Date   

Re: Defence sites study

Terry
 

There is a railway on Rottnest Island 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rottnest_Island
An entry states in part
"A light railway was built from the jetty at Kingstown Barracks on Thomson Bay, to transport materiel and munitions to the guns. Captain (later Brigadier) Frank Bertram Hussey (1908–1985) was seconded from the Australian Staff Corps[36] to oversee the construction of this.[37] The military fixtures including the barracks and railway became known as the "Rottnest Island Fortress".
"After World War II the guns and infrastructure were decommissioned and parts of the railway removed. The 9.2-inch battery, however, was saved from disposal because the high cost of removing and shipping the guns to the mainland exceeded their value as scrap metal.

In the 1990s the gun emplacements and railway were extensively reconstructed, and since then a popular tourist activity has included a tour of the guns and the tunnels, with the journey to the battery being made on a purpose-built train from Kingstown Barracks. In November 2003 a new railcar was put into service for this route, called the Captain Hussey (named after Brigadier Hussey; see above). The railcar was built with volunteer assistance, and cost $171,500."

Terry Boardman


Re: Defence sites study

Colin Harvey
 

The Swan Island fort tramway (from Queenscliff) was installed in 1883.
Other Port Phillip sites that definitely had tramways are Point Nepean and the South Channel fort.
If other defence sites that are not strictly 'forts' are included we might include the Williamstown torpedo store (by 1886) and perhaps military magazines.
Colin


Defense sites study

Iain@...
 

Its good to see somebody reads the RAHS News…

 

The study is firmly in the pre-nineteenth century period so many light railways are excluded. However I was thinking of Cockatoo Island as being such a site being a key defence asset for ship repairing. I might run the idea past Don to see what he thinks.

 

Cheers

 

 

Dr Iain Stuart

 

JCIS Consultants

P.O. Box 2397

Burwood North

NSW 2134

Australia

 

(02) 97010191

Iain@...

 

 


Re: Defence sites study

John Browning
 
Edited

Other coastal military sites that spring to mind include the naval establishments HMAS Penguin at Pittwater and Swan Island in Port Philip Bay.
They both used battery electric units for haulage on narrow gauge track. 
I should add that these were 20th century sites.
John


Re: Defence sites study

Petan
 

Hi Folks,

 

Did someone say munitions tramways for a fort????   Well, Fort Lytton at the mouth of the Brisbane River has appeared in the LRRSA yahoogroups at various times and Samboo The Bear, our house companion, wishes to submit the following Facebook picture of himself on a munitions trolley at Fort Lytton. Samboo also thinks his picture on this trolley has appeared in the LRRSA yahoogroup before in message 8994 on 12 October 2016.  Google will probably give details of the other tramways there including a horse line. One display had mines on a tramway wagon.

https://www.facebook.com/samboothebear/photos/a.1090333487740576/1091945537579371/?type=3&theater

 

Cheers

Peter Cokley

 

From: LRRSA@groups.io <LRRSA@groups.io> On Behalf Of Stuart Thyer
Sent: Friday, 7 September 2018 3:14 PM
To: LRRSA@groups.io
Subject: [LRRSA] Defence sites study

 

I’m not aware if any fort sites ever had light railways within them for the transport of munitions, but if readers are aware of anything published in this area, it may be of interest to the researchers listed below.

 

_._,_._,_


Re: Defence sites study

Peter Anderson
 

Good afternoon all,

 

I am a new member to the LRRSA and this is my first response to the groups.io, so please accept my apologies in advance for any misunderstandings.

 

I’m not sure of how broad the term “fort” wants to be interpreted, but I am aware of a couple of Australian Defence sites that incorporated light (2’ gauge) railways for the movement of munitions:

Royal Australian Navy Armament Depot (RANAD) – Newington, this site was operated by the Dept of Defence until 1999, and then handed over to the NSW Government for the 2000 Sydney Olympic games and the site became known as the Newington Armory and the rail system became known as the Millennium Parklands Railway (MPR).   All the military infrastructure is intact including the rail system which incorporates approximately 8 km of track, 70 odd turnouts, 6 battery electric locomotives, 40 flat top wagons (4 of which pre-date WW1) and 4 articulated passenger carriages designed (2003) to carry up to 50 people.  Attached are photos of the restored wagons, locomotives and passenger carriages, and below is an extract from a recent internal report that may provide some useful background information.  

 

The MPR is an ex Department of Defence 24 inch (610 mm) gauge railway that was designed for the movement of munitions within the site known as Royal Australian Navy Armament Depot (RANAD) – Newington.  The original rail system was constructed in 1909 servicing the wharf, munitions magazines, storage and laboratory facilities, being expanded during World War 2 and remaining in operational use until 1999 when it was handed over to the Olympic Co-ordination Authority (OCA).  The Armory Precinct has significant natural and historical value, with the sentry post, magazines, residences and other buildings still used today by the Sydney Olympic Park Authority (SOPA) be it for other purposes, along with the wetlands bushland being the last remnant of the Blaxland coastal forest on the Sydney harbour foreshore. 

 

The Newington Armory illustrates the sequence of design philosophies for explosives handling through the 19th and 20th century’s, of which the railway played an integral part as the only form of transport throughout the facilities that links all munitions handling and storage facilities.

 

The railway had been maintained by the Royal Australian Navy up until the site was handed over to the OCA in 1999, the OCA subsequently became the SOPA in 2001.

 

The Millennium Parklands Railway was granted limited accreditation on the 24 October 2002 for the purpose of conserving, restoring, and maintaining the rail infrastructure and the development of passenger rollingstock and associated operational and safety systems for the purpose of conveying persons within the Armory Precinct.  Full accreditation was granted on the 8th December 2003.

 

Generally, the restoration, construction and maintenance principals with respect to infrastructure and display vehicles are based on the Department of Defence – Engineer in Chief’s Technical Instruction No. 50 Railway, 24 Inch Gauge – 22 May 1944, being deemed satisfactory for the very low speed (max 10kph) operations of the MPR. 

 

The passenger rollingstock design was limited by loading gauge and required the development of a unique “fail safe” braking system incorporating a number of safety interlocks.  Standard components to the 24 inch (610 mm) rail industry were used in bogie and coupling design and construction.

 

Woomera – South Australia. The defence facility Woomera used a 2’ gauge railway for the movement of the “Ikara” missile from the workshops to its launch and testing bed.  In 2002 we arranged a visit to Woomera and recovered the 2’ gauge rail infrastructure and arranged shipment to Sydney to assist in maintaining the MPR rail infrastructure.

 

Trust this is of some help.

 

Regards,

Peter

 

Peter Anderson

0418 624 507

Email  peter.anderson@...

 

The information contained in this email message and any attached files may be confidential information, and may also be the subject of legal professional privilege.  If you are not the intended recipient any use, disclosure or copying of this email is unauthorised.

If you received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete all copies of this transmission together with any attachments.

 

 

From: LRRSA@groups.io <LRRSA@groups.io> On Behalf Of Stuart Thyer
Sent: Friday, 7 September 2018 3:14 PM
To: LRRSA@groups.io
Subject: [LRRSA] Defence sites study

 

I’m not aware if any fort sites ever had light railways within them for the transport of munitions, but if readers are aware of anything published in this area, it may be of interest to the researchers listed below.

 

East coast nineteenth century defence sites study
 
The Federation of Australian Historical Societies (FAHS) has been commissioned by the Department of Environment with a Protection of National Heritage Places grant to prepare two thematic papers relating to east coast nineteenth century defence sites.
 
The aim of the papers is to provide advice to the Australian Heritage Council. The work of preparing the papers has fallen to Associate Professor Don Garden, President of the FAHS. Don Garden is well known as a historian based in Victoria.
 
One paper is to be a general outline of nineteenth century defence issues in the eastern colonies, to provide context for understanding the extant fortifications.
 
The second paper is to examine the possibility of sites being advanced for the National Heritage List in Sydney and Melbourne.
 
The challenge of the project is gathering together information and reports from around Australia and Don Garden faces not only the tyranny of distance but also the frustration of having much of the literature on the defence sites being in unpublished reports to Government agencies (the so-called grey literature).
 
However, the positive outcome will be for the first time a national understanding of pre-colonial defence sites, their similarities and their differences and this will help determine those sites that meet the high significance thresholds to achieve National heritage listing.

 
Don Garden has written to the Royal Australian Historical Society to see if any affiliated societies may have useful information and whether there are any individuals who may be able to help. Please email Don Garden if you are able to assist.


Defence sites study

Stuart Thyer
 

I’m not aware if any fort sites ever had light railways within them for the transport of munitions, but if readers are aware of anything published in this area, it may be of interest to the researchers listed below.

East coast nineteenth century defence sites study
 
The Federation of Australian Historical Societies (FAHS) has been commissioned by the Department of Environment with a Protection of National Heritage Places grant to prepare two thematic papers relating to east coast nineteenth century defence sites.
 
The aim of the papers is to provide advice to the Australian Heritage Council. The work of preparing the papers has fallen to Associate Professor Don Garden, President of the FAHS. Don Garden is well known as a historian based in Victoria.
 
One paper is to be a general outline of nineteenth century defence issues in the eastern colonies, to provide context for understanding the extant fortifications.
 
The second paper is to examine the possibility of sites being advanced for the National Heritage List in Sydney and Melbourne.

 
The challenge of the project is gathering together information and reports from around Australia and Don Garden faces not only the tyranny of distance but also the frustration of having much of the literature on the defence sites being in unpublished reports to Government agencies (the so-called grey literature).
 
However, the positive outcome will be for the first time a national understanding of pre-colonial defence sites, their similarities and their differences and this will help determine those sites that meet the high significance thresholds to achieve National heritage listing.

 
Don Garden has written to the Royal Australian Historical Society to see if any affiliated societies may have useful information and whether there are any individuals who may be able to help. Please email Don Garden if you are able to assist.


Re: Marrickville, Sydney Metrol tunnelling

Terry
 

Although the site is in the suburb of Marrickville those of us who relate more to railway stations will recognise it as the one time Sydney Steel(?) location alongside the Illawarra line just on the St. Peters side of Sydenham station (near the large stormwater retention dam.
Terry


Re: Desalination tram

Petan
 

Thanks Folks!

 

LR s 196 & 197 that John listed now downloaded as PDFs from the LRRSA online bookshop! LR197 even had a loco picture.

 

Cheers

Peter Cokley

 

From: LRRSA@groups.io <LRRSA@groups.io> On Behalf Of John Browning
Sent: Sunday, 2 September 2018 3:35 PM
To: LRRSA@groups.io
Subject: Re: [LRRSA] Desalination tram

 

Reports in LR 193, 196 & 197.
John


Marrickville, Sydney Metrol tunnelling

John Browning
 

For those interested in current light railway operations, there has been a possible sighting of narrow gauge tunnelling locomotives at the Marrickville site for the Sydney Metro. If anyone can go to the Bedwin Road overbridge it should be possible to take some photos from there. It is vital to record what we can as once they go underground, identification will be even harder. Hoping to see some photos before long. Thanks to anyone who can help.
John 


Re: Desalination tram

John Browning
 

Reports in LR 193, 196 & 197.
John


Re: Desalination tram

John Browning
 

Yes. As reported in LR but I can't quote the issue(s) just now.
John


Re: Desalination tram

Philip G Graham
 

Hi Peter

I have seen ..somewhere.. that there were hire locomotives from the US firm Mining Equipment Ltd (MEL), mostly various models of second-hand Plymouth locos. Perhaps John can enlighten us shortly?

-PGG-


Desalination tram

Petan
 

I am wondering if there is any more tramway data on the Tugun Gold Coast desalination project.

 

Back in LRRSA group message 3197 on Oct. 23, 2009 John Browning wrote the following message, shown below, about desalination projects. Yesterday I also purchased the PDF for Light Railways 193 February 2007 which also contained John’s message on the Tugun Gold Coast desalination project including that John Holland Construction was responsible for building twin undersea tunnels for the intake and discharge pipelines for the project, both of which were excavated concurrently by tunnel boring machine. Twin access shafts were excavated at Betty Diamond Park, Tugun. John Holland was attempting to source 10 km of 401b rails for this project in November 2006.

 

John’s message 3197 on Oct. 23, 2009; It is well known that narrow gauge rail equipment was used for the ocean intake and outlet tunnels of the Gold Coast desalination project. With similar projects at Kurnell (NSW), Wonthaggi (Vic), Port Stanvac (SA) and Binningup (WA), the possibility of significant narrow gauge railway use cannot be discounted. These projects are fleeting and hard to gain any access to, but if they are not even recorded when they take place, our knowledge going into the future is the poorer. Can anyone provide any information about the possible use of rail equipment in these (or similar) tunnel projects? I am keen to see any relevant information reported in 'Light Railways'. Thanks John.

 

I have searched the past messages on this LRRSA group and John’s 2009 message is the sole Tugun desalination mention I can locate.

 

Cheers

Peter Cokley

 


Re: Sydney Metro may have tunnel locomotives

Stuart Thyer
 

Further to Philips posting, the Chatswood site is fast developing, with a large shed already erected on the site midway between Chatswood and Artamon stations adjacent to the north shore railway. The site is between Nelson st and Mowbray rd and as the shed opens towards Nelson st, an excellent view into the site is probably available there.


Sydney Metro may have tunnel locomotives

Philip G Graham
 

Project overview

Sydney Metro, City & Southwest line, Chatswood~Marrickville - JHCPBG jv (C) - TBM DoubleShield 7.0 m od x 4 x X XXX m (_/19~_/2x); TBM Hybrid MixedShield/Slurry 7.0 m od x 1 x 700 m {15 500 m total} (_/19~_/19) {JHCPBG=John Holland/CPB Contractors/Ghella jv}

TBM #1N Chatswood{LS}~Blues Point (TBM DoubleShield)
TBM #2N Chatswood{LS}~Blues Point (TBM DoubleShield)

TBM #3H (i) Barangaroo{LS}~Blues Point (TBM Hybrid MixedShield/Slurry)
TBM #3H (ii) Barangaroo{LS}~Blues Point

TBM #4S Marrickville{LS}~Barangaroo (TBM DoubleShield)
TBM #5S Marrickville{LS}~Barangaroo (TBM DoubleShield)

For the newer Sydney Metro City & Southwest line Project jv partner Ghella will be the actual TBM operators, they have usually had narrow gauge construction railway [conrail] with loco-hauled stock servicing their TBM projects, and recent indications from the Sydney Metro City & Southwest Marrickville site office tend to reinforce this surmise. The tunnel locomotives and supporting rolling stock have not yet been identified, these usually are delivered on a Just-In-Time basis. It remains to be said that close observation by LRRSA members and other interested parties of this work-site from the vantage point of the Bedwin Road Overbridge needs to be reported frequently during the next three months. Once the locomotives arrive they will only be on the surface for a few weeks before disappearing 'down-the-hole". A useful identification feature is the paint colour of orange (new-build Schöma); white (second-hand Schöma) or Yellow/Blue (GIA).

The first TBM is currently being assembled at the Marrickville Dive Site. The Herrenknecht Doubleshield TBM has serial number S-1137 and the second is due shortly.

Sydney Metro, City & Southwest line, Marrackville~Barangaroo - JHCPBG jv (C) - Herrenknecht TBM DoubleShield (i) Up Line S-1137 7.0 m od x X XXX m (_/19~_/2x); Down Line S-11xx 7.0 m od x X XXX m (_/19~_/2x) {JHCPBG=John Holland/CPB Contractors/Ghella jv}

Also the trend for acoustic sheds over the surface worksites means that later one will have to rely on "official sources" for glimpses of interior tunneling works down to TBM level.

Please report your sightings to the LRRSA group here or the Light Railways News Editor.

-PGG-


Kangaroo Island Salt Railway

Chris Ward
 

Does anyone have access to photographs of the engines and other equipment used on the salt railway from Muston to Salt Lake.  I’m anxious to obtain quality photos for display to recognise these engines and the railway that operated up until about 1950.  Most tourists and many locals have no knowledge of this part of Kangaroo Island’s history.  Any additional information concerning Kerr Stuart  locomotives that were used including the Day’s Caterpillar powered engine and the Purcell section car would be very welcome

 

Regards

Chris

Kangaroo Island Pioneers Association, Inc.

 


Light Railways No.262 is in the mail

Frank Stamford
 

Light Railways 262, the August issue, and the first of the 2018-2019 membership year, was packed by a willing team of volunteers last night, and handed over to Australia Post today. 

The main articles in this issue include The Clarence River Breakwater, Part 4 (NSW); Baxter & Prince Sawmills and the locomotive "Deane" (WA); and Schoema Tunnel Locomotives Exported to Australia and New Zealand; along with the regular Industrial Railway News, Heritage & Tourist, Field Reports, and Letters section. And it is a 48 page issue this time.

All being well your copy should be in your letter box next week. If you are not a member you can purchase a copy via the online shop, paper or PDF. Follow this link: http://lightrailwayresearchsocietyofaustralia.cart.net.au/

Frank


Cudgen's Decauville

Petan
 

Still researching my CSR Condong topic and found a puzzle for the cylinder size of Cudgen's Decauville steamer.

 

I have found four different published cylinder dimensions for Cudgen's Decauville Loco. Bruce Belbin did two articles, four months apart, in LR when he was editor and used a different cylinder size for the same locomotive in each article. I didn’t notice any LR follow up letter to the editor on the specific Decauville cylinder size topic. CC Singleton also wrote two articles on the topic with a different size in each article, eight years apart. John Armstrong’s 1976 article, noted below, matches Singleton’s second article.  

 

I see 250mm x 320mm cylinders on p.6 of Bruce Belbin's 'Childers number 4 - A brief history of Fowler 16830, Part one - QLD' in LR 204 December 2008.

 

I see 210mm x 300mm on p.12 of the same author's (Bruce Belbin) follow up article, 'Childers number 4 - A brief history of Fowler 16830, Part two - NSW' in LR 206 April 2009

 

I see 9 in (228.6 mm) x 12.5in (317.5mm) in CC Singleton’s ARHS July 1940 Bulletin yet the same author’s, CC Singleton, ARHS July 1948 Bulletin states 9in x 12in (304.8mm), eight years later, so he may have found a different source in that eight years.

 

I see 9in diameter by 12in stroke cylinders in John Armstrong's 1976 Tweed ARHS Bulletin article.

 

No cylinder size for this loco in CS Small’s ‘Decauville Locomotives in Australia’, ARHS Bulletin April 1971.

 

The locomotive, 245 of 1897, was ordered for Penny & Co of Knockroe Sugar Mill, Cordalba, which is in the Isis district near Childers QLD.  Its  August 1897 arrival at Knockroe is recorded in Trove http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article21562872   This mill started operations about 1892 and continued until 1902, when it was sold to the CSR and the Decauville went to CSR’s Childers mill. It arrived at the then isolated Cudgen portion of CSR’s Condong sugar mill tramway system in 1913.

 

Cheers

Peter Cokley

 


Re: Hunslet 1215 / 303

BM
 

Michael,

Wow! You certainly had an amazing day out at the ‘Tracks to Trenches’ event with such an amazing collection of locomotives and other WWI items.

 

I retired as editor of Australian Railway History in late May, so am currently focusing my efforts on my autobiography of my career in international development assistance activities, plus a book on my involvement in railway magazines and railway heritage. Both are major projects!

 

Best Wishes

Bob McKillop

 

From: LRRSA@groups.io [mailto:LRRSA@groups.io] On Behalf Of Michael C. via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, 16 July 2018 7:57 AM
To: lrrsa@groups.io
Subject: [LRRSA] Hunslet 1215 / 303

 

Dear all,

 

Me again... Apologies once again in advance for filling your inboxes with off-topic emails.

 

This weekend saw the popular 'Tracks to the Trenches' event held by the Moseley Railway Trust http://mrt.org.uk/

 

Please visit: http://www.ww1-event.org/

 

The event saw the official launch of War Department Light Railway Hunslet 1215 / 303 whci I am sure will be familiar to you in Australia.

 

I have uploaded a collection of images to Flickr.

 

Please take a look if you are interested: https://www.flickr.com/photos/55958391@N07/albums/72157671215769618

 

I also met John Browning which was pleasure and a surprise! 

 

Cheers,

 

Michael Chapman


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