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Who knows the Triax TDS100LG ?
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Ernst Lobsiger
Dear All,
years back I had a Triax TD80 and later a Triax TD110. At that time Triax antenna mounts were close to unusable regarding elevation adjustments. Therefore I machined some extras to improve/back elevation adjustment with a threaded rod. Arne has taken my design and came up with a solution with hardware store available parts. While my image got lost his design can still be checked here: https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/message/26874 Recently I made a google search for not too expensive 1m dishes available in the UK. I came across the TDS100LG which now seems to have a much improved elevation mount. https://triax.com/shop/en/tds-100lg-ral-7035-singlepack-120518 https://pimapi.triax.com/Perfion/File.aspx?id=9daf009a-920b-4767-b5d5-2d095383d076 https://pimapi.triax.com/Perfion/File.aspx?id=b335250b-28a2-4dd1-bb03-de458d7ca8c3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlz-AGyWhF8 If I understand that right Charlie said something about the feed arm of his TDS80A being too long? This piece is marked as something that has to be ordered separately for the TDS80A!? https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/message/34579 Can Charlie please explain if the new TDXNNN series potentially has a feed arm problem with the wide spread Inverto BLACK Ultra HGLN QUAD? Is there anyone that uses one of these new Triax TDXNNN designs (probably after 2019) that can comment on the new elevation mount and/or the mechanical stability and the performance of these dishes? Is there a comparable 1.0-1.1m model readily available in the UK? If such a thing exists please comment on the same points as above. Best regards, Ernst |
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geojohnt@aol.com
Ernst, It seems they have not? Very quickly, I purchased a TD 110 back in 2015 and found it totally impossible to align accurately - for our 'demanding use' - and required accurate alignment owing to the ridiculous rear Az/El clamp mechanism. It's impossible to adjust one without upsetting the other. I complained bitterly to Triax who said I was the only person ever to complain about this dish which they had sold quite a few of in the UK. And they use this type of clamp on most all(?) their dishes. The company I purchased the dish from refused to accept the dish back or give me a refund or compensation. The dish then spent 6 years at the bottom of the garden unused till I moved house. I'm thinking of going '1.2 m' from my 1 m - if I do it will be a Gibertini with a proper 'standard' dish/pole Az/El clamp. But I'm waiting to see what E 10-B power contours are first. Regards, John
On Saturday, 25 February 2023 at 14:14:24 GMT, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger@...> wrote:
Dear All, years back I had a Triax TD80 and later a Triax TD110. At that time Triax antenna mounts were close to unusable regarding elevation adjustments. Therefore I machined some extras to improve/back elevation adjustment with a threaded rod. Arne has taken my design and came up with a solution with hardware store available parts. While my image got lost his design can still be checked here: https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/message/26874 Recently I made a google search for not too expensive 1m dishes available in the UK. I came across the TDS100LG which now seems to have a much improved elevation mount. https://triax.com/shop/en/tds-100lg-ral-7035-singlepack-120518 https://pimapi.triax.com/Perfion/File.aspx?id=9daf009a-920b-4767-b5d5-2d095383d076 https://pimapi.triax.com/Perfion/File.aspx?id=b335250b-28a2-4dd1-bb03-de458d7ca8c3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlz-AGyWhF8 If I understand that right Charlie said something about the feed arm of his TDS80A being too long? This piece is marked as something that has to be ordered separately for the TDS80A!? https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/message/34579 Can Charlie please explain if the new TDXNNN series potentially has a feed arm problem with the wide spread Inverto BLACK Ultra HGLN QUAD? Is there anyone that uses one of these new Triax TDXNNN designs (probably after 2019) that can comment on the new elevation mount and/or the mechanical stability and the performance of these dishes? Is there a comparable 1.0-1.1m model readily available in the UK? If such a thing exists please comment on the same points as above. Best regards, Ernst |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 07:36 AM, geojohnt@... wrote:
It seems they have not?John, with my poor English I have no idea how I should understand the above. In any case it seems you have not be the only one that did complain. That's finally why Triax *has* changed the design of their mount. Regards, Ernst |
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Charlie
Ernst, There is an eBay UK shop that has these in; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165707809847 (I have asked them before and from what I can tell, AS-100 is the designation from a Polish wholesaler. They checked the box and the instructions say it's a TDS100LG)... almost bought one instead of the Channel Master and wish I had with the problems I have had trying to get a 3 degree multifeed on that due to the width of the integrated feed!The arm came as part of the boxed set when I bought it from CPC. On Sat, 25 Feb 2023 at 14:14, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger=belponline.ch@groups.io> wrote: Dear All, |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 08:55 AM, Charlie wrote:
I gather the older Black Ultras have a longer neck, does anyone have one to measure?Charlie, thanks for that. The Inverto BLACK Ultra HGLN Quad has a neck of 50mm length. I never had a problem with that on my TD80 or TD110. The mount has been improved no question but should have one third screw in the middle (not just bumps) as a hinge for elevation tuning. With the old clamp construction (you still see that on Arne's pictures), as John experienced, tuning was close to mission impossible 2.0. I have seen the dish at the URL below. Regards, Ernst https://kamsat.co.uk/index.php/satellite-dish-triax-100cm.html |
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Charlie
Ernst, Thanks - that answers the "will it work on that dish" quite well; certainly if the illumination angle or whatever you want to term it is comparable I would expect so if it's 50mm on the neck. Guess it is time for me to get one. I think the singles may be even longer on the old model? Obviously not ideal anymore though if you want HVS-2 out of it... The mount appears to have a more cone-like elevation pivot on the 100 upon closer inspection, that may well give it some more stability too if the other part matches nicely given the cone shape. It's just a big raised dot on the 80.
That's the website of that eBay seller it would appear :)
Charlie |
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Charlie
Oh, to follow that up, just found the Inverto drawings re. the dimensions Old style single is 68.5 mm New style single 39 mm (I was close with a tape measure!) New style twin 38.3 mm New style quad 34.5 mm
So if your dish needs the LNB pushed right in that makes the quad even tighter :(
This of course all gets all the more fun when HVS-4 appears on HB13 in the future and we either need to look at monoblocks or rocket LNBs for the small separation (hopefully with most using 1m+ standard LNBs should work within reason for them) Charlie |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 10:07 AM, Charlie wrote:
That's the website of that eBay seller it would appear :)Charlie, you name it. I just looked at the price and said: Hey, my shop is cheaper. Most of the dishes sold here are even more crap than the Triax TDS100. Ernst |
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geojohnt@aol.com
Hello Ernst, Sorry that was an answer to your comment that Triax had changed the design of their dish mount. I should have said I don't think they have changed the design. I will dig out my old photos from my complaint to Triax in 2015 stored on 'another device' somewhere. Oh, and I meant to add that I think the length of the LNB support arm is/should be, at the correct length - depending on the size of the offset dish - to place any standard Universal Ku-band LNB at the focal point. Regards, John.
On Saturday, 25 February 2023 at 16:06:14 GMT, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger@...> wrote:
On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 07:36 AM, geojohnt@... wrote: It seems they have not?John, with my poor English I have no idea how I should understand the above. In any case it seems you have not be the only one that did complain. That's finally why Triax *has* changed the design of their mount. Regards, Ernst |
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geojohnt@aol.com
Charlie, >The elevation adjustment on it is the same as my TDS 80A from what I can see though and that is an absolute pig to adjust - the two bolts fit very loosely in slots & the pivot >point is again loose, a bump pressed into the back bracket which fits into a hole on the part that fits to the reflector. The azimuth flops around all over the place if you're not >careful when doing elevation, it is absolute junk still :( Thank the Lord. I'm not alone. The elevation and azimuth are held by the same bolts not singularly as in 'standard' dish clamps where you can secure Az. and El. separately. Regards, John
On Saturday, 25 February 2023 at 16:55:40 GMT, Charlie <charlie.johnson119@...> wrote:
Ernst, There is an eBay UK shop that has these in; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165707809847 (I have asked them before and from what I can tell, AS-100 is the designation from a Polish wholesaler. They checked the box and the instructions say it's a TDS100LG)... almost bought one instead of the Channel Master and wish I had with the problems I have had trying to get a 3 degree multifeed on that due to the width of the integrated feed!The arm came as part of the boxed set when I bought it from CPC. On Sat, 25 Feb 2023 at 14:14, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger=belponline.ch@groups.io> wrote: Dear All, |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:10 AM, geojohnt@... wrote:
I should have said I don't think they have changed the design.John, as I explained they have (probably in 2019). The old design you certainly talked about is the one me and Arne had shown here: https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/message/26874 Ernst |
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geojohnt@aol.com
Ernst, I've found the photos of my '2015' TD 110, attached and looking at the photos of the 'new' Triax dish clamp arrangement in the link you sent, the design doesn't seem to have changed. You need to loosen the clamp bolts to adjust the dish elevation but due to the 'semi-circular' dish rib and pole 'C' dish clamping arrangements, the dish azimuth is now able to wobble E and W a bit. With the usual dish clamping arrangement from most other manufacturers, attached, the azimuth and elevation adjustments can be done with one or the other adjustments secured. Regards, John
On Saturday, 25 February 2023 at 16:06:14 GMT, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger@...> wrote:
>it seems you have not be the only one that did complain. >That's finally why Triax *has* changed the design of their mount. Regards, Ernst |
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Charlie
John, The actual mechanics of it have changed (no "sliding rail" design anymore) but certainly the complaint of the wobble when adjusting still very much rings true. You would think it would pull itself straight within the back bracket but no.Not that adjusting azimuth also isn't very nasty what with the grip teeth in the bracket (and my wall L bracket is aluminium, bites right in). The Channel Master ain't perfect but is an absolute breeze in comparison... Attached is the mounting hardware on my TDS 80A. You can see how much slop there is by how those pen marks don't line up anymore. Charlie  
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geojohnt@aol.com
Charlie, Yes, I think you are right. Rocket LNB's would probably be required with only a 3 degree separation in satellites. Though having said that, I see that the new Black Ultra quad LNB has a much smaller feed horn aperture then the 'older' one I have. So it may well be able to 'fit in' alongside. Old LNB aperture diameter 59.50. New LNB aperture diameter 47.88 At the moment all Inverto 3 degree spacing monoblocks suggest 80 cm dishes use - for 13, 16 19 E. Regards, John
On Saturday, 25 February 2023 at 18:18:41 GMT, Charlie <charlie.johnson119@...> wrote: This of course all gets all the more fun when HVS-4 appears on HB13 in the future and we either need to look at monoblocks or rocket LNBs for the small separation (hopefully with most using 1m+ standard LNBs should work within reason for them) Charlie |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 04:28 AM, geojohnt@... wrote:
John, I do not understand why it is so hard to see that the design has actually changed. Charlie has one of these latest Triax dishes and confirms what I said. Your image shows you had the old design that me and Arne have improved with a threaded elevation rod. But there is still a problem when you set elevation with the new design. The mount should have a third horizontal center screw that keeps the dish aligned if you slightly loose the two elevation bolts. But instead of this central hinge the C like bracket has only two dots punched in (clearly visible on Charlie's first image above). These dots can easily slide out of the existing center hole while you try to optimize elevation making the dish divert in whatever direction. I attach three images from frames of the Triax video that show: A) There are three horizontal holes in the main steel part of the mount. B) Only two of them are stiffed with sleeves so you can tighten the bolts. C) There are only two dots punched in used as elevation turning centers. This means to make a TDSxxx usable you have to drill precisely trough these two center dots and add a third screw (and sleeve). You must be equipped and mechanically skilled to do that at home. It shows the well known problem we have with all of these consumer grade TV dishes. Even with my Gibertini OP 125L I had (and still have) such problems. John, before you order the Gibertini OP 125L you should maybe read again this whole thread (unfortunately meanwhile most images got lost). https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/topic/23184280 Charlie, thanks again for your contribution. It seems Triax sends us "Vom Regen in die Traufe". Best regards, Ernst |
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Betreff: Re: [MSG-1] Who knows the Triax TDS100LG ?
An: <MSG-1@groups.io> Von: "Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io" <ernst.lobsiger@...> Datum: Sun, 26 Feb 2023 09:19:52 -0800 Antwort an: <MSG-1@groups.io> It seems Triax sends us "Vom Regen in die Traufe".This is "Vp, Regen unter Umgehung der Rtaufe direkt in die Güllerinne". I refrain from offering a translation. Seems I can be pretty happy with my Wavefrontier T90, sounds like the brandname of a tank... Whoooooosh!! Today at around noon (UT 11.00) all received channels hit the ground floor here. An hour later, everythin looked good again. Sounds like Sun outage. Cheers, U. |
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Von: "Ulrich G. Kliegis" <Ulrich.Kliegis@...>
An: <MSG-1@groups.io> Datum: Sun, 26 Feb 2023 19:36:58 +0100 Betreff: Re: [MSG-1] Who knows the Triax TDS100LG ? Priorität: normal Antwort an: <MSG-1@groups.io> This is "Vp, RegenSorry, any automatic translation will fail. Try "Vom Regen unter Umgehung der Traufe direkt in die Güllerinne" The old culture of re-reading what I have written before sending it off needs a brush-up. Cheers, U. |
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Ernst Lobsiger
On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 10:53 AM, Ulrich G. Kliegis wrote:
"Vom Regen unter Umgehung der Traufe direkt in die Güllerinne"Ulli, My stronger version so far was ""Vom Regen unter Umgehung der Traufe direkt in die Sch....." Cheers, Ernst |
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geojohnt@aol.com
Hello Ernst and Charlie, Yes, sorry. I can't see for looking. Triax have changed from the ribbed curve dish plate and 'C' clamps to a flat spine and flat clamp. I would have thought this would work 'much better.' Regarding getting a larger dish, I've got my fingers crossed for Eutelsat 10-B. Since I get around 13.7 dB SNR on BAS/HVS-1 with a 1 m dish on E 10-A, it shouldn't be worse on 10-B(?) and possibly a slight improvement. We shall see. Regards, John.
On Sunday, 26 February 2023 at 17:19:56 GMT, Ernst Lobsiger via groups.io <ernst.lobsiger@...> wrote:
On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 04:28 AM, geojohnt@... wrote: John, I do not understand why it is so hard to see that the design has actually changed. Charlie has one of these latest Triax dishes and confirms what I said. Your image shows you had the old design that me and Arne have improved with a threaded elevation rod. But there is still a problem when you set elevation with the new design. The mount should have a third horizontal center screw that keeps the dish aligned if you slightly loose the two elevation bolts. But instead of this central hinge the C like bracket has only two dots punched in (clearly visible on Charlie's first image above). These dots can easily slide out of the existing center hole while you try to optimize elevation making the dish divert in whatever direction. I attach three images from frames of the Triax video that show: A) There are three horizontal holes in the main steel part of the mount. B) Only two of them are stiffed with sleeves so you can tighten the bolts. C) There are only two dots punched in used as elevation turning centers. This means to make a TDSxxx usable you have to drill precisely trough these two center dots and add a third screw (and sleeve). You must be equipped and mechanically skilled to do that at home. It shows the well known problem we have with all of these consumer grade TV dishes. Even with my Gibertini OP 125L I had (and still have) such problems. John, before you order the Gibertini OP 125L you should maybe read again this whole thread (unfortunately meanwhile most images got lost). https://groups.io/g/MSG-1/topic/23184280 Charlie, thanks again for your contribution. It seems Triax sends us "Vom Regen in die Traufe". Best regards, Ernst |
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Charlie
13.7 dB is the sort of level I'd love to see! On my 1m wide (84cm equiv elliptical) Channel Master with its proper matched feed & C120 LNB I usually see sort of 12.0-12.2 dB on a clear day and a little more at night. Not great with the step down HVS-2 saw on my setup migrating to C3, and that was after replacing the LNB with iffy vertical pol :( Barely an improvement over the TDS80A (which is only really 70...) although in strong wind that did show some loss, the Channel Master with its moulded fibreglass construction does not give half of a monkey's and keeps right on like nothing is happening.
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