Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips #bluepill #stm32 #arm #morsecodetutor


David Leckie
 
Edited

Hi
I have built up an MCT and its working fine. Thats not the problem.
I programmed it using a UART.

Now when I bought the Blue Pill board I bought 2 (one spare)
Anyway another amateur wanted MCT so I first checked all OK with loading blink then put the MCT software onto my spare Blue Pill.  All OK

As I now had no Blue Pills I ordered some more.
These have just arrived and I cannot get them to go into program mode.
Power up the board in "run" mode.
Red LED continious and green flashing so far so good.
Pwr down.
Swap program jumper
PWR up
Press reset
And the green LED does not go out.
When I try to upload I get an error message.  "Failed to init device."
I have tried this with 2 new boards both times the same.
I never had this problem with the old boards.

Now I came across this https://www.cnx-software.com/2020/03/22/how-to-detect-stm32-fakes/

So I got a magnifying glass out and checked.
The MPU is labeled CS32F103C8T6
I then checked the sales advert and it says STM32F103C

The genuine one is labelled STM32F103C

Has anyone else have boards with the CS32F103C8T6 chip.
If so do they work?
Are there fake or clones appearing that do not work?

Thoughts?  Help?

73

dave
GM4NFI


Jim Pruitt
 

How do you read that chip?  No matter how I turn it or which way the light is pointing I can't see the letters, even under a 4x magnifier or a 10x microscope! I even tried taking a picture of it but still no way to read the lettering on the chip.

Thank you.

Jim Pruitt
WA7DUY


On 4/8/2020 9:07 AM, David Leckie wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Hi
I have built up an MCT and its working fine. Thats not the problem.
I programmed it using a UART.

Now when I bought the Blue Pill board I bought 2 (one spare)
Anyway another amateur wanted MCT so I first checked all OK with loading blink then put the MCT software onto my spare Blue Pill.  All OK

As I now had no Blue Pills I ordered some more.
These have just arrived and I cannot get them to go into program mode.
Power up the board in "run" mode.
Red LED continious and green flashing so far so good.
Pwr down.
Swap program jumper
PWR up
Press reset
And the green LED does not go out.
When I try to upload I get an error message.  "Failed to init device."
I have tried this with 2 new boards both times the same.
I never had this problem with the old boards.

Now I came across this https://www.cnx-software.com/2020/03/22/how-to-detect-stm32-fakes/

So I got a magnifying glass out and checked.
The MPU is labeled CS32F103C8T6
I then checked the sales advert and it says STM32F103C

The genuine one is labelled STM32F103C

Has anyone else have boards with the CS32F103C8T6 chip.
If so do they work?
Are there fake or clones appearing that do not work?

Thoughts?  Help?


--
Jim Pruitt
WA7DUY


David Leckie
 

Hi Jim

With a good light and a magnifying glass my four  pretty easily read.
Definitely reads CKS32F103C8T6.

And below the CKS logo.

I have done some searching and these are clones with issues.

I then had a close look at the advertiser's photo.  The chip is clearly labelled STM32F103C.
Using a genuine photo to sell a fake!

73

Dave
GM4NFI


David Leckie
 

Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?

73
Dave
GM4NFI
Fake STM32F103C by CKSGenuine STM32F103C


Joshua Blanton
 

I don't think they're exactly fakes, so much as they're Chinese microcontrollers that share many features from the STM32 (for ease of programming, and almost certainly ease of design). The seller definitely misrepresented the boards that you bought, though! I have seen several reports of inexpensive STM32 boards being populated with these parts, or the GD32 parts, instead of real STMicro components... The easiest path would be to get a refund on those boards and get some with real ST parts; otherwise you'll need to find or write a functional bootloader for the CKS parts.

Good luck!
Josh, KB8NYP


On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 07:16 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:
Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?


David Leckie
 

Hi

 

Yes I suppose “fake” is not the correct word as they are not labelled “STM” but CKS.   But they were sold as STM versions. 

 

Yes I have started the refund process with eBay.  I bought them without the pins soldered and had to solder them in before use. 

Hence what I am returning has been taken out of its original packaging and “modified”.  Hope they don’t argue.

 

I have ordered some more which the seller says are genuine.

 

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-STM32-Blue-Pill-STM32F103-STM32F103C8T6-72Mhz-Dev-Kit-Board-Module-UK/254324313050?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

 

Many thanks for the advice

73

Dave

GM4NFI

 

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joshua Blanton
Sent: 09 April 2020 15:06
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

I don't think they're exactly fakes, so much as they're Chinese microcontrollers that share many features from the STM32 (for ease of programming, and almost certainly ease of design). The seller definitely misrepresented the boards that you bought, though! I have seen several reports of inexpensive STM32 boards being populated with these parts, or the GD32 parts, instead of real STMicro components... The easiest path would be to get a refund on those boards and get some with real ST parts; otherwise you'll need to find or write a functional bootloader for the CKS parts.

 

Good luck!

Josh, KB8NYP

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 07:16 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?


jjpurdum
 

Dave:

If you bought them on eBay, I'm sure they'll be accepted. Also, if you used PayPal, you can also complain to them if you have problems. I find them to be very good about processing complaints against a vendor.

Jack, W8TEE

On Thursday, April 9, 2020, 11:10:20 AM EDT, David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:


Hi

 

Yes I suppose “fake” is not the correct word as they are not labelled “STM” but CKS.   But they were sold as STM versions. 

 

Yes I have started the refund process with eBay.  I bought them without the pins soldered and had to solder them in before use. 

Hence what I am returning has been taken out of its original packaging and “modified”.  Hope they don’t argue.

 

I have ordered some more which the seller says are genuine.

 

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-STM32-Blue-Pill-STM32F103-STM32F103C8T6-72Mhz-Dev-Kit-Board-Module-UK/254324313050?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

 

Many thanks for the advice

73

Dave

GM4NFI

 

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joshua Blanton
Sent: 09 April 2020 15:06
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

I don't think they're exactly fakes, so much as they're Chinese microcontrollers that share many features from the STM32 (for ease of programming, and almost certainly ease of design). The seller definitely misrepresented the boards that you bought, though! I have seen several reports of inexpensive STM32 boards being populated with these parts, or the GD32 parts, instead of real STMicro components... The easiest path would be to get a refund on those boards and get some with real ST parts; otherwise you'll need to find or write a functional bootloader for the CKS parts.

 

Good luck!

Josh, KB8NYP

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 07:16 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?


jjpurdum
 

Dave:

BTW, you can install a bootloader on a "blank" STM. This is a pretty complete explanation:


Jack, W8TEE





On Thursday, April 9, 2020, 11:28:17 AM EDT, jjpurdum via groups.io <jjpurdum@...> wrote:


Dave:

If you bought them on eBay, I'm sure they'll be accepted. Also, if you used PayPal, you can also complain to them if you have problems. I find them to be very good about processing complaints against a vendor.

Jack, W8TEE

On Thursday, April 9, 2020, 11:10:20 AM EDT, David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:


Hi

 

Yes I suppose “fake” is not the correct word as they are not labelled “STM” but CKS.   But they were sold as STM versions. 

 

Yes I have started the refund process with eBay.  I bought them without the pins soldered and had to solder them in before use. 

Hence what I am returning has been taken out of its original packaging and “modified”.  Hope they don’t argue.

 

I have ordered some more which the seller says are genuine.

 

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-STM32-Blue-Pill-STM32F103-STM32F103C8T6-72Mhz-Dev-Kit-Board-Module-UK/254324313050?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

 

Many thanks for the advice

73

Dave

GM4NFI

 

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joshua Blanton
Sent: 09 April 2020 15:06
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

I don't think they're exactly fakes, so much as they're Chinese microcontrollers that share many features from the STM32 (for ease of programming, and almost certainly ease of design). The seller definitely misrepresented the boards that you bought, though! I have seen several reports of inexpensive STM32 boards being populated with these parts, or the GD32 parts, instead of real STMicro components... The easiest path would be to get a refund on those boards and get some with real ST parts; otherwise you'll need to find or write a functional bootloader for the CKS parts.

 

Good luck!

Josh, KB8NYP

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 07:16 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?


David Leckie
 

Hi Jack

 

I just came across this see  below which we do all the time with the genuine boards. 

 

I was not sure where the default bootloader “lives” but it seems to be hard coded and not installed after manufacture.

 

With a new board I normally use the USART method once to check that “blink” works then upload the Arduino boot loader as so far I have not come up against memory limitations due to the Arduino bootloader size.

I wonder do the CKS “look a likes” not have a hard coded bootloader or a different bootloader.

 

The fact that they have the CKS logo makes me think they are not bad copies but just different.

 

73

 

Dave

GM4NFI

 

Using STM32's Serial Bootloader

All STM32 ARM chips contain a hard-coded bootloader that allows them to be programmed via USART1.

Note: Espruino boards have a USB implementation of the STM32 bootloader protocol built in. Do not follow these instructions unless you want to overwrite the bootloader.

Wiring Up

USART1 is usually on pins PA9 (TX) and PA10 (RX) of the chip itself, and it is 3.3v TTL level. If you have an:

  • Espruino board, you'll have to use a USB-TTL converter and connect directly to the pins. 
  • STM32DISCOVERY board, you'll have to use a USB-TTL converter and connect directly to the pins. 
  • Maple/Olimexino board, you'll have to use a USB-TTL converter and connect to either the pins marked TX1 and RX1, or D7(TX) and D8(RX) on the Olimexino.
  • 'HY' board, you don't have to do much at all - they have a USB-TTL converter onboard, and it is connected to USART1.

Enabling the Bootloader

To get into the bootloader, you need to reset the device with the BOOT0 pin set to 1, and  BOOT1 set to 0:

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of jjpurdum via groups.io
Sent: 09 April 2020 16:28
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

Dave:

 

If you bought them on eBay, I'm sure they'll be accepted. Also, if you used PayPal, you can also complain to them if you have problems. I find them to be very good about processing complaints against a vendor.

 

Jack, W8TEE

 

On Thursday, April 9, 2020, 11:10:20 AM EDT, David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi

 

Yes I suppose “fake” is not the correct word as they are not labelled “STM” but CKS.   But they were sold as STM versions. 

 

Yes I have started the refund process with eBay.  I bought them without the pins soldered and had to solder them in before use. 

Hence what I am returning has been taken out of its original packaging and “modified”.  Hope they don’t argue.

 

I have ordered some more which the seller says are genuine.

 

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-STM32-Blue-Pill-STM32F103-STM32F103C8T6-72Mhz-Dev-Kit-Board-Module-UK/254324313050?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

 

Many thanks for the advice

73

Dave

GM4NFI

 

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joshua Blanton
Sent: 09 April 2020 15:06
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

I don't think they're exactly fakes, so much as they're Chinese microcontrollers that share many features from the STM32 (for ease of programming, and almost certainly ease of design). The seller definitely misrepresented the boards that you bought, though! I have seen several reports of inexpensive STM32 boards being populated with these parts, or the GD32 parts, instead of real STMicro components... The easiest path would be to get a refund on those boards and get some with real ST parts; otherwise you'll need to find or write a functional bootloader for the CKS parts.

 

Good luck!

Josh, KB8NYP

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 07:16 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Here a macro photos of the two chips. Left hand is the fake. Right is genuine and working in my MCT.

Is anybody else come across these fake chips that will not go into programming mode?


Joshua Blanton
 

Hello Dave,

The internet seems to indicate that the UART loader works as expected on those parts - but it seems that at least some of the boards had a too-large value for the BOOT0 pull-up that wouldn't properly put the part in loader mode. I don't know if it's worth the effort, but you could check the voltage on the BOOT0 pin after jumpering it to 1...

Good luck,
Josh, KB8NYP


On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 11:48 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Hi Jack

 

I just came across this see  below which we do all the time with the genuine boards. 

 

I was not sure where the default bootloader “lives” but it seems to be hard coded and not installed after manufacture.

 

With a new board I normally use the USART method once to check that “blink” works then upload the Arduino boot loader as so far I have not come up against memory limitations due to the Arduino bootloader size.

I wonder do the CKS “look a likes” not have a hard coded bootloader or a different bootloader.

 

The fact that they have the CKS logo makes me think they are not bad copies but just different.


David Leckie
 

Hi Josh

 

Thanks for the info.  I have already posted them all back to the supplier for an eBay refund on the grounds that they were sold with a picture of a genuine STM32F103C MPU.

I have ordered boards from another supplier who says he checks his boards before he puts them out to customers – mind you his boards are a fair bit more expensive.

I had a genuine STM board and it went into program mode fine.  When I repeated exactly the same procedure with these boards they would not enter program mode.

 

Changing a tiny SMT pull up resistor is just a bit beyond my skill level. 

 

73

Dave

GM4NFI

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joshua Blanton
Sent: 10 April 2020 23:35
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

Hello Dave,

 

The internet seems to indicate that the UART loader works as expected on those parts - but it seems that at least some of the boards had a too-large value for the BOOT0 pull-up that wouldn't properly put the part in loader mode. I don't know if it's worth the effort, but you could check the voltage on the BOOT0 pin after jumpering it to 1...

 

Good luck,

Josh, KB8NYP

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020, 11:48 David Leckie <djcleckie@...> wrote:

Hi Jack

 

I just came across this see  below which we do all the time with the genuine boards. 

 

I was not sure where the default bootloader “lives” but it seems to be hard coded and not installed after manufacture.

 

With a new board I normally use the USART method once to check that “blink” works then upload the Arduino boot loader as so far I have not come up against memory limitations due to the Arduino bootloader size.

I wonder do the CKS “look a likes” not have a hard coded bootloader or a different bootloader.

 

The fact that they have the CKS logo makes me think they are not bad copies but just different.


Tom, wb6b
 

Hi,

Here is a video on using the GD32F103, boot loaders and such. And he mentions a CK chip, also. If your ST-Link will not recognize the chip, to allow you to flash a boot loader. Or the built in UART boot loader (BOOT 0 jumper enabled, requiring a USB to TTL adaptor) does not work with your programming software, then that is a big issue. The CS sounds like yet another clone chip. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE8-DCMXzo8

The story is there was a schematic circulated around the internet that almost all the Blue Pill boards are based on, that showed a 10K pull-up resistor on the D+ line of the USB connector. Many computers have USB problems with that value. It is supposed to be somewhere around 1.5K. I've been lucky, I've not had a problem with the 10K resistors. 

Tom, wb6b


David Leckie
 

Hi

 

My problem was with boards with the CKS32F103C8T6 chip.  Fortunately I had one board with a genuine STM32F103C chip to compare with.  I could carry out exactly the same procedure with both boards to compare.

 

The   CKS32F103C8T6 board powered up with the red LED pwr on steady and the green Pin 13 LED flashing. 

Moving Boot 0 jumper and pressing reset, the green LED went out but came back on when RESET was released.  They would not enter programming mode.

 

Doing the same with the genuine STM32F103C board – the green LED went out and stayed out and I could upload OK.

 

I have returned the CKS32F103C8T6 boards (so I cannot check the resistor) and re-ordered from a different supplier who says he tests all his boards before dispatch.

 

73

 

Dave

GM4NFI

 

 

From: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io [mailto:SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io] On Behalf Of Tom, wb6b
Sent: 13 April 2020 07:54
To: SoftwareControlledHamRadio@groups.io
Subject: Re: [SoftwareControlledHamRadio] Blue Pill - STM32F103 - Programmers and Boot Loaders #BluePill #STM32 #ARM #MorseCodeTutor none genuine chips

 

Hi,

Here is a video on using the GD32F103, boot loaders and such. And he mentions a CK chip, also. If your ST-Link will not recognize the chip, to allow you to flash a boot loader. Or the built in UART boot loader (BOOT 0 jumper enabled, requiring a USB to TTL adaptor) does not work with your programming software, then that is a big issue. The CS sounds like yet another clone chip. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE8-DCMXzo8

The story is there was a schematic circulated around the internet that almost all the Blue Pill boards are based on, that showed a 10K pull-up resistor on the D+ line of the USB connector. Many computers have USB problems with that value. It is supposed to be somewhere around 1.5K. I've been lucky, I've not had a problem with the 10K resistors. 

Tom, wb6b


David Leckie
 
Edited

Hi

A follow up to my earlier discussion on non-STM MPU's as used in some clone "Blue Pill" boards.
It looks like you correctly identified the problem i.e. a too-large value for the BOOT0 pull-up.

I was given yet another "Blue Pill" that again used a CKS32F103C8T6 chip - the type that I could not previously get to go into Program Mode.
Since then I have bought a ST-Link programmer and when I used that instead of the UART method I found I could program the board fine.

So these boards seem to be perfectly usable so long as you use an ST-LInk programmer and not the UART method.

73

Dave
GM4NFI