Re: Where can I buy floater balloon?
Bill,toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
In post 34692 Mikael said:
> If I fill a foil balloon (like the one linked to first in this thread) with helium with 6gram of lift, seal it and let it sit inside it have lost its 6 gram of lift within a week and fall to the > floor but when used as a balloon for a radio tracker at +10000m its fine for several month, I had a tracker up for 64 days last year before a storm toke it down and Dave > > have a balloon released in February with this (2) balloon stil flying, whats happening at altitude that prevents the gas from leaking out as it does at ground level?
In post 34705 he states that this is repeatable, so I assume he did not happen to have a leak
in the balloons that remained in the house.
Is there something about mylar that makes it more impermeable to helium at -50C
(as found at 10,000 meters) vs room temperature of 20C?
I don't see PV=nRT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideal_gas_law
causing the reported behavior.
Here is my reasoning, a first attempt at thinking this through:
Let's assume the balloon has "just enough" helium to fill it out at 10,000 meters,
so the pressure inside the balloon is always equal to the ambient pressure,
whether it is at sea level or at 10,000 meters.
At 10,000 meters the air is roughly four times less dense, so the balloon
will be 4 times larger than at sea level. But at sea level, the air that the balloon displaces
will have 4 times the density, so the lift of the helium is the same as at 10,000 meters.
(The lift is equal to the weight of the air displaced by the balloon minus the weight of the helium.)
Likewise, the temperature change affects the density of helium and air in equal measure.
(Assume the helium eventually reaches the same temperature as the ambient air.)
If the mylar balloon has more helium than needed at 10,000 meters (but does not pop),
then the pressure of the helium at altitude will be greater than the "just enough" case
and thus it is more dense. The lift will be less at altitude than it is at sea level.
The balloon will rise to that altitude at which the lift is equal to the weight of the payload.
When Mikael's balloon left behind in the house sinks to the floor after a week, it has
less helium remaining in the balloon than the one that is floating at 10,000 meters.
Even though the balloon at altitude is likely overfilled, with the helium pressing on the mylar walls.
But somehow the balloon leaks less at altitude? Curious.
On Sun, May 26, 2019 at 12:21 AM, J68HZ wrote: