Date   

Re: Collet ID

Brian Geffre
 

So I identified the type of collet I have.  Brown and Sharpe 21 emergency collets, all 73 of them.  Now, I would like to find a chuck to make these collets useful.  Is there a name for the chuck that could search under?  
Thanks for the help everyone.  


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Mark R. Jonkman
 

If you follow the link that I put up for Victor there is a breadcrumb at the top of the page (breadcrumbs are links that appear in a row, in this case home, drill.. , blank machinable arbors. Click on the blank machinable arbors link and that takes you to a page with all the information on the blank portion size for each different MT taper arbor.

mark


From: "Harley Schlinger old1940@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 5:03:28 PM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

Does anyone know the Dimensions "Diameter" of blank portion of the "2 MT to Blank Machine able Arbor" from Victor, Glad to hear the Quality is usually good from Victory, has anyone had any experience with "All industrial tool Supply" and there Quality of tooling been? 

Harley



From: "'Jim B.' btdtrf@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 12:09 PM
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder [1 Attachment]

 
[Attachment(s) from Jim B. included below]
I have been holding off posting, because I did not want to steal anyone’s thunder.
Attached is a photo of three die holders I made some  8 years ago, now. The two on the right use “Repurposed” MT-2 shanks, as suggested by Phillip Polk.
The black one is actually a Drill holder. It was designed to clamp on a drill shank when inserted. 8mm I think. I just needed to turn a stub on the holder.
The one on the far left uses a ”Store bought” shank as suggested by Mark J.
I did not know that Victor Tools sold them. I do use Victor a lot. Quality is usually good.
 
Jim B.
 
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2016 6:40 PM
To: southbendlathe@...
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 
 
I found a box full of bushing burnishing tools on the internet and bought them , they were #2 Morse and are machinable , and my creativity made use of them. it was a very inexpensive source for #2 shanks. 
'
 

To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:43:57 +0000
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 
 
Hey Bob
 
While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:
 
 
just in case that is more suitable for your task. 
 
I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.
 
Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast.
www.avast.com




Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder [1 Attachment]

Harley Schlinger
 

Does anyone know the Dimensions "Diameter" of blank portion of the "2 MT to Blank Machine able Arbor" from Victor, Glad to hear the Quality is usually good from Victory, has anyone had any experience with "All industrial tool Supply" and there Quality of tooling been? 

Harley



From: "'Jim B.' btdtrf@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 12:09 PM
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder [1 Attachment]

 
[Attachment(s) from Jim B. included below]
I have been holding off posting, because I did not want to steal anyone’s thunder.
Attached is a photo of three die holders I made some  8 years ago, now. The two on the right use “Repurposed” MT-2 shanks, as suggested by Phillip Polk.
The black one is actually a Drill holder. It was designed to clamp on a drill shank when inserted. 8mm I think. I just needed to turn a stub on the holder.
The one on the far left uses a ”Store bought” shank as suggested by Mark J.
I did not know that Victor Tools sold them. I do use Victor a lot. Quality is usually good.
 
Jim B.
 
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2016 6:40 PM
To: southbendlathe@...
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 
 
I found a box full of bushing burnishing tools on the internet and bought them , they were #2 Morse and are machinable , and my creativity made use of them. it was a very inexpensive source for #2 shanks. 
'
 

To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:43:57 +0000
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 
 
Hey Bob
 
While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:
 
 
just in case that is more suitable for your task. 
 
I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.
 
Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast.
www.avast.com



Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Jim B. <btdtrf@...>
 

I have been holding off posting, because I did not want to steal anyone’s thunder.

Attached is a photo of three die holders I made some  8 years ago, now. The two on the right use “Repurposed” MT-2 shanks, as suggested by Phillip Polk.

The black one is actually a Drill holder. It was designed to clamp on a drill shank when inserted. 8mm I think. I just needed to turn a stub on the holder.

The one on the far left uses a ”Store bought” shank as suggested by Mark J.

I did not know that Victor Tools sold them. I do use Victor a lot. Quality is usually good.

 

Jim B.

 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2016 6:40 PM
To: southbendlathe@...
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

I found a box full of bushing burnishing tools on the internet and bought them , they were #2 Morse and are machinable , and my creativity made use of them. it was a very inexpensive source for #2 shanks. 

'

 


To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:43:57 +0000
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

Hey Bob

 

While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:

 

 

just in case that is more suitable for your task. 

 

I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.

 

Sincerely

Mark R. Jonkman

This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast.
www.avast.com


About Neil's Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder photo tutorial

Jack Jennings
 

Neil,

Just some loud applause on the quality of your photo tutorial from a guy who knows how much time and effort it takes to do a really clear and technically complete job like this.  Your pictures are great!  Captions clear.  A terrific job and model for others to attempt to achieve.  Only comment - Numbering filenames helps, but because of the manner that the photo section jumbles photos, a number in the caption would make it a little easier to follow the sequence.

Could you share the secrets of your shadowless lighting technique?   Looks to me as if you are either working under a very large lighting tent or bouncing your illumination from large white selective surface above your lathe!

Jack Jennings


On Jan 6, 2016, at 3:44 AM, SOUTHBENDLATHE@... wrote:

 Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
   Posted by: "Neil Butterfield" neilbfield@... neil85020
   Date: Tue Jan 5, 2016 6:52 pm ((PST))

I just posted 28 photos entitled “TURNING MT2 SIMPLE PROCEDURE” showing an aluminum block made to fit my compound for aligning the compound precisely to the axis of your lathe at the correct angle for turning a #2 Morse Taper, a Jacobs taper or whatever taper you want. The Compound Block is used with a sine plate or an existing taper that you duplicate. Most of the Morse tapers I turn are too long for the stroke of my compound but I just turn what I can and then move the apron  and complete the taper finishing up with a file and emery. Old time machinists did it this way 100 years ago. Don’t get all worked up about the accuracy and fit required of a MT shank. Most of our MT arbors are jammed into the tailstock quill and they don’t even turn, the quill just holds the shank, and usually accurately enough for whatever operation you’re preforming. 

Jacobs tapers are a piece of cake because they are so short. I prefer using a sine plate and jo blocks to set my angle rather than trying to copy an existing taper.

Neil Butterfield


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Neil Butterfield <neilbfield@...>
 

Very good suggestion. I’ll certainly do that next time. Always amazing the goods ideas that come up when you show how you perform an operation.

Neil B.

 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2016 7:47 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: RE: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

Excellent processes and documentation.
I suggest one change to process. Rather than cutting the taper beginning at the tang with second cut at the head or large end, reverse the process to cut the tang end last, or even just the diameter appropriately and straight cut the remaining tang end portion. The change should remove any flaw or step in the second machining operation. Head end is far more functional than tang end regarding grip in taper and any flaw in concentricity.


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

rjitreeman0909@...
 

Excellent processes and documentation.
I suggest one change to process. Rather than cutting the taper beginning at the tang with second cut at the head or large end, reverse the process to cut the tang end last, or even just the diameter appropriately and straight cut the remaining tang end portion. The change should remove any flaw or step in the second machining operation. Head end is far more functional than tang end regarding grip in taper and any flaw in concentricity.


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

oscar kern <kernbigo@...>
 

this what i use in the tailstock to turn a taper


On Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:52 PM, "'Neil Butterfield' neilbfield@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]" wrote:


 
I just posted 28 photos entitled “TURNING MT2 SIMPLE PROCEDURE” showing an aluminum block made to fit my compound for aligning the compound precisely to the axis of your lathe at the correct angle for turning a #2 Morse Taper, a Jacobs taper or whatever taper you want. The Compound Block is used with a sine plate or an existing taper that you duplicate. Most of the Morse tapers I turn are too long for the stroke of my compound but I just turn what I can and then move the apron  and complete the taper finishing up with a file and emery. Old time machinists did it this way 100 years ago. Don’t get all worked up about the accuracy and fit required of a MT shank. Most of our MT arbors are jammed into the tailstock quill and they don’t even turn, the quill just holds the shank, and usually accurately enough for whatever operation you’re preforming.
 
Jacobs tapers are a piece of cake because they are so short. I prefer using a sine plate and jo blocks to set my angle rather than trying to copy an existing taper.
 
Neil Butterfield
 
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2016 1:44 PM
To: southbendlathe
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 
 
Hey Bob
 
While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:
 
 
just in case that is more suitable for your task. 
 
I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.
 
Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: "mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]" <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...>
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:26:29 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 
 
It will have to be tomorrow (Wed) as I just read the email now. I'll set  a reminder on my phone to go grab it when I get home.
 
Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: "Robert Blodinger w4npx@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 3:42:17 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 
 
 
Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.
 
I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.
 
Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.
 
Thanks again,
 
Bob
 
I
 
2
 

On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:
 
 
 
Hey Bob
 
One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 
 
Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.
 
I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.
 
Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder
 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.
I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.
The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end
I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.
I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.
My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.
I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.
 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.
So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.
Bob
 
.

 
 
 
 
 
 



Re: Southend Fourteen, fixed speed.

Mark R. Jonkman
 

Alex

If you can match the wiring diagrams I posted previously you will find that there may be several fuses in the path. It may be as simple as one of the fuses being blown. In the diagrams I have the fuses are identified by a number and FU so 1FU, 2FU, etc.

Of the two 1969 diagrams I posted one has only 1 fuse and the other shows 3 fuses on the other diagram. All are on the Speed increase/decrease circuit.

I've had several people mention that a rotary phase converter will kick out a higher voltage one leg. One gentleman I talked to while I was buying my Fourteen mentioned he blew out fuses and other electronics on one of his machines when the higher leg was connected to a particular input line on his machine. 

If it turns out to be a fuse then I would double check to see if 1L1 happens to have higher voltage then the other input legs. If that is the case then change it to 1L2 would be my best guess, then change the fuse and try again. On all the diagrams 1L1 and 1L3 make up the single phase circuit that controls the speed reducer motor. Therefore if you have a high leg setting it in through 1L2 would have it go direct to the main motor. 

However, I'm not an electronics or electrical expert. There are far smarter and more capable folks on this list that might be able to interpret these diagrams better and give you a more knowledgeable response on rotary phase converters etc. I could be totally blowing smoke out of my butt so to speak. I'm going by what a gentleman told me happened to him with one leg of a rotary phase converter causing stuff to blow out on some machine or other he had plugged into it because of that. 

What you did not say was whether you test ran this machine before you brought it home. And whether at that time the machine properly increased or decreased in speed. If that was the case that all controls worked perfectly before purchase then its more plausible that a fuse or something blew out when plugged in to your power system. Also if  you did test things out before bringing home, was the power used proper 3 phase power (utility power) or generated 3 phase (rotary or static phase converter)?

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "Latheman latheman2@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 7:01:50 PM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Southend Fourteen, fixed speed.

 

"Perhaps Ted (lathe man) might know more."
The older FOURTEEN has an access panel in the rear of the bench(backside)

Ted

> On Jan 5, 2016, at 8:58 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] wrote:
>
> Perhaps Ted (lathe man) might know more. Honestly I can only go by what my Fourteen has and the diagrams that I have access to.



Posted by: Latheman <latheman2@...>


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Neil Butterfield <neilbfield@...>
 

I just posted 28 photos entitled “TURNING MT2 SIMPLE PROCEDURE” showing an aluminum block made to fit my compound for aligning the compound precisely to the axis of your lathe at the correct angle for turning a #2 Morse Taper, a Jacobs taper or whatever taper you want. The Compound Block is used with a sine plate or an existing taper that you duplicate. Most of the Morse tapers I turn are too long for the stroke of my compound but I just turn what I can and then move the apron  and complete the taper finishing up with a file and emery. Old time machinists did it this way 100 years ago. Don’t get all worked up about the accuracy and fit required of a MT shank. Most of our MT arbors are jammed into the tailstock quill and they don’t even turn, the quill just holds the shank, and usually accurately enough for whatever operation you’re preforming.

 

Jacobs tapers are a piece of cake because they are so short. I prefer using a sine plate and jo blocks to set my angle rather than trying to copy an existing taper.

 

Neil Butterfield

 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2016 1:44 PM
To: southbendlathe
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

Hey Bob

 

While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:

 

 

just in case that is more suitable for your task. 

 

I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.

 

Sincerely

Mark R. Jonkman

 


From: "mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]" To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:26:29 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

It will have to be tomorrow (Wed) as I just read the email now. I'll set  a reminder on my phone to go grab it when I get home.

 

Sincerely

Mark R. Jonkman

 


From: "Robert Blodinger w4npx@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 3:42:17 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

 

 

Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.

 

I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.

 

Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.

 

Thanks again,

 

Bob

 

I

 

2

 


On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:

 

 

 

Hey Bob

 

One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 

 

Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.

 

I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.

 

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman

 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.

I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.

The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end

I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.

I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.

My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.

I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.

 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.

So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.

Bob

 

.


 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: Southend Fourteen, fixed speed.

sblatheman
 

"Perhaps Ted (lathe man) might know more."
The older FOURTEEN has an access panel in the rear of the bench(backside)

Ted

On Jan 5, 2016, at 8:58 AM, mark.jonkman@comcast.net [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Perhaps Ted (lathe man) might know more. Honestly I can only go by what my Fourteen has and the diagrams that I have access to.


Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

phillip <pepolk@...>
 

I found a box full of bushing burnishing tools on the internet and bought them , they were #2 Morse and are machinable , and my creativity made use of them. it was a very inexpensive source for #2 shanks. 
'



To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:43:57 +0000
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

Hey Bob

While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:


just in case that is more suitable for your task. 

I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:26:29 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

It will have to be tomorrow (Wed) as I just read the email now. I'll set  a reminder on my phone to go grab it when I get home.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "Robert Blodinger w4npx@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 3:42:17 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 


Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.

I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.

Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.

Thanks again,

Bob

I

2


On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:

 


Hey Bob

One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 

Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.

I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.

I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.
The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end
I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.
I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.
My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.
I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.
 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.
So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.
Bob

.












Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Mark R. Jonkman
 

Hey Bob

While I'd like to get rid of that  #2MT 1/2-20 arbor, you might also want to take a look at:


just in case that is more suitable for your task. 

I'll bring the the arbor to work tomorrow, give me a call if/when you decide to come to town.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:26:29 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 

It will have to be tomorrow (Wed) as I just read the email now. I'll set  a reminder on my phone to go grab it when I get home.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "Robert Blodinger w4npx@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 3:42:17 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 


Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.

I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.

Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.

Thanks again,

Bob

I

2


On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:

 


Hey Bob

One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 

Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.

I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.

I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.

The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end

I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.

I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.

My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.

I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.

 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.

So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.

Bob


.








Re: Southend Fourteen, fixed speed.

Mark R. Jonkman
 

Not sure how to get access to the Reeves drive on your machine. On my lathe the area of the stand in front of the bed is held on with a row of button head caps crews along the top and bottom of the plate. This can be seen in the first illustration of:


However, in the 1969 parts diagram:


This does not appear to be the case - at least it doesn't show the same panel being removed.

I would have to believe that either the back or the front of that stand in front or behind the bed would have to come off to access the Reeves drive because you need to be able to setup the limit switches on the Reeves drive and you have zero access because its on the other side of the motor and transmission.

Using 
page 11
The copy is ugly but the vantage point of the photo seems to be from behind and it appears to be the older (or at least different) Reeves drive motor system. There most be some kind of panel that comes off the back to give access.

Perhaps Ted (lathe man) might know more. Honestly I can only go by what my Fourteen has and the diagrams that I have access to.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "Alex Sanchez alex@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Monday, January 4, 2016 9:12:15 PM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Southend Fourteen, fixed speed.

 

I left all the wiring intact, I didn’t want to start making changes before I powered it up.

Where is the Reves Drive and how do you access it ? 
I am assigning that is a to “other end of the motor, unfortunately I have no way to access it, the from and rear panels on my lathe are not removable or I haven’t been able to figure how to do it .

On Jan 4, 2016, at 7:33 PM, 'm. allan noah' kitno455@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:


There is a little motor that drives the open/close mechanism in the reeves drive. For some reason, that motor or its electrics seem to be fragile. You will have to dig into it.

allan

On Mon, Jan 4, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Alex Sanchez alex@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:
 

 
I finally got my Lathe running, unfortunately the Increase/Decrease speed buttons don't work, it runs a a constant speed , approx 420 RM in low gear and a bit over 4000 in high gear. Any ideas ? 

The tach is constant at approx 450RPM
Lathe is running on a rotary 5HP PhaseCraft converter with a 5HP idler motor.




Disclaimer

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the recipient(s). If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute, copy or alter this email. Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and might not represent those of the company. Warning: Although the company has taken reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this email, the company cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the use of this email or attachments.





-- 
"well, I stand up next to a mountain- and I chop it down with the edge of my hand"




Disclaimer

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the recipient(s). If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute, copy or alter this email. Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and might not represent those of the company. Warning: Although the company has taken reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this email, the company cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the use of this email or attachments.




Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Mark R. Jonkman
 

It will have to be tomorrow (Wed) as I just read the email now. I'll set  a reminder on my phone to go grab it when I get home.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman


From: "Robert Blodinger w4npx@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]" To: "southbendlathe"
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 3:42:17 AM
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 


Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.

I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.

Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.

Thanks again,

Bob

I

2


On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:

 


Hey Bob

One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 

Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.

I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.

I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.

The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end

I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.

I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.

My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.

I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.

 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.

So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.

Bob


.







Re: on bed design.

Gregg Eshelman
 

On 1/5/2016 1:17 AM, john kling jkling222@yahoo.com [SOUTHBENDLATHE] wrote:


Looking at pictures of Hardinge lathes that have what looks somewhat
like a wide flat bed, I see that they have angles on both the front and
back side. In a sense this like having a single inverted V - with
several inches of metal where the peak would otherwise be. So I will
take the Hardinge off of the precision flat bed lathes. I have seen
pictures of 1900 Drummond lathes with a tube type bed. The pictures do
not reveal a slot in the "tube" - which I assume must be there to make
any sense as a design.
Before Hardinge went to the dovetail bed they used a flat bed with outward sloping sides and a slot down the middle. Commonly called a split bed. The exact same profile was used on at least two other makes of lathe so accessories are interchangeable.

The split and dovetail bed lathes mostly do not have any kind of a conventional saddle/carriage or any type of leadscrew or power feed. Accessories like cross slides or compound slides are movable along the bed but get locked in place while in use.

The lathes are intended to work on small areas of the workpiece. When they do threading, it's with an attachment that does thread chasing with a follower on a master thread mandrel, usually mounted on the left end of the spindle. Thus they cannot do things like cut long tapers or very long threads. Nor can they easily make full length turning cuts for doing things like rounding rough stock. Usually they're fitted with collets in the spindle for starting with smooth stock.

Some of the Hardinge lathes with dovetail bed have power feed, and the most desirable HLV-H model can also do threading without a chaser attachment. Their earliest dovetail bed lathes were essentially the same as the split beds with a different profile on top. Same accessories but also altered for the dovetail. Some accessories for the split bed had removable alignment blocks that could be swapped for ones to fit the dovetail.


Re: on bed design.

eddie.draper@btinternet.com
 

Round bed Drummonds have a slot at the bottom of the tube, and the leadscrew is inside it.  There always seem to be a few on ebay UK.  Probably controversial, but I'd put them in the category of "exhibit" rather than "tool" nowadays, although it is fair to say that a great many were made and sold and doubtless did good work.  Many had treadle drive.  My first lathe work was on a later flat bed Drummond.  Drummond eventually were bought out by Myford.

Eddie




From: "john kling jkling222@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: "SOUTHBENDLATHE@..."
Sent: Tuesday, 5 January 2016, 8:17
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] on bed design.

 
Looking at pictures of Hardinge lathes that have what looks somewhat like a wide flat bed, I see that they have angles on both the front and back side. In a sense this like having a single inverted V  - with several inches of metal where the peak would otherwise be. So I will take the Hardinge off of the precision flat bed lathes. I have seen pictures of 1900 Drummond lathes with a tube type bed. The pictures do not reveal a slot in the "tube" - which I assume must be there to make any sense as a design.



Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

eddie.draper@btinternet.com
 

I made a centre to fit the headstock on our Broadbent 18" centre height (that's 36" in American) x 10' between centres Broadbent using the compound slide on the Colchester Triumph 2000 (about 7.5" centre height).  I turned between centres without setting the tailstock over.  I had to have 2 bites at it to get the length of travel, but I removed a layer of metal between the 2 ends I was working on, so it contacts on the 2 end sections only, over about 3" each end.  I blued and wobbled and kept adjusting the compound till it was right.  This involved a lot of running backwards & forwards between the 2 lathes carrying a c20kg lump.  I have no idea what the actual angle was.  The component diameter was between 4 & 5 inches.  The last whisker was taken off with emery cloth.  I made a drawbar to secure it in place, since it sticks out a long way for specific jobs, and this enabled me to put the point on while it was in situ on the Broadbent.  The actual point is a grade 10.9  24mm bolt locknutted in place, and this means I can unscrew it and fit an even longer point when turning a set of wheels (carefully!) which have a double crankpin + return crank and eccentric crank for a loco with outside valve gear.  A light trim of the point is made each time this change is made.

My point is:  Forget trying to set accurately by calculation, calculate somewhere near, then fiddle with it till it's right.  Maybe make a chuck-away soft piece first to achieve the set up.  Maybe make several once it's set.  Morse & other tapers can have a non contacting gap in the middle.  (And yes, I do happen to have MT2 & 3 reamers in the cupboard in case a taper slips.)

Eddie




From: "john Losch johnlosch32@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE]"
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Cc: john Losch
Sent: Tuesday, 5 January 2016, 1:11
Subject: Re: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 
1/4/16

to all,

I agree with the procedure Lou has posted below.  I wrote a similar description of making tapers a few days ago, and I later discovered an error in what I wrote.  The compound travel is insufficient for most of the primary lengths of Morse, B&S, Jarno, and whatever that are used in our SB and similar other lathes of comparable sizes.  I made the collet closer I use in my 9SB longer ago than I want to remember, and I am still using it.  The taper length for a Morse #3 is shorter on a closer than for a conventional Morse taper.  I think the testing procedure I suggested for final fitting of tapers using Prussian blue is advisable.  

I continue to make tapers to fit an ancient Waltham tool maker’s lathe that came out of the Waltham Watch Factory, as well as tapers for a German Watchmaker’s jeweling tailstock of unknown origin, both of which are still in use in my shop.   The technique is fine for any tapers of less than 2.5” long.  That is the travel of the compound on my SB 9” lathe.  I apologize if I misled readers: you will not be able to make a full-length Morse or similar taper using the compound to turn that length.  No problem with shorter tapers.

Lou’s suggestion about moving the carriage and then trying to recover the depth of cut on a longer taper might work.  I have never tried it.  Has anyone else “been there, done that?"

Jcl





On Jan 4, 2016, at 6:51 PM, Lou McIntosh lhm@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:


I've learned a lot from reading this discussion, and I'm grateful for all these posts.

Having said that, http://littlemachineshop.COM part number 2394 costs $13 and might be a useful starting point for MT2 projects ...

and I've had good luck cutting MT2 and MT3 by chucking and centering a "known good" piece and adjusting the compound until an indicator at exact center height can remain within 1 or 2 tenths while the compound is cranked from one end of its range to the other.

... I don't use tailstock set-over on anything finicky because my tailstock stops being coincident with spindle
axis as soon as I unlock it or advance it.  Learned this on 22" lathes at work, but it's just as valid on my SB9.  

... I make accurate taper cuts with the compound because it is so much quicker to set up than tailstock set-over, and the limitations on accuracy are (1) the limitations of my indicator and (2) how accurately I can set my indicator (and later, my cutting tool) to actual axis height over ways.  

... I'm lazy, and I can do this compound setup faster than I can fool around with tailstock set-over.

...  Q.  So, what if length of taper exceeds compound travel?

...  A.  Fiddle with the cross slide until tool is again in contact with work;  at least I know that my taper setting is still correct, even when saddle is moved.

... EVERYONE's mileage offends, so I apologize to everyone who doesn't think this post is useful.  I'll still use it because I don't know any better. 












Re: Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

Robert H. Blodinger
 

Mark, you always wind up with great solutions.  I thought something was wrong when I setup the .070 offset but should have followed thru after the first couple of cuts.  Jim B's idea if fine but my piece is already tapered and I would have to start from scratch again.  Looks like you win.  I will be in town tomorrow but not till mid afternoon and will give you a call.  Hope this gets to out  in time to bring one of those Threaded MT 2 pieces with you, no problem if it is the next day.

I may have screwed up tonight as I made a bad guess using a formula for set over when you know the length of the total part and the diameter of each end of the tapered part, now have about. .9 or so left on the big end and down to .72 on the small end, but my taper was too much. I decided I better quit and do it your way.

Hopefully your threaded pieces have threads I have a tap for, or guess I can take the threads off and bore the end of a rod and lock title them on so the whole thing is exactly positioned and the same length as my half finished part.

Thanks again,

Bob

I

2


On Jan 4, 2016, at 10:50 AM, mark.jonkman@... [SOUTHBENDLATHE] <SOUTHBENDLATHE@...> wrote:

 

Hey Bob

One option might be to carefully measure your current workpiece and determine the current taper per foot based on the offset you used. Then calculate out how much less or more needs to be offset to get the correct offset and adjust accordingly. Like others have said the offset has everything to do with the length of the workpiece. If you take light cuts and if you have enough stock left to remove you can probably get a good match with a few adjustments. 

Another option might be to buy a #2 morse taper arbor with a  threaded end on it. Then either use the thread to attach the tool holding part or turn it off and use just the stub to connect to your tool holding portion.

I bought a couple of #2 morse taper arbor with a half inch thread on them (I think it was half inch thread) a couple of years ago from Victor Tool Exchange for something like $8 each (or something like that).  Since I sold my Heavy 10 two weeks ago I'll probably never use them. If you want one for say $5 let me know I can meet you on the downtown mall at lunch one day this week.

Sincerely
Mark R. Jonkman
 

From: SOUTHBENDLATHE@... [mailto:SOUTHBENDLATHE@...]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 3:18 AM
To: SOUTHBENDLATHE@...
Subject: [SOUTHBENDLATHE] Help needed to cut MT 2 taper for Tailstock Die Holder

 I am making a Tailstock  Tap and Die Holder with feel from a Homeshop Machinist article March-April 2015 article.

I have started to cut the MT 2 Taper.  The taper is over a length of 2.803 inches.

The article advises a Tailstock set over of .070.  I carefully centered the Tailstock with a coaxial indicator ( and I know that it was already cutting exactly on center as the 1.5 inch piece I was cutting from had just been reduced from 1 11/16 in and tas true it's whole length.  I am cutting between centers.  I first cut a half in long tang half in wide at the tail end

I checked the math of the article and came up with exactly .070 for the set over (forward ).  With an indicator on a drill Chuck in the Tailstock I moved the Tailstock forward .070 and started to reduce the 1.5 in stock up to a shoulder about 3 inches from the beginning of the taper.

I reduced the width at the Tailstock small end of the taper down to .8445 an then measured at the 2.803 station large end and found that it was down to. .893, a difference from the small end of only .0485.

My goal was to reduce the small end down to .572 per MT2 specs to get the large end at the 2.803 station of .700 as per MT2 specs, a difference over the 2.803 inches of .128.

I realized then that I must have a problem because I was getting close to my final size and figured something was wrong as I was not going to be able to get there when so close and still only a difference between the two ends of of only .0485.

 I again checked the set over and it is right on .070, also the marks on the Tailstock showing set over measure .070 apart.

So do I have a problem, and if so what do I do to get the taper correct and hopefully save the part before I go too far.

Bob


.



Re: on bed design.

john kling
 

Looking at pictures of Hardinge lathes that have what looks somewhat like a wide flat bed, I see that they have angles on both the front and back side. In a sense this like having a single inverted V  - with several inches of metal where the peak would otherwise be. So I will take the Hardinge off of the precision flat bed lathes. I have seen pictures of 1900 Drummond lathes with a tube type bed. The pictures do not reveal a slot in the "tube" - which I assume must be there to make any sense as a design.

9981 - 10000 of 105750