And I await with bated breath the release/arrival of the Rivarossi
2-6-6-6 Allegheney! WHOOO-ha what a monster!

Brad Bourbina

----Original Message Follows----
From: "Chris Shinn" <cnshinn@home.com>
Reply-To: HOsteam@onelist.com
To: <HOsteam@onelist.com>
Subject: Re: [HOsteam] Future of the "plastic" steam models.
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 18:12:28 -0600

I would say that LifeLike and Bachmann will probably stick to more
"generic" loco's, at least for a couple more years as interest in steam
picks up again. They will probably keep bringing out USRA models,
or like the Spectrum Decapod soon to be released, loco's that saw
heavy use but haven't been made available except in brass.


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

Aristocraft steam was before my time, too. Like you I've seen quite a few
on eBay and have even been tempted to bid on a couple. I wonder how
well they ran?

Chris Shinn
Winnipeg, Canada

Hi All,

While we are all discussing the upcoming resurgence of steam in HO, does
anyone on this list remember the variety of locos that AristoCraft made in
the 1950's? I'm too young to remember those days, but I'm constantly
enjoying seeing (new to me) Aristo HO steam locos appearing on eBay and at
meets.

From what I can tell, there was a resurgence of interest in
turn-of-the-century (1900, that is ;-) steam and AristoCraft fed that
interest well.

Cheers,
Thomas Beutel
San Francisco

I would say that LifeLike and Bachmann will probably stick to more
"generic" loco's, at least for a couple more years as interest in steam
picks up again. They will probably keep bringing out USRA models,
or like the Spectrum Decapod soon to be released, loco's that saw
heavy use but haven't been made available except in brass.

Bachmann's Shay is hopefully a prelude of a Climax next year (ohhhh
plllleeeeasssseeee, please make one!). I would say a Pacific, Mogul,
and 10 wheelers are likely in the next few years. For larger loco's I
would put money on 2-6-6-2's, and maybe even a 2-10-2. I can see the chance
of the 4-8-4 in a GOOD model, but probably after steam is well entrenched
in modeling again. Only large layouts could hope to run one as I can't
imagine that a GOOD running Northern is likely to be able to use anything
under 24" minimum radii. Bachmann could possibly upgrade the drive on
their current 4-8-4's and badge it a "Spectrum" but I think most would agree
that for $200 you'd want the same quality as the 2-8-0 & 4-8-2 with pipes
applied seperately. Most folk don't look at their current PRR K4 as being
in the same class as the others as it was just "rebadged" with a better drive.

The new P2K Mallet is a beautiful, extremely well running loco, and I expect
their soon-to-be-released 0-8-0 should be just as good (it better be, I've got
one on order...)

It's a great time to be a steam-lover. I was getting tired of trying to get old
Mantua's and Rivarossi's up to snuff... <g>

Chris Shinn
Winnipeg, Canada
Member, Renegade HO Modular Club
< http://members.xoom.com/renegade_MRC >
"If it ain't steam, it's a powered boxcar"

The 4-8-4 is a good wish but I think there are a lot of USRA engines yet
to go. I would suspect to get the greatest coverage we can expect a whole
series of USRA's (4-6-2's, 2-8-2's, 2-10-2's all in light and heavy). None
will do me any good but from a manufactures point of view (and sales) they
are probably the best choice.

Hi Leo,

I would love to see a P2K/Roco GS4!!! Another candidate would be the GS3 and
GS6. They are essentially the same, with variations in the skirting and
appliances. You have pre-war Daylight lettering (small lettering in upper
band), post-war lettering (large lettering), black, and don't forget Western
Pacific.

Perhaps with some creative die work, the whole GS2/3/4/5/6 series could be
represented. Just make them strong enough to pull a long train! ;-)

BTW, speaking of plastic steam, does anyone know when the Bachmann 2-10-0
will be out?

Cheers,
Thomas

Hello all,

I have been away for a while from all the latest news about new and
announced
products. So I will ask here.

Is there any information on the new P2K engine?

Due to a high visibility being known to the world, would you say a P2K/Roco
GS4 (Southern Pacific Northern 4-8-4 in Daylight, American Freedom, San
Joaquin
and Black Commuter) would not be out of the question?

Here is an engine that can take four color schemes, not many can say the
same.
From a manufacturer point of view, as steam engines are concerned, this is
great. Except for the USRAs, most engines are always very railroad specific
in looks, appliances and colors. Of course a lot of them have the so called
"Fantasy Schemes", but that should be relegated to the toy section, not to
the
$100-200 engines.

Any comments?

Cheers
Leo

"Another candidate would be the GS3 and
GS6. They are essentially the same, with variations in the skirting and appliances. "

Actually not even close, the GS-3 is essentially the same as the GS-4, boiler, drivers (80"), cylinders, etc. The cosmetic differences are the cab and boiler front.
The SP GS-6 and the WP GS64s are copies of the earlier, smaller GS-1 and GS-2 classes, engines with 73 inch drivers, with an all weather cab (like the GS-4).
It is interesting to speculate on what the next "quality Plastic" steamer should be. Almost as common as the consolidations, for an equally long period were the Ten Wheelers. A nice size for any layout, I like SP but what would be the best prototype 4-6-0 for a P2K model?

Mine was one of the last msgs posted in Feb., re: the MDC HOn3 2-8-0.
One msg followed that, then nothing till yesterday, Mar. 12. I believe
the Onelist/eGroup merger took place during that time. Maybe possible
that a msg or 2 got dropped in the great e void?

Also, earlier in Feb I asked about the Bachmann 2-8-0 (Spec.) being
appropriate for 1930. General consensus of replies is that it's
appropriate. Thanks to those who replied.

Jim

Casey Sterbenz wrote:

You are right this list is VERY quiet, especially compared to the vocal
bunch on the HOn3 list. To stir the pot a little I posted ( in the files
section ) some photos of a Ken Kidder Porter Mogul I have repowered and
detailed. One photo shows the completed loco. One shows the frame with
motor & gearbox. The remaining 2 photos show the loco to tender coupling
I made for this loco.

The loco is repowered with a Sagami 1620 and NWSL 36:1 gearbox. The loco
drivers are about 36". The gear in the gearbox is just barely smaller that
the drivers. To use this gearbox, I had to cutoff the the part of the
gearbox cover plate that covered the bottom of the gear.

The loco is set up with a 5 wire electrical connector between loco &
tender to support DCC wiring with decoder in the tender and motor &
headlamp in the loco. With the connector I built for this loco, one screw
through the drawbar and connector into the tender secures the tender both
mechanically & electrically.

George Gilbert

Have been thinking of bashing a Milw prairie, has someone used the
Backmann 2-6-2 for any projects? Particularlly curious as to how well
it could be made to run. Roger Aultman


http://www.nconnect.net/~raul/AA1.htm

Casey Sterbenz wrote:

From: "Casey Sterbenz" <sterbejj@hotmail.com>

Bob,

I've not seen anything recently either, like since the end of February. I
just looked at the archives and the last message there is one I remember
getting back then.

Seems like HO Steam really is a quiet list - 258 messages since the list
started last year.

I'm wondering if the list wasn't down for a while - last week I
requested a copy of the Bachmann Spectrum 2-8-0 disassembly/servicing
instructions (my swapmeet loco came without them) . . . and my request
didn't even come back to me.

Marshall

Bob,

I've not seen anything recently either, like since the end of February. I just looked at the archives and the last message there is one I remember getting back then.

Seems like HO Steam really is a quiet list - 258 messages since the list started last year. On the O-Trains list I'm on there are often 50 messages in a weekend.

I'm as guilty as anyone else on the list, I guess, in not chatting up my HO projects. Part of that is because I'm doing other things right now. I'm enjoying my new live steam "Ruby", an 0-4-0T in G gauge. Part of my work includes putting together an outdoor track on which to run this little engine. I'm also preparing my workshop to put together a cradle boat for a grand baby who is due in August. That will take me about a hundred hours or so which will not leave much time for work on my HO 2-8-0. Might be this Fall before I get back to HO railroading!

Casey Sterbenz

From: "Robert and Pauline Powell" <lgrp@norlink.net>
To: "Casey Sterbenz" <sterbejj@hotmail.com>
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 18:09:48 -0000

Hello Casey

Can you tell me if the HO steam onelist has gone off-line?

I haven't recieved any e-mail for three or four weeks.

Regards

Bob Powell

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

Hi guys,

Yep, a quiet list. About as quiet as a gentle wisp of steam from a
slightly leaky gland on a hot summers day. It never has generated a lot of
traffic. I have wondered if that is a bad thing and decided it's not! I'd
rather have the occasional quality post than a lot of 'pap' to wade through.
Every now and then someone comes up with a good question and usually finds
an answer.

As for the list being down, I can't rule out the possibility. The merger
of eGroups and Onelist has shown up in a little flakiness in the last couple
of weeks on other lists I am on. Some messages have been delivered to some
members and not to others. Very strange. Fingers crossed that it will all
be 'business as usual' before long.

Maybe you could do me a favour and let me know if you have not received this
post. :-) :-)

Hey, great pictures of the Ken Kider Porter Mogul on the files section.
Good to see that feature being used. Here's a quick click to one of the
pix:

http://www.onelist.com/files/HOsteam/PorterMogul/Porter09-1.jpg

Cheers,

Nelson Kennedy (list 'owner')
Christchurch, New Zealand
Ferrymead Trams, NZR 0 gauge, a little Espee H0 are at
http://downunder.railfan.net
Honourable Association of Good Guys and Irreverent Souls

<<Message: 1
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 10:19:51 -0000
From:

In a message dated 2/22/00, 5:54:22 AM, HOsteam@onelist.com writes:
<<Are you changing your suggestion that I go with a NWSL gear drive? I
read the above that you're suggesting I go with KTM replacement
gears. Although this model has lasted 30 years (and the gearbox
started showing signs of wear 10 years ago), I'm not looking forward
to tinkering with this model any more than I absolutely have to. I'd
rather tinker with something else :-). My primary concern is for a
smooth drive, with longevity a very close second.>>


First, would be to determine what is the problem with your current gearbox.
The problem areas are excessive play in the bearing surface areas and gear
wear. In the bearing surfaces the shafts are generally hardened steel, the
worm shaft bronze bearings and the gearboxes white metal. I would expect any
of the steel shafts to have the least wear. Replacement of the bronze
bearings on the worm shaft is very easy. If the bearing holes in the gearbox
are worn, a new gearbox is the answer, although the idler shaft could have
new bronze bearings fitted. The gears should wear in the following sequence,
worm gear turns fastest and only one tooth contacts the idler worm gear. The
reverse worm gear on the driver turns the slowest and wears the least (in an
idler gearbox). The idler gear is usually nylon and can be chewed up by a
bad worm gear. I would expect in most cases the axle gear to be the least
worn; so replacement of the worm and worm gear (idler gear) would give like
new performance without having to replace the axle gear. A new gearbox case
would cure wear problems in white metal bearing surfaces, without pulling an
axle gear. Be sure to use thrust washers to get a nice, almost snug fit on
the worm shaft. Excessive play between the worm shaft bearings and the worm
will cause a steam engine to "buck" when running with a train downhill, even
with a new gearbox.

The NWSL HO gearboxes (.3 mod) have smaller teeth than the KTM gearboxes,
this means less strength and more susceptible to wear. The larger .4 mod
gearboxes have gear teeth similar to those of the KTM gearboxes. I suspect
in the future these will be available with retrofit ball bearings on the worm
shaft. These gearboxes are larger than the KTM gearboxes so require
modification to the frame. But the potential benefits of roller bearings on
the worm shaft; make these gearboxes my favorite if I have to pull the driver
axle gear, especially noisy PFM articulateds like my PFM D&RGW L-125. I
avoid pulling axles at all costs, but many gearboxes are so poor that there
really isn't a choice.

ken

Ken Clark wrote:

"Since this a KTM model, I would stick with KTM gears/driver sets.
At most NMRA conventions (and O Scale West) the inventory of
replacement parts that came from Vince Waterman's 'Trackside
Specialties' are on display. Somewhere in the mass of jumbled papers
resulting from my recent move, there is the new address and company
name, seems they periodically advertise in MR."

I'm sorry that this reply is so late, but I've had some difficulty
receiving list traffic. i.e. I've got none since I signed up,
despite confirming that I'm a member of the list, and scheduled to
recieve the digest version. I'm forced to read the digest at the
one-list website, evidently.

Ken, your response is MOST encouraging. In fact, I'd looked at my
WSM AC-4 (4-8-8-2 for the non-SP modelers on the list), and they
looked very promising.

If you (or anyone else) comes accross Mr. Waterman's new address and
company name, I'd be indebted.

The nickel plating kit that was suggested is a good one. I'll be
looking for it. I have some other projects (not train related) that
I could use this for. I happened to have a J.C. Whitney catalog, and
they have plating kits for many metals, including gold, silver, and
nickel. Except for the gold :-), they're all fairly reasonably
priced - much less than what I had expected to send the drivers out
to be plated.

Are you changing your suggestion that I go with a NWSL gear drive? I
read the above that you're suggesting I go with KTM replacement
gears. Although this model has lasted 30 years (and the gearbox
started showing signs of wear 10 years ago), I'm not looking forward
to tinkering with this model any more than I absolutely have to. I'd
rather tinker with something else :-). My primary concern is for a
smooth drive, with longevity a very close second.

Someone mentioned steel wheels - I've never complained about going to
nickel silver wheels on Athearn engines. Even with the nickel silver
wheels, they seem to out pull similar locomotives from other
manufacturers that have nickel silver wheels. Pure adhesion isn't a
real factor for most modelers, even in a club environment. A little
extra weight compensates nicely. However, I'll agree that adhesion
is an issue with steam models. It's a lot harder to get the weight
of most steam engines up so that they can pull. Super-weighting a
steam locomotive is an art form all to itself.

Thinking ahead a bit, I'd like to do this same driver treatment to my
Sunset models MT-4 and -5 (4-8-2s). The model is shipped with spoked
drivers, and most MTs had universal main drivers by the 1950s. I can
probably find loco's to model that didn't have the main driver
replaced, but then they wouldn't be typical of the time. Any
suggestions for the Sunset models?

Thanks to everyone,
- Arved
From just a little too close to CSX milepost 666, Sanford subdivision
Modeling the Southern Pacific from AC-4s to AC4400CWs.

In a message dated 2/21/00 9:08:08 AM Pacific Standard Time,
martin.fischer@inka.de writes:

<< TW the engine is oil burning. This leads to another question. Where
would they put the oil tank on a tank engine ? I suppose inside the
cab, right ? Would it be a rectangular box on one side of the cab or
what ? Where would the the filling hatch be ? I forgot to mention that
the engine is a small Davenport 0-4-0 switcher.
>>
The usual fuel bunker was at the back of the cab; water tanks were generally
put on top of the boiler on tank engines. For the amount of water carried,
there was not much fuel needed to be carried between pit stops. Some of the
saddle tank 2-6-6-2T logging engines only had a small rear porch for a fuel
bunker, and they were comparatively large tank engines.

ken

On Mon, 21 Feb 2000 kenrclark@aol.com wrote:

From: kenrclark@aol.com

In a message dated 2/21/00 2:38:25 AM Pacific Standard Time,
martin.fischer@inka.de writes:

<< Could anybody here point me to information on the Web ( or elsewhere
) on backhead details for a ( small ) steam engine ? >>
Martin,
A good start would be to find a current Precision Scale Company (PSC)
catalog for HO Parts and Locomotives. In the past they had a cab interior
set for small steam (0-4-0 to 2-8-0s) part # 3714. However the C-16 cab kit
(HOn3) # 3702 is for possibly a smaller engine. You did not specify if the
engine was wood, coal or oil burning, the details will vary some according to
fuel used. PSC also did a kit for an HOn3 0-6-0 which was very,very small
coal burner. I don't know about current availability of these parts
(formerly kits were $30-$40) but I would check the caboose hobbies in denver
website, e-mail them, they have a PSC part inventory in many ways better
than the company. Note the new Walthers catalogs do not attempt to list all
the PSC parts, that's why the catalog is so useful.

good luck, ken

Ken,

thanks for the pointer. I will do as you suggested and contact
Caboose Hobbies.

BTW the engine is oil burning. This leads to another question. Where
would they put the oil tank on a tank engine ? I suppose inside the
cab, right ? Would it be a rectangular box on one side of the cab or
what ? Where would the the filling hatch be ? I forgot to mention that
the engine is a small Davenport 0-4-0 switcher.

--
Gr��e / Regards

Martin

Hi,

first let me introduce myself. My name is Martin Fischer, I live in
Germany and am modeling narrow gauge in HOn3 / HOn30. My main
interest currently is building motive power.

This leads to my qestion: I'm currently working on a small 0-4-0
steam switcher and would like to add some interior cab detailing.
Could anybody here point me to information on the Web ( or elsewhere
) on backhead details for a ( small ) steam engine ?

Regards,
Martin