Date   

Re: Telique log files (was: Re: Missing Segments)

Roger Mawhinney <roger@...>
 

David
It might be a worthwhile experiment to see how your DVB card would run in
your main system. I have a very heavily loaded single PC system and have no
lost segments over the past few days. Could it be that users with 2 PCs are
using a reasonably old (low performance)PC as the receiver? If performance
is essentially disk bound, then even simple things like hard disk buffers
and faster I/O buses which have improved dramatically over the past year or
so will make a huge difference, possibly to the point where a heavily loaded
single "modern" PC can out perform the reception only duties of a less
capable PC.

Have any 2 PC users tried a direct comparison with single high performance
PC configuration?
Roger

|

|-----Original Message-----
|From: David Taylor [mailto:david-taylor@...]
|Sent: 13 November 2003 16:49
|To: MSG-1@...
|
|--- In MSG-1@..., "Peter Benney" <tugboat@g...> wrote:
|[]
|> I had bad segment loss today on the 0200, 0215, 0230 cycles and
|the 0245 cycle was reported missing.
|>
|> The Tellique log shows a mass of "missed messages" and several
|error messages...
|>
|> "Failed to open data channel 'Eumetsat Data Channel 2', address
|224.223.222.21:2511
|> (wrong interface address 192.168.238.238?)"
|>
|> I note the B2C2 interface share IRQ18 with my NIC. I think if I
|move the NIC to another PCI slot it may well get another IRQ.
|
|I don't know. On my 1GHz Pentium III system (ASUS CLUSL2-C
|motherboard), today I removed the DVB card (i.e. uninstalled it in
|software) and moved it to a different slot.
|
|On re-installing it all the IRQs are about the same and still
|shared - IRQ 9 is (ISA) ACPI compliant system, (PCI) DVB card, sound
|card, video card and network card. I wonder if I ought to
|have "Plug-and-play OS" enabled in the BIOS?
|
|On the 2.8GHz Pentium 4 system with its ASUS P4P800 motherboard, the
|IRQs are (PCI) 5 Hauppauge audio driver, 11 USB controller, 16 video
|card, 17 sound card, 18 disk, 19 USB, 20 IEEE 1394, 21 DVB card and
|Hauppauge video driver, 22 network and added-in SCSI card. Where do
|these IRQs above 15 comre from? [And no, I am not recommended that
|anyone use a DVB card on such a fully loaded system - mine is just
|an experiment).
|
|Cheers,
|David
|
|
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Re: Security update?

Alan Sewards <alan.sewards@...>
 

John,
I downloaded and installed this update today (after setting a System
Restore point!) and had no problems with the restart.

Best regards - Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Parkins" <kvp@...>
To: "MSG-1 Mailing List" <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2003 12:51 PM
Subject: [MSG-1] Security update?


Hello All,

I installed the latest Microsoft security update (KB824145) to my
processing
computer this morning and it got stuck in a re-booting loop once it
had fired itself up. I got it going in safe mode and restored back to
yesterday and now it seems fine. Anyone else had a problem with this
update?




--
Best regards,
John mailto:kvp@...




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MSG-1-unsubscribe@...



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Re: Reports from a least affected user

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

I don't suppose it would help but has anyone affected by the
problems (Windows XP) tried adding to the boot file, the very last
line, /pcilock - according to Microsoft knowledge base this can
help with PCI IRQ conflicts.

[boot loader]
timeout=2
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)&#92;WINNT
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)&#92;WINNT="Microsoft Windows XP
Professional" /fastdetect /pcilock
^^^^^^^^
Didn't know about that one, James. As I read it though, this means
that you have to sort out the IRQs yourself first, and then Windows
doesn't touch the result.

Talking of interrupts - the 188 byte packets come down at a 27.5MS/s
rate. What is the resulting bit rate? 100Mb/s? One bit every
10ns? So a 188 byte packet lasts 2us? There's no way a PC could
handle 500K interrupts a second! So what is the packet size and
interrupt rate? How many packets fit into the on-card buffer?

Cheers,
David


Re: lost/delayed segments

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

- is there a possibility to figure out where the segments are lost
(without waiting for some eumetsat messages) ?

I would love to see a real-time Web page with this information - how
about it Eumetsat?

- was there a change in the dissimination in the past 3 days?
Not that I know of.

- if there are some segments delayed, how long it makes sense to
wait for them. my image processor is adjusted, to wait at maximum 2
hours for delayed segments. segments ariving more then 2 hours after
the first segment are ignored. may this 2 hour threshold cause the
lost segments?

When data is updated every 15 minutes, how much use is two-hour old
data? The bandwidth of the system is not even twice that required
for a real-time data stream, so more than one full cycle of catch-up
is unlikely, I think.

By the way, please be a little patient with the moderators - to
avoid spam new member's posts are moderated and could take a few
hours to appear.

Cheers,
David


Telique log files (was: Re: Missing Segments)

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "Peter Benney" <tugboat@g...> wrote:
[]
I had bad segment loss today on the 0200, 0215, 0230 cycles and
the 0245 cycle was reported missing.

The Tellique log shows a mass of "missed messages" and several
error messages...

"Failed to open data channel 'Eumetsat Data Channel 2', address
224.223.222.21:2511
(wrong interface address 192.168.238.238?)"

I note the B2C2 interface share IRQ18 with my NIC. I think if I
move the NIC to another PCI slot it may well get another IRQ.

I don't know. On my 1GHz Pentium III system (ASUS CLUSL2-C
motherboard), today I removed the DVB card (i.e. uninstalled it in
software) and moved it to a different slot.

On re-installing it all the IRQs are about the same and still
shared - IRQ 9 is (ISA) ACPI compliant system, (PCI) DVB card, sound
card, video card and network card. I wonder if I ought to
have "Plug-and-play OS" enabled in the BIOS?

On the 2.8GHz Pentium 4 system with its ASUS P4P800 motherboard, the
IRQs are (PCI) 5 Hauppauge audio driver, 11 USB controller, 16 video
card, 17 sound card, 18 disk, 19 USB, 20 IEEE 1394, 21 DVB card and
Hauppauge video driver, 22 network and added-in SCSI card. Where do
these IRQs above 15 comre from? [And no, I am not recommended that
anyone use a DVB card on such a fully loaded system - mine is just
an experiment).

Cheers,
David


Telique log files (was: Re: Missing Segments)

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "David Strickland" <David@s...> wrote:
[]
Final thought of the day but I have yet to check it out. I
know we are well out of the equinox but several times I have lost
segments on bright clear sunny days with no wind or rain like today
around 1100-1140. I wonder if the LNB is suffering from being heated?

Well, that's where the least stable oscillator is, and it is most
exposed to the elements. But if things were as bad as they
sometimes seem, surely satellite digital TV would not be accepted by
customers?

This I will check at the next opportunity. My dish is a low cost
88cm and is probably only coated with normal paint ( a Timestep
dish). Paints designed for dishes are non reflective to Infra Red so
it is a possibility. Here in the south with a good look at the Sat
one would not expect signal losses to this extent. The level
indications and SNR are good and should be enough.

Be very aware of stating DVB card version and driver version when
comparing "signal quality" or SNR readings.

Removal of the WiFi card and replacement with Ethernet to a WAP
has seriously reduced the collection PC processor load with all
loadings well below 20% peak. Averages are down below 5% for
processor, disc and pageing. No other unnecessary services are
running but this seems to have had little effect on the number of
lost segments. By the way no segment losses since 1315 so in my case
it does seem there is a time relationship for at least some of the
segment loss.
I really don't know what to blame right now. The drivers behave
rather differently in terms of producing a CPU load between V4.2.2
and V4.2.8, but whether this procudes a difference if the missing
segment rate I don't know. Whether it is the hardware, the drivers,
the DVB Receiver application, or the Tellique software that is the
weak link, I don't know!

Minimisng any extra CPU load certainly helps!

Cheers,
David


Skynet.sys version - today's tests

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

Folks,

Today I changed the SkyCard drivers on my main Receiver PC from
V4.2.8 (as supplied with the V2.6B DVB card) to the earlier V4.2.2
drivers (as supplied with the V2.3 card).

There are two differences that I have noticed:

- the reported signal level is a LOT lower. What was yesterday 85%
quality and sometimes 15dB SNR is now 52% quality and 8.4dB SNR.
This is from the same physical feed into the same physical card.
From a support perspective, it makes it essential to know what card
and drivers are being used when someone reports a signal-level
problem. I guess some of you were already aware of this, but it
came as a shock to me!

- the CPU peaks that I was seeing when receiving data files (I
think) seem to have completely vanished. Well, that is perhaps an
exaggeration. There is a background CPU activity of 1-2-3% (using
Task Manager), with peaks up to perhaps 8%. However, those peaks
are when the Processing PC is dragging files off the Receiver PC.
There are no longer any obvious peaks during file reception (as
opposed to 8% during network activity).

As far as I am aware all other software is the same, Windows 2000
Prof SP4, Zone Alarm, eTrust anti-virus. As yet, I have no feeling
for the comparitive missing segment rate of the two systems (the
very high winds forecast for the next two days might reveal that),
but the experience again urges me to caution users against changing
any part of the system.

So far, just on missing segments, yesterday the main system missed
one segment which was OK on the backup system. Today the backup
system missed two segments which were OK on the (revised) main
system.

Cheers,
David


May I not regret saying this....

Lawrence <lawrence@...>
 

So far this morning (and also some of yesterday evening) I have not seen
any holes in my images. There has *always* been a hole in the 9.45am
HRIT image set - but not today.

Long may it continue.

Lawrence


PAYMENT PROBLEMS

BARRY DAY <barryday@...>
 

Hello all , can anyone tell me the best way to pay for my software to
EUMETSAT, I would like to do by VISA but on my invoice there donsn't seem to
be anyway off doing this.
Thanks
Barry Day(G3WIS)
barryday@...


Re: driver for technisat skystar2 dvb card

maxrpunkt
 

Hi, how can i figure out, which skystar card version i am using?
regards, max


DVB Dishes

Douglas Deans <douglas@...>
 

All those in the UK looking for dish wind tests should not be disappointed
in the next few days....assuming you can find them afterwards !!
Looks particularly nasty for the west.

Regards
Douglas.


Re: Reports from a least affected user

a_van_belle
 

I might be lucky, up to cycle 2300 I had not a single segment missing
today !

Running receive-only on PIII @ 1 Ghz with 256 Mb mem./ 40 Gb disc /
100 Mbit NIC
W2K sp3, Skystar v2.3 SQ=70%, driver 4.2.2, TQ 2.3.1,
eToken on trial with RTE 3.00.
HRIT, LRIT and ATOVS PID on, all channels on.

Thanks to the people at Eumetsat !

Greetings,
Arne van Belle


Re: Reports from a least affected user

Robert Moore
 

Just to cheer up all of those who have had problems - today I had only two
segments reported missing, and they were there anyhow! So perfect reception
after a week of misery.

Robert



Quoting James Brown <satellite@...>:

I am one of those who seem to be least affected by the problems in MSG
reception, so I just wondered if folk would be interested in seeing the
log file for today thus far. It covers the period of 9:15 this morning
to 20:00 this evening.

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing cycles report
0000
0015
0030
0045
0100
0115
0130
0145
0200
0215
0230
0245
0300
0315
0330
0345
0400
0415
0430
0445
0500
0515
0530
0545
0600
0615
0630
0645
0700
0715
0730
0745
0800
0815
0830
0845
2015
2030
2045
2100
2115
2130
2145
2200
2215
2230
2245
2300
2315
2330
2345

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Late segments report
(no report)

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing HRIT & LRIT segments report
(none)

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing rebroadcast & derived segments report
(none)

Cheers,
James
--
James Brown


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------------------------------
Professor Robert Moore
Department of Sociology, Social Policy
and Social Work Studies
The University of Liverpool
Eleanor Rathbone Building
Bedford Street South
Liverpool
L69 7ZA

tel and fax: 44 (0) 1352 714456


Re: Reports from a least affected user

Trevor Davies <g0jix@...>
 

Another least affected operator ( I think ) reporting another good day.
MSG DMG report attached,its easier than typing.Notes added where appropriate.

Norton has scoured for the little blighters,
so if you receive this one it must be clean,I think.
73 de Trevor G0JIX.
----------

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing cycles report

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Late segments report
(no report)

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing HRIT & LRIT segments report
Cycle: 0700
msg-ch01, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | I switched on sometime after
msg-ch02, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | 0700 hence these supposedly
msg-ch03, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | missing segments.
msg-ch04, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | MSG DMG decoded on segment 8
msg-ch05, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | and those I deleted before creating
msg-ch06, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 | an animated sequence.
msg-ch07, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 |
msg-ch08, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 |
msg-ch09, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 |
msg-ch10, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 |
msg-ch11, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 |
msg-ch12, seg: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 |
Cycle: 1700
msg-ch01, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 | These segments missing as I'd
msg-ch02, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 | pulled the plug after having
msg-ch03, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 | received only the first segment.
msg-ch04, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch05, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch06, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch07, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch08, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch09, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch10, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch11, seg: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 |
msg-ch12, seg: 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 |

Key: msg=HRIT lrit=LRIT
01=VIS006 02=VIS008 03=IR016 04=IR039
05=WV062 06=WV073 07=IR087 08=IR097
09=IR108 10=IR120 11=IR134 12=HRV

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing rebroadcast & derived segments report
(none)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Must have suffered from a local problem during the 0815 Cycle as I was
missing segments 1234567 Channel 11 only,but as you can see MSG DMG has not reported it.


Re: Reports from a least affected user

James Brown
 

You and I have been at this hobby for quite a time now and weather satellite
reception has always been a challenge for computers. There has always been
inexplicable variations in peoples reception all the way through.
Thanks Douglas for the longevity perspective! I still can't bear to part with the photo machine I built, nor the frame store which handled 16 image animations with 256 grey-levels, and had pixels that sparkled as the chips heated up and the timing got iffy! But I have since parted with the BBC computer which need me to learn machine code, and the Commodore Amiga which had outstanding graphics for that day - though I still have a demo disk I put together.

Ah nostalgia's not what it used to be though......

But back on topic. I'm using a single machine, loads of time doing research on the Internet, and even Norton's one button check and the anti-virus full system scan don't seem to introduce any problems. Data seems to find a way of being buffered somewhere to its heart's content, until there's time for it to catch up. I just count myself very fortunate in that respect. But as noted before, my sky card does have its very own IRQ - that could be significant.

I don't suppose it would help but has anyone affected by the problems (Windows XP) tried adding to the boot file, the very last line, /pcilock - according to Microsoft knowledge base this can help with PCI IRQ conflicts.

[boot loader]
timeout=2
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)&#92;WINNT
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)&#92;WINNT="Microsoft Windows XP
Professional" /fastdetect /pcilock
^^^^^^^^

Cheers,

James


--
James Brown


Re: Reports from a least affected user

Douglas Deans <douglas@...>
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "James Brown" <satellite@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2003 8:17 PM
Subject: [MSG-1] Reports from a least affected user


I am one of those who seem to be least affected by the problems in MSG
reception, so I just wondered if folk would be interested in seeing the
log file for today thus far. It covers the period of 9:15 this morning
to 20:00 this evening.

Thanks for that James. Yes I am exactly the same. It has been a good day.
I am also fortunate in that the only problems during recent weeks have been
those that Eumetsat have reported.
You and I have been at this hobby for quite a time now and weather satellite
reception has always been a challenge for computers. There has always been
inexplicable variations in peoples reception all the way through.
Remember Timestep's great programs. I for one had few problems but there
were those with synch problems, some serious some less so. You and I
resolved minor pixel movement by utilising USB/Serial port adaptor with
great success (until XP came along).
There was the mystery of why some soundcards (and on-board chips) worked
well when decoding wave files, whilst others had synch problems from time to
time (I experienced that).
So MSG reception joins a formidable list. The truth is that when either
receiving something where synchronisation is critical or receiving huge
amounts of very fast data, anything interrupting is a disaster......
unfortunately our computers thrive on interrupts.... some set-ups (and
motherboard designs) seem to deal better with it.
Unlike David, I am no expert, but I am sure his thoughts re buffer
arrangements are most valid.

Regards
Douglas.


Reports from a least affected user

James Brown
 

I am one of those who seem to be least affected by the problems in MSG reception, so I just wondered if folk would be interested in seeing the log file for today thus far. It covers the period of 9:15 this morning to 20:00 this evening.

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing cycles report
0000
0015
0030
0045
0100
0115
0130
0145
0200
0215
0230
0245
0300
0315
0330
0345
0400
0415
0430
0445
0500
0515
0530
0545
0600
0615
0630
0645
0700
0715
0730
0745
0800
0815
0830
0845
2015
2030
2045
2100
2115
2130
2145
2200
2215
2230
2245
2300
2315
2330
2345

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Late segments report
(no report)

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing HRIT & LRIT segments report
(none)

_______________________
Date: 2003-11-12

Missing rebroadcast & derived segments report
(none)

Cheers,
James
--
James Brown


Re: driver for technisat skystar2 dvb card

a_van_belle
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "maxrpunkt" <reuterm@l...> wrote:

the new technisat skystar2 dvb driver/software with version 4.2.8
don't works fine. resulting in a lot of lost segments and 20% lower
signal quality.
Hello Max,

Don't be fooled by the lower signal quality. The new Skystar rev2.6B
readings are simply lower compared to the old rev2.3 card.
This reading is a calculated value, it is not calibrated and may even
depend on drivers.
Have read reports that the USB box has even lower signal quality
readings.
To be sure that your Antenna/LNB/receiver/PC do work correctly try to
view sailing channel with ProgDVB, see previous messages in this list.

But one remark: The 4.2.8 driver is packed only with the new 2.6B
revision. I am not sure if this version is fully compatible with the
old card reveision. To be save better stick to the 4.2.2 driver for
older cards.
If other members do use 4.2.8 driver on Skystar rev 2.3 succesfully,
please let us know.

Greetings,
Arne van Belle


Re: Telique log files (was: Re: Missing Segments)

Peter Benney <tugboat@...>
 

- a shared IRQ line which prevents timely servicing of an interrupt
or even the loss of an interrupt?
David,

I had bad segment loss today on the 0200, 0215, 0230 cycles and the 0245 cycle was reported missing.

The Tellique log shows a mass of "missed messages" and several error messages...

"Failed to open data channel 'Eumetsat Data Channel 2', address 224.223.222.21:2511
(wrong interface address 192.168.238.238?)"

I note the B2C2 interface share IRQ18 with my NIC. I think if I move the NIC to another PCI slot it may well get another IRQ.

Peter


Telique log files (was: Re: Missing Segments)

David Strickland <David@...>
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "David Taylor" <david-taylor@b...>
wrote:
David,
I loaded my verbose files into MSWord and used 'find' to
seach
for 'missing'. Every missed segment corollates with the log. I
....
localised effects, though the signal as per Arne looks good.

Regards David S.
So what I would like to know is what "missed" means:

- a momentary break in signal?
......
It's a genuine issue, ad we really need a guide to minimising or
eliminating the problem.

Cheers,
David
David,
Final thought of the day but I have yet to check it out. I know
we are well out of the equinox but several times I have lost segments
on bright clear sunny days with no wind or rain like today around
1100-1140. I wonder if the LNB is suffering from being heated? This I
will check at the next opportunity. My dish is a low cost 88cm and is
probably only coated with normal paint ( a Timestep dish). Paints
designed for dishes are non reflective to Infra Red so it is a
possibility. Here in the south with a good look at the Sat one would
not expect signal losses to this extent. The level indications and
SNR are good and should be enough. Removal of the WiFi card and
replacement with Ethernet to a WAP has seriously reduced the
collection PC processor load with all loadings well below 20% peak.
Averages are down below 5% for processor, disc and pageing. No other
unnecessary services are running but this seems to have had little
effect on the number of lost segments. By the way no segment losses
since 1315 so in my case it does seem there is a time relationship
for at least some of the segment loss.

Regards David S.