Date   
Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

NarrowMinded1
 

If you go to the HOn3 Narrow Gaugers Facebook group thereare pics of the #705 in Blackstone cars and compared to the #58 and Sergeant Sharon couplets. Also, I posted a reply I received from Kadee regarding the availability of the #705 in.bilk packs as follows...

Reply from Kadee re: #705 bulk packs...

"Hello Mr. Kline,

Sorry No.  We are just starting production and it will take quite sometime to build up a reserve stock. Also, the coupler's design will not allow it to be used in another type of coupler box or cast on pocket.

Most Blackstone models come with our #714 HOn3 couplers and the #705 will fit anywhere the #714 will fit"

They kind of contradict themselves in the reply but the proof is in the pics. IMHO they would be shooting themselves in the foot if the #705 didn't fit where the defacto standard #714 did.

"That's a great shame. I had hoped that this would a) retro fit the 714 as a drop in replacement and b) eliminate the 'bounce' altogether. The potential for sales to RailLine and BS owners must surely have been a consideration. But if the conversion involves hacking away bits of an already perferctly good draft box, then I'm afraid I'm not interested.

Lost opportunity IMHO

Mark K"
--
Nathan Kline
Tiadaghton Valley Railroad & Coal Co.
McConnellsburg, PA
--------------------------------------------------
Web: https://www.tiadaghtonvalleyrr.com/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/TiadaghtonValleyRailroad/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVJMoICFWw9Muse6xm8moiQ

--
Nathan Kline
Tiadaghton Valley Railroad & Coal Co.
McConnellsburg, PA
--------------------------------------------------
Web: https://www.tiadaghtonvalleyrr.com/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/TiadaghtonValleyRailroad/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVJMoICFWw9Muse6xm8moiQ

For Sale PFM hi grade K-27

Doug Boudakian <dboudrrtrain@...>
 

Mint condition PFM Hi grade K-27 2-8-2. Runs like a Swiss watch. Has bag with extra screws. A couple small parts need to soldered back on the engine. No driver wear. Box is in mint condition with all foam inserts and Pfm plastic wrap for engine and tender. Has original warranty card. Pictures on request. Send private reply and not to the list. $400
Shipping extra

Doug Boudakian

@Durango

Re: Any narrow gauge news/ coupler bounce is prototypical

Earl Knoob
 

One must also understand how the draft (pulling) and buff (pushing) forces act on the prototype.  When pulling up hill, the slack is stretched.  It is going down grade where it gets interesting.  The slack will run in to the engine and stay that way until the air brakes are applied and the train then stretches the slack.  In the days of steam, you did all you could to keep the slack stretched out.  The problem with out HOn3 models is the cars don't roll free enough to keep the train bunched against the engine.  If there was enough drag in the cars, they could be kept stretched going down grade, but then the locomotives couldn't pull anything up grade.  Back in the dark ages of DC operation I had a couple of cabooses set up with rear marker lights and rail wipers that provided power for lamps.  With the wipers down, I almost had to double head the caboose up grades.  But going down grade, it anchored the train nicely and kept it stretched.  The solution was to rig up a way for the wiper to be pulled up off the rail when running up hill.  The wiper could be manipulated with a tooth pick when the train was stopped.  Kinda crude, but it worked and all trains had to stop at the top of the grades for an "airbrake inspection" before starting down.


From: HOn3@groups.io <HOn3@groups.io> on behalf of ftgcss <ftgc@...>
Sent: Friday, July 19, 2019 10:45 AM
To: HOn3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [HOn3] Any narrow gauge news/ coupler bounce is prototypical
 
Coupler "bounce" as you describe it only happens on cars with cushioned drawbars (auto racks, lumber racks and some box cars for example) narrow gauge cars of 50's and previous did not have cushioned drawbars and therefore had no "bounce".  Additionally even with cushioned drawbars once the slack is stretched the couplers stay pulled out unlike Kadees whose springs can actually pull the cars back together and make the train look like a slinky going down the track.

Scott

Re: Any narrow gauge news/ coupler bounce is prototypical

ftgcss
 

Coupler "bounce" as you describe it only happens on cars with cushioned drawbars (auto racks, lumber racks and some box cars for example) narrow gauge cars of 50's and previous did not have cushioned drawbars and therefore had no "bounce".  Additionally even with cushioned drawbars once the slack is stretched the couplers stay pulled out unlike Kadees whose springs can actually pull the cars back together and make the train look like a slinky going down the track.

Scott

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention-Change subject line

Don Peterson
 

Any chance we can change the subject line to reflect the subject being discussed?

Don Peterson

On Thursday, July 18, 2019, 9:40:56 PM MDT, Dale Buxton <dbtuathaddana@...> wrote:


Dusty

Question 1
Yes
Question 2
Don’t know. 242 box is a different animal not seen by these eyes.
Question 3
Already answered in question 1

After all is said and done. I am really glad Kadee has done an updated design. I was long overdue. 

But, now that I have been using Sergents for quite a while now. They are easier for me to assemble and mount.

This new 705 really needs its designed coupler box. Which means my scratch built and Blackstone cars would all need coupler box area surgery to use them.

All a built up Sergent coupler needs is to be dropped in a 714 or 714 clone coupler box. That works for me!

Dale B



On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 19:58 Art D3 <apdutra3@...> wrote:
We'll have to wait a little longer for 705 couplers. Just check Kadee's website (7/18 9:45PM) and they are sold out until Monday 7/22. I guess that Kadee is finding out how annoying the old coupler bounce is!
--
Art Dutra
Meriden, CT

Re: WP&Y pilot

Robert Bell
 

Sean, 
I do not believe that PSC ever offered the pilots separately.  I have two of the "trailing" units and need the plow pilot.  I just recently started to scratch-build one.  
Several years ago on the whitepassfanlist on yahoo, some of the other guys proposed getting PSC to make a run of the plows and to my knowledge nothing happened.
That being said, are you looking for the plow or the trailing pilot?

Rob Bell 
Waynesville, NC 


On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 5:17 PM, Sean
<Cndrsean@...> wrote:

Anybody out there know the PSC number for the HOn3 WP&Y diesel that had the “Switching/yard Pilot” I remember seeing it in the two motors set you could buy when they came out (20years ago+) I bought the single motor but it didn’t come with that additional pilot.
Thx
Sean L McCarthy

Re: Any narrow gauge news/ coupler bounce is prototypical

roundbell@...
 

If you have actually worked on real railroad cars you realize that "coupler bounce" happens on the real cars. The springing in the coupler draft gear is used to absorb coupling impact both in and out. Each car coupling has some give both in the jaws and in the springs that mount the coupler in the body. The 714 have too much give ( Bounce ) but to be correct models of real couplers they do need some bounce but looking at the 715 in a model looks like it will have no more "bounce" than the real couplers have and if you have the point at the front of the coupler box pin the coupler will center. I think the new coupler will satisfy the people who object to the "bounce" and we will have to see how difficult it is to install in various models.  LocoDoc


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kasprowicz <marowicz@...>
To: HOn3 <HOn3@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Jul 18, 2019 11:46 pm
Subject: Re: [HOn3] Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

That's a great shame. I had hoped that this would a) retro fit the 714 as a drop in replacement and b) eliminate the 'bounce' altogether. The potential for sales to RailLine and BS owners must surely have been a consideration. But if the conversion involves hacking away bits of an already perferctly good draft box, then I'm afraid I'm not interested.

Lost opportunity IMHO

Mark K

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Mark Kasprowicz
 

That's a great shame. I had hoped that this would a) retro fit the 714 as a drop in replacement and b) eliminate the 'bounce' altogether. The potential for sales to RailLine and BS owners must surely have been a consideration. But if the conversion involves hacking away bits of an already perferctly good draft box, then I'm afraid I'm not interested.

Lost opportunity IMHO

Mark K

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Dale Buxton
 

Dusty

Question 1
Yes
Question 2
Don’t know. 242 box is a different animal not seen by these eyes.
Question 3
Already answered in question 1

After all is said and done. I am really glad Kadee has done an updated design. I was long overdue. 

But, now that I have been using Sergents for quite a while now. They are easier for me to assemble and mount.

This new 705 really needs its designed coupler box. Which means my scratch built and Blackstone cars would all need coupler box area surgery to use them.

All a built up Sergent coupler needs is to be dropped in a 714 or 714 clone coupler box. That works for me!

Dale B



On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 19:58 Art D3 <apdutra3@...> wrote:
We'll have to wait a little longer for 705 couplers. Just check Kadee's website (7/18 9:45PM) and they are sold out until Monday 7/22. I guess that Kadee is finding out how annoying the old coupler bounce is!
--
Art Dutra
Meriden, CT

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Art D3
 

We'll have to wait a little longer for 705 couplers. Just check Kadee's website (7/18 9:45PM) and they are sold out until Monday 7/22. I guess that Kadee is finding out how annoying the old coupler bounce is!
--
Art Dutra
Meriden, CT

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Dusty
 

Does this mean that the 705 coupler requires a flat on the back of the pivot post to allow the spring to find 'center'? How does the 242 box accomplish centering? How would the Blackstone pivot accomplish centering?

I can't wait to get some 705's.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Dale Buxton
 

Ditto!

Dale B

On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 13:29 Mike Van Hove <vanhovem22@...> wrote:
Why not just bite the bullet, and use Sergent Couplers?

Scale size, easy assembly, they fit, Prototypical operation, and NO Bounce, Slinky Action or whatever you want to call it.

I’ve been using them for several years now, and very satisfied.

No connection to the company, just a satisfied user.

Mike Van Hove

On Jul 18, 2019, at 1:21 PM, Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:

What would happen if you used the short scale head coupler on a Blackstone car. Add your own post farther back to couple closer. Would the 'whiskers' have room to function width wise?

Is the 705 bounce less than the 71x bounce?

I wonder if Kadee had any idea how many people find the Hon3 split coupler bounce annoying.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Dale Buxton
 

No whisker springs on this car. Its a coil spring at the back end of the coupler, inside a metal loop that fits in slot behind the unique pivot post. It has about 1/32” of in-line play.

A home built pivot post Is certainly an option. But forget about spring loading the coupler if you do this. The as made pivot post is so unique in design that you can’t get the little spring back in behind a simple round pivot post without fully compressing the spring!

Last night I tried to do this many times on a Blackstone boxcar and I simply could not get that little spring in the slot it was supposed to go into!

On the spring bounce issue. This is still an in-line springing system. There is about 1/32” of play at each coupler. So 1/16” play at each car end. I have not mounted any of these yet to test the amount of spring bounce in a train.

Dale B



On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 12:21 Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:
What would happen if you used the short scale head coupler on a Blackstone car. Add your own post farther back to couple closer. Would the 'whiskers' have room to function width wise?

Is the 705 bounce less than the 71x bounce?

I wonder if Kadee had any idea how many people find the Hon3 split coupler bounce annoying.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Mike Van Hove
 

Why not just bite the bullet, and use Sergent Couplers?

Scale size, easy assembly, they fit, Prototypical operation, and NO Bounce, Slinky Action or whatever you want to call it.

I’ve been using them for several years now, and very satisfied.

No connection to the company, just a satisfied user.

Mike Van Hove

On Jul 18, 2019, at 1:21 PM, Dusty <dustburm@q.com> wrote:

What would happen if you used the short scale head coupler on a Blackstone car. Add your own post farther back to couple closer. Would the 'whiskers' have room to function width wise?

Is the 705 bounce less than the 71x bounce?

I wonder if Kadee had any idea how many people find the Hon3 split coupler bounce annoying.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Richard Johnson
 

I switched over to using Accumate couplers in my hon3.  They fut closer, look more scale and dont bounce, but tis been a few years simce i picked up an hon3 model, i think i had to ream out the center post hole a bit.
Rich johnson

www.RichardSJohnson.net

"Those who enjoy freedom must endeavor to preserve it."


"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms"
Thomas Jefferson


From: HOn3@groups.io <HOn3@groups.io> on behalf of Dusty <dustburm@q.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2019 11:21:44 AM
To: HOn3@groups.io <HOn3@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [HOn3] Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention
 
What would happen if you used the short scale head coupler on a Blackstone car. Add your own post farther back to couple closer. Would the 'whiskers' have room to function width wise?

Is the 705 bounce less than the 71x bounce?

I wonder if Kadee had any idea how many people find the Hon3 split coupler bounce annoying.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Dusty
 

What would happen if you used the short scale head coupler on a Blackstone car. Add your own post farther back to couple closer. Would the 'whiskers' have room to function width wise?

Is the 705 bounce less than the 71x bounce?

I wonder if Kadee had any idea how many people find the Hon3 split coupler bounce annoying.

Dusty Burman 

Re: Back to the Good Scale!

lloyd lehrer
 

Tam valley units from deadrail can fit. There is also new bluetooth that was announced at nmra national that is very compact. Have not seen it yet. Just heard it came out. Have not seen any details yet.

lloyd lehrer, (310)951-9097

On Wed, Jul 17, 2019, 9:20 PM <alsands@...> wrote:
Is Airwire small enough yet fo HOn3?

Alan Perth Western Australia


--
lloyd lehrer

Re: Any narrow gauge news from the NMRA National Convention

Mark Kasprowicz
 

Shhhh...say nothing. It will go away.

Re: Back to the Good Scale!

jczul36
 

Al, I spoke to Jim weekly, and I miss him too!
Jim would be very happy to hear you’re modeling in Hon3.  
Regards,
jc


On Jul 17, 2019, at 4:31 PM, Alan Lautenslager <alan.lautenslager@...> wrote:

Ever since I retired from CVP Products and moved out of Dallas I have been floundering around as to what scale to spend my time in. I have everything from Z scale to G scale and they all that their pros and cons for me. In going thru some boxes the other day I came across one that made me choke up. 
Jim Vail use to call me about every 3 weeks at CVP just to chat and give me hell like only Jim could! He keep bugging me about going into HOn3. I told him I no longer had a motive power but still had lots of rolling stock. The conversation for that day ended from a grunt from Jim. About a month later a box showed up at my house. Inside was an unpainted Westside Models C-25, a painted and re-motored PFM RGS #20 and a factory painted Westside Models C-16 #268 with back head detail and instrument motor ( All sound installed by Jim). He called a few days later and told me I had no excuse now not to be modeling in Hon3 and wished me a happy retirement. It was not too one that he was gone.
Having come across those locos sealed the decision for me. I will be starting on a small HOn3 layout in honor of Jim. Although the only times Jim and I got together were at the conventions we did spend a lot of time on the phone. Conversations that I will remember for a long time. 
Damn I miss those calls.
Regards - Al ( CVP Products retired )

Re: Back to the Good Scale!

alsands@...
 

Is Airwire small enough yet fo HOn3?

Alan Perth Western Australia