Date   
Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Dale Kritzky
 

Besides the assembly fixture the only other tools I use to put together the couplers are gorilla super glue and tweezers for the balls. An idea of how easy they go together is,I met my my friend at a truckstop in Ohio, I showed him how they went together and he ended up building about 10 couplers in 20 minutes and he's got sausage fingers.
Sent from my NOOK

"Bill Keene wakeene@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:

 

Josh & Group,


IIRC… there were some U-tube videos — or similar — showing assembly of the couplers. Just can not seem to find them in my data filing system today. Old dog memory in action, I guess.

My question to you is … are there any special tools required? I know one needs the assembly jig, but other than that, what is a definite necessity?

Thanks & Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA



On Jul 7, 2016, at 12:00 AM, josh@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:

I was afraid to tackle the kits... Then the A's went out, and now I've done over 100 EC87 and SBEC87's, and I prefer it.

I'm sure there is a member or two who would assemble kits for you for a nominal charge.
Josh
San Diego CA


Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Dave Snyder
 

Bill, ole man time has afflicted me as well. Here are some things I find needed. A vision enhancement, Optivisor, or lighted magnifier arm, or some lucky people can get by with inexpensive reading glasses. A nice big towel rolled up and shaped into a U or circle to rest your hands and forearms on 
and reduce shakes and catch those flying springs and ball bearings. Some nice long thin surgical tweezers to place bearings and springs on jig. A magnet to recover those pesky bearings. A needle to dispense the super glue (some cut the eye off halfway to give better glue volume) deposition.
Get extra springs and bearing with the jig. Probably forgot something, memory deteriorates with vision and nerves. Note that mother nature seems to help by gradually improving your vision and nervous control with repetition. Wishing you well.

Dave Snyder
Louisville, Ky.

Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Mike Van Hove
 

Dave, Bill, and anyone else who cares:

I would recommend a small jewelers screwdriver that is very slightly magnetized.  Probably touching it to a magnet a couple of times will be enough.   I use that to pick up the ball (and the spring).  When I get the ball over the hole, I just push it off the magnet with the same pencil I used to Graphite the hole.  The ball will fall right in place.  I stress, you don’t want very much magnetism as you only want to pick up one ball, not a handfull.

These are pretty easy to do, once you get started.  I agree with Dave about the towel or some kind of thing to keep the errant balls from rolling off the work surface.  Once they hit the floor, they seem to evaporate.
Same with the springs.  In actuality, you really won’t loose all that many.  I bought (1) pack of extras when I started, have built enough couplers for 110 cars and haven’t used the entire pack of spares yet.

Give it a whirl, they are kinda fun to build, and as we all know, they sure look a whole lot better.

Mike Van Hove

On Jul 7, 2016, at 3:34 PM, davesnyder59@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:

Bill, ole man time has afflicted me as well. Here are some things I find needed. A vision enhancement, Optivisor, or lighted magnifier arm, or some lucky people can get by with inexpensive reading glasses. A nice big towel rolled up and shaped into a U or circle to rest your hands and forearms on  
and reduce shakes and catch those flying springs and ball bearings. Some nice long thin surgical tweezers to place bearings and springs on jig. A magnet to recover those pesky bearings. A needle to dispense the super glue (some cut the eye off halfway to give better glue volume) deposition.
Get extra springs and bearing with the jig. Probably forgot something, memory deteriorates with vision and nerves. Note that mother nature seems to help by gradually improving your vision and nervous control with repetition. Wishing you well.

Dave Snyder
Louisville, Ky.


Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Mike Van Hove
 

Dave, Bill, and anyone else who cares:

I would recommend a small jewelers screwdriver that is very slightly magnetized.  Probably touching it to a magnet a couple of times will be enough.   I use that to pick up the ball (and the spring).  When I get the ball over the hole, I just push it off the magnet with the same pencil I used to Graphite the hole.  The ball will fall right in place.  I stress, you don’t want very much magnetism as you only want to pick up one ball, not a handfull.

These are pretty easy to do, once you get started.  I agree with Dave about the towel or some kind of thing to keep the errant balls from rolling off the work surface.  Once they hit the floor, they seem to evaporate.
Same with the springs.  In actuality, you really won’t loose all that many.  I bought (1) pack of extras when I started, have built enough couplers for 110 cars and haven’t used the entire pack of spares yet.

Give it a whirl, they are kinda fun to build, and as we all know, they sure look a whole lot better.

Mike Van Hove

On Jul 7, 2016, at 3:34 PM, davesnyder59@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:

Bill, ole man time has afflicted me as well. Here are some things I find needed. A vision enhancement, Optivisor, or lighted magnifier arm, or some lucky people can get by with inexpensive reading glasses. A nice big towel rolled up and shaped into a U or circle to rest your hands and forearms on  
and reduce shakes and catch those flying springs and ball bearings. Some nice long thin surgical tweezers to place bearings and springs on jig. A magnet to recover those pesky bearings. A needle to dispense the super glue (some cut the eye off halfway to give better glue volume) deposition.
Get extra springs and bearing with the jig. Probably forgot something, memory deteriorates with vision and nerves. Note that mother nature seems to help by gradually improving your vision and nervous control with repetition. Wishing you well.

Dave Snyder
Louisville, Ky.


Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

David Olsen
 

To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX

Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Ryan Harris
 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX


Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Michael Looney
 

How many does he need done? I would do it for him, but I am on the east coast, and depending on how many he needs, all I would charge him would be shipping. and the jig to put them together. I am home all the time from being disable and a bad heart, so it give me the time to do that for him.
Michael Looney


Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 17:08:17 -0500
From: SergentEng@...
Subject: Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?
To: SergentEng@...

 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX




Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Nathan Rich
 

I am still available for anyone who needs couplers assembled. Just email me off list if you need some done. I paint, assemble, break in, and re-ship them. I do not keep stock on hand, everything is made to order, and I have no inside track on anything if it is unavailable on the site.

My 27 year old eyes are laser sharp and I would love to take on anybody's coupler needs. Especially if you can't get the rusty red primer, I can send you completed painted couplers.

Nathan Rich

On Jul 7, 2016 3:08 PM, "Ryan Harris ryan.harris@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX


Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Bill Keene <wakeene@...>
 

Hello Andy, Dale, Josh, Dave, Dave, Mike, Ryan, Michael, Nathan, and whoever else my old dog memory has managed to forget,

Wow! Thank you all of the advise and encouragement. Believe me, it is very much appreciated. 

In fact, each of you have raised my confidence about giving the task of assembly a try. Once I get the necessary kits and begin assembling these couplers I will report my experiences. 

Some asked how many couplers I needed. Thanks for asking. The answer is around 130 pairs. This is about the total of pieces of equipment that I will eventual require to support the planned layout. Right now the immediate number is 64 pairs. I also have installed 20 pairs on that many assembled freight cars. 

Also, regarding the notice of discontinuance of the assembled couplers that prompted my original question, I can fully understand Frank Sergent’s action. I have searched the group’s archives for his notice but somehow I missed finding it. Then again, I am not the best of searchers. I must have missed the original posting due to my schedule that has me working on a cruise ship for four months out of the year. One tends loose touch with what is going on around one when at sea. 

Again, a big THANK YOU for each and every response. Also for the confidence raising advise and encouragement.

Cheers & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Jul 8, 2016, at 2:25 PM, Nathan Rich thaddeusthudpucker@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:


I am still available for anyone who needs couplers assembled. Just email me off list if you need some done. I paint, assemble, break in, and re-ship them. I do not keep stock on hand, everything is made to order, and I have no inside track on anything if it is unavailable on the site.

My 27 year old eyes are laser sharp and I would love to take on anybody's coupler needs. Especially if you can't get the rusty red primer, I can send you completed painted couplers.

Nathan Rich

On Jul 7, 2016 3:08 PM, "Ryan Harris ryan.harris@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX





Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Dave Snyder
 

Your welcome Bill, but be aware. The Sergent's are kinda like potato chips, the more I make, the more I want.

Dave Snyder
Louisville, Ky.

Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Michael Looney
 

Bill:
 Before you order make sure to order spare springs, and balls, because I know for a fact you will always need more, because a spring like to go on a trip that you didn't plan for it, and the tniy little balls, want to follow them, and they weren't even invited to go. I order in bulk 144 at a time, and than put everything in little plastic boxes that you can close and lock shut, and than label all the boxes. I also use a Kadee spring tool for putting or trying to put the spring in place.
 If anyone else can think of anything I might have missed, let him know, or anything that might help him along the way.
 Once you have put together a few you will get the hang of it, or you will be cussing all of us out, for forgetting to tell you something that was important, but remember some of us are old fart, with bad hearts.
 Michael Looney


Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2016 20:35:45 -0700
From: SergentEng@...
Subject: Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?
To: SergentEng@...

 
Hello Andy, Dale, Josh, Dave, Dave, Mike, Ryan, Michael, Nathan, and whoever else my old dog memory has managed to forget,

Wow! Thank you all of the advise and encouragement. Believe me, it is very much appreciated. 

In fact, each of you have raised my confidence about giving the task of assembly a try. Once I get the necessary kits and begin assembling these couplers I will report my experiences. 

Some asked how many couplers I needed. Thanks for asking. The answer is around 130 pairs. This is about the total of pieces of equipment that I will eventual require to support the planned layout. Right now the immediate number is 64 pairs. I also have installed 20 pairs on that many assembled freight cars. 

Also, regarding the notice of discontinuance of the assembled couplers that prompted my original question, I can fully understand Frank Sergent’s action. I have searched the group’s archives for his notice but somehow I missed finding it. Then again, I am not the best of searchers. I must have missed the original posting due to my schedule that has me working on a cruise ship for four months out of the year. One tends loose touch with what is going on around one when at sea. 

Again, a big THANK YOU for each and every response. Also for the confidence raising advise and encouragement.

Cheers & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Jul 8, 2016, at 2:25 PM, Nathan Rich thaddeusthudpucker@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:


I am still available for anyone who needs couplers assembled. Just email me off list if you need some done. I paint, assemble, break in, and re-ship them. I do not keep stock on hand, everything is made to order, and I have no inside track on anything if it is unavailable on the site.

My 27 year old eyes are laser sharp and I would love to take on anybody's coupler needs. Especially if you can't get the rusty red primer, I can send you completed painted couplers.

Nathan Rich

On Jul 7, 2016 3:08 PM, "Ryan Harris ryan.harris@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX







Virus-free. www.avast.com

Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Bill Keene <wakeene@...>
 

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the advise on getting started with the assembly process. 

I plan on ordering extra springs and steel balls. Like you, I have put a good number into orbit. Has to be in orbit as they never seem to come back to mother earth. 

In fact, once when I ran out of springs I resorted to installing now out of service Kadee coupler knuckle springs. These are a bit softer and do not provide as much resistance to movement of the coupler but do tend to work acceptably. I have even installed the Sergent couplers without springs but with a cut bit of foam in their place. The jury is still out on this but so far no problems. Then again, there is fairly limited running at my place until the layout gets farther along in construction. 

Thanks for the reminders, hints, suggestions, and encouragement.

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Jul 9, 2016, at 4:11 PM, Michael F Looney excalibur5776@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:


Bill:
 Before you order make sure to order spare springs, and balls, because I know for a fact you will always need more, because a spring like to go on a trip that you didn't plan for it, and the tniy little balls, want to follow them, and they weren't even invited to go. I order in bulk 144 at a time, and than put everything in little plastic boxes that you can close and lock shut, and than label all the boxes. I also use a Kadee spring tool for putting or trying to put the spring in place.
 If anyone else can think of anything I might have missed, let him know, or anything that might help him along the way.
 Once you have put together a few you will get the hang of it, or you will be cussing all of us out, for forgetting to tell you something that was important, but remember some of us are old fart, with bad hearts.
 Michael Looney


Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2016 20:35:45 -0700
From: SergentEng@...
Subject: Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?
To: SergentEng@...

 
Hello Andy, Dale, Josh, Dave, Dave, Mike, Ryan, Michael, Nathan, and whoever else my old dog memory has managed to forget,

Wow! Thank you all of the advise and encouragement. Believe me, it is very much appreciated. 

In fact, each of you have raised my confidence about giving the task of assembly a try. Once I get the necessary kits and begin assembling these couplers I will report my experiences. 

Some asked how many couplers I needed. Thanks for asking. The answer is around 130 pairs. This is about the total of pieces of equipment that I will eventual require to support the planned layout. Right now the immediate number is 64 pairs. I also have installed 20 pairs on that many assembled freight cars. 

Also, regarding the notice of discontinuance of the assembled couplers that prompted my original question, I can fully understand Frank Sergent’s action. I have searched the group’s archives for his notice but somehow I missed finding it. Then again, I am not the best of searchers. I must have missed the original posting due to my schedule that has me working on a cruise ship for four months out of the year. One tends loose touch with what is going on around one when at sea. 

Again, a big THANK YOU for each and every response. Also for the confidence raising advise and encouragement.

Cheers & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Jul 8, 2016, at 2:25 PM, Nathan Rich thaddeusthudpucker@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:


I am still available for anyone who needs couplers assembled. Just email me off list if you need some done. I paint, assemble, break in, and re-ship them. I do not keep stock on hand, everything is made to order, and I have no inside track on anything if it is unavailable on the site.

My 27 year old eyes are laser sharp and I would love to take on anybody's coupler needs. Especially if you can't get the rusty red primer, I can send you completed painted couplers.

Nathan Rich

On Jul 7, 2016 3:08 PM, "Ryan Harris ryan.harris@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

Around that time someone on the list offered to assemble them. I suppose that's still an option if the enterprising list member wishes to speak up.

They really aren't that hard to assemble but if your eyes are 40 years old or more I would recommend a 4 power Optivisor along with the assembly fixture. Good luck!

Ryan H
Fort Worth, TX


On 7/7/2016 5:04 PM, 'David R. Olsen' 3acr.scout@... [SergentEng] wrote:
 
To answer Bill's original question, I believe Frank announced about 6 months ago that he would no longer be offering the assembled couplers because it was just getting to be too much work for him. I remember it coming up on the list but don't have my old messages handy at the moment.

I don't mind assembling them myself but have been lazy about getting around to painting the parts first.

Dave Olsen
El Paso, TX







Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Mike Conder
 

Did anybody mention the assembly jigs?  VERY useful ...

Mike Conder

Re: [SergentEng] Re: EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Andrew
 

Dale did.  The jig is extremely useful.  You can see Sergent couplers on the Mohegan Pequot layout at the NTS this weekend (my equipment is equipped with them).  
Andrew Porter  

On Jul 9, 2016, at 7:42 PM, "Mike Conder vulturenest1@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:

 

Did anybody mention the assembly jigs?  VERY useful ...

Mike Conder

Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Bill Keene <wakeene@...>
 

Mike,

Yes! Got that on the order form also. Thanks.

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Jul 9, 2016, at 4:42 PM, Mike Conder vulturenest1@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:


Did anybody mention the assembly jigs?  VERY useful ...

Mike Conder


Re: [SergentEng] EC87A - DISCONTINUED?

Mike Conder
 

Good deal!

Remember, there are a bunch of assembly tips in the message archives.  One of my favorites is using poster putty (aka blue tack) on the end of a stick to place the ball into the coupler.

Mike Conder

Intermountain 19,600 gal. tankcars/ SEC87K

jjjwar@outlook.com
 

Has anyone tried installing the SEC87K compatible shank double shelf coupler on the Intermountain 19,600 gallon corn syrup tank cars? On the cars I have the long coupler box is held on by two screws. The stock coupler is a Kadee whisker coupler with the standard shank with the big hole. A Sergent SEC87K fits just fine but is a little tight in the side to side swing.


The problem I ran into is the coupler height is a little too high. About .015" to .020". I cannot lower the coupler box as the end frame of the car acts as the lid for the coupler box. Was wondering if anyone else had this problem and if so how did you correct it. I am kind of stumped on what to do.


 I did find that the SEC87K fits fine on the Atlas 17,600 gal. tank cars just fine. Drop in fit. The SEC87K also fits very nice on the new Sale Trains 31K crude oil tank cars. One again a drop in fit.



Wayne R

Ontario, Canada

Re: [SergentEng] Intermountain 19,600 gal. tankcars/ SEC87K

Nathan Rich
 

Try smoothing the upper and lower parts of the shank with a bastard file. That should free it up a bit

Take the same file to the top of the bolster on the truck one pass at a time to lower the car.

Nathan Rich

On Aug 4, 2016 6:10 PM, "jjjwar@... [SergentEng]" <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

Has anyone tried installing the SEC87K compatible shank double shelf coupler on the Intermountain 19,600 gallon corn syrup tank cars? On the cars I have the long coupler box is held on by two screws. The stock coupler is a Kadee whisker coupler with the standard shank with the big hole. A Sergent SEC87K fits just fine but is a little tight in the side to side swing.


The problem I ran into is the coupler height is a little too high. About .015" to .020". I cannot lower the coupler box as the end frame of the car acts as the lid for the coupler box. Was wondering if anyone else had this problem and if so how did you correct it. I am kind of stumped on what to do.


 I did find that the SEC87K fits fine on the Atlas 17,600 gal. tank cars just fine. Drop in fit. The SEC87K also fits very nice on the new Sale Trains 31K crude oil tank cars. One again a drop in fit.



Wayne R

Ontario, Canada

Re: [SergentEng] Intermountain 19,600 gal. tankcars/ SEC87K

Alan Hummel
 

I used the SE coupler, not a kit, when Frank was still selling assembled couplers & the coupler swing was fine.
My worst problem so far in height is with the 5161 cvd hoppers. I had to file the coupler lid as well as the where the truck rides,to get the coupler to a decent height & I think this was a BAD oversight by Athearn in tooling that car. Sounds like they did the same with the tanker.

Al Hummel

Re: [SergentEng] Intermountain 19,600 gal. tankcars/ SEC87K

Nathan Rich
 

I don't think the Athearn model is badly tooled, they just don't expect any of us to expect such tight tolerances as is nee ded when we use Sergent couplers.

Nathan Rich

On Fri, Aug 5, 2016 at 10:17 AM, Alan Hummel ahummel72@... [SergentEng] <SergentEng@...> wrote:
 

I used the SE coupler, not a kit, when Frank was still selling assembled couplers & the coupler swing was fine.
My worst problem so far in height is with the 5161 cvd hoppers. I had to file the coupler lid as well as the where the truck rides,to get the coupler to a decent height & I think this was a BAD oversight by Athearn in tooling that car. Sounds like they did the same with the tanker.

Al Hummel