Topics

SNR/Link Margin up again.


geojohnt@...
 

All,

It's happened again.

I didn't see this till 17:00 UTC when my SNR was peaking at 13.6 dB.
Looking at 'Austria at this time there were two large thunder storms but only in the south of the country not at the usual uplink in the NE.

Looking at David's 'Europe logs' there was an extended period of 'increased signal' this afternoon seen across Europe.

Anyone know where the location of the second/ary uplink station?

Regards,
John T.




David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

All,

It's happened again.

I didn't see this till 17:00 UTC when my SNR was peaking at 13.6 dB.
Looking at 'Austria at this time there were two large thunder storms but only in the south of the country not at the usual uplink in the NE.

Looking at David's 'Europe logs' there was an extended period of 'increased signal' this afternoon seen across Europe.

Anyone know where the location of the second/ary uplink station?

Regards,
John T.
=============================

John,

The two stations are located in Vienna (backup) and Aflenz (prime). This page took a little finding!

https://www.4rfv.com/WHKYMIABWVBH/342/telekom-austria-group-renews-partnership-with-newtec-for-eumetsats-eumetcast-upgrade.htm


This page will also be of interest:

https://www.eumetsat.int/website/home/TechnicalBulletins/EUMETCast/DAT_3569223.html

Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@...
Twitter: @gm8arv


geojohnt@...
 

David,

Thanks for the links.

Firstly, the two uplinks are not that far away from one another - Aflenz being to the SW of Vienna, and a super cell storm such as can occur in Europe could effect both locations at the same time.

I Google mapped Vienna Arsenal - which is in the centre of Vienna near the Hauptbahnhof and there appears to be just one 'large' dish in the car park of the Arsenal. 

Secondly, thanks for the EUMETSAT link - very interesting information.
I wonder why I've never been directed to this document on my several several complaints over the years regarding SNR variations.

The document states Link Margin is the most important parameter - I agree, of course, my Link Margin level follows variations of my SNR level precisely.
0.1 dB drop in SNR = 0.1 dB drop in Link Margin, etc.

Yesterday's considerable 'upgrade' in SNR/LM seen by many, ran from ~ 12:45 to 17:45 UTC.

Regards,
John.

++++++++++++++++++++++


John,

The two stations are located in Vienna (backup) and Aflenz (prime).  This 
page took a little finding!

  https://www.4rfv.com/WHKYMIABWVBH/342/telekom-austria-group-renews-partnership-with-newtec-for-eumetsats-eumetcast-upgrade.htm


This page will also be of interest:

  https://www.eumetsat.int/website/home/TechnicalBulletins/EUMETCast/DAT_3569223.html

Cheers,

David

-- 
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@...
Twitter: @gm8arv 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++


-----Original Message-----
From: David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺 via groups.io <david-taylor@...>
To: msg-1@groups.io
Sent: Thu, 30 Jul 2020 9:18
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] SNR/Link Margin up again.

All,

It's happened again.

I didn't see this till 17:00 UTC when my SNR was peaking at 13.6 dB.
Looking at 'Austria at this time there were two large thunder storms but
only in the south of the country not at the usual uplink in the NE.

Looking at David's 'Europe logs' there was an extended period of 'increased
signal' this afternoon seen across Europe.

Anyone know where the location of the second/ary uplink station?

Regards,
John T.
=============================




-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-



David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

David,

Thanks for the links.

Firstly, the two uplinks are not that far away from one another - Aflenz being to the SW of Vienna, and a super cell storm such as can occur in Europe could effect both locations at the same time.

I Google mapped Vienna Arsenal - which is in the centre of Vienna near the Hauptbahnhof and there appears to be just one 'large' dish in the car park of the Arsenal.

Secondly, thanks for the EUMETSAT link - very interesting information.
I wonder why I've never been directed to this document on my several several complaints over the years regarding SNR variations.

The document states Link Margin is the most important parameter - I agree, of course, my Link Margin level follows variations of my SNR level precisely.
0.1 dB drop in SNR = 0.1 dB drop in Link Margin, etc.

Yesterday's considerable 'upgrade' in SNR/LM seen by many, ran from ~ 12:45 to 17:45 UTC.

Regards,
John.
===================================

Yes, there's less separation between Aflenz and Wien then between Usingen and Fucino. About 115 km. Perhaps the unlink dish is somewhere near that large tower with the helipad ( 16.390384° 48.195655°), but I don't know. Perhaps you mean the dish to the west of that building? I may be completely wrong!

I wonder whether that document was created because we asked questions! I recall one incident when it appeared that stations towards the west of the satellite footprint had lost signal strength which was discussed with EUMETSAT in detail.

Glad you're finding the comparisons useful!

Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@...
Twitter: @gm8arv


geojohnt@...
 

David,

Mmmmm.

I'm presuming that Google Maps are orientated to the north so the only large dish I can see at The Arsenal is in the car park on the eastern side of the site.
And, if the 'map' is orientated north, the dish is pointing SW - W?

I can't see any other 'large,' as would presumably be required for this uplink dishes, pointing in a 'southerly' direction.

[Images copyright of Google maps]

????

Regarding 'signal strength,' I found the article interesting reading about 'backing off' a transponder as part of fine tuning a transponder and not pushing it into the non linear curve.
And of course, when the bandwidth was increased I guess the apparent 'signal level decreased?' 

10:00 UTC and already 32.3 degrees down here. 

Regards,
John.

+++++++++++++++++++



Yes, there's less separation between Aflenz and Wien then between Usingen 
and Fucino.  About 115 km.  Perhaps the unlink dish is somewhere near that 
large tower with the helipad ( 16.390384° 48.195655°), but I don't know. 
Perhaps you mean the dish to the west of that building?  I may be completely 
wrong!

I wonder whether that document was created because we asked questions!  I 
recall one incident when it appeared that stations towards the west of the 
satellite footprint had lost signal strength which was discussed with 
EUMETSAT in detail.

Glad you're finding the comparisons useful!


Cheers,
David
-- 
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web: https://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@...
Twitter: @gm8arv


-----Original Message-----
From: David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺 via groups.io <david-taylor@...>
To: MSG-1@groups.io
Sent: Thu, 30 Jul 2020 14:38
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] SNR/Link Margin up again.

David,

Thanks for the links.

Firstly, the two uplinks are not that far away from one another - Aflenz
being to the SW of Vienna, and a super cell storm such as can occur in
Europe could effect both locations at the same time.

I Google mapped Vienna Arsenal - which is in the centre of Vienna near the
Hauptbahnhof and there appears to be just one 'large' dish in the car park
of the Arsenal.

Secondly, thanks for the EUMETSAT link - very interesting information.
I wonder why I've never been directed to this document on my several several
complaints over the years regarding SNR variations.

The document states Link Margin is the most important parameter - I agree,
of course, my Link Margin level follows variations of my SNR level
precisely.
0.1 dB drop in SNR = 0.1 dB drop in Link Margin, etc.

Yesterday's considerable 'upgrade' in SNR/LM seen by many, ran from ~ 12:45
to 17:45 UTC.

Regards,
John.
===================================





-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-



geojohnt@...
 

David,

Interesting?

  • A1 Teleport Aflenz is the only earth station in Austria
  • The satellite ground station was first opened in 1980
  • More than 50 antennas on an area of roughly 6,500 m2 send data at the speed of light to satellites located 36,000 km away
  • A photovoltaic park generates the electric power for the satellite station
  • Award-winning Teleport is an architectural masterpiece realized by Gustav Peichl


Regards,
John.




Hartmut Schulla
 

The Eumetcast backup station is located in Vienna at the ORF-Center, 1120 Wien.

 

 

Von: MSG-1@groups.io <MSG-1@groups.io> Im Auftrag von geojohnt via groups.io
Gesendet: Freitag, 31. Juli 2020 12:14
An: MSG-1@groups.io
Betreff: Re: [MSG-1] SNR/Link Margin up again.

 

David,

 

Interesting?

 

  • A1 Teleport Aflenz is the only earth station in Austria
  • The satellite ground station was first opened in 1980
  • More than 50 antennas on an area of roughly 6,500 m2 send data at the speed of light to satellites located 36,000 km away
  • A photovoltaic park generates the electric power for the satellite station
  • Award-winning Teleport is an architectural masterpiece realized by Gustav Peichl

 

 

Regards,

John.

 

 

 


geojohnt@...
 

Hello Hartmut,

Thanks very much for your clarification.

Totally off topic, but thinking about ORF, I can still remember the interval time signal from Radio Wein before the news when on a school holiday to Austria in the late 50's or early 60's on a small Perdio transistor radio I had.

Der, der a der, der a der, dah, dah.

Can't find a recording anywhere but found this which will bring back lots of memories to all you, like me, child SW Listeners:


Many 'classics,' and remembered 'jingles' including Vatican Radio - which is still played, I believe.
And of course especially in those days from countries 'behind the Iron Curtain.'

Best wishes,
John.

++++++++++++++++


-----Original Message-----
From: Hartmut Schulla <mail@...>
To: MSG-1@groups.io <MSG-1@groups.io>
Sent: Fri, 31 Jul 2020 11:29
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] SNR/Link Margin up again.

The Eumetcast backup station is located in Vienna at the ORF-Center, 1120 Wien.
 
 
Von: MSG-1@groups.io <MSG-1@groups.io> Im Auftrag von geojohnt via groups.io
Gesendet: Freitag, 31. Juli 2020 12:14
An: MSG-1@groups.io
Betreff: Re: [MSG-1] SNR/Link Margin up again.
 
David,
 
Interesting?
 
  • A1 Teleport Aflenz is the only earth station in Austria
  • The satellite ground station was first opened in 1980
  • More than 50 antennas on an area of roughly 6,500 m2 send data at the speed of light to satellites located 36,000 km away
  • A photovoltaic park generates the electric power for the satellite station
  • Award-winning Teleport is an architectural masterpiece realized by Gustav Peichl
 
 
Regards,
John.