Topics

Drill bits for Grab Irons

Dusty
 

I use #86 bits for .010 grabs. I've got 2 or 3 bits left and need to get a few more. My local tool company moved to who knows where. I found 2 styles on Ebay. Jobber shafts and those with 1/8 shafts.
They also have a plastic stop ring. Probably intended for cnc.

Anyone have an opinion on which type of bit to use for drilling plastic? My experience is with the jobber style but maybe the other style has advantages?

Dusty Burman 

Dale Buxton
 

Dusty, 

those must be the ones from Drill Bit City. I use them and like them a lot. They are very sharp and cut plastics great!

They have a high carbide content so they are more brittle. But they cut sooooo nice. They also come in really great storage/shipping containers.

 The guy usually has some re-sharpened versions for a slightly lower price point.

Dale B



On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 17:26 Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:
I use #86 bits for .010 grabs. I've got 2 or 3 bits left and need to get a few more. My local tool company moved to who knows where. I found 2 styles on Ebay. Jobber shafts and those with 1/8 shafts.
They also have a plastic stop ring. Probably intended for cnc.

Anyone have an opinion on which type of bit to use for drilling plastic? My experience is with the jobber style but maybe the other style has advantages?

Dusty Burman 

Mike Van Hove
 

Dusty,

Try this link, he should have anything you need.


I hope this helps,

Mike Van Hove


Columbia, MO

On Aug 27, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:

I use #86 bits for .010 grabs. I've got 2 or 3 bits left and need to get a few more. My local tool company moved to who knows where. I found 2 styles on Ebay. Jobber shafts and those with 1/8 shafts.
They also have a plastic stop ring. Probably intended for cnc.

Anyone have an opinion on which type of bit to use for drilling plastic? My experience is with the jobber style but maybe the other style has advantages?

Dusty Burman 

Robert Bell
 

Have not used these people yet, but worth a look...

Rob Bell 
Waynesville, NC

Mark Lewis
 

Good prices, but many items have no stock. 🤔 

Mark Lewis 
narrow gauge modeling in N.C.

Dusty
 

Robert,

Thanks for suggesting Unique Master Models. John Vojtech is an excellent modeler and great to do business with. I an using one of his scribes (SCR02) to clear the remnants of the door protector strap on the Railline box I'm working on. It's perfect for clearing the scribed siding groves. This car is a great big salvage job. Prior owner started car by drilling huge, crooked, misaligned grab iron holes. I'm trying to square up, fill up and improve the grab iron mounting holes.

The other tool from UMM I love is the JLC saw. Excellent for styrene. Makes Xacto and Jeweler's saws results look like chain saw cuts. Great for post assembly cuts.

Pulled the trigger on #83 and #86 jobber bits from Drill America (via Homely Despot). We will see.......

Dusty Burman

Climax@...
 

I see all these issue with properly locating grab irons and wonder.  Back in the mid 1960's I made a jig out of a piece of cardstock and a small section of wood.  I used a drafting pencil to locate the horizontal locations and vertical locations where the lines crossed.  All I did was drill holes in it and I have been using it for the last 50 years.  I have never had any one question grab iron locations.  All I do it slap the jig up agains the end of the car, slide it up tight to the roof line or trip board, hold it and start drilling.  When I'm done I insert grab irons and its done.  I turn the jig over and use the same techniques at the other end for the single grab iron.  Simple and effective.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: Dusty
Sent: Aug 28, 2019 11:39 AM
To: HOn3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [HOn3] Drill bits for Grab Irons

Robert,

Thanks for suggesting Unique Master Models. John Vojtech is an excellent modeler and great to do business with. I an using one of his scribes (SCR02) to clear the remnants of the door protector strap on the Railline box I'm working on. It's perfect for clearing the scribed siding groves. This car is a great big salvage job. Prior owner started car by drilling huge, crooked, misaligned grab iron holes. I'm trying to square up, fill up and improve the grab iron mounting holes.

The other tool from UMM I love is the JLC saw. Excellent for styrene. Makes Xacto and Jeweler's saws results look like chain saw cuts. Great for post assembly cuts.

Pulled the trigger on #83 and #86 jobber bits from Drill America (via Homely Despot). We will see.......

Dusty Burman

Dusty
 

Drilling the end grab holes isn't quite as much fun as drilling the holes in the sides. This is how I try to hold the body while drilling by hand.

Dusty Burman

Russ Norris
 

Great idea, Mark.  I am about to mount Tichy grab irons on an EBT house car.  I will definitely use this technique.


On Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 6:54 PM Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:
Drilling the end grab holes isn't quite as much fun as drilling the holes in the sides. This is how I try to hold the body while drilling by hand.

Dusty Burman


--
Russ Norris, MMR
Cape Cod, Massachusetts
http://blacklogvalleyrailroad.blogspot.com/

Joseph Melhorn
 

I realize I’m chiming in late (as usual) but another source is Drillman1 on eBay:

 

https://www.ebay.com/usr/drillman1

 

I’ve purchased a lot of carbide drill bits, end mills and other various cutters from him over the years. I think his prices are reasonable for the products he offers. Service is excellent.

Many moons ago I shared on one of the lists a low speed alternative to using a Dremel tool to hand drill holes for grab irons using twist drills. It consisted of using a General Tools Miniature powered screwdriver (Lowes Item # 78618 - on sale now for $9.99 thru 11/01/2019), some hex wrench stock (4,0mm hex wrench) and a micro drill chuck with collet set and a couple of grub screws. Since I built mine, I’ve noticed that the brass micro chuck sets now range in size from 0,5mm to 3,0mm - .0196” to .118” (eBay# 192671709836). When I acquired mine they went from 0,0mm to 3,0mm. There is a universal 0,3mm to 3,5mm (.0118” to .1378”) adjustable micro chuck (eBay# 191949240231) that could be used, too. There is still a way to get to zero closing. It requires another mini mandrel with a 0 to 1,2mm (0 to .0472”) capacity (eBay# 200866133453). This mandrel has a 3/32” (2,381mm (.0937”)) shank. You would need to trim ~1” (25,4mm) off the shank to fit in the micro chuck collet. An added bonus of using the adjustable micro chuck instead of the chuck w/collet set is that it opens wide enough to accommodate the 1/8” (3,175mm) carbide PC Board drill bits.

Here’s the procedure: Use an abrasive cutoff disc and cut a piece of the hex wrench about 1-1 1/4" long. Measure across the "points" on the 4.0mm hex wrench. I measured a screwdriver bit from my Micro Screwdriver and it measures ~.175" Take the set screw out of the chuck and drill out the hole to ~.175". Closest is a #17 at .173 or a #16 at .177". If you have a lathe or access to a lathe it's pretty simple. It can be done on a drill press if you have a vise that you can clamp the chuck into. Once the hole is drilled if you used the #17 drill bit, line up a flat on the piece of hex wrench that you cut off and dressed, with the hole for the set screw and press the cut piece in until it is about 1/8"past the set screw hole. Run the set screw in and you're done. I've made several of these for myself and friends, under $20.00 for the whole thing. Yeah, I know it’s brass and will eventually wear out, but I'm betting you'll drill several tens of thousands of grab iron holes before that happens. They're so cheap that you should buy several and you can get at least three pieces out of the 4.0mm hex wrench. Make three or four of them and keep your most used bits chucked up and its quick to change bit sizes for that project you're working on. I made six up for my workbench.

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

Mark Lewis
 

Joe:

Thanks for the tip and detailed info.

Mark Lewis
narrow gauge modeling in N.C.

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 12:38 PM Joseph Melhorn <toyman@...> wrote:

I realize I’m chiming in late (as usual) but another source is Drillman1 on eBay:

 

https://www.ebay.com/usr/drillman1

 

I’ve purchased a lot of carbide drill bits, end mills and other various cutters from him over the years. I think his prices are reasonable for the products he offers. Service is excellent.

Many moons ago I shared on one of the lists a low speed alternative to using a Dremel tool to hand drill holes for grab irons using twist drills. It consisted of using a General Tools Miniature powered screwdriver (Lowes Item # 78618 - on sale now for $9.99 thru 11/01/2019), some hex wrench stock (4,0mm hex wrench) and a micro drill chuck with collet set and a couple of grub screws. Since I built mine, I’ve noticed that the brass micro chuck sets now range in size from 0,5mm to 3,0mm - .0196” to .118” (eBay# 192671709836). When I acquired mine they went from 0,0mm to 3,0mm. There is a universal 0,3mm to 3,5mm (.0118” to .1378”) adjustable micro chuck (eBay# 191949240231) that could be used, too. There is still a way to get to zero closing. It requires another mini mandrel with a 0 to 1,2mm (0 to .0472”) capacity (eBay# 200866133453). This mandrel has a 3/32” (2,381mm (.0937”)) shank. You would need to trim ~1” (25,4mm) off the shank to fit in the micro chuck collet. An added bonus of using the adjustable micro chuck instead of the chuck w/collet set is that it opens wide enough to accommodate the 1/8” (3,175mm) carbide PC Board drill bits.

Here’s the procedure: Use an abrasive cutoff disc and cut a piece of the hex wrench about 1-1 1/4" long. Measure across the "points" on the 4.0mm hex wrench. I measured a screwdriver bit from my Micro Screwdriver and it measures ~.175" Take the set screw out of the chuck and drill out the hole to ~.175". Closest is a #17 at .173 or a #16 at .177". If you have a lathe or access to a lathe it's pretty simple. It can be done on a drill press if you have a vise that you can clamp the chuck into. Once the hole is drilled if you used the #17 drill bit, line up a flat on the piece of hex wrench that you cut off and dressed, with the hole for the set screw and press the cut piece in until it is about 1/8"past the set screw hole. Run the set screw in and you're done. I've made several of these for myself and friends, under $20.00 for the whole thing. Yeah, I know it’s brass and will eventually wear out, but I'm betting you'll drill several tens of thousands of grab iron holes before that happens. They're so cheap that you should buy several and you can get at least three pieces out of the 4.0mm hex wrench. Make three or four of them and keep your most used bits chucked up and its quick to change bit sizes for that project you're working on. I made six up for my workbench.

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

Pete C
 

Joe
  Do you have any pictures of your setup.  Your details are great but a few pictures would help make it a bit clearer, at least for me.  😉

On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:06 PM, Mark Lewis <narrowrails12@...> wrote:

Joe:

Thanks for the tip and detailed info.

Mark Lewis
narrow gauge modeling in N.C.

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 12:38 PM Joseph Melhorn <toyman@...> wrote:

I realize I’m chiming in late (as usual) but another source is Drillman1 on eBay:

 

https://www.ebay.com/usr/drillman1

 

I’ve purchased a lot of carbide drill bits, end mills and other various cutters from him over the years. I think his prices are reasonable for the products he offers. Service is excellent.

Many moons ago I shared on one of the lists a low speed alternative to using a Dremel tool to hand drill holes for grab irons using twist drills. It consisted of using a General Tools Miniature powered screwdriver (Lowes Item # 78618 - on sale now for $9.99 thru 11/01/2019), some hex wrench stock (4,0mm hex wrench) and a micro drill chuck with collet set and a couple of grub screws. Since I built mine, I’ve noticed that the brass micro chuck sets now range in size from 0,5mm to 3,0mm - .0196” to .118” (eBay# 192671709836). When I acquired mine they went from 0,0mm to 3,0mm. There is a universal 0,3mm to 3,5mm (.0118” to .1378”) adjustable micro chuck (eBay# 191949240231) that could be used, too. There is still a way to get to zero closing. It requires another mini mandrel with a 0 to 1,2mm (0 to .0472”) capacity (eBay# 200866133453). This mandrel has a 3/32” (2,381mm (.0937”)) shank. You would need to trim ~1” (25,4mm) off the shank to fit in the micro chuck collet. An added bonus of using the adjustable micro chuck instead of the chuck w/collet set is that it opens wide enough to accommodate the 1/8” (3,175mm) carbide PC Board drill bits.

Here’s the procedure: Use an abrasive cutoff disc and cut a piece of the hex wrench about 1-1 1/4" long. Measure across the "points" on the 4.0mm hex wrench. I measured a screwdriver bit from my Micro Screwdriver and it measures ~.175" Take the set screw out of the chuck and drill out the hole to ~.175". Closest is a #17 at .173 or a #16 at .177". If you have a lathe or access to a lathe it's pretty simple. It can be done on a drill press if you have a vise that you can clamp the chuck into. Once the hole is drilled if you used the #17 drill bit, line up a flat on the piece of hex wrench that you cut off and dressed, with the hole for the set screw and press the cut piece in until it is about 1/8"past the set screw hole. Run the set screw in and you're done. I've made several of these for myself and friends, under $20.00 for the whole thing. Yeah, I know it’s brass and will eventually wear out, but I'm betting you'll drill several tens of thousands of grab iron holes before that happens. They're so cheap that you should buy several and you can get at least three pieces out of the 4.0mm hex wrench. Make three or four of them and keep your most used bits chucked up and its quick to change bit sizes for that project you're working on. I made six up for my workbench.

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

Joseph Melhorn
 

Hi Pete,

Give me a day or three and I’ll snap some pics and upload them for you.

Thanks for the interest.

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

Joseph Melhorn
 

Well, it took more than a few days to put this together. Somehow the NNGC and a trip to Kalifornia to attend, plus other sundry diversions… well you get the picture. Attached is a short tutorial on how I make those small chucks for use in a General Tools Miniature Powered Screwdriver and some source information.

Regards,

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

Pete C
 

Thanks for the great detailed information Joe,  and since I have the general drill I plan to make one like you have outlined.

Pete 


On Sep 26, 2019, at 3:46 PM, Joseph Melhorn <toyman@...> wrote:

Well, it took more than a few days to put this together. Somehow the NNGC and a trip to Kalifornia to attend, plus other sundry diversions… well you get the picture. Attached is a short tutorial on how I make those small chucks for use in a General Tools Miniature Powered Screwdriver and some source information.

Regards,

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ

 

<Drill Bit Chuck.pdf>

Bill Lugg
 

Thanks for the detailed instructions.  I'll have to put one of these together.  FWIW, Home Depot and Amazon have the General tool for $12.67 compared to Lowes' price of $19.98.  Also, Amazon has a LED lighted version for $21, which might just be interesting, though adding the chuck might just block the light.

Bill Lugg

On 9/26/19 1:46 PM, Joseph Melhorn wrote:

Well, it took more than a few days to put this together. Somehow the NNGC and a trip to Kalifornia to attend, plus other sundry diversions… well you get the picture. Attached is a short tutorial on how I make those small chucks for use in a General Tools Miniature Powered Screwdriver and some source information.

Regards,

Joe Melhorn

Sahuarita, AZ