Re: Alberta Navigation and Coal/Great Falls and Canada Railway

Nigel Phillips

Correction. Two 2-6-0 tender locomotives with 41" drivers, middle driver unflanged, two 2-8-0 tender locomotive with 37" drivers, middle two drivers unflanged. There were some tight curves/switches in the Lethbridge yard, yet to find a plan of the Great Falls yard. The roundhouse at Lethbridge was quite big, probably changed the builder of the locomotives.

On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 11:47 AM Nigel Phillips <nigelp18000@...> wrote:
Thanks, Kevin,

The Southern Methodist University (SMU) has an impressive database of Balwin records and documents. These include the order books with an index by the purchaser or by class. I came across this through

The SMU site is   The later C16 locomotives built by Baldwinshould be in there.

The lines I am interested in had 3 orders in 1890 for a 2.6.0 and two 0-6-0 locomotives. The order book gives customer-specific dimensions such as cylinder sizes, wheel diameters, etc. Diagrams are also available which have to be ordered. Going through the order books is tedious work, all handwritten in cursive.

The sources I use in the UK for wheels, axles, etc. are as follows:

Alan Gibson Workshop  -
Markits  -

I have had a look at the P.S.C. offering, but as this is designed for the D&RG C16 it may not suit the later 2-8-0 locomotives built by Baldwin for the Alberta/Great Falls line. It's also HOn30, not HOn3, which would mean drifting out the axles and replacing them with longer ones. AGW wheels, crankpins, and rods come to around $70.00, enough for an 8-coupled engine. Driving gear and narrow gearbox come to around $20-$50 depending on the source. Markits has TT axles, gearboxes, etc. HOn3 gauge, and instant quartering with this design. UK scratch modeling has a slightly different philosophy, motor (± flywheel) with worm driving a brass gear directly in a gearbox that locates on the driving axle. Both AGW and Markits wheels are normally RP25 compliant. Something from NWSL would be the alternative, although the product range is reduced.

No mill or lathe since downsizing. If AGW agrees to do the frame millings (I am in the process of asking), they are made available to others who want them. Around $15 each for the engine or tender. Otherwise, it's an etch in N/S, which will be expensive for the first sheet (but lots of space for other things). Home etching is less precise but more expensive than commercial etching for a limited run. Commercially, up to 12 x 12 inch etching costs around $50 for the setup, around $50 for the etch, depending on how much half etching is done (front or back). That's a lot of etching, enough for lots of pieces. If anybody knows of an etching service that does model railroad one-offs here in the US please let me know. I also know of one company in the UK that will take a works diagram and generate the etches for a custom build.

Anybody interested in having something etched let me know and I'll see if it can be done at the same time. Layered vector graphics, I use CorelDraw.

Sorry for the 2 previous posts, didn't realize there was a delay.

On Monday, March 1, 2021, kevin b via <> wrote:

i have a friend who may know about a book or books to assist you.
i'll contact him and see what he may know.
will replay asap.

as for using N gauge anything on an HO model, the problem is whatever you want to use, is in N gauge.
for instance: wheels, way too little, too narrow, spokes way too puny, and on and on.
not saying a N scale motor etc won't work, but you'd have to up size the drivers at the very least, but i don't see that working because the diameters would be too big and not clear each other due to axle spacing.

i HOPE you solve the problem, because i too want to scratch build some locos.
p.s.c lists a set of drivers for a C-16. a 4 axle set, 2 with flanges, 2 without, one axle geared, and one lead truck wheel set.
they are not exactly cheap though, last time i looked the set was close to 90 bucks.

'course, there are still some HOn3 MDC kits out there, on ebay and so on, but they're running roughly a c note each.
but, if it's all there, you get a complete 2-8-0 that way.

more later.

Came across this 200-mile long 3 foot gauge railway in Montana/Alberta that ran from 1890 to around 1903 before becoming standard gauge (with a lot of dual gauge track during the transition). Quite a few more narrow gauge miles around Lethbridge, AB. The standard gauge was operated by the Great Northern and the Canadian Pacific after a lot of political maneuvering and financial skullduggery. Lots of interesting modeling interests, including a transborder depot that bisected the international boundary.

The starting locomotives were Baldwins, the first 3 erected in 1890 (and in the Baldwin records). 4-4-0's, then on to 2-6-0 and 2-8-0 locomotives. Quite a few photographs of the locomotives are around but most lack suitable datum points to guesstimate dimensions. I'm interested in the Moguls but have run into the usual problem of this gauge and scale, the scarcity of models. Can anybody point me to some plans/blueprints/diagrams with dimensions? Specifically the Moguls. Trawling through the available information online I have some possible wheel diameters (dependent on the cylinder dimensions), but a diagram with the major dimensions is what I am really looking for. Rather than going down the regauging route, which I'm very familiar with as I model EM gauge (16.5 to 18.2mm), I think it's more feasible to have some frames cut and etched and proceed from there with the bodywork. Wheels and cut-down axles from Alan Gibson Works in the UK, along with a narrow gearbox and motor suitable for DCC operation. Built a few of these in OO/4mm scale, so nothing new there.

I looked briefly at regauging an N-scale chassis and using 3D printed add-ons for the boiler, cab, and tender but I'm not convinced that an N-scale body is a good match for the body, and the same applies to the wheels.

Any assitance appreciated.

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