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Re: Wodonga - Cudgewa Railway
Michael J
To bring this topic within the pervue of the LRRSA, the report into narrow gauge railways that resulted in the building of the four 2'6" gauge lines we are familiar with, proposed Tallangatta - Corryong as a possible route for a narrow gauge line, before the broad gauge line was build. That really would have been shades of Colorado with narrow gauge stock specials rumbling over those trestles and around those hills. It was also proposed to build a narrow gauge line south from Tallangatta into the Alps.
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Michael
--- In LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au, "lockeddrive" <lockeddrive@...> wrote:
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Re: RVR - Orangegrove Station (Dec 2010)
Toot222
Brad
You did well in finding what you did, looks like 4 wheel drive country. Steve Chapman On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 4:43 PM, Brad Peadon PdOB <alcogoodwin@yahoo.com.au>wrote: Howdee everyone,
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RVR - Orangegrove Station (Dec 2010)
Brad Peadon PdOB <alcogoodwin@...>
Howdee everyone,
Have just put up some photos of Orangegrove station taken on the last day of 2010. Thought they may be of interest. http://hunter-coal.blogspot.com/2011/01/wikipedia-richmond-vale-railway-minmi.html Brad South Maitland Railways - http://hunter-coal.blogspot.com/ Philippine Railway Hist Society - http://philippine-railways.blogspot.com Semi-Retired Foamer - http://alcogoodwin.blogspot.com/ Manila Sunset Convenience Store - http://manila-sunset.blogspot.com ~ William (Bill) James Sullivan - 1949-2010 - Never To Be Forgotten ~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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VIC: Bogong Creek Tramway
Steamfreak <steamfreak@...>
Hi all,
I took a pleasant stroll along the Bogong Creek Tramway yesterday. I began at the Clover Arboretum (near Clover Power Station on the Falls Creek Rd) and headed down the Little Arthur Fire Trail down to the East Kiewa River and up to the start (end?) of the aqueduct. At the rail depot/shed there were a variety of rail vehicles, including a shed on rails, a locomotive of some sort, a flat car sitting on two hinged underframes, and a passenger trolley on the shed. Most of the wagons seemed to be built on the same type of Robert Hudson underframes. The aqueduct itself is currently out of order due to a number of recent landslips blocking it, but the tramway is intact and has seen recent use. I wandered along the line, looks like all wooden sleepers have been replaced with steel ones, except for under some sets of points. The steel sleepers are stamped Trak-Lok 25-03-03 and are punched for presumably 2' track as well as 3'. It was a most pleasant walk, with a couple of sidings along the way, one featuring a couple of side-tip cocopans (is that the right term for these?) and a couple of tankers. The cocopans had Robert Hudson builders plates too. One corner featured a rather large black snake warming itself partially under the end of one of the steel sleepers. About 6km along the aqueduct I reached the Big River Fire Trail and stopped for lunch. In the siding sat a rustin' Ruston locomotive and a wide flat car loaded with sleepers. The Ruston appeared to be in working order. At that point, the aqueduct was closed off by a big gate and fence with sign saying "Danger - Death or Worse" or words to that effect. This was disappointing as I had wanted to go right up to Bogong Creek. The "Keep Out" signs seem to be honoured more in the breach than in the observance, judging by the well worn foot track through the barbed wire fence. I had met a walking party earlier who had walked down from the High Plains and come right along the aqueduct, and they said there were major landslides along the section to Bogong Creek that had brought down trees and at one point destroyed a tramway bridge. This landslide is visible on Google Earth so it is not new, but they said there were a number of recent large landslides too. Anyway, not to be deterred, I detoured up the Big River Fire Trail for another 6km or so to reach the East Kiewa Fire Trail, and headed down there to Bogong Creek. An impromptu spa bath under a waterfall was most pleasant after the hot walk. The East Kiewa Fire Trail is impassable at that point, being gouged out to a depth of 1-2m for a width of 20m or so due to the torrent that had recently come down the mountain. Any intake infrastructure that existed there on the aqueduct is now no longer either, just a wide expanse of washed up river rocks. There is still a concrete intake gate and hut, but it is high and dry and half full of rocks. The aqueduct is in a pipe there and the tramway doesn't appear to extend that far along. Return to Clover Power Station was via Big River Fire Trail and a short walk back along the Falls Creek Rd. Total distance around 20km. A most interesting walk in any case, the scenery along that tramway is spectacular to say the least, and would be more so in winter. My original reason for heading up there was to scope out some possible routes up Mt. Bogong for a ski trip this winter, so I will be back there in the colder months to view the scenery again! Photos here: http://pics.steamfreak.com/thumbnails.php?album=247 Cheers, Trevor Staats.
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Re: 50 years of LRRSA
Frank Stamford
Hello all,
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I think I have a foundation date for the VLRRS, (which became the LRRSA)! The opening paragraph of the first Secretary's Report says that it is for the Year Ending 17 February 1962. Such a precise date tells me that the foundation meeting must have been held on 18 February 1961, which is very much in line with my estimate. The report said that membership had increased from 5 to 10, that six ordinary general meetings were held during the year, and that "the Society has held expeditions over abandoned tramways near Warburton and Powelltown". Frank
On 3/01/2011 9:58 AM, rnveditor wrote:
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Re: Wodonga - Cudgewa Railway
steamfreak711 <steamfreak@...>
Hi Claus,
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There are a bunch of photos of the remaining bridges and other remnants of the line on my photo site here: http://pics.steamfreak.com/index.php?cat=17 Cheers, Trevor.
--- In LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au, "lockeddrive" <lockeddrive@...> wrote:
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
Frank Stamford
On 3/01/2011 9:59 AM, richard horne wrote:
Hello Richard, Yes there is also a close connection between the early South Australian 3ft 6in gauge and the Norwegian 3ft 6in gauge, and I intend to cover that in the book. As things developed the South Australian 3ft 6in gauge more closely resembled the Norwegian than did the Queensland. Norway's Beyer, Peacock 2-4-0Ts with the sloping cylinders were an extremely important development, as they greatly surpassed the previous attempts at building 3ft 6in gauge locos in performance. They appear to have been jointly designed by Carl Pihl (of Norway) and Charles Beyer. The first was "Tryggve" BP builder's number 704 of June 1866, so they predated the Isle of Man copies by a considerable time. Yes the SAR "V" class derived from the Norwegian Type VI, but they were much smaller than the Norwegian locos. The early sequence of 3ft 6in gauge developments (as I see it) were: 1. 1862 - Hamar-Grundsett (Norway) railway opened - proved 3ft 6in gauge would work for a public railway. Used link and pin couplings, and 0-4-2T locomotives built by Robert Stephenson which had a rigid wheelbase and recommended minimum curve radius of 15 chains. 2. 1864 - Trondheim-Støren (Norway) railway opened - proved 3ft 6in gauge would work in difficult country. Still used link and pin couplings, but locomotives were Avonside 2-4-0Ts with leading Bissell truck, and much more successful on sharp curves (but the sharpest was 9 chains radius). 3. 1865 - 1867 Ipswich - Toowoomba railway opened - proved that 3ft 6in gauge would work in mountainous country with very sharp curves (5 chains radius). First locomotives were Avonside 2-4-0s - a tender version of the locomotives already supplied to Norway. Did not use chopper couplings as they had not been invented yet, and the English consultant Charles Fox did not like the link and pin couplings. 4. 1866 - 1868 Drammen - Randsfjord (Norway) railway opened. First use of chopper couplings, and first use of Beyer, Peacock sloping cylindered 2-4-0T locomotives. Both of these new developments were considered very successful. After that a frenzy of 3ft 6in gauge developments occurred throughout the world. It perplexes me why Queensland avoided using Beyer, Peacock locomotives when they were used so successfully in all the other Australian colonies. Possibly politicians or book-keepers made the decisions based on lowest tender bids rather than long term cost effectiveness Regards, Frank --- On Sun, 2/1/11, Frank Stamford <frank.stamford@bigpond.com
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Wodonga - Cudgewa Railway
lockeddrive <lockeddrive@...>
Many thanks to all respondents for the info. received.
Cheers Claus
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
rthorne475
But don't the early 3'6"g. locos in Norway have more in common with those in South Australia that in Queensland? Norway's Beyer, Peacock 2-4-0Ts with sloping cylinders dated from1873 and the SAR's W class 2-6-0s of 1877 were clearly a BP development of that design. I imagine that the SAR V class 0-4-4Ts of 1876 were derived from the Norwegian 0-4-4Ts of 1875, both being built by BP. Both systems used centre couplings, whereas QGR used buffers and screw link couplings. I seem to recall that either John Knowles or Bill Callaghan had an interest in this, but I'm sure that you are well aware of it, too.
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Richard
--- On Sun, 2/1/11, Frank Stamford <frank.stamford@bigpond.com> wrote:
From: Frank Stamford <frank.stamford@bigpond.com> Subject: Re: [LRRSA] Norwegian Museum Railways ... To: LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au Date: Sunday, 2 January, 2011, 20:47 Hello Brian, Thanks for your comment. I do not know of any books in any language covering the subject as a whole. There are a several good histories of individual lines in Norwegian (the Røros line in particular), and a very good (but long out-of-print) history of the locomotives in Norwegian, but nothing covering the subject as a whole. At this stage I think I have most of the necessary source material, and an outline structure of chapter headings. When I have more to show for it I will be seeking a publisher in the UK but if necessary I will self publish. I expect most of the market for such a book would be in Europe, not in the southern hemisphere, though early Queensland developments will be partly covered in the book. Regards, Frank On 3/01/2011 4:14 AM, Brian Rumary wrote: Frank Stamford wrote: Later this year I hope to start writing a book on Norwegian 3ft 6in gauge railways, and that will need a lot of map work. That should be worth waiting for; I don't know of _any_ books on the subject in English. Don't forget to let us know the details when it finally comes out. Brian Rumary, England www.rumary.co.uk [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: 50 years of LRRSA
I have added the last of the Sat.1.3.69 photos taken at Belmont Common. Most of the younger people must have been BCR associates, not our own.
33a: ?, Ralph Cleary, ?, ?, ? 33b: no recognition 35: no recognition 36: Closest is Laurie Savage; distant may be Andrew & David Hennell. 37: driver John Scott 38: left to right from cab: ?, possibly Michael Menzies, Laurie Savage, ?, possibly David & Andrew Hennell. Regards, Roderick B Smith Rail News Victoria Editor
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Re: FW: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods
Petan
John Browning's address & contact details are on the bottom of his emails.
Cheers Peter C QLD From: LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au [mailto:LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au] On Behalf Of Christopher Hart Sent: Sunday, 2 January 2011 9:22 AM To: LRRSA@yahoogroups.com.au Subject: Re: [LRRSA] FW: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods Brian, John doesn't live in Rockhampton these days but I'll let him enlighten you as to his whereabouts, Chris Hart On 1 January 2011 22:20, Brian Rumary <brian@rumary.co.uk> wrote:
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
Frank Stamford
Hello Brian,
Thanks for your comment. I do not know of any books in any language covering the subject as a whole. There are a several good histories of individual lines in Norwegian (the Røros line in particular), and a very good (but long out-of-print) history of the locomotives in Norwegian, but nothing covering the subject as a whole. At this stage I think I have most of the necessary source material, and an outline structure of chapter headings. When I have more to show for it I will be seeking a publisher in the UK but if necessary I will self publish. I expect most of the market for such a book would be in Europe, not in the southern hemisphere, though early Queensland developments will be partly covered in the book. Regards, Frank On 3/01/2011 4:14 AM, Brian Rumary wrote:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
B.Rumary
Frank Stamford wrote:
Later this year I hope to start writing a book on Norwegian 3ft 6inThat should be worth waiting for; I don't know of _any_ books on the subject in English. Don't forget to let us know the details when it finally comes out. Brian Rumary, England www.rumary.co.uk
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Re: 50 years of LRRSA
I am back from a boating week, so the series resumes at the correct progress date.
On Sat.1.3.69, from Cheetham Geelong the group moved to Belmont Common Railway. This was a preservation group based on the surviving equipment from the Fyansford - Batesford 1067 mm gauge line, built to haul limestone for cement making, but by then superseded by a conveyor belt. Today BCR survives as Bellarine Peninsula Railway, on the regauged Drysdale - Queenscliff former VR line; the Fyansford cement factory has been closed and demolished. In today's four photos, I can recognise only Ralph Cleary (busy filming on the wagon). I suspect that all of the younger people were either general public, sharing the operating session with our VRLRRs/LRRSA group, or were associates of BCR. The driver was John Scott. He was pushing the dead Vulcan, using the Hudswell Clark, past a photoline; he misjudged the braking needed. On a later occasion he gave me my first lesson in handling steam power. The most important lesson to learn is keeping up the water level in the boiler (ahead of proper lubrication, ahead of maintaining sufficient steam for the train to move). I still recall these lessons when aboard paddlesteamers, although these normally use feedwater pumps rather than injectors. Regards, Roderick B Smith Rail News Victoria Editor
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Re: FW: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods
A C Lynn Zelmer
Depends on what you mean by narrow gauge, Brian, when thinking of Rockhampton...
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QR's 3' 6" gauge main yards and engine facilities are all under water at Rocky with enough water over the track that rail services to the south have apparently been cut. All the motive power has been moved to the Yaamba area to the north where it is comparatively dry. The Purrey steam tram is out of service at the moment for its annual inspection/maintenance but the museum should only be affected by the flooding if it exceeds the 1918 flood levels. Maps from that flood show the water as just reaching the museum precinct. The city is now essentially surrounded with no road, rail or air connections to the outside world, and is likely to remain so for the next couple of weeks as the floods aren't expected to peak until mid-week (Wednesday 5 Jan 2011). The sugar cane areas are a fair way north and south of the city and have their own problems... I understand that the Bundaberg Rum distillery is surrounded with water, implying that the sugar mill is also wet, but the local news only talks about the distillery. Best wishes to all for the new year, Lynn
The following was just posted on the Industrial Railway Society Yahoo
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Re: Wodonga to Corryong railway history
There were efforts to convert part to a tourist line: too much railway to maintain, too much money needed, too remote. Various rollingstock items were stored at Huon, deteriorating steadily. Some have been moved to other projects. Bridge girders were relocated to other projects.
A lot of the former line is now a rail trail, which provides most of the benefits, but at a fraction of the cost. In September, a local committee commissioned a set of history panels of the line, erected at the site of Cudgewa station. If you are walking or cycling the line, there are two pubs at Tallangatta, one at Koetong, one at Cudgewa, and then two in Corrying (the major regional centre which the line never reached). Regards, Roderick B Smith Rail News Victoria Editor ...it would potentially have made a great tourist line...Claus
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Re: FW: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods
Christopher Hart
Brian,
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I live in the Herbert district in North Queensland where the trackage is flood damaged on a fairly regular basis, including now. Each time, It all gets repaired and come the crushing season, it's business as usual for the cane trains. John doesn't live in Rockhampton these days but I'll let him enlighten you as to his whereabouts, Chris Hart
On 1 January 2011 22:20, Brian Rumary <brian@rumary.co.uk> wrote:
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FW: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods
B.Rumary
The following was just posted on the Industrial Railway Society Yahoo
list. Does anyone know what the situation in Queensland is regarding narrow gauge railway matters? Brian Rumary, England =================================================== to: Industrial Railway Society <IndustrialRailwaySociety@yahoogroups.com> from: Bigrabbits <bigrabbits@yahoo.co.uk> date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 00:33:36 +0000 (GMT) subject: [IndustrialRailwaySociety] Queensland Floods reply-to: IndustrialRailwaySociety@yahoogroups.com Large areas of Queensland are currently flooded to unprecedented levels. This no doubt affects the sugar cane lines and railway preservation sites there. Bundaberg was listed on the news and they are arranging to evacuate parts of Rockhampton. Rockhampton will be known to many as the home of the Purrey Steam tram but it is also the home of Lancashire ex-pat, IRS member and member of this Group, John Browning. John, we sincerely hope you are not affected by the floods and send our Best Wishes for the New Year. Graham, Terry and family.
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
Frank Stamford
Hello John,
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Thanks for the feedback. With regard to the Oslo-Trondheim page, I am afraid the map is not a mistake. It is the Oslo-Bergen map recycled with the names of Trondheim and Dombås added. As I wanted to wind that project up before the year ended I needed to take a short cut, though I am not very happy with it. For the same reason there is no route map of the Old Voss Railway or the Krøderen railway, though the Old Voss Railway, especially, needs one. Later this year I hope to start writing a book on Norwegian 3ft 6in gauge railways, and that will need a lot of map work. As a spin-off of that process I should be able to provide better maps on the website. Any feedback on the need for corrections on the website is greatly welcomed, and providing making the corrections is not too time consuming I will happily do it. By the way, I think the strange weight driven device in the waiting room of Ilseng station at the Hamar Railway Museum is probably a clock, with the clock-face on the other side of the wall in the station-master's office. Regards, Frank
On 1/01/2011 6:55 PM, John Dennis wrote:
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Re: Norwegian Museum Railways ...
John Dennis <jdennis@...>
Excellent work Frank,
Thanks for taking the time to do this. One minor correction. The Oslo-Trondheim page, with the views from the moving train, has the Oslo-Bergen map. John On Fri, 31 Dec 2010 12:42:48 -0000, "Frank" <frank.stamford@bigpond.com> wrote: Hello all,========================================================== John Dennis jdennis@optusnet.com.au Melbourne,Australia Home of the HOn30 Dutton Bay Tramway and the Australian Narrow Gauge Web-Exhibition Gallery Dutton Bay URL: http://members.optusnet.com.au/duttonbay WebX http://members.optusnet.com.au/jdennis/ng_webex.html
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