simple question, is the QLG2-SE GPS ant waterproof?


M0PWX
 

very simple
is the QLG2-SE GPS ant waterproof?

i have checked the docs, and done a search (gps waterproof, 12 threads returned) and not found an answer

got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?

thanks

73, Peter
M0PWX


Alan G4ZFQ
 

got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?
Peter

Another thread refers to reading the manual Peter... :-)

"An active antenna module is used, having a magnetic mount, antenna patch and Low Noise
Amplifier in a weather-resistant enclosure. It is supplied with 2m of coaxial cable and an
SMA connector."

73 Alan G4ZFQ


M0PWX
 

Thanks alan,

 

I missed that bit, I did read the manual, honest guv

 

73

 

Peter

M0PWX

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Alan G4ZFQ
Sent: 09 August 2021 15:21
To: QRPLabs@groups.io
Subject: Re: [QRPLabs] simple question, is the QLG2-SE GPS ant waterproof?

 


> got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a
> waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in
> the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?

Peter

Another thread refers to reading the manual Peter... :-)

"An active antenna module is used, having a magnetic mount, antenna
patch and Low Noise
Amplifier in a weather-resistant enclosure. It is supplied with 2m of
coaxial cable and an
SMA connector."

73 Alan G4ZFQ




 


Curt wb8yyy
 

Peter

Plastic tends to have very low loss even at 1600 MHz. Note the radome covers on many microwave antennas. I suggest going on safer side to protect the hardware. 

Curt


Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...>
 


Alan

If there is doubt about the GPS patch antenna being waterproof,
it might be interesting to solder up a tiny Yagi for GPS frequency.
Some hams seem to focus on antennas for HF or VHF.  Working
on an antenna design for 1.7 GHz could be interesting and easy
due to the smaller antenna size.  At that frequency one could
build a multi-element antenna that could have significant gain
over a simple patch antenna.

Arv
_._


On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 9:21 AM Alan G4ZFQ <alan4alan@...> wrote:

> got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a
> waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in
> the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?

Peter

Another thread refers to reading the manual Peter... :-)

"An active antenna module is used, having a magnetic mount, antenna
patch and Low Noise
Amplifier in a weather-resistant enclosure. It is supplied with 2m of
coaxial cable and an
SMA connector."

73 Alan G4ZFQ






Alan G4ZFQ
 

At that frequency one could
build a multi-element antenna that could have significant gain
over a simple patch antenna.
Arv,

One antenna I use is a quadrifilar from a radiosonde, not waterproof but I guess it was in it's polystyrene box. It is amplified.

I never tried it but a dipole/reflector should be better than a patch. Would it match the amp?

An unamplified antenna with suitable gain to overcome a short length of coax and cover the whole sky might be an interesting game.

73 Alan G4ZFQ


Dave VE3LHO
 

 But gain in this case implies directivity. I'm not sure you want to be trying to track these sats with the antenna especially since recieving from 3 or more is a goal and they won't be aligned in the sky.


On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 08:28 AM, Arv Evans wrote:
 
Alan
 
If there is doubt about the GPS patch antenna being waterproof,
it might be interesting to solder up a tiny Yagi for GPS frequency.
Some hams seem to focus on antennas for HF or VHF.  Working
on an antenna design for 1.7 GHz could be interesting and easy
due to the smaller antenna size.  At that frequency one could
build a multi-element antenna that could have significant gain
over a simple patch antenna.
 
Arv
_._
 

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 9:21 AM Alan G4ZFQ <alan4alan@...> wrote:

> got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a
> waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in
> the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?

Peter

Another thread refers to reading the manual Peter... :-)

"An active antenna module is used, having a magnetic mount, antenna
patch and Low Noise
Amplifier in a weather-resistant enclosure. It is supplied with 2m of
coaxial cable and an
SMA connector."

73 Alan G4ZFQ


Alan G4ZFQ
 

Dave
 But gain in this case implies directivity.
Yes, there is a fairly low limit to the gain. The "beam" must be directed upwards, presuming a low antenna then no response would be required below 20-30°
It must be possible to improve a fair bit on a tiny patch antenna?

73 Alan G4ZFQ


Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...>
 

Dave 

You are correct.  One would need to test for beam width and then
calculate how many satellites would fit inside the beam at that distance.

Other types of focused antenna would probably have the same problem.

Arv
_._


On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 11:05 AM Dave VE3LHO <dave@...> wrote:
 But gain in this case implies directivity. I'm not sure you want to be trying to track these sats with the antenna especially since recieving from 3 or more is a goal and they won't be aligned in the sky.

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 08:28 AM, Arv Evans wrote:
 
Alan
 
If there is doubt about the GPS patch antenna being waterproof,
it might be interesting to solder up a tiny Yagi for GPS frequency.
Some hams seem to focus on antennas for HF or VHF.  Working
on an antenna design for 1.7 GHz could be interesting and easy
due to the smaller antenna size.  At that frequency one could
build a multi-element antenna that could have significant gain
over a simple patch antenna.
 
Arv
_._
 

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 9:21 AM Alan G4ZFQ <alan4alan@...> wrote:

> got my U3s with GPS and want to put it far end of the garden in a
> waterproof box, but is the GPS antenna suitable for outside the box in
> the weather so it can get a more reliable signal?

Peter

Another thread refers to reading the manual Peter... :-)

"An active antenna module is used, having a magnetic mount, antenna
patch and Low Noise
Amplifier in a weather-resistant enclosure. It is supplied with 2m of
coaxial cable and an
SMA connector."

73 Alan G4ZFQ


Rob Giuliano
 

If you are looking for a 'build your own", a while back (maybe early 2000s), there were a few I saw a couple of GPS antenna projects.
   https://www.arrl.org/files/file/Technology/tis/info/pdf/0210036.pdf
   And a similar one that fit inside the old "L'eggs" stocking eggs.

Neither was amplified, but I've seen inline (coax) amplifiers available for under $20
Seems buying one is cheaper.  I'd look at the Proxicast Through Hole option on Amazon.
  It looks like it could be sealed on the outside of your box, and the rest of the stuff inside would be safe (assuming your box is waterproof).
--
Rob KB8RCO


Dave VE3LHO
 

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 11:52 AM, Alan G4ZFQ wrote:
Dave
 But gain in this case implies directivity.
Yes, there is a fairly low limit to the gain. The "beam" must be
directed upwards, presuming a low antenna then no response would be
required below 20-30°
It must be possible to improve a fair bit on a tiny patch antenna?
No doubt but the patches work amazingly well.
One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job is it worth "fixing"?


M0PWX
 

All I asked was if the one supplied was waterproof :0

 

Alan provided the answer yes, and included the bit I missed in the docs thought I had read them but obviously not

 

And this has snowballed into options of yagi’s, patch antenna and QFH 😊

 

The QFH option intrigues me for another day, and may experiment with it later, it would need a DC blocker as 3.3v for the pre-amp is present on the SMA

Thanks for all the feedback

 

73

 

Peter

M0PWX

 

From: Dave VE3LHO
Sent: 10 August 2021 14:37
To: QRPLabs@groups.io
Subject: Re: [QRPLabs] simple question, is the QLG2-SE GPS ant waterproof?

 

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 11:52 AM, Alan G4ZFQ wrote:

Dave

 But gain in this case implies directivity.

Yes, there is a fairly low limit to the gain. The "beam" must be
directed upwards, presuming a low antenna then no response would be
required below 20-30°
It must be possible to improve a fair bit on a tiny patch antenna?

No doubt but the patches work amazingly well.
One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job is it worth "fixing"?

 


Alan G4ZFQ
 

One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job is it worth "fixing"?
Dave,

Personally I have no problem, a 2m cable puts my antenna in a fairly good position outside. Mounted on a metal plate seems to improve signals, certainly does when inside my workshop.

But as Arv said "It could be interesting" Rob's example looks interesting.

73 Alan G4ZFQ


Curt wb8yyy
 

Yeah, like I want to see someone really construct a GPS Yagi, the precision required is quite an undertaking. Hence the patch. 

Water sitting on the antenna might eventually cause corrosion (or not) but it's high dielectric constant might affect reception, which is why radiome covers are common. 

Curt


Johan Bodin
 

It is perfectly feasible to design a yagi for 1575MHz but it would not be a good idea since a GPS receiver works by correlating signals from many different satellites that are moving across the sky. The ideal GPS antenna is an omnidirectonal RHCP circularly polarized antenna that can "see" from horizon to horizon i all azimuth directions.

73 de SM6LKM

wb8yyy wrote:

Yeah, like I want to see someone really construct a GPS Yagi, the precision required is quite an undertaking. Hence the patch.

Water sitting on the antenna might eventually cause corrosion (or not) but it's high dielectric constant might affect reception, which is why radiome covers are common.

Curt


Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...>
 

Also need to ask "how many satellites do I need to see at once?".

_._


On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 8:37 AM Dave VE3LHO <dave@...> wrote:
On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 11:52 AM, Alan G4ZFQ wrote:
Dave
 But gain in this case implies directivity.
Yes, there is a fairly low limit to the gain. The "beam" must be
directed upwards, presuming a low antenna then no response would be
required below 20-30°
It must be possible to improve a fair bit on a tiny patch antenna?
No doubt but the patches work amazingly well.
One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job is it worth "fixing"?


Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...>
 

But how many satellites do you need to see for setting
frequency, speed, and location information?  It seems
that horizon-to-horizon may be an overkill for our
purposes?

_._


On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:37 AM Johan Bodin <jbodin@...> wrote:
It is perfectly feasible to design a yagi for 1575MHz but it would not
be a good idea since a GPS receiver works by correlating signals from
many different satellites that are moving across the sky. The ideal GPS
antenna is an omnidirectonal RHCP circularly polarized antenna that can
"see" from horizon to horizon i all azimuth directions.

73 de SM6LKM

wb8yyy wrote:
> Yeah, like I want to see someone really construct a GPS Yagi, the
> precision required is quite an undertaking. Hence the patch.
>
> Water sitting on the antenna might eventually cause corrosion (or not)
> but it's high dielectric constant might affect reception, which is why
> radiome covers are common.
>
> Curt






N3MNT
 

I used one of these small waterproof antennas on my vehicle with a Kenwood mobile rig.  It was on the roof of my vehicle for 10 yrs with no issue.


Dave VE3LHO
 

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 12:06 PM, Arv Evans wrote:
Also need to ask "how many satellites do I need to see at once?".
 
My understanding, which is probably wrong :-), is that 3 (solid signal) is a good number.
 
_._

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 8:37 AM Dave VE3LHO <dave@...> wrote:
On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 11:52 AM, Alan G4ZFQ wrote:
Dave
 But gain in this case implies directivity.
Yes, there is a fairly low limit to the gain. The "beam" must be
directed upwards, presuming a low antenna then no response would be
required below 20-30°
It must be possible to improve a fair bit on a tiny patch antenna?
No doubt but the patches work amazingly well.
One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job is it worth "fixing"?

 


Dave VE3LHO
 

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 09:12 AM, Alan G4ZFQ wrote:
One needs to ask "what problem am I solving?". If the patch does the job
is it worth "fixing"?
Dave,

Personally I have no problem, a 2m cable puts my antenna in a fairly
good position outside. Mounted on a metal plate seems to improve
signals, certainly does when inside my workshop.

But as Arv said "It could be interesting" Rob's example looks interesting.
Yes fair point. I'm not arguing someone shouldn't persue "interesting" just wanted to make the point it might not be exactly "useful".
Curiosity or whatever else might drive you is great but its good to approach it with your eyes wide open, as they say.