Topics

Westside C-16


Robert Herrick
 

I've refrained from buying brass rolling stock because I am not confident our small brass locomotives can pull them, i.e. I have no practical experience. My eyesight and patience for building kits are not what they used to be and I am eyeing a brass caboose and possibly a brass passenger car. I'll be running very shorts freights and a two-car passenger train behind C-16s and T-12s (both re-motored) respectively, but I still have deep reservations about brass. Your experience and sage advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

Bob Herrick


Mark Kasprowicz
 

I know a few people have substituted the brass trucks and thereby improved the 'rollability' of brass trucks - I've done it too. I know they're like rocking horse shot (ref Mike Conder) but if you can get some Blackstone trucks they will make a huge difference. Also remember that a coating of Bullfrog Snit (ahem!) can significantly improve the pulling power of brass locos.

Mark K

To the Vulture - sorry mate but it gave me  good laugh. We're all in need of as many of those as we can get!


Mick Moignard
 

A Westside C-16 will easily pull half a dozen brass cars, probably more, on the flat, but it will help to deal with any resistance issues in the trucks or replace with better trucks. One coach and a brass caboose will not worry it unless their trucks are truly awful.

Mick

________________________________
Mick Moignard
m: +44 7774 652504
Skype: mickmoignard

, so please excuse the typos.


Ric Case
 

Bob I have found that replacement trucks ( ie Blackstone)helps to decrease the drag coefficient! 
I can pull 6 to 9 cars with a brass coach! 
Main line is around 2 %steady grade! 
I use all black stone C19 during operations.
Just information!

Ric Case 
EBT Modeler 
Hamilton Ohio 
1-513-375-7694

On Apr 7, 2020, at 8:46 AM, Robert Herrick <rdherrick@...> wrote:

I've refrained from buying brass rolling stock because I am not confident our small brass locomotives can pull them, i.e. I have no practical experience. My eyesight and patience for building kits are not what they used to be and I am eyeing a brass caboose and possibly a brass passenger car. I'll be running very shorts freights and a two-car passenger train behind C-16s and T-12s (both re-motored) respectively, but I still have deep reservations about brass. Your experience and sage advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

Bob Herrick


Russ Norris
 

Although I run larger brass engines (EBT 2-8-2's) I thought my experience might be helpful.  I can pull the brass EBT business car without difficulty, and I have a couple of brass freight cars that run OK.  But a lot depends on the quality of the trucks.  For example, the brass trucks that originally came with the business car did not roll well.  My trains are generally made of long strings of EBT hoppers from Blackstone, and I can run long trains up a 2% grade without difficulty.  But add a brass passenger car or caboose on the end, and I have to shorten the train.  I believe the problem lies in the trucks.  Replacing conventional or brass trucks with the Blackstone Vulcan trucks solves the problem.

Russ

On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert Herrick <rdherrick@...> wrote:
I've refrained from buying brass rolling stock because I am not confident our small brass locomotives can pull them, i.e. I have no practical experience. My eyesight and patience for building kits are not what they used to be and I am eyeing a brass caboose and possibly a brass passenger car. I'll be running very shorts freights and a two-car passenger train behind C-16s and T-12s (both re-motored) respectively, but I still have deep reservations about brass. Your experience and sage advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

Bob Herrick


--
Russ Norris, MMR
Cape Cod, Massachusetts
http://blacklogvalleyrailroad.blogspot.com/


Climax@...
 


I think that is Bullfrog Snot not snit.  I'd hate to think what Bullfrog snit is.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kasprowicz
Sent: Apr 7, 2020 9:17 AM
To: HOn3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [HOn3] Westside C-16

I know a few people have substituted the brass trucks and thereby improved the 'rollability' of brass trucks - I've done it too. I know they're like rocking horse shot (ref Mike Conder) but if you can get some Blackstone trucks they will make a huge difference. Also remember that a coating of Bullfrog Snit (ahem!) can significantly improve the pulling power of brass locos.

Mark K

To the Vulture - sorry mate but it gave me  good laugh. We're all in need of as many of those as we can get!


Mark Kasprowicz
 

Errr....It was a play on words aimed square on at Mike Conder for one of his postings. I know what Bullfrog Snot is though I'm beginning to prefer 'Snit' as in 'have you Snitted today?' or 'Does you aunt know you Snit?'

Mark K


Mike Conder
 

Yeah, yeah, yeah .... making fun of my iPhone’s itty-bitty keyboard (can’t be fat fingers, right?  That’s my story and I’m sticking to it!)

What everybody else said is correct, it’s more about the quality of the trucks and not the actual weight that limits what the loco can do. 

Mike Conder

On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 8:46 AM Mark Kasprowicz <marowicz@...> wrote:
Errr....It was a play on words aimed square on at Mike Conder for one of his postings. I know what Bullfrog Snot is though I'm beginning to prefer 'Snit' as in 'have you Snitted today?' or 'Does you aunt know you Snit?'

Mark K


Ric Case
 

Mike I laughed but didn’t comment! Lol. Same problem!

Ric Case 
EBT Modeler 
Hamilton Ohio 
1-513-375-7694

On Apr 7, 2020, at 1:34 PM, Mike Conder <vulturenest1@...> wrote:


Yeah, yeah, yeah .... making fun of my iPhone’s itty-bitty keyboard (can’t be fat fingers, right?  That’s my story and I’m sticking to it!)

What everybody else said is correct, it’s more about the quality of the trucks and not the actual weight that limits what the loco can do. 

Mike Conder

On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 8:46 AM Mark Kasprowicz <marowicz@...> wrote:
Errr....It was a play on words aimed square on at Mike Conder for one of his postings. I know what Bullfrog Snot is though I'm beginning to prefer 'Snit' as in 'have you Snitted today?' or 'Does you aunt know you Snit?'

Mark K


Mike Van Hove
 

You can’t blame everything on “Fat Fingers”. I find Spell Check does me in, quite often.

Mike Van Hove

On Apr 7, 2020, at 2:10 PM, Ric Case <ebtmodeler@...> wrote:

Mike I laughed but didn’t comment! Lol. Same problem!

Ric Case 
EBT Modeler 
Hamilton Ohio 
1-513-375-7694

On Apr 7, 2020, at 1:34 PM, Mike Conder <vulturenest1@...> wrote:


Yeah, yeah, yeah .... making fun of my iPhone’s itty-bitty keyboard (can’t be fat fingers, right?  That’s my story and I’m sticking to it!)

What everybody else said is correct, it’s more about the quality of the trucks and not the actual weight that limits what the loco can do. 

Mike Conder

On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 8:46 AM Mark Kasprowicz <marowicz@...> wrote:
Errr....It was a play on words aimed square on at Mike Conder for one of his postings. I know what Bullfrog Snot is though I'm beginning to prefer 'Snit' as in 'have you Snitted today?' or 'Does you aunt know you Snit?'

Mark K




Robert Herrick
 

Thank you all for the helpful responses! I shall forge ahead.

Bob H


STEVEN WYSOWSKI
 

The Westside C-16’s have great pulling power and you should not worry about the brass cars that you are considering. I have three and all pull weighted 10-11 carloads without any slipping on tight curves and very slight inclines. I do have Blackstone trucks on all of my rolling stock,it helps a great deal.


Russ Norris
 

I would say the same for the Hallmark Samhongsa EBT 2-8-2's.  I have a video of one of the heavy mikes pulling 16 cars and a  caboose up a 2% grade, all on Blackstone trucks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WxE4er1YRE&list=PLShv0WAO_MT9j_-DKQb0UhOu68KWc5kuG&index=3&t=121s  


On Wed, Apr 8, 2020 at 9:31 AM STEVEN WYSOWSKI <swysowski@...> wrote:
The Westside C-16’s have great pulling power and you should not worry about the brass cars that you are considering. I have three and all pull weighted 10-11 carloads without any slipping on tight curves and very slight inclines. I do have Blackstone trucks on all of my rolling stock,it helps a great deal.


--
Russ Norris, MMR
Cape Cod, Massachusetts
http://blacklogvalleyrailroad.blogspot.com/


John Stutz
 

Bob

As several people have noted, rolling resistance is as much or more a matter of trucks than of weight. Blackstone's will work very well, but their range is limited.

Precision Scale (PSC) has a much larger range, with many trucks available with Delren sideframes, which roll as well as Blackstone's trucks, particularly those used in the latter PSC kits. But these can be too flexible to securely retain their wheel sets when the sideframes are simply clipped into the Delren bolsters. I ACC one or both sideframes to the bolster, or substitute the brass bolsters and crimp them enough to restrict sideframe twist.

Rio Grande Models had a very extensive range, and while they are now closed, there should still be plenty available second hand. Rio Grande's metal is a soft tin alloy, not much different from bearing metal, centrifugally cast in rubber molds, They can be built to roll very well, but do need to be cleaned up, and lubrication.

Brass trucks are usually lost wax or lost plastic, cast in a single use plaster mold made by burning out the masters and sprues. Such molds can form bubbles where the plaster does not quite adhere to the master, and these bubbles fill with brass. Exterior bubbles can be cut or filed off. Those within the sideframe bearing holes really require special tooling to remove, so should be avoided. Brass does require lubrication, especially with brass axles.

John Stutz

On April 7, 2020 at 7:46 AM Robert Herrick <rdherrick@...> wrote:

I've refrained from buying brass rolling stock because I am not confident our small brass locomotives can pull them, i.e. I have no practical experience. My eyesight and patience for building kits are not what they used to be and I am eyeing a brass caboose and possibly a brass passenger car. I'll be running very shorts freights and a two-car passenger train behind C-16s and T-12s (both re-motored) respectively, but I still have deep reservations about brass. Your experience and sage advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

Bob Herrick