Re: The Flyer Crawl?



  S-N-S has their half speed can motor for many Flyer locomotives that cuts top end speed in half while allowing smoke production at lower track speeds.  However there are other low speed motors that we have been discussing on the RepowerAndRegear list  that are very strong and have a very low 12 volt speed.  The problem is that their design is not very compatible with the BEMF function of some DCC decoders.  They work well with PWM and non-PWM DC motor controllers.  I have bought several of the DC motor controllers for some experimentation.  One of these controllers makes a nice hand held unit, coupled with a 9volt DC battery you have a pocket sized power pack.  

  I believe at one time S-N-S made their Flyer worm available for use on other motors.  This is an option I would explore if the worm was designed for a 2mm shaft (the most common shaft size for most of the 12 volt aftermarket motors).  2.4mm could be made to work as well.  The motors I have been trying lately are four magnet six pole DC motors designed for remote auto mirrors.  On straight DC they are very strong and smooth.  I installed one in an old AC Gilbert HO Hudson from the 1950s (which had a 7-15 volt motor).  I had to pull the worm from the old motor (the hardest task in this remotoring). When done, without the smoke unit connected, no load 12 volt current draw for the mechanism was 100 milliamps, less than many motors, uninstalled and less than my best running engines with Sagmai 2032s and flywheels running no load at 12 volts.  Oh and yes the chuff piston was connected as well.  Right now it seems there are tens of thousands of this Mabuchi SF-266SA 18*18MM Square 6-Pole Rotor Mini DC Motor 18*18MM Square 6-Pole Rotor Mini DC Motor motor for sale on eBay for around $2 including shipping.  It is a 2mm shaft motor. A flyer compatible worm with a 2mm shaft ID would allow for some experimentation.

The gear ratio of a Flyer Timko remotored loco is 18.5 to 1 (observed by turning the flywheel)

The Timko motor has a double lead worm, the axle gear appears to be 37 tooth.

Obviously a single lead worm would double the gear ratio.  The S-N-S 'slow' motor appears to have a single lead worm (Same motor RPM, but the single lead worm doubles the gear ratio).

The S-N-S can motor has an uninstalled 12 volt no load of 150milliamps, compared to 40 milliamps of the Mabuchi SF-266SA 18*18MM Square 6-Pole Rotor Mini DC Motor.

The Mabuchi SF-266SA has a 12 volt rpm of around 7500,  If there is interest I'll hookup my digital motor tachometer and test the starting voltage/RPM and 12 volt RPM of the Timko and S-N-S motors.

ken clark

On 2018-05-14 03:44, TERRY M STONE wrote:

Ken...  I run DC can motors exclusively, S& S and Timko, and I have been using a new MRC power pack designed for G scale trains.  The LGB locos start at about the same voltage as HO engines, so I figure I've got that covered too.  This combination has "tamed" Flyer locos into running very slow speeds, but they still reach a certain point and stall.  And yes, I have considered the huge current draw of the smoke units, so I have tried slower speeds with the smoke unit not wired.

The conversations at the Spree both involved wanting old Flyer to crawl across switches and "snuggle up" to cars in the yard for coupling without "damaging the load inside."  Many, but not all, of my HO and On30 locos will do this, and that was pretty much what the questioners wanted.  I just don't think the old engines can do it

That being said, there are quite a few guys in "Flyerland" who would still like to do it, and the discussions were left hanging because all I could produce is the theory of weight and gearing being the problem moreso than the motor.   However, the motor controller seems like it might be the answer and the cost to test one is certainly low enough!  

Thanks from myself and all those who want to do "The Flyer Crawl!"

Stumpy Stone in Ohio    

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