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Re: Carbide Bids
BOB WRIGHT
I use carbide 99% of the time on my 10K and i don't run it any faster or change the feed rate but thats just how i do it. I ran carbide inserts for 8 years on an 1899 18" lathe the same way and it ran production 8 hrs a day 5 days a week. So expeirment and see what suits you best...Bob
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Re: Carbide Bids
Gene Horr
I'm guessing that you haven't used carbide before on this lathe. If
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this assumption is not correct then ignore this post <g>. Carbide works best with a heavy cut and a machine that can produce a lot of force. It is really for mass production in larger machines. For the lighter/smaller machines plain old HSS actually works best for most people. Gene
On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 11:25 AM, "Scrubby" <steamlocoengr@...> wrote:
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Re: Carbide Bids
Rich Dean <toolman8@...>
Brian,
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you don't give much info, but if the tools are similar to what I got, 1/4" IC triangle unmarked imported, they are indeed junk. For 1" cold rolled steel, 1/4 tips are too small and fragile. Also they are hard to find metric sizes. The biggest problem is the holders have only one shoulder to retain the insert. In use the tiny clamp screw cannot hold the insert steady and it walks around. Inserts are ready to use, but can be reground a little. Diamond is really the only way. The cut must be at least near the tip radius in depth and run at higher speeds than HSS. I gave up on the holders and made my own 2 sided pocketed ones with a decent screw. Found loads of the inderts on Feebay for cheap. Still 1/4" inserts are very fragile for heavy work. -=RichD=- "Scrubby" wrote:
I just bought some 1/4" carbide tool cutter bits from Enco and I'm not having any luck in turning. I'm using a straight bit holder that is level with the bed, not the 16 1/2 degree holder and I just can't turn at all with these Enco bits. Do they have to be ground more with the green grinding wheel for the correct angels? I'm assuming that these $30.00 bits from Enco are ready to use. What RPM should I be using when turning 1" stock?
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Re: Carbide Bids
Michael Schetterer <finegrainmetal@...>
Well, carbide certainly thrives under obscene SFPM and healthy feeds, but it doesn't need them. I've used a wide variety of carbide, from El Cheapo brazed to super-duper polycoated inserts, under a wide variety of DOC, feed, and SFPM. I just finished a job opening a bore to 2", with carbide, taking .0005" DOC cuts at the end, at modest SFPM (OK, it was 1144SP :-) ).
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I think it has more to do with geometry than material. Carbide can "take the heat" of a serious cut in steel at wicked speeds, but not if the edge is sharp. So, a blunt edge is desirable for high MRR. But, a blunt edge is a problem if you're going for a nice finish on smudgy materials like 1018 or A36. Now, if you set up for a healthy DOC and feed with a brazed insert, you're going to run into a new problem -- long, jagged-edged, hot swarf wrapping itself all over everything. What a nighmare! Make sure you don't reach in there and try to clear those nasty stringers, as you WILL slice yourself. If you want to go down this road, PLZ look into inserted carbide with a proper chipbreaker that breaks up the stringers into little curly-Q's. Regards. Mike To: southbendlathe@... From: btdtrf@... Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 12:52:56 -0500 Subject: RE: [southbendlathe] Carbide Bids First: Did you buy the Enco Brand or “Made in the USA”? Enco brand stuff is less than desirable. Second Carbide needs a deep cut and a high rate of RPM. Set your lathe on fastest RPMS and take at least 1/32” depth of cut. 1/16 is better.
Jim B.
From: southbendlathe@
Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 12:26 PM To: southbendlathe@ Subject: [southbendlathe] Carbide Bids
I just bought some 1/4" carbide tool cutter bits from Enco and I'm not having any luck in turning. I'm using a straight bit holder that is level with the bed, not the 16 1/2 degree holder and I just can't turn at all with these Enco bits. Do they have to be ground more with the green grinding wheel for the correct angels? I'm assuming that these $30.00 bits from Enco are ready to use. What RPM should I be using when turning 1" stock?
Brian Get gifts for them and cashback for you. Try Bing now.
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Re: Carbide Bids
w keith griffith
Boy,,, the initial message sounded more like the tool is above center and rubbing instead of cutting. I use carbide inserts, and some no name brazed bits and seem to do ok even at really odd slow speeds and fine cuts. So,,, turn off the lathe, and trap a steel rule between the cutting point of the tool bit and the material that's chucked up ready for turning. Somewhere there's a nice picture of this,,, but the rule should be vertical. If you raise the tool bit above center,,, the rule top will lean away from you, if you lower the tool bit below center the rule will lean into you. Once you trap the rule,,, look from the tailstock toward the chuck,,, you'll see what I mean about the rule leaning. If you really look,,, if the tool bit is above center very much, it's possible to see the front face of the tool, and not the point actually in contact with the material you want to turn. Then all it does is just "skid" instead of cutting.
-----Original Message-----
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Re: Carbide Bids
Jim B. <btdtrf@...>
First: Did you buy the Enco Brand or “Made in the USA”? Enco brand stuff is less than desirable. Second Carbide needs a deep cut and a high rate of RPM. Set your lathe on fastest RPMS and take at least 1/32” depth of cut. 1/16 is better.
Jim B. From:
southbendlathe@... [mailto:southbendlathe@...] On Behalf Of "Scrubby"
I just bought some 1/4" carbide tool cutter bits
from Enco and I'm not having any luck in turning. I'm using a straight bit
holder that is level with the bed, not the 16 1/2 degree holder and I just
can't turn at all with these Enco bits. Do they have to be ground more with the
green grinding wheel for the correct angels? I'm assuming that these $30.00
bits from Enco are ready to use. What RPM should I be using when turning 1"
stock?
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Re: Carbide Bids
Scott McGrath <mcgrath@...>
For carbide the work needs to run much faster than HSS so check your speeds you'll find that there are separate speed recommendations for HSS and Carbide. A Machinery Handbook is a good starting place
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"Scrubby" wrote:
I just bought some 1/4" carbide tool cutter bits from Enco and I'm not having any luck in turning. I'm using a straight bit holder that is level with the bed, not the 16 1/2 degree holder and I just can't turn at all with these Enco bits. Do they have to be ground more with the green grinding wheel for the correct angels? I'm assuming that these $30.00 bits from Enco are ready to use. What RPM should I be using when turning 1" stock?
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Carbide Bids
Brian
I just bought some 1/4" carbide tool cutter bits from Enco and I'm not having any luck in turning. I'm using a straight bit holder that is level with the bed, not the 16 1/2 degree holder and I just can't turn at all with these Enco bits. Do they have to be ground more with the green grinding wheel for the correct angels? I'm assuming that these $30.00 bits from Enco are ready to use. What RPM should I be using when turning 1" stock?
Brian
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Re: Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
Stephen Arnold <sarnold@...>
I agree with Ed. Bigger fans can be acquired from electronic surplus houses for cheap. I bought a 5” 240V AC fan that hooks right into a VFD control point so that the fan is running whenever the motor is running regardless of speed. The fan cost me <$20 and I fashioned a baffle out of a new (empty) plastic paint can purchased at the local hardware store for <$5. That fan moves a LOT of air, 100% of it through the motor (more than the integral fan does) so that I can run the motor pretty darn slow. I have been somewhat cavalier with the 3 phase motor since it cost me “only” $75 and was brand new at the time. I have run it from effectively stall (<20 rpm) all the way up to 110% of its rated speed. Torque is a problem at the lower end of that speed range – not much to work with. The squealing belt lets me know when I am pushing the limits too far.
Steve A
From:
southbendlathe@... [mailto:southbendlathe@...] On
Behalf Of eng4turns
This comment is intended for those who are
trying to get by for the least amount of money or to use what you got and is
not intended to be a recommendation for the technically "best" way to
do it. Now that the disclaimer is done:
--- In southbendlathe@...,
"jdoerp" wrote:
> > You might consider buying a new or used 1 HP motor that is rated by the motor manufacturer as an inverter duty motor. They typically have much better and higher temperature rated insulation that will stand up to the high carrier frequency used by the inverter to reduce noise or hum. Typically you would not want to operate below 30 Hz. or half speed for extended periods as the motors cooling fan is turning slower and will not cool as well. Then you need to decide if your motor and drive combination is going to be an older V/f type or a cutting edge sensorless vector control type. Most new drives can be configured as either V/f or vector control. A few Google searches on VFD motor drives will provide plenty of reading information and learning opportunities. > > John > > --- In southbendlathe@..., "whitey" wrote: > > > > You will Love it. Whitey > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: All Thumbz > > To: southbendlathe@... ; southbend10L@... > > Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 5:11 PM > > Subject: [southbendlathe] Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor > > > > > > > > In order to use a VFD for control, I'm contemplating replacing the reliance 115V motor that came with my 10L, contacter and push button switch box with a 220V 3 phase motor that is controlled by a VFD that converts my 220V 1 phase house current to 220V 3 phase output. > > > > Would a motor such as this one work? It seems to be the correct HP (.75) and speed for my 1970's H10L. > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/South-Bend-Lathe-Heavy-10-Motor-and-Frame-Assembly_W0QQitemZ280401895133QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4149415edd > > > > > > Nelson > > >
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Re: Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
eng4turns
This comment is intended for those who are trying to get by for the least amount of money or to use what you got and is not intended to be a recommendation for the technically "best" way to do it. Now that the disclaimer is done:
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
If you want to go with a VFD but already have a 3-phase motor you want to use or do not want to oversize your VFD and/or motor to account for overheating at low speeds or overheating due to harmonics, then you can use an electronics muffin fan to assist with your motor cooling. Set it up at the bell end so that it blows in the same direction as the motor's fan. It should be big enough make a difference, get the 5" fan, not the little 2" or 3" ones. They can be had in everything from low voltage DC up to 120VAC. I use them for cooling my VFD enclosures, complete with air filters to keep the shop dust out. Ed in Florida
--- In southbendlathe@..., "jdoerp" <ok3fan@...> wrote:
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South bend 9" for sale
bartholomewrichard949
Hallo,
I am posting this for an elderly friend who doesn't have a computer. He wishes to sell his very clean SB complete with two chucks, faceplate, 1/2hp motor, etc, etc. He lives in Cheshunt just north of London near the M25. Please contact me for further details, Thanks, Richard (01842-819969 - Evenings)
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Re: Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
All Thumbz <im_all_thumbz@...>
--- On Mon, 12/7/09, Jim B. wrote:
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Re: Newbie Here
Rusty <thebrassbasher@...>
Bob:
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Thanks so much for the info. Rusty
--- In southbendlathe@..., "Bob Wright" <aametalmaster@...> wrote:
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Re: Newbie Here
BOB WRIGHT
Well your sn means its a 1962 9"...Bob
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--- In southbendlathe@..., "Rusty" <thebrassbasher@...> wrote:
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Re: Thread Cutting Oil
Brian
Thanks Rich for the info. I'll get the right cutting oil and I'll reduce the size of the tip alittle.
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Brian
--- In southbendlathe@..., Rich Dean <toolman8@...> wrote:
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Newbie Here
Rusty <thebrassbasher@...>
I just acquired a used (new for me) lathe. it is a South Bend 9 inch. the serial number is 49730NKX9. All I know is that the serial number is suppose to mean something. i brought it home and immediately discovered that the lathe has running problems. It has a start/stop push button switch with a speed control dial. It is a GE Statortrol DC motor with a large control box mounted between the cabinet under the head stock where the motor is and the three drawers that are to the right. It barely turns over when the flat bet tensioner is engaged. The head stock pulleys are free turning and so is the jackshaft underneath. When I take off the A belt from the motor pulley it spins just fine. Not knowing what I really am doing i decided to order a new Baldor 1/2 HP motor. i also ordered a new drum switch from McMaster-Carr
I think I got a decent deal for the money though. It has a Aloris AXA with 6 tool holders that has never been used. A new turret that goes where the tail stock goes and has not yet been set up, no holes in the big hex where the tooling goes. I did get a normal tail stock. 5 each 3C collets in 1/32 Hardinge (they were new). Also a set of RSB in 1/16 inch up to 1/2 inch, used but look okay. In researching the internet I think that these are called RedArrow by SouthBend, they do have an arrow going through all the letters. I also received Armstrong tool holders but no wedges, They have a 1/2 inch wide opening. I did get a lot of armstrong 1/4 inch tool holders though. One of the drawers on the cabinet is missing part of the lock assembly. I had the inside part with the latch but not the lock with the tumbler or the outside knob. I just bought 3 of the knurled knobs on eBay and I only need one of them. I will be putting the other two back up on eBay after I receive them. What I need is the keyed tumbler that goes inside the lock. I would also like to know something about what I have. I decided that I have had it with the Chinese import junk. I have a bench top drill press that just about jumps off the bench every time I turn it on. Every thing, and I mean every thing on the machine is out of balance really bad. Rusty
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Re: Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
jdoerp
You might consider buying a new or used 1 HP motor that is rated by the motor manufacturer as an inverter duty motor. They typically have much better and higher temperature rated insulation that will stand up to the high carrier frequency used by the inverter to reduce noise or hum. Typically you would not want to operate below 30 Hz. or half speed for extended periods as the motors cooling fan is turning slower and will not cool as well. Then you need to decide if your motor and drive combination is going to be an older V/f type or a cutting edge sensorless vector control type. Most new drives can be configured as either V/f or vector control. A few Google searches on VFD motor drives will provide plenty of reading information and learning opportunities.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
John
--- In southbendlathe@..., "whitey" <whanson@...> wrote:
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Re: A tale of two center gages or don't buy junk! [2 Attachments
Jim B. <btdtrf@...>
From: southbendlathe@... [mailto:southbendlathe@...] On Behalf Of viajoaquin@...
Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 7:59 PM To: southbendlathe@... Subject: Re: [southbendlathe] A tale of two center gages or don't buy junk! [2 Attachments
Oh boy! You can lead a horse to water but...
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Re: A tale of two center gages or don't buy junk! [2 Attachments
viajoaquin@...
Oh boy! You can lead a horse to water but...
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Who is HHIP so I can avoid them? Thanks to your post about Wholesale Tool having 15% off on 11/30 I got some decent hex and square 5C collets. They were the same Chinese crap everybody else sells but cheaper. (Even Shars!) They must draw from different suppliers because I got boxed ones like from Enco and I got the ones in the red cylinders like from Grizzly as well as the square plastic container, a silver box and one in a ziplock bag! BakoRoy
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim B. <btdtrf@...> To: southbendlathe@... Sent: Mon, Dec 7, 2009 4:39 pm Subject: [southbendlathe] A tale of two center gages or don't buy junk! [2 Attachments] I wanted to grind a threading tool for Whitworth/BSF threads. I needed a 55 degree center gage. Now this s not a tool you use every day. I looked in the MSC BIJ book and they had a made in the USA one, Starrett I think, for around $20 plus shipping. I looked on eBay for a few days but none showed up. I suppose I could have waited. I found a cheepie both at ENCO and at HHIP. I decided to order the HHIP one at $3.55 since I have not ordered from them lately. I was disappointed in the last order. When it came I was disappointed again. The gage was poorly made (Made in China). Just stamped out, barely tumbled and the markings were poor. A few days later I found another one at "Victor Machinery Exchange" It appeared, from the picture, to be much better quality. It was $4.50. I thought I would try again. It arrived today. To some extend the quality was better, nicely finished, hardened and stainless steel, made in India. But the design is faulty. The scales, usually used to measure TPI's are metric. The Whitworth/BSF threads are INCH!!!!. There is no way they will match up with the metric scale which makes that feature useless. Then there is the chart of double depths, these are for American Standard 60 degree threads not the Whitworth 55 degree threads. Useless again! There is an attachment showing the two gages together, front and back. Well so far, with shipping I have paid as much as it would have cost to get the Starrett in the first place and I am still not happy. Yes both are usable and in fact I finished grinding the tool with the very crummy one from HHIP. Second attachment. It's just that I keep doing this. Spending good money for imported crap with which I am not happy. Every time I do I promise never again and then go and break my promise. Jim B. ------------------------------------ -- Web: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/southbendlathe/ More pix: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SouthBendLathePix/ Newbie guide: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SouthBendLathePix/ Files area FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/southbendlathe/files/SouthBendLatheFAQ.html Post: mailto:southbendlathe@... Email Moderators: mailto:southbendlathe-owner@... * * * * * Manage your subscription by sending a blank message as follows: Unsubscribe: southbendlathe-unsubscribe@... Stop delivery: southbendlathe-nomail@... Daily digest mode: southbendlathe-digest@... Individual emails: southbendlathe-normal@... Yahoo! Groups Links
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Re: Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
Jim B. <btdtrf@...>
You would be paying a premium for the 10L parts that come with it that you already have. In addition the shipping to my house, not far from yours, is $ 235, Look here: https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2009120718405829&item=10-2384&catname=electric $100 plus $41.55 shipping Or https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2009120718405829&item=10-2385&catname=electric
$113 plus $43.15 Now I am not sure about the shaft size you need. They are both 5/8 but 7/8 motors are available.
Jim B.
From: southbendlathe@... [mailto:southbendlathe@...] On Behalf Of All Thumbz
Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 7:11 PM To: southbendlathe@...; southbend10L@... Subject: [southbendlathe] Want to change to 220V - 3 phase motor
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