Date   

Re: conoco tank cars

 

What is your cauterizing tool? A soldering iron?

Bruce Dunlevy 


On Jul 20, 2020, at 11:15 AM, Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:

Brian,

I was underwhelmed with the ease of Kadee truck disassemble. And the timing of disintegration. When I'm designing a car I attach and remove the trucks a bunch of times. Once I realized the trucks fell apart when they were right side up there had to be a better way. I assembled them with a screw and nut. I then 'welded' them with a cautery tool. Virtually NONE of my other cars have equalized trucks and they perform very well. Now I can handle the trucks unmounted at will. It works for me.

Dusty Burman 
623 261-8707

<1595261345408868311612617161100.jpg>


Re: conoco tank cars

Dusty
 

Brian,

I was underwhelmed with the ease of Kadee truck disassemble. And the timing of disintegration. When I'm designing a car I attach and remove the trucks a bunch of times. Once I realized the trucks fell apart when they were right side up there had to be a better way. I assembled them with a screw and nut. I then 'welded' them with a cautery tool. Virtually NONE of my other cars have equalized trucks and they perform very well. Now I can handle the trucks unmounted at will. It works for me.

Dusty Burman 
623 261-8707


Re: conoco tank cars

Brian Kopp
 

 Dave she demanded $2 a truck!  While I outwardly protested, I was happy to pay her..... =)
--
Brian Kopp
Jacksonville, FL


Re: conoco tank cars

Climax@...
 

Brian, Your a woos, making your poor daughter put the trucks together for you.  Kind of reminds me of the days when I hired my 3 daughters to cut shingles out of cedar sheets for putting on structures.  hahahaha  They hated it and went on strike.

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Kopp
Sent: Jul 19, 2020 8:11 PM
To: HOn3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [HOn3] conoco tank cars

Robert the Kadee 720+ trucks sort of clip-together but if they are not on a car, they fall apart, by design. A little weird, IMHO. I have a cigar box with trucks that are built and pre-weathered for installs. Can't really do that with 720 series unless you put a temporary screw and nut thru the mount hole to keep the parts together......

That said they go together easier than just about any other truck I have. No stressing the sideframes or other worry-some procedures like keeping track of 8 springs while you squish the bolster to and fro.  A few months ago I posted a picture here of my 17 year oid daughter putting Kadee spring trucks together for me..... for a fee.....

--
Brian Kopp
Jacksonville, FL


Re: conoco tank cars

Brian Kopp
 

Robert the Kadee 720+ trucks sort of clip-together but if they are not on a car, they fall apart, by design. A little weird, IMHO. I have a cigar box with trucks that are built and pre-weathered for installs. Can't really do that with 720 series unless you put a temporary screw and nut thru the mount hole to keep the parts together......

That said they go together easier than just about any other truck I have. No stressing the sideframes or other worry-some procedures like keeping track of 8 springs while you squish the bolster to and fro.  A few months ago I posted a picture here of my 17 year oid daughter putting Kadee spring trucks together for me..... for a fee.....

--
Brian Kopp
Jacksonville, FL


Re: conoco tank cars

Robert Veefkind
 

 
 
In a message dated 7/11/2020 1:55:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, kc5lpa1@... writes:
 
My pleasure Robert. Send along a picture of your tank car conversion when you are ready to share one. I'd love to see it!
--
Brian Kopp
Jacksonville, FL
_._,_._,_
looks like it's on hold until I have enough patience to assemble the Kadee 717 trucks. I didn't know Kadee has newer ones that snap together.   Bob V. in virus plagued S.E. Fl


Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

kevin b
 


If you have a Shapeways account (free) you can establish a conversation
with the designer and ask him the question you asked here re a scaled
down/NG version. 

roger that bill.

i already posted the question to him is his was the same size as the original.
he has yet to reply.

 FWIW, it looks like his design might lend itself to 
inserting some weight in the voids between the frame members, 

most likely, the scaled down version would not allow room for enough weight. 'course, i'd have to have one in hand and so on, which is a problem, since he hasn't made one.....

especially if you used some heavy metal like plutonium...just kidding.  :o)

er, yea, plutonium, i'll stop off at  wal mart on my way home tomorrow and pick some up. lol.... hell, who knows, they might even have it.Emoji

HTH
Bill Lugg

Kevin.


Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

Bill Lugg
 

If you have a Shapeways account (free) you can establish a conversation with the designer and ask him the question you asked here re a scaled down/NG version.  FWIW, it looks like his design might lend itself to inserting some weight in the voids between the frame members, which might achieve your goals sufficiently...especially if you used some heavy metal like plutonium...just kidding.  :o)

HTH
Bill Lugg

On 7/18/20 5:18 PM, kevin b via groups.io wrote:
Here s the shapeways MDC narrow frame.

https://www.shapeways.com/product/T6Y3BXVEP/mdc-26-ft-tank-car-frame-1-87?optionId=42389275&li=user-wishlist

thanks for the post on that.
i checked it out.
looks pretty good, i especially like the center saddle on the print.
but,  it looks like it's very close to the original in size, which makes it too big for narrow gauge, at least in my opinion.
i'm likely to buy one anyhow however.
just to have it in hand for 100% inspection and so on.
by any chance, does anyone on here know the person who did the computer file for the piece?
might be he'd do another one but downsized.
i still want the thing made from metal though, that puts the weight on the car to begin with, and nice and low etc.

thanks.
kevin.




Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

kevin b
 

Here s the shapeways MDC narrow frame.
looks pretty good, i especially like the center saddle on the print.
but,  it looks like it's very close to the original in size, which makes it too big for narrow gauge, at least in my opinion.
i'm likely to buy one anyhow however.
just to have it in hand for 100% inspection and so on.
by any chance, does anyone on here know the person who did the computer file for the piece?
might be he'd do another one but downsized.
i still want the thing made from metal though, that puts the weight on the car to begin with, and nice and low etc.

thanks.
kevin.




Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

Robert Veefkind
 

 
 
In a message dated 7/18/2020 1:44:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, kc5lpa1@... writes:
 

sure beats an hour milling the mdc frame plus 20 minutes vacuuming
I looked for that on shapeways but did not find it----thanks


Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

Brian Kopp
 

Here s the shapeways MDC narrow frame.

https://www.shapeways.com/product/T6Y3BXVEP/mdc-26-ft-tank-car-frame-1-87?optionId=42389275&li=user-wishlist

I can recommend three resources to review for NG tank cars:
Grandt NGP Volume 4
Sloan 100+10 years of DRGW NG freight cars
Slim Gauge Cars Second Edition has more drawings to complement Sloan

Sloan has a nice narrative on the Union Tank and Conoco cars, and a  bit on the Texaco cars.

Sloan says UTLX cars on the DRGW NG were rebuilts from old tank cars. UTLX had 2 styles: narrow frame and frameless, with the narrow frame at 4' 10".

Sloan also says it was Conoco who had all sorts of frame styles including flat cars, wood underframes and 4 styles of steel underframes. The tanks and domes came in various lengths and diameters too.  Grandt has a photo of derailed and flipped COLX 8 from 1913 in Telluride. You can see the really narrow steel underframe that sloan says was 18" wide. (like the MDC frame style). COLX cars became CONX cars in the 20s.


--
Brian Kopp
Jacksonville, FL


TIMBER TIMES AND TALL TIMBER SHORT LINES MAGAZINES

Keith Wiseman
 

Hello All,

Shameless plug to let everyone know I have most every one of these magazines listed on ebay and duplicates of many. 

ebay seller wisemodserv

Thanks if interested. Sorry for bothering if not. 


Thanks,

Keith Wiseman
Wiseman Model Services Inc.


Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

John Stutz
 

Keven and Robert

The MDC old timer tank frame is a very oversize version of that used under the UTLX X-3(?) tanks, successors to the Van Dyke frameless tank cars. A drawing of the 6,000 gallon, center sill framed car, is in the 1906 Car Builders Dictionary (available online) as figures 494-96. This frame consists of two 15" channels, with a top cover plate 19 7/8" wide. An accurate HO scale frame is available from Shapeways, but I do not recall the vendor's name.

A drawing of the 10,000 gallon UTLX Van dyke immediately precedes the above one, and give a good idea of how the 6,000 gallon version looked when new.

About 25 years ago someone offered a fairly crude narrow frame conversion kit for the MDC old timer tanks. This was basically just an injection molded rectangle of styrene channels, with bolsters and coupler mounting pads. It should be straightforward to duplicate this, using Evergreen styrene channel stock. Follow the drawings in Sloan, add decal rivets, and you can improve on it. I would screw the coupler pockets directly onto the tank, since the whole point of building narrow frame cars was to set the tank shell as low as possible while still clearing the coupler draft gear.

John Stutz

On July 15, 2020 at 5:49 PM "kevin b via groups.io" <arcatruck13@...> wrote:


I tried to mill down the MDC zamac frame to narrow frame proportions with little luck. Bob Veefkind

hello Bob, and all other interested parties:

personally, i think the thing to do for the MDC tank car is make a frame for it.
i have a spin casting machine, i can get a mold made.
i am not a machinist and therefore can't make a master pattern myself.

in my opinion, the MDC frame is about 2x thicker (top to bottom) than it needs to be.

so, now where to get a master pattern.....

Kevin.
 
hello Bob.

 

 


Re: Conoco narrow gauge tank cars

John Stutz
 

Robert

A few years ago I bought an HO scale frame forfor UTLX prototype of the MDC tank cars form Shapeways. I believe that it is still being offered.
However My reading of the Grandt Pictorial is that the relatively high center of gravity of these cars was enough of a problem to preclude running them on 3' gauge trucks. Although that seems questionable, since a tank on flatcar is carried almost as high, and the converted UTLX Van Dyke (Gramps) tanks were only a few inches lower.

On July 15, 2020 at 12:08 PM "Robert Veefkind via groups.io" <snookdust@...> wrote:

Good day gentle modelers

After re-reading Grandts pictorial and Dr. Sloans N.G. freight cars, I am convinced modeling them (tank cars) is a hobby in itself. They were built with various frames different trucks and brake systems.Even on a wood frame with truss rods. The lettering changed over the years too. Most of you are aware of these things I know.
Dry transfer lettering to me is much preferred. I still have a bunch of CDS dry transfers but they are dried out and all suggestions to restore them did not work.I wonder what the shelf life is?
I tried to mill down the MDC zamac frame to narrow frame proportions with little luck. Bob Veefkind
 

 


Re: conoco tank cars

Mike Conder
 

I didn’t know you guys did custom decals, that’s very good to know.   What format do you need for the artwork?

On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 4:38 AM M2fq via groups.io <M2fq=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

Kevin

We make decals you have artwork


On Thursday, July 16, 2020 kevin b via groups.io <HOn3@groups.io> wrote:
well, already, problems.

1. the printer i said get, can't be had.

2. alps is out of business.

3. the white ink i'm told is available is for printers no longer being made.

so, at the moment, i'm in re-groupe mode.

results by the end of the month are now probably not possible.

i have not called it quits yet though.

Kevin.


Re: conoco tank cars

M2fq@...
 

Kevin

We make decals you have artwork




On Thursday, July 16, 2020 kevin b via groups.io <HOn3@groups.io> wrote:

well, already, problems.

1. the printer i said get, can't be had.

2. alps is out of business.

3. the white ink i'm told is available is for printers no longer being made.

so, at the moment, i'm in re-groupe mode.

results by the end of the month are now probably not possible.

i have not called it quits yet though.

Kevin.


Re: conoco tank cars

kevin b
 

You might try printing them in silver or light gray.
Ken Martin

thanks.
might just have a go at that.
Kevin.


Re: conoco tank cars

kevin b
 

Try searching for Ghost Inks, they sell white laser toner cartridges that fit standard printer models. 

thanks.
I'll give that a shot.
Kevin.


Re: conoco tank cars

Ken Martin
 

You might try printing them in silver or light gray.
C&S engines were lettered with aluminum leaf and many said they looked white.
Most decal makers make the engine lettering in white. 
Thinfilm did some in silver and I used them on a couple of engines and they do look like white.

Ken Martin



On Jul 16, 2020, at 3:59 PM, kevin b via groups.io <arcatruck13@...> wrote:

well, already, problems.

1. the printer i said get, can't be had.

2. alps is out of business.

3. the white ink i'm told is available is for printers no longer being made.

so, at the moment, i'm in re-groupe mode.

results by the end of the month are now probably not possible.

i have not called it quits yet though.

Kevin.

_._,_._,_


Re: conoco tank cars

hiroechan
 

Try searching for Ghost Inks, they sell white laser toner cartridges that fit standard printer models. 


On Thu, Jul 16, 2020, 7:39 PM Bill Lugg <luggw1@...> wrote:
There's several Alps printers on eBay (if that's what you're looking
for): https://www.ebay.com/b/Alps-Printers/1245/bn_320493 - most of them
look like junkers.  I'm not sure what model you're looking for.

And I found a refurbished MD5500 for a mere $5,500 here:
https://www.e-scan.com/alps-md5500/.  It even comes with a laptop.

Bill Lugg


On 7/16/20 4:59 PM, kevin b via groups.io wrote:
> well, already, problems.
>
> 1. the printer i said get, can't be had.
>
> 2. alps is out of business.
>
> 3. the white ink i'm told is available is for printers no longer being
> made.
>
> so, at the moment, i'm in re-groupe mode.
>
> results by the end of the month are now probably not possible.
>
> i have not called it quits yet though.
>
> Kevin.
>
>