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Nagel Commemoratives (NC)....... I know this looks bad but please bear with me.........

flyinggardengnome
 

Hey there, it's past midnight where I am, but I've decide to throw this question to you guys, hoping to gain some opinions:

 

Nagel Commemoratives (CN)....... all 15 of them and their current value (if they do have any).

 

I know, many veterans here would have rolled his or her eyes upon seeing these two words, thinking why would this young fellow wanna discuss this old and worn topic?

 

Yes, I know that in the context of art value, the CNs are considered the bottom of the rung, meaning they have little to no value at all, the root cause being that after Nagel passed away (R.I.P.), Bornstein saw an opportunity to cash in on his work and decided to print lots and lots of posters (the CNs) into the market, causing the value to drop drastically. According to Nagel veterans, to date there have been unaccountable numbers of CNs floating in the market. It is indeed a sad scene.

 

However...... I have been thinking (maybe a little too much, but please indulge with me for a sec): as of November 2018, are the 15 CNs really worth nothing at all? I mean, of course I understand they don't value as much as those lifetime prints (printed when Nagel was alive), this is a well-established fact. But they have to have some value, right? If so, how much? I mean, at the very least they are still Nagel's work, be it published before or after his death. I know in today's modern art world, everything moves rapidly. Collectors only look for art pieces that appreciates in value over time, and wastes no time and money on art pieces that have little to no value. Why would they? It would be illogical, both economically and intellectually. 

 

Also, Nagel is still considered relatively unknown if compared to his artist peers (Warhol, Lichtenstein etc). Heck, I bet in my whole neighbourhood only I know who Nagel is. That is also the main reason this forum exists: to revive the glory days of Nagel in the 80s! 

 

Anyway, I digress. What I want to ask is this: Is it worth collecting Nagel Commemoratives during this times? Also, are they really that worthless? I mean, some of the NCs, like NC #3 aka Sushi Girl once graced the cover of some magazine...? (I read this fact somewhere while I was web-sleuthing) Surely this must make that particular poster worth more than the others? 

 

Yes, I also know that as the 15 CNs were printed progressively, each CNs were printed more prints (more supply) than previous ones, meaning there are more CN #2 than CN #1, and so on so forth.

 

I apologise for the lengthy post, and perhaps this topic may stir some criticisms among veteran collectors. Maybe I shouldn't have discuss this topic at all, since there is nothing (more?) left to be said about these CNs. I could say that in the world of Nagel arts, they are considered a failure......? Haha. Anyway, I noticed that discussions about CNs weren't that many in the forums. Maybe there isn't any logical reason to debate their worth at all, being that there are many more lifetime Nagel prints worth much much more than CNs, that are yet to be discussed and debated.

 

But let's give this topic one more go, shall we? I promise I will let it go after this. 

 

I apologise for my ignorance, and if any of my words offended any one of the readers. 

 

Thank you for your time for reading my humble post tonight. 

 

Good night.

Craig Blankenship
 

They are worth the $50 you pay for them .

Unless....you could the original acrylic on board .  Where are they and who owns them?


On Nov 18, 2018, at 1:00 PM, flyinggardengnome <ooi.chunping@...> wrote:

Hey there, it's past midnight where I am, but I've decide to throw this question to you guys, hoping to gain some opinions:

 

Nagel Commemoratives (CN)....... all 15 of them and their current value (if they do have any).

 

I know, many veterans here would have rolled his or her eyes upon seeing these two words, thinking why would this young fellow wanna discuss this old and worn topic?

 

Yes, I know that in the context of art value, the CNs are considered the bottom of the rung, meaning they have little to no value at all, the root cause being that after Nagel passed away (R.I.P.), Bornstein saw an opportunity to cash in on his work and decided to print lots and lots of posters (the CNs) into the market, causing the value to drop drastically. According to Nagel veterans, to date there have been unaccountable numbers of CNs floating in the market. It is indeed a sad scene.

 

However...... I have been thinking (maybe a little too much, but please indulge with me for a sec): as of November 2018, are the 15 CNs really worth nothing at all? I mean, of course I understand they don't value as much as those lifetime prints (printed when Nagel was alive), this is a well-established fact. But they have to have some value, right? If so, how much? I mean, at the very least they are still Nagel's work, be it published before or after his death. I know in today's modern art world, everything moves rapidly. Collectors only look for art pieces that appreciates in value over time, and wastes no time and money on art pieces that have little to no value. Why would they? It would be illogical, both economically and intellectually. 

 

Also, Nagel is still considered relatively unknown if compared to his artist peers (Warhol, Lichtenstein etc). Heck, I bet in my whole neighbourhood only I know who Nagel is. That is also the main reason this forum exists: to revive the glory days of Nagel in the 80s! 

 

Anyway, I digress. What I want to ask is this: Is it worth collecting Nagel Commemoratives during this times? Also, are they really that worthless? I mean, some of the NCs, like NC #3 aka Sushi Girl once graced the cover of some magazine...? (I read this fact somewhere while I was web-sleuthing) Surely this must make that particular poster worth more than the others? 

 

Yes, I also know that as the 15 CNs were printed progressively, each CNs were printed more prints (more supply) than previous ones, meaning there are more CN #2 than CN #1, and so on so forth.

 

I apologise for the lengthy post, and perhaps this topic may stir some criticisms among veteran collectors. Maybe I shouldn't have discuss this topic at all, since there is nothing (more?) left to be said about these CNs. I could say that in the world of Nagel arts, they are considered a failure......? Haha. Anyway, I noticed that discussions about CNs weren't that many in the forums. Maybe there isn't any logical reason to debate their worth at all, being that there are many more lifetime Nagel prints worth much much more than CNs, that are yet to be discussed and debated.

 

But let's give this topic one more go, shall we? I promise I will let it go after this. 

 

I apologise for my ignorance, and if any of my words offended any one of the readers. 

 

Thank you for your time for reading my humble post tonight. 

 

Good night.

Cooper_Monster
 

I think there is an objective way to look at this, and that's through the actual marketplace. So let's see what that says,

An entire set of the NCs recently sold for $810 (2 bids) on eBay recently. That's a lot of Nagels to digest, but it does say there is a market. I'd consider that the wholesale price.

A framed NC1 sold for $295 recently on eBay. That's practically the price of the frame, or one could consider it's the price of the print with the frame thrown in for free.

NC13 seems to routinely sell in the $200 to $300 range framed. It seems to be the most popular of the NCs, though personally, I like it the least. I'm sure it's popularity is due to the horse and it routinely sells to non-Nagel collectors.

An unframed NC4 sold for $199.

Unframed NC9, 11, & 12 sold as a lot for $170.

Unframed NC5 went for $155.

Unframed NC7 went for $160.

Framed NC10 - $140

etc. etc.

Of real interest is an unframed NC15, undoubtedly the most common one. Auction format, 30 bids, $56. I think that's the real bottom line. Any of the NCs are worth at least $50. Some are going to go for more. They're good images, especially for the entry level collector. Better than the posters that came later. Someone can hang them without worry about sun damage, just enjoy it, especially if you like the image. I will even admit picking up a "Park Place" print even though I know it's an estate edition but I've always admired the image and I got it for a steal ($50 I think.)

Will they ever be taken "seriously" by "collectors"? No. But not everyone can afford originals or even lifetime works, so buy what you like and can afford. I like Chiparus too, but I can't afford the original sculptures - which means that I wouldn't have a problem buying a high quality authorized edition as long as I understood what I was getting. At the same time, if I was given a Pollack, the first thing I'd do is sell it and use the money on something I'd like, I don't care how much the Pollack would impress "collectors" - I think he's ridiculously overrated. My walls, my opinion is the only one that counts.

Best advice I ever got was "Buy what you like and can afford. Ignore everyone else. If it becomes worth something, count yourself lucky."

 

First of all, don't apologize for this or any other post!  That's what this group is all about.  So the more conversation, the better.  This is the best way to get credible information from a variety of viewpoints.

I agree that value is in the wallet of the beholder, so I'll spare you that lecture.  Personally, I won't buy anything that isn't signed/numbered or an original.  And by signed, I mean signed by Patrick Nagel, not anyone else.  As far as I'm concerned, and this is pointed out in the book, having Jennifer Dumas sign posthumously published piece was just one more attempt by Karl Bornstein to squeeze every last nickel out of Patrick Nagel.

Still, I've seen some very happy people who own signed/unsigned pieces and as others have said, they're happy with them.

In order to judge values without people's subjective opinions, your best bet is simply to cruise expired EBay listings.  I suspect you'll find that none of the Commemoratives or Estate-type editions fetch more than an average of $100 or so -- if that.  The only advice I'd offer beyond that is, as with every other piece, insist on its pristine condition.  That alone makes your print that much more enjoyable.  Even a minor flaw becomes an ever-present irritant.

Rob Frankel
TheArtistWhoLovedWomen.com <-- You realize Christmas is coming, right?