Date   

Re: FSD

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "Douglas Deans" <douglas@d...> wrote:
The first 21.00 (GOES 9) are the same as the 18.00 using the new
file naming convention.

I wouldn't waste programming time, David, until you get a
definitive answer on this from Eumetsat.

Douglas.
Well, I couldn't let my users down, could I?

However, changing the program to recongnise those file names has
revealed that the images are incorrect. They appear offset to the
west, and the left and right parts of the image appear different. I
don't believe this is due to the program. I also notice a higher
rate of missing segments (on the MSG-1 HRIT/LRIT data) that I would
expect due to weather effects, so I would not put this one down to
my program.

I'll put the beta up on the Web site so you can see what I mean.

Is anyone else seeing a higher-than-expected missing segment rate?
(You can check today's data with the Tools, Missing segments
report... if you change the date).

Cheers,
David


Re: FSD

Luca Bertagnolio <lucaberta@...>
 

Didn't they say that on the 24th there was some ground segment
maintenance work to be done? I hope it's more than changing the
filename of the FSD data! :-)

Luca

--- In MSG-1@..., "David Taylor" <david-taylor@b...>
wrote:
Is anyone else seeing a higher-than-expected missing segment rate?


Re: FSD

Alan Sewards <alan.sewards@...>
 

Apropos of this, Eumetsat don't seem to be making any (or much) use of the
Messages capability in the MSG dissemination. What messages there are are
usually out of date, the standard one in the Admin Messages could as well be
in the Timetable section, and there is rarely if ever any News. I get the
impression either that it is difficult to insert these messages, or that the
mode of operation does not include sending out information via them. Be nice
if someone thought about this!

Best regards - Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Taylor" <david-taylor@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 11:38 PM
Subject: [MSG-1] Re: FSD


--- In MSG-1@..., "Douglas Deans" <douglas@d...> wrote:
The first 21.00 (GOES 9) are the same as the 18.00 using the new
file naming convention.

I wouldn't waste programming time, David, until you get a
definitive answer on this from Eumetsat.

Douglas.
Well, I couldn't let my users down, could I?

However, changing the program to recongnise those file names has
revealed that the images are incorrect. They appear offset to the
west, and the left and right parts of the image appear different. I
don't believe this is due to the program. I also notice a higher
rate of missing segments (on the MSG-1 HRIT/LRIT data) that I would
expect due to weather effects, so I would not put this one down to
my program.

I'll put the beta up on the Web site so you can see what I mean.

Is anyone else seeing a higher-than-expected missing segment rate?
(You can check today's data with the Tools, Missing segments
report... if you change the date).

Cheers,
David



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
MSG-1-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




Extra files

Paul Telco <paul@...>
 

Hello Group,

Is it normal to receive amsua, amsub and hirs data along with HRIT, LRIT and FSD?

David Taylor's MSG Data Manager does a thorough job of retrieving HRIT, LRIT and FSD from my remote receiver PC and deleting them when decoded. Now, after about three weeks of operation, I'm left with thousands of amsua, amsub and hirs files in the 'Received' folder.

Presumably this is image data. Could it be decoded into images?

Paul


Re: FSD

Douglas Deans <douglas@...>
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Sewards" <alan.sewards@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 8:26 AM
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] Re: FSD


Apropos of this, Eumetsat don't seem to be making any (or much) use of the
Messages capability in the MSG dissemination. What messages there are are
usually out of date, the standard one in the Admin Messages could as well
be
in the Timetable section, and there is rarely if ever any News. I get the
impression either that it is difficult to insert these messages, or that
the
mode of operation does not include sending out information via them. Be
nice
if someone thought about this!

Best regards - Alan
To be fair Eumetsat have a relatively small team working on this and I
suspect when they have some busy days (such as Monday and Tuesday) admin
comes second .... it is a trial and does not carry the importance (and
probably staffing) required by the 3 operational satellites.
But you are right the admin is helpful as we are also fine tuning our
systems and wondering if it us or them !

Regards
Douglas.


Messages

Douglas Deans <douglas@...>
 

I also meant to say in my previous mail that I receive quite a number of
e-mails direct. For example I received one from OPS this morning advising
me of the FSD problems and saying they hoped to have it rectified soon. I
mention this as I know some people do not get those messages. It was an
optional service offered at the time of registration etc. It's very useful.
My feeling is that Eumetsat are using this more to alleviate the engineers
workload.

Regards
Douglas.


Re: Extra files

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

Is it normal to receive amsua, amsub and hirs data along with
HRIT, LRIT and FSD?

David Taylor's MSG Data Manager does a thorough job of retrieving
HRIT, LRIT and FSD from my remote receiver PC and deleting them when
decoded. Now, after about three weeks of operation, I'm left with
thousands of amsua, amsub and hirs files in the 'Received' folder.

Presumably this is image data. Could it be decoded into images?

Paul
Yes, you can use my ATOVS reader to decode this data. You can write
a small batch file to move the data from the Receiver PC to the
Processing PC and decode it there. I am keen to make more us of
this data than just image decoding, and am looking for input. For
more information, please see:

http://www.satsignal.net => Satellite Tools, ATOVS Reader

http://www.satsignal.net => Weather Satellites, MSG-1 and ATOVS

Trial licences are available for the software. If you don't want to
get this data, please remove PID 500 (01F4 hex).

Cheers,
David


Re: Extra files EARS/ATOVS -Amsua, Hirs

mdrapes2003
 

Yes I think it would be great if the file handling for the
retransmitted NOAA Amsua and Hirs files could be built in to MSG
Manager in the future to take care of all those files MSG transmits.
The ATOVs Reader is good for viewing but does not look after the file
handling at present.

It might be worthwhile to have an overlay option for putting ATOVs
image sections over HRIT images.

Cheers
Mark




--- In MSG-1@..., "David Taylor" <david-taylor@b...>
wrote:
Is it normal to receive amsua, amsub and hirs data along with
HRIT, LRIT and FSD?

David Taylor's MSG Data Manager does a thorough job of retrieving
HRIT, LRIT and FSD from my remote receiver PC and deleting them
when
decoded. Now, after about three weeks of operation, I'm left with
thousands of amsua, amsub and hirs files in the 'Received' folder.

Presumably this is image data. Could it be decoded into images?

Paul
Yes, you can use my ATOVS reader to decode this data. You can
write
a small batch file to move the data from the Receiver PC to the
Processing PC and decode it there. I am keen to make more us of
this data than just image decoding, and am looking for input. For
more information, please see:

http://www.satsignal.net => Satellite Tools, ATOVS Reader

http://www.satsignal.net => Weather Satellites, MSG-1 and ATOVS

Trial licences are available for the software. If you don't want
to
get this data, please remove PID 500 (01F4 hex).

Cheers,
David


Re: Extra files EARS/ATOVS -Amsua, Hirs

Douglas Deans <douglas@...>
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "mdrapes2003" <mdrapes2003@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 1:13 PM
Subject: [MSG-1] Re: Extra files EARS/ATOVS -Amsua, Hirs



Yes I think it would be great if the file handling for the
retransmitted NOAA Amsua and Hirs files could be built in to MSG
Manager in the future to take care of all those files MSG transmits.
The ATOVs Reader is good for viewing but does not look after the file
handling at present.

It might be worthwhile to have an overlay option for putting ATOVs
image sections over HRIT images.

Cheers
Mark
Hello Mark

Perhaps there is some misunderstanding here. The ATOVS data has nothing to
do with MSG. Last year Eumetsat started their Eumetcast service to provide
ATOVS (vertical sounding data... not images) from a range of ground
receiving stations. You can only receive the data if you apply and register
with Eumetsat. The data does not come down in any of the MSG data streams
but comes down on its own, Eumetsat Data Channel 1.
I do agree however that the excellent file management options would be
useful in the ATOVS reader, but ATOVS must be kept quite separate from MSG.

Regards
Douglas.


Re: Extra files EARS/ATOVS -Amsua, Hirs

mdrapes2003
 

There is a good explanation of what the AMSU-A/B(active Microwave)
and HIRS (Active Infrared) instruments do on the Eumetsat site:


http://www.eumetsat.de/en/index.html?
area=left7.html&body=/en/dps/atovs.html&a=770&b=1&c=700&d=700&e=0

(the above should be one line to paste in to your browser)

Mark


Re: Extra files EARS/ATOVS -Amsua, Hirs

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "mdrapes2003" <mdrapes2003@y...> wrote:

Yes I think it would be great if the file handling for the
retransmitted NOAA Amsua and Hirs files could be built in to MSG
Manager in the future to take care of all those files MSG
transmits.
The ATOVs Reader is good for viewing but does not look after the
file
handling at present.

It might be worthwhile to have an overlay option for putting ATOVs
image sections over HRIT images.
Folks, please can we take discussion of non MSG-1 topics to a
different list? Discussion of future updates to my ATOVS Reader is
perahps best on the SatSignal list.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SatSignal/

Thanks,
David


Re: FSD

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

--- In MSG-1@..., "Luca Bertagnolio" <lucaberta@y...>
wrote:
Didn't they say that on the 24th there was some ground segment
maintenance work to be done? I hope it's more than changing the
filename of the FSD data! :-)

Luca
Yes, and it is clear that the changes made (to hardware and
software, I understand) did not go as planned, and some unforeseen
complications have arisen. Eumetsat are looking at this problem at
the moment, but FSD has stopped until the problems are resolved.

It may be that NEWS messages telling us about the issues aren't
getting to us for some reason. Please remember this is still the
trial period.

Why I am seeing a greater than normal number of missing segments is
unknown!

Cheers,
David


Re: Equipment for receiving MSG-1

johnrigsec@...
 

In a message dated 22-09-03 08:20:11 GMT Daylight Time,
alan.sewards@... writes:

While John is busy collating the inputs from those who have participated in
the MSG-1 dissemination trials, I thought it might be of interest to
question some of the basic assumptions. The main one of these is that one
needs to have two computers, one for the reception function and one for the
decoding. Because I only had one, I had to make do with it for all
functions, and in doing so I expected I would lose some of the data.
However, as time has gone on, I have begun to realise that any data that
might have been lost due to possible overload of the single computer is
insignificant compared with data lost from other sources associated with the
dissemination trials. In fact, I did a test overnight where I stopped the
MSG DM and then restarted it at 0500UTC, so it had about 12 hours of
captured data to process, which is does in what I call 'catch-up' mode, that
is running flat out with the CPU utilization running around 80-100% on a
continuing basis. It took about two hours to process all the stored data
and, as far as I could tell by a visual inspection of the thumbnails, there
were no missing segments in either the period of stored data or in data
captured during the catch-up processing. This leads me to suspect that a
single computer is all that is needed for MSG reception, provided of course
that it has sufficient power. I should note here that I only collect seven
of the 12 HRIT channels, all the LRIT and FSD, so I do not have a full load.
I may try an experiment of collecting the full set and see if that makes any
difference. My computer is nothing special, 1800 Athlon, with 512 MB.
Because I have had great difficulty in getting two computers running
Windows XP to network properly, I am seriously considering departing from
the two-computer concept and sticking with a single one for MSG, and I feel
pretty confident that it will work. Anyone else had similar thoughts? Should
we do some serious tests to find out if two computers are really necessary?

Best regards - Alan

Alan Sewards
email: alan.sewards@...
web site: http://asewards.free.fr
Alan,

Thank you for your most useful comments.
The idea of my survey was nothing ground breaking but just to see what people
are actually using as opposed to the recommended system.

It seems to me that what you want from the new service will determine what
specification your system should be.
If you want 1/4 hourly imaging in several channels plus 1/4 or half hourly
animation
then you will require a higher spec. computer than if you just want to look
at a
specific image every half hour or hour - like good old rolling WEFAX.

Perhaps someone could answer the question as to what computer specification
(or system) one requires for running 1/4 or 1/2 hourly animation (of a
selected
channel/s) whilst also being able to receive and process the HRV and a couple
of
selected IR channels?

Regards,
John.


Re: Equipment for receiving MSG-1

johnrigsec@...
 

In a message dated 22-09-03 16:19:57 GMT Daylight Time,
alan.sewards@... writes:

Guy,
You have made my point - we don't *know* how much a second machine is
really needed. We have lots of armwaving but few facts. As it makes a big
difference when looked at in terms of thousands of users buying and
maintaining equipment, it might be a good thing if we got it right ahead of
time? (IMHO)

Best regards - Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Guy Martin" <agm@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 10:44 AM
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] Equipment for receiving MSG-1


I don't believe the Rx machine needs to be anything special, I use an Abit
KT7 with a Duron 800 and its just cruising along consuming minimal
resources. However when data arrives it does need to deal with it instantly
and not be held up by MDM decompressing or saving, it needs a 'non maskable
interrupt' in effect and MDM provides a tick box to do just this. I use a
Gigabyte GA7VKML with an Athlon 1200 in the display machine and the
processor goes to 100% when MDM is dealing with data and uses about 322/512
Mb of RAM. I really need a faster machine for this application although
having said that it does work ok with no dropped segments. A serious spec
machine may function well as a single unit and a lower grade machine could
receive data and decompress/display alternately. It is always important to
turn off services that you don't need and which consume resources as vanilla
installs come with everything turned on. Regarding XP, I'm a Win2K man and
not yet happy with XP when u!
sed outside of MS products.

Cheers, Guy
Alan,

I think we are getting to the reason for my survey - 'what do I need to
receive MSG-1 dissemination via EUMETCast?'

It seems to me that what you want from all the data available will determine
the specification of the system you go for.
And, maybe we will not fully know that till the service becomes fully
operational in
January?

I envisaged my use of MSG imaging as being a high resolution version of
WEFAX.
That is, I have it running all day as a rolling display and can look at D2
and CO1 and 2's every half hour to see what going on in Europe and to
automatically update a European
D2 animation.

Of course, MSG now gives us whole globe 1/4 hour imaging in 11 channels and I
want
it all - even if some of the channels are perhaps a little 'esoteric.'
I would suggest the channels of most interest to us are HRV and the usual IR
and WV.

I am beginning to wonder if I shouldn't have approached the issue the other
way around.
That is - this is what I want from MSG dissemination so what system do I
need?

Regards,
John Tellick.


Missing Eumetsat announcements

David J Taylor GM8ARV 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇪🇺
 

Folks, I have just heard from Eumetsat that the same problem which
has resulted FSD being wrongly disseminated has also caused the loss
of messages telling us about the problems and progress in solving
them. So the lack of News messages is not because they were not
being sent out!

Eumetsat hope to have things back to normal as soon as possible.

David


Re: Missing Eumetsat announcements

Luca Bertagnolio <lucaberta@...>
 

I was travelling so I was not receiving MSG-1 in the past days, but
today I received some data and the striking thing was the complete
absence of any ADMIN files.

I will be in California until the end of next week, let's see if when
I'll be back things will will have returned to normal.

Bye, Luca

--- In MSG-1@..., "David Taylor" <david-taylor@b...>
wrote:
Folks, I have just heard from Eumetsat that the same problem which
has resulted FSD being wrongly disseminated has also caused the
loss
of messages telling us about the problems and progress in solving
them. So the lack of News messages is not because they were not
being sent out!

Eumetsat hope to have things back to normal as soon as possible.


Re: Equipment for receiving MSG-1

Guy Martin <agm@...>
 

John, I believe a lot of people just look at the weather perhaps once a (work)day if the weather is a bit 'boring' as in the SE at the moment whereas if there are deep atlantic depressions or french thunderstorms or snow on the way then frequent images and animations are the order of the day. I tend to do this myself and I know of two keen Wefax people who have been put off at the thought of having to purchase a second machine. If one average spec machine is to be used to alternately receive files and decode/display them a useful utility would be an application that flags you when a sequence starts and when all files for that sequence are complete.

Regards, Guy

----- Original Message -----
From: johnrigsec@...
To: MSG-1@...
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] Equipment for receiving MSG-1


In a message dated 22-09-03 16:19:57 GMT Daylight Time,
alan.sewards@... writes:


I am beginning to wonder if I shouldn't have approached the issue the other
way around.
That is - this is what I want from MSG dissemination so what system do I
need?

Regards,
John Tellick.





Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
MSG-1-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

----------

http://www.gordano.com - Messaging for educators.


Re: FSD

Alan Sewards <alan.sewards@...>
 

I have seen the postings regarding the lack of FSD imagery but I have also
not received any LRIT since the morning of Sept 22nd. Is this general? I ask
because I changed machines that morning and had to move the receiver card,
DVB software, tellqiue software and the rest, so there were plenty of
opportunities for things to go wrong at my end! Isn't it strange how things
tend to go broke at the sending end when one is making changes at the
receiving end!

Regarding Douglas' comments below, I appreciate that the OPS office is
likely pressed, but email is not the best method for letting people know on
a continuing basis, particularly when one has a 24/7 satellite channel at
one's disposal. Because I have only a dial-up Internet connection, I usually
only collect email twice a day, whereas I can click on the MDM Messages tab
anytime during the day if I suspect things have gone awry.

Best regards - Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Douglas Deans" <douglas@...>
To: "MSG-1" <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] Re: FSD



----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Sewards" <alan.sewards@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 8:26 AM
Subject: Re: [MSG-1] Re: FSD


Apropos of this, Eumetsat don't seem to be making any (or much) use of
the
Messages capability in the MSG dissemination. What messages there are
are
usually out of date, the standard one in the Admin Messages could as
well
be
in the Timetable section, and there is rarely if ever any News. I get
the
impression either that it is difficult to insert these messages, or that
the
mode of operation does not include sending out information via them. Be
nice
if someone thought about this!

Best regards - Alan
To be fair Eumetsat have a relatively small team working on this and I
suspect when they have some busy days (such as Monday and Tuesday) admin
comes second .... it is a trial and does not carry the importance (and
probably staffing) required by the 3 operational satellites.
But you are right the admin is helpful as we are also fine tuning our
systems and wondering if it us or them !

Regards
Douglas.





To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
MSG-1-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




Re: Equipment for receiving MSG-1

Alan Sewards <alan.sewards@...>
 

David has made a good point here, and so has John in a related posting
(decide what you want from MSG-1 then choose the system to fit).
I have just changed my machines around with a dedicated wxsat machine doing
all MSG1 reception and processing on a 24/7 basis. It is networked to my
main PC which has GSS and all my other software on it and through which I
make my Internet connection and is only switched on when I want to play with
it. It is sheer joy to be able to fire up GSS and pick out the files of
interest from the wxsat machine through the network connection and play with
them without the machine being loaded down with MDM. That is the other side
of David's point - the conventional two-machine setup means that the main PC
is always on its knees with MDM doing decoding. If you have a two-machine
setup, try doing it this way - I'm sure you won't switch back!
(The wxsat machine cost me 500 Euros+OS, 2400Athlon with K7S5A equivalent
mobo and 512 MB PC333 DDR RAM.)

Best regards - Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Taylor" <david-taylor@...>
To: <MSG-1@...>
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 11:33 PM
Subject: [MSG-1] Re: Equipment for receiving MSG-1


While John is busy collating the inputs from those who have
participated in the MSG-1 dissemination trials, I thought it might
be of interest to question some of the basic assumptions. The main
one of these is that one needs to have two computers, one for the
reception function and one for the decoding.

One advantage of the two PC setup that no-one has yet mentioned is
that while you are out of the house, you only need leave the
dedicated receiver PC on, not your main PC. You can make that PC
remote, and even have a wireless LAN link to it! The Receiver PC
probably doesn't need as many anti-virus or OS updates as
your "normal" PC, so can have a longer up time.

One PC works, but it will not have the flexibility, performance or
stability of the two-PC system. Nothing to stop you starting small
and expanding as you can. You pays your money, and you takes your
choice, as they say!

Cheers,
David



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
MSG-1-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




FSD is back then

James Brown <james@...>
 

Title says it all - getting GMS ch 26 as I write.

James
--
James Brown