screw on the
collar.But it seems to me that the screw in the collar must be there to
zero it or adjust it so I'm utterly confused here.
Can anybody direct me to a better exploded parts view with a little
better explanation - like cross-feed travel locking nut maybe?:)
Dave


gorvil
 

--- In southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com, "Dave" <dkirk_4@y...> wrote:
Good morning.
The saddle-apron-cross slide assembly is out of the
electrolyte
bath, and on the surface anyway, is quite rust free! The cross
slide is
still frozen on the compound rest and on the saddle. While I was
trying
to free up the compound rest swivel-I found the two allen head
lock
screws that keep it in place, loosened them, and with a few taps
of a
hammer, loosened and lubed and it swivels freely.
These two screws ride on two pins with angled ends that clamp the
inverted cone shaped mounting spud of the compound. This is all
that holds the compound on the carriage. You will have to unscrew
them quite a ways for the pins to clear the wide part of the cone to
completely remove the compound.




There must be some kind of locking mechanism on the compound
rest
to keep it from sliding on the swivel and a lock on the on the
base
too, right? It's difficult to tell from the parts diagram in the
Army
manual,but it looks like the screw on top of the compound rest
base
bears down on the cross-feed screw and that locks it in place on
the
saddle, or the screw in the graduated collar?
I don't see anything on the compound rest except a screw on the
collar.But it seems to me that the screw in the collar must be
there to
zero it or adjust it so I'm utterly confused here.
Can anybody direct me to a better exploded parts view with a
little
better explanation - like cross-feed travel locking nut maybe?:)
Dave


ed beers
 

Dave,

First apply more kroil...

No lock.

There is a gib that takes out the slack on the dovetail. IIRC you have
9 and this is adjusted via set screws on the side of the compound. If
you can remove the set screws, you should be able to force the gib out
with a punch.

Have you managed to remove the lead screw for the compound? You should
be able to unscrew the entire dial assemble from the compound. A strap
wrench would help. Note that the lead screw must not be frozen to do
this since the dials mounting threads and lead screw have different
pitches.

Ed

On Sun, 2005-05-01 at 02:03, Dave wrote:
Good morning.
The saddle-apron-cross slide assembly is out of the electrolyte
bath, and on the surface anyway, is quite rust free! The cross slide
is
still frozen on the compound rest and on the saddle. While I was
trying
to free up the compound rest swivel-I found the two allen head lock
screws that keep it in place, loosened them, and with a few taps of a
hammer, loosened and lubed and it swivels freely.
There must be some kind of locking mechanism on the compound rest
to keep it from sliding on the swivel and a lock on the on the base
too, right? It's difficult to tell from the parts diagram in the Army
manual,but it looks like the screw on top of the compound rest base
bears down on the cross-feed screw and that locks it in place on the
saddle, or the screw in the graduated collar?
I don't see anything on the compound rest except a screw on the
collar.But it seems to me that the screw in the collar must be there
to
zero it or adjust it so I'm utterly confused here.
Can anybody direct me to a better exploded parts view with a
little
better explanation - like cross-feed travel locking nut maybe?:)
Dave





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ed beers
 

On Sun, 2005-05-01 at 22:51 +0000, Dave wrote:
--- In southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com, Ed Beers <sreeb@b...> wrote:
Dave,

First apply more kroil...

No lock.

Have you managed to remove the lead screw for the compound? >
Ed
Have not gotten the lead screw out. I assume you mean the screw
holding the ball crank onto the cross-feed screw, and not the cross-
feed screw itself?
I meant unscrewing the bushing from the cross slide.

Note that to do this you must be able to either move the slide or spin
the lead screw in the bushing.

Have you been able to remove the oiling screws on the cross slide? More
penetrating oil.

I don't want to be to pessimistic but if you are having this much
trouble disassembling it, it may be past saving...

Ed

I only have the Army manual to reference here so I
am not being a stickler for terminology, I just want to make sure I
understand exactly what you're talking about.( I haven't been able to
acces the newbie guide until just now. Kept coming up as file
translation error or something)
I think I know where the problem is now though. Probably the
bushing and the dial are frozen together and frozen into the slide
itself. More soaking.

I did get the swivel lock nuts out. The pins are still in there
though. I did manage to get a few of the screws out after I ground a
few screwdrivers for a tight fit. Thanks for that tip, made all the
difference( now I know what I was saving all those old screwdrivers
for:) )

Thanks very much for all the help! I have a pretty good idea what
to focus on now. I didn't want to force anything, just kept looking
for those lock nuts. So what keeps the cross slide and rest from
moving when you're cutting something?
The lead screws/nuts.


MUCH THANKS!!
Dave





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Dave
 

--- In southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com, Ed Beers <sreeb@b...> wrote:
Dave,

First apply more kroil...

No lock.

Have you managed to remove the lead screw for the compound? >
Ed
Have not gotten the lead screw out. I assume you mean the screw
holding the ball crank onto the cross-feed screw, and not the cross-
feed screw itself? I only have the Army manual to reference here so I
am not being a stickler for terminology, I just want to make sure I
understand exactly what you're talking about.( I haven't been able to
acces the newbie guide until just now. Kept coming up as file
translation error or something)
I think I know where the problem is now though. Probably the
bushing and the dial are frozen together and frozen into the slide
itself. More soaking.

I did get the swivel lock nuts out. The pins are still in there
though. I did manage to get a few of the screws out after I ground a
few screwdrivers for a tight fit. Thanks for that tip, made all the
difference( now I know what I was saving all those old screwdrivers
for:) )

Thanks very much for all the help! I have a pretty good idea what
to focus on now. I didn't want to force anything, just kept looking
for those lock nuts. So what keeps the cross slide and rest from
moving when you're cutting something?


MUCH THANKS!!
Dave


Dave
 

?

I meant unscrewing the bushing from the cross slide.

Note that to do this you must be able to either move the slide or spin
the lead screw in the bushing...

...I don't want to be to pessimistic but if you are having this much
trouble disassembling it, it may be past saving...

Ed
Could be past saving for tight tolerance work, but I was reading the
newbie FAQ last night and I notice it is a guide for " ressurecting" a
lathe, as opposed to say, just "restoring one". I think this definitely
falls into the former category. I did get one of the apron screws out,
the other one is still soaking. The Coumpound rest is off.It was loose,
I didn't want to pry anything until I was sure how it was held on there.
I think just more soaking,heat, percussion, and maybe another trip to
the electolyte bath, maybe not so much amperage this time.
Part of the headstock is turning freely, the Quill gear, just from
frequent oiling.
The bushing seems frozen in there, but with the compound rest off, I
can get oil in behind everything now.
Thanks again for all the help, knowing how it comes apart makes a BIG
difference. I'll try and keep these to a minimum, I think that FAQ
reminder might have been pointed in this direction!
Dave


scottimsjr@...
 

Dave, your resolution will result in the resurrection of this lathe.  Unless the bed is badly worn, it will be accurate.  Most everything else can be dealt with given your patience and perseverence. 


bdmail <bdmail@...>
 

Damn right !


Wow!



Bernie




Dave, your resolution will result in the resurrection of this lathe.  Unless the bed is badly worn, it will be accurate.  Most everything else can be dealt with given your patience and perseverence.  



pjwizr_1999 <pjwizr_1999@...>
 

Dave,

the compound swivel is held in place by a horizontal screw that bears
on a brass gib ( actually a set of 2 IIRC but this picture shows one,
squarehead type (http://www.lathes.co.uk/southbend9-inch/page4.html)),
the gib itself is completely hidden but is riding in a groove cut into
the (upper) moving part of the compound. if you remove these screws you
can usually jiggle the compound enough to get the gibs to back out
enough to let the compound come up out of the hole, then push the small
gib out backwards with a wire and make sure you place all the small
parts where they can be easily kept-track-of. if the compound swivels
you should be able to get this apart OK with some patience. this gib
and screw is about the only locking device the swivel has so be nice to
it. it works fine as long as you arent overtaxing it, and has been a
poorman's radius attachment if you know how to set up the tooling for
the cut and take care not to overdo it. the brass gib is replaceable
and generally refuses to beat up the circular dovetail but IMHO, its
never good to push your luck with parts that are a pain to replace.

the straight-line sliding actions of the compound and x-slide are
similar, there is a mating set of dovetail grooves - each set has a
flat gib that takes up the play by setting the pressure on a bank of
setscrews. if you take all these setscrews out ( for each gib) then the
slide should come apart freely. if it is still stuck you should be able
to tap it apart with a small hard plastic or brass hammer, at last
resort try to tap the gib out with a brass drift. if the gib is rusted
to either surface it may be very stubborn. lots of kroil, PB or
whatever you are using. be very careful with steel punches, the will
ding the cast iron easily.. it would be unusual for the gibs to be
frozen in place to both surfaces because there is almost always some
oil hiding in there. the more chips it packs in, the more oil is there
to shield from rust and water.

BTW, its no terrible crime if you wind up leaving the apron attached to
the saddle, if you can reach everything well enough to dismantle and
clean everything else on it just reassemble it and go to work. if th
ejoint is frozen that tight then it sure shouldnt be aproblem for
working with it. probably will free up some after kroil penetration and
use later.

that UK site mentioned above ( aka tony's lathe site) is a great one
for diagrams etc, gives some views not seen in the army manual. have
fun with it. lots of great stuff to enjoy there.




Ed Beers <sreeb@b...> wrote:
Dave,>
First apply more kroil...>
No lock.>
There is a gib that takes out the slack on the dovetail. IIRC you
have> 9 and this is adjusted via set screws on the side of the
compound. If> you can remove the set screws, you should be able to
force the gib out> with a punch.


Dave
 

--- In southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com, bdmail <bdmail@o...> wrote:
Damn right !


Wow!



Bernie




Dave, your resolution will result in the resurrection of this
lathe. Unless
the bed is badly worn, it will be accurate. Most everything else
can be dealt
with given your patience and perseverence.

Aww..shucks! Thanks for the vote of confidence.
The compound rest has now gone into a coffee can full of diesel fuel
for a nice soak. If this doesn't work I'm afraid I'm going to have to
try drilling the gib screws and applying a screw extractor. How long
a soak? Weeks or months?
Dave


gmdagena2000
 

Maybe you could try "PB Blaster". It is a liquid wrench like spray
that mechanics use to loosen frozen parts on cars. you can get it at
most auto parts stores, such as NAPA, Carquest. That stuff has been
real good. It works on most metals. Another thing mechanics use for
working out corrosion is called "ZEB 45" and I imagine it works
similarly. I've tried the kerosene/diesel route in the past and it
works wonders for packing grease, old grease and oil, but it doesn't
do much on corroded in parts.

On my Clausing, I'm finding straight muriatic acid to work fastest,
but it has a tendency to pit the parts if they are left in the acid to
long. Muriatic acid is Hydrocholoric Acid (HCl) and HCl is used in
the metalurgical fields to etch samples to reveal the grain.
Electrolysis is much gentler, but I'm finding that it to be less
effective on heavily rusted parts than muriatic acid.

At any rate, wouldn't drill unless I absolutely have to. I have never
had good luck with screw extractors, especially small ones.

-Gabe


Aww..shucks! Thanks for the vote of confidence.
The compound rest has now gone into a coffee can full of diesel
fuel
for a nice soak. If this doesn't work I'm afraid I'm going to have
to
try drilling the gib screws and applying a screw extractor. How long
a soak? Weeks or months?
Dave