Started painting a Mantua Pacific this week. Soap and water wash

by a pickling bath, and then a coat of dark gray auto primer. The primer

sticking well and is about the right shade, a very dark gray, looks black
under indoor lights. However, as primer's do, its VERY flat, not a hint of
shine anywhere. Most of the time this makes the locomotive look a bit
sooty and cindery and I am happy with the effect.
This locomotive has been slightly kitbashed to make it look like a B&M
P4. These were the pride of the B&M and kept in pretty good condition.
Looking through 6 or 8 photo's in my two B&M books, the P4's are always
clean, neatly painted and the paint shows a bit of gloss in every photo.
I'm beginning to think of sealing the decals on with a clear glossy

to get a little bit of shine into the paint. Has anyone tried this? Any
other finishing hints and kinks for steam loco paint that anyone cares to
share?


Keeping the memory of steam alive!

....I'm beginning to think of sealing the decals on with a clear glossy

to get a little bit of shine into the paint. Has anyone tried this? Any
other finishing hints and kinks for steam loco paint that anyone cares to
share?


Keeping the memory of steam alive!

----------
From: DLewis0163@aol.com[SMTP:DLewis0163@aol.com]
Reply To: HOsteam@egroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2000 6:38 PM
To: HOsteam@egroups.com
Subject: Re: [HOsteam] Superdetailing Mantua Steamers

I had the same problem getting the printed road name off, so I just used
three light coats of dilute grimy black in my airbrush, and after
decalling
for the LAMEDEER SHORTLINE RAILWAY, weathered the engine via airbrush with

grimy black, grey, a mist of blue-black, and some light grey on the water-

carring undersidevparts(injectors, tubes, vales,etc.) where water
impurities
encrust things. I airbrushed the running gear and wheels grimy black and
the
underside of the tender trucks with a bit of rust. I'm still working on
it,
but it looks great. I got rid of the horrible bell, installing a great
CalScale casting.
I'll have to clean overspray off the treads and oil the valve train. I'll
take a picture of it and send it to you sometime soon.
Don


Keeping the memory of steam alive!

----------
From: DLewis0163@aol.com[SMTP:DLewis0163@aol.com]
Reply To: HOsteam@egroups.com
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2000 11:14 AM
To: HOsteam@egroups.com
Subject: Re: [HOsteam] Superdetailing Mantua Steamers

I found your posting very interesting and potentially useful, as I am
looking
to replace the pilot on my IMC Mogul (mfrd by Mahano). This is a fine
running
loco, in the Premier Series, but the pilot is diminutive and rides too
high.
Since I continue to be pleased with these new IHC locos, I look to improve

the few flaws. I may try your "fix". Do you have any photos of your work
in
progress?
Don Lewis


Keeping the memory of steam alive!

And think about this? Why does the most popular modeling scale (HO)

very few models of that most common of American steam locos, the 4-4-0 ?

There are:

Bachmann's (two models, not sure what they are based on)
Rivarossi (all based on V&T)
IHC (several based on a V&T prototype and one similar to an SP E-23 by
Cooke.)
Mantua (the General, and let's not forget the Belle of the '80s)

Have I forgotten any?

So at least it's a start. In my opinion, all except the IHC Cooke suffer
from poor electrical contact and could benefit from a flywheel, if only
there were room to put one.

Does anyone have any success stories they could share about improving the
running qualities of 4-4-0's?

Regards,
Thomas Beutel





Keeping the memory of steam alive!

George Gilbert wrote:

Well, didn't mean to doubt the attraction of the steam-diesel transition
era. It was a very interesting railroad era and the only era steam and
diesel could co-exist. I suspect it will always draw a large following.
And modeling the era has resulted in some beautiful layouts.

But what I don't understand is why the earlier eras have drawn so little
interest. The standard guage equipment of Turn of the (19th) Century is
very similiar to narrow guage equipment of that and later eras. And

guage has certainly developed a strong following.

.......................

You're dealing with the facts that most people model either the
present or something they saw as a youth.

The last big 4-4-0 modeling binge was the 100 year anniversary of
the Civil War, when there was a lot of The General movies and
historical coverage about. This was somewhat followed by the
centennial of the Golden Spike at the end of the 60's as well as
frequent exposure to TV viewers of that glorious post Civil War
train that James West and Atemus Gordon got to use under the
presidential command of then President Grant in the program, Wild,
Wild West.

There were almost no 4-4-0's in HO other than the late 1950 dies
of the 1850's Mantua General and finally some imported plastic
versions of a later 1880 AHM American standard. There was a Grant
(?) boiler conversion for the Mantus from Cary and a very few
brass imports. They were even fewer 4-4-0's available in the
larger scales.

There has been very little exposure of the 4-4-0's to the average
RR modeler over the last couple of decades. That can change. They
were the most numerous of all types of locomotives and performed
every possible type of service. That just needs to be made better known.

I'm of the strong belief that the absolutely huge cost of tooling
for conventional kits is what has restricted the types available
all these years.

I'd like to see and am working to have it come about....... That
low volume castings with primarily etched bodies become better
known in the States. The British Commonwealth has done just this
for that last few decades and instead of just their version of a
cast General, they have several similar mixed media kits of
similar prototypes.

No, not American Standard 4-4-0's, but a rich assortment of their
types of engines. Far more than if they had to produce only with
steel dies to cast their engine kits.

I am currently using the methods at the bottom of the posting to
make several types of 4-4-0 frames from published drawings. Marry
that method with PSC and CalScale castings, custom etching sets
for several types and era's of locomotives, start with frames of
the detail of the Kemtron C-16's and instead of paying a fortune
for one set of dies, we get a vast number of etched body sets to
build around precision, detailed, lost wax and/or etched brass
frames for much less pre production costs.

Yes, 3d and 2d scans to cnc-milled custom parts to precise scale
making master parts to any desired scale. There are also similar
methods to make the etched body shells from computerized pictures.

There should be more smaller types available. There should be much
more of the never before commercially available prototypes on the
scale market. I'm pushing for this. I'm finding several people
that are already doing parts of this, more and more are appearing
each week. I'm almost completely tooled up with specialized
software, two 3d scanners, two desk top prototyping cnc-mills of
differing specialties as well as what I need to make, proof, and
perfect my own etchings. I don't have volume equipment, but I do
have what is needed to make precise master parts for outside duplication.

I can assure you, I am not the only one doing this. Keep asking
for what models you'd like to see produced. The odds are that
several people out there can make it a reality if they can just
fit it in to their plans.

So have another good look at those sweet Cal Scale and PSC domes
and other fittings and start envisioning what you will see more
and more of to use those fine parts.

As for me, I have four distinctly different types of 4-4-0's
already planned to go on those frames. The first thing will be
replacement Kemtron quality frames to replace those crappy FED
4-4-0 and 2-6-0 featureless joke frames. Kits should follow
several months later......

best,
Mike Bauers

--
[Home Computer etching/3d scanning/milling/drawings to models/pics
to drawings/cad? Look over ModelersCad at
http://www.eGroups.com/group/modelerscad]


Keeping the memory of steam alive!

On Sun, 29 Oct 2000 21:32:31 -0600, "George Gilbert" <grgilbert@home.com>
writes:

The comment about post 1945 selling best always puzzled me. I have always
thought the earlier eras ( say 1880 to maybe 1920's ) when the steam was
THE
dominant land transporation machine were much more interesting. You move

to mid 20th century then trucks and cars and airplanes move to center
stage;
trains just become a nuisance to highway traffic.

Post war modeling allows people to model the steam-diesel transition era.
We also get to have some of the most modern steam locomotives, such as

Superpower. It also means we can mix heavyweight trains with

and even the introduction of intermodal (a.k.a. TOFC - SP GS-class 4-8-4s
hauling TOFC on "Overnights" for example). And even though road and air
travel flourished, mail and intermediate distance travel was still
predominantly handled by trains.

To each his own, though.

- Arved
Modeling the Southern Pacific, from AC-4s to AC4400CWs.
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Keeping the memory of steam alive!