Date   

L&N 50's era sale (revised)

Michael McCaffery <mrr@...>
 

Of course, it's meant to be read while laying down or standing on your head.
: - )



For some reason, I couldn't get the latest version of Adobe Acrobat Reader
to perform that simple chore. However, I've updated the site to remove all
the RailOp and DecoderPro printouts and let the listings speak for
themselves.



Michael in Bend




<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HOsteam/message/3773;_ylc=X3oDMTJwdWs5N3VjBF9
TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE3MTc0NQRncnBzcElkAzE3MDYwNDMwMTQEbXNnSWQDMzc3MwRzZWM
DZG1zZwRzbGsDdm1zZwRzdGltZQMxMTg0NDEyNjcz> Re: L&N 50's era sale

Posted by: "Roger T."
<mailto:rogertra@highspeedplus.com?Subject=%20Re%3A%20L%26N%2050%27s%20era%2
0sale> rogertra@highspeedplus.com <http://profiles.yahoo.com/rogertrav>
rogertrav

Fri Jul 13, 2007 1:29 pm (PST)


If you have even a passing interest in the subject matter, I encourage
you to check out: www.bendrailroader.com
Can you flip the orientation?

Bit difficult to read sideways. :-)

Cheers.

Roger T.
Home of the Great Eastern Railway at:-


Re: [HOsteam] L&N 50's era sale

Roger T
 

If you have even a passing interest in the subject matter, I encourage
you to check out: www.bendrailroader.com
Can you flip the orientation?

Bit difficult to read sideways. :-)

Cheers.

Roger T.
Home of the Great Eastern Railway at:-
http://www.highspeedplus.com/~rogertra/


L&N 50's era sale

Michael McCaffery <mrr@...>
 

I've set up a personal website to list various HO scale L&N items
(including steam locos) that might be of interest to this group,
including photographs and prices of these items. I'll be adding an
extensive collection of books at a later date that also might be of
specific interest to list members.

If you have even a passing interest in the subject matter, I encourage
you to check out: www.bendrailroader.com
<http://www.bendrailroader.com/> . Please reply off-list, if you will.

Thanks for the bandwidth!

Michael McCaffery


Re: Newbie needs Spectrum kitbash advice

Jeff Fry <jpmfry@...>
 

Matt-

Take a look at this site-

http://www.housatonicrr.com/

It features quite a bit of information on kitbashing the Spectrum
4-6-0.

Jeff Fry



--- In HOsteam@yahoogroups.com, acl-wayne@... wrote:

Hi all,

I am new to the group and joined so I could drink from the fountain
of knowledge of you more experienced kitbashers. I am about to start
a project that involves the Spectrum High-boilered 4-6-0 and need
some advice,
<SNIP>
Matt Bumgarner


Re: [HOsteam] Newbie needs Spectrum kitbash advice

Wayne Long
 

Hi all,

I am new to the group and joined so I could drink from the fountain
of knowledge of you more experienced kitbashers. I am about to start
a project that involves the Spectrum High-boilered 4-6-0 and need
some advice, as the prototype I want to model does require some
kitbashing.
My questions are:

a) Are the boiler details (running boards, bell, etc) on the loco
merely press fit, or are they glued in?

b) If they are glued (or even if they are not), any tips on removing
the bell, whistle, and headlight?

c) The small tender from the 52" driver loco looks more like my
prototype than the big tender that comes with the high boiler
version. I can't merely swap tenders, as the tender floor of the
smaller unit is considerably below the loco's cab floor. Can anyone
recommend any larger diameter wheels I can put into the tender to
raise its height? I am aware I may have to add shims and lower the
coupler if I do this.

d) Any other words of wisdom for a greenhorn with 5 thumbs on each
hand?

e) Any custom builders/painters out there want to quote the job?

Thanks in advance

Matt Bumgarner

Matt,

After comparing the two versions at the Bachmann web site, I don't feel that larger wheels are the answer. You would have to use wheels that are 10" larger than those that come with the tender to raise it 5"! What would that look like even if the wheel sets fit into the sideframes and don't rub the bottom of the tender?

The tender floor on the 63" driver version is correct for that locomotive. You have 2 courses of action: Kitbash the correct tender or find a tender like you want. If you kitbash, you could use, perhaps, the trucks and under frame of the tender and build on that.

Wayne Long


Newbie needs Spectrum kitbash advice

mattbumgarner <matt@...>
 

Hi all,

I am new to the group and joined so I could drink from the fountain
of knowledge of you more experienced kitbashers. I am about to start
a project that involves the Spectrum High-boilered 4-6-0 and need
some advice, as the prototype I want to model does require some
kitbashing.
My questions are:

a) Are the boiler details (running boards, bell, etc) on the loco
merely press fit, or are they glued in?

b) If they are glued (or even if they are not), any tips on removing
the bell, whistle, and headlight?

c) The small tender from the 52" driver loco looks more like my
prototype than the big tender that comes with the high boiler
version. I can't merely swap tenders, as the tender floor of the
smaller unit is considerably below the loco's cab floor. Can anyone
recommend any larger diameter wheels I can put into the tender to
raise its height? I am aware I may have to add shims and lower the
coupler if I do this.

d) Any other words of wisdom for a greenhorn with 5 thumbs on each
hand?

e) Any custom builders/painters out there want to quote the job?

Thanks in advance

Matt Bumgarner


Re: [HOsteam] BOWSER

Tom Knowles <ncstl@...>
 

WOW, Pete, this was great!

Thanks for the memories.

Tom Knowles


cripete wrote:

It is worth noting that the kits marketted by the
current Bowser incarnation, which, (since it is now
approximately 40 years since the English family went into business using this moniker) are most of
what will be encountered today, were not the design work of a single organization.
The Harriman styled "Casey Jones" 4-6-0 and 2-8-0
were VARNEY's last innovation in steam locomotives.....etc...etc...etc


BOWSER

cripete <pjboylanboylan@...>
 

It is worth noting that the kits marketted by the
current Bowser incarnation, which, (since it is now
approximately 40 years since the English family
went into business using this moniker) are most of
what will be encountered today, were not the design
work of a single organization.

The Harriman styled "Casey Jones" 4-6-0 and 2-8-0
were VARNEY's last innovation in steam locomotives.
They were made as medium priced models , and unlike
the pre Korean War roster of Varney steam kits
were easier to assemble, and having a cast Zamac
boiler and more modern die work (they benefitted
from WW2 advances in equipment, and from VARNEY
being able to afford such equipment) were a good
affordable basis for superdetailers as well as
just operating modelers.

They did not have the design features or options
of the original BOWSER locos (from when they were
in California). The latter were: a NYC 'K-11' class
pacific, that is a fine running well detailed cast
zamac boilered loco; a UP 4-6-6-4 that also ran
well and had fine cast boiler; and a supposed
USRA 4-8-2, that could be made into reasonably
accurate copies of many prototypes. These locos
all had valve gear kits available from the makers
and were excellent running locos.

It is worth noting that the "Challenger" type was
the best looking, as well as the best operating
articulated steamer around for many years in 'HO'
scale. This is because the potmetal "Allegheny"
offered by ARBOUR's predecessor( WINTON), had
an absence of any detectable quality control.
It never got any better, from what I understand
under ARBOUR, or their successors. The boiler
castings apparently could not be adequately
relieved during the pours. So if they left the
lead in long enough to set up and cool
enough to form the big block of lead boiler,
they had difficulty getting it out without
damaging the casting. The primary worry would
have been the mould halves, but regardless of
my guesstimations of why these shortcomings in
this and their "Kanawah" ocurred , from "opening
day" WINTON had difficulties with distorted
major cast elements. Needless to say, it never
got any better, because these operators never
moved out of the rudimentary technology they were
using. I am sorry for this aside, but will close
by mentioning the other articulated commonly
available (if you had the bucks) prior to the
Korean War. This was the VARNEY "Yellowstone",
which vaguely followed the real things contours.
The only one I ever encountered had a sandcast
bronze or brass boiler and was easily the most
impressive 'HO' loco I had ever seen to that
time. It had been built by a buddy of Bill
McClanahan, whose name I don't remember but he
was: a Texan; a tall drink of water; and had a
different quality than Bill. The boiler had been
treated with abrasive rotary bits (grit in rubber
domes) in a Foredom rotary tool, so it was not
rough. It had rivet strips soldered where needed,
and was multi powered. Bill,who was a reporter
by the way, and it's owner , who was a manual crafts-
person of some kind, averred they never had found
a layout where they could put enough cars behind
it to stop it hauling them away. I believed them,
for given it's mass and the torque that multiple
Pittman motors could generate, it would have been
formidible. I don't know how others made out that
worked up this "Yellowstone" kit, but it was more
like the kind of kits that existed in the 1930s,
and in the world of larger scales, than the
kind of kits produced under BOWSER's mark.
While oriental fabricated brass articulated
mallets appeared in the late fifties, it was
over a decade before any of them operated
like the BOWSER "Challenger" did.

The Pennsylvania RR prototypes with a few exceptions
were from PENN_LINE. These were more expensive than
the medium priced "Harriman" locos. They had better
detailing on the smaller prototypes, but their
decapods for example ( I bought several of these
at DeGroot's hobby shop in 1956 for $34.95 each per
old boxes I encounter when diving in search of
STUFF) had blocky cast on power reverse,and so
forth.
The boilers needed the parting seam filed,
and lots of cast details had to be removed if
you wanted a good looking loco.
Last year I came across a list of what I
bought from Cal-Scale to improve its detailing ,
and it amounted to almost twelve bucks for bell,
power reverse, generator, and some other stuff. It
also required making other things out of brass wire
and imagination on my part to get sand pipes,
water pipes, air line cooling lines, and snifters
, etc. They gave you the valve gear to assemble,
unlike the Varney locos or their cheaper locos
acquired from the JOHN ENGLISH company.
The PENN-LINE engines were powered by Pittman
Motors. Pittman is about the only supplier from
that time that modern BOWSER has not absorbed.
They are a far larger outfit than the model
maker, and as their website indicates will sell
you marvelous motors for some pretty marvelous
prices that make FAULHABER's cheap.
Penn-Line did not make a Pennsy 'N' class loco,
or a USRA "Santa Fe". The current BOWSER entity
redid the 'I' class boiler, as the ones from
PennLine was incorrect in its boiler diameter.
They also have created a "northern" apparently
using the original BOWSER of California's 4-8-2
boiler as a basis.

JOHN A ENGLISH (no relation to the current
owner of BOWSER) produced a Pennsy 'A' class
switcher, and a pseudo USRA "Pacific" and
"Mikado". The two road locos sold for twenty
bucks and the 0-4-0 for under fifteen. They
were extremely popular locos, because of this.
By going to the parts makers, and buying
a valve gear kit you would get a heck of a
nice loco at a low cost. The zamac driver
centers have not stood up well over the years,
so not nearly as many of these locos are
around at train shows , as the numbers sold
would suggest. Nevertheless, given todays
technology and presuming the main dies are not
worn out, you could get an agreeable loco from
this makers designs.

I hope this brings back some good memories,
and Good-Luck, Peter Boylan


Re: [HOsteam] Bowser kits

David Boyd
 

I have built a couple of "old lady', "casey jones" models, and found there
drivers much to rigid, as suggested a sprung system would be better. I have
built the 'Challenger' model and have had much better performance as It has made
appearances for the last ten years on our clubs modular layout. I do like to
use an inexpensive can motor on my models that tops out the RPM so I get a
better scale speed control. Good luck and have fun! David



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


Re: [HOsteam] Bowser kits

Wayne Long
 

Reinhard,

I have built a Bowser light Pacific kit and a 4-8-2 mechanism. While this does not make me an expert on Bowser steam, I feel I should make a few comments.

First, as has been said, the technology is old. However, the mechanisms are substantial. It is unfortunate to me that the drivers are not sprung. If you follow carefully the instructions and have no bind in the mechanism, these locomotives are good pullers. I have installed one of the third party motor assemblies and it is an improvement over the earlier open motor and gearing.

Second, the boiler/cab castings leave a good deal to be desired. They are castings that are too rough in places. At least Bowser pre-drills the holes for the detail parts. Every one of their locomotive boilers needs to be detailed, and this is done with detail kits from Bowser containing many brass lost wax castings. You can end up with a credible looking steam locomotive even though it might not confirm to prototype drawings.

Third, the tenders, like the boilers are cast zamac and the detail is not up to plastic level. The tender trucks are cast metal with brass wheels. Electrical pick-up is through one side of the tender trucks and the opposite side drivers. This has presented problems on DC track going from block to block. It is a big problem to solve if you want pick-up from all of the drivers, like on plastic steam. For DCC, you would have to isolate the motor from the frame, requiring a jumper wire from the frame to one of the motor brushes.

Wayne Long


Re: [HOsteam] Bowser kits

mwbauers
 

They sell updated motors with an integrated pinion gear for the kits from a third party, and on the Bowser site.

I'm not sure what motors are in the kits. But the kits seem to be darned good to begin with and if you have to replace the motor for a modern can.

Well, that still might be ok.

Best to ya'
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee Wi, USA

On Jun 16, 2007, at 4:23 PM, mike rosz wrote:

I heard they were pretty good years back but just could not come up with that much cash at one time.
I did bu a Round house kit but it is still in the box.
Reinhard Peters <reinhard@rub-peters.de> wrote:
I wonder if the Bowser steam engine kits have good quality.

The 0-6-0 seams to have an up to date motor but the motor of the 2-8-0
looks some what outdated.

I would be glad to get some opinions.


Re: [HOsteam] Bowser kits

mike rosz
 

I heard they were pretty good years back but just could not come up with that much cash at one time.
I did bu a Round house kit but it is still in the box.
Reinhard Peters <reinhard@rub-peters.de> wrote:
I wonder if the Bowser steam engine kits have good quality.

The 0-6-0 seams to have an up to date motor but the motor of the 2-8-0
looks some what outdated.

I would be glad to get some opinions.

Thank you
Reinhard






---------------------------------
Building a website is a piece of cake.
Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.


Re: [HOsteam] Bowser kits

Victor Bitleris
 

I haven't built a new Bowser kit, but have a couple of older ones, a 4-4-2 and a K4 4-6-2. Mine both have the old open frame (very good quality) motor, but I will be putting in Helix humpers in both. It is easier on the decoders. But, the quality of the kits are very good, albeit OLD technology. They do require a bit of work to build and tune, but end up being very very good runners. Detailing them is a challenge, but I have seen some very beautifully detailed Bowsers. If you like challenging kits, these are for you. But, they are very good quality, they are nothing like some of the other older manufactures, such as Arbour and The Locomotive Company. They are just a bit more complex than Mantua, but I think you get a better product also. My K4 took a bit of "breaking in", but it became a REALLY smooth runner.

Good luck and regards, Vic Bitleris
Raleigh, NC




----Original Message Follows----
From: "Reinhard Peters" <reinhard@rub-peters.de>
Reply-To: HOsteam@yahoogroups.com
To: HOsteam@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HOsteam] Bowser kits
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2007 19:17:54 -0000

I wonder if the Bowser steam engine kits have good quality.

The 0-6-0 seams to have an up to date motor but the motor of the 2-8-0
looks some what outdated.

I would be glad to get some opinions.

Thank you
Reinhard

_________________________________________________________________
Get a preview of Live Earth, the hottest event this summer - only on MSN http://liveearth.msn.com?source=msntaglineliveearthhm


Bowser kits

Reinhard Peters <reinhard@...>
 

I wonder if the Bowser steam engine kits have good quality.

The 0-6-0 seams to have an up to date motor but the motor of the 2-8-0
looks some what outdated.

I would be glad to get some opinions.

Thank you
Reinhard


Re: [HOsteam] SP Intermountan AC-12 Disassemly and Remotoring

Rick Watson <rwkp@...>
 

On the Tehachapi layout in San Diego, AC-12s are assigned point helper on passenger trains (per the prototype). You wouldn't hit high speeds on the hill, be the flatter areas north of Bakersfield they did.

I think the real issue here is that there is such a speed discrepancy, that it makes consisting very difficult.

Rick Watson

---- Jon Miller <atsf@inow.com> wrote:
I'm not sure why anyone would change the speed of this engine but to
each their own. RMJ says the speed is 24.8 MPH and derates the score
because of this. I guess this all goes back to the very old argument as to
how fast engines should run. I would suspect that the Aces spent most of
their lives at around 25 mph however RMJ says it "could" reach 69 mph.
And personally I would like it to run at 69 mph if my RR was 6 real
miles long however the normal model RR isn't even close.

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS

--
Rick Watson
Modeling the Southern Pacific Los Angeles Division
in Tempe, AZ


Re: [HOsteam] SP Intermountan AC-12 Disassemly and Remotoring

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

I'm not sure why anyone would change the speed of this engine but to each their own. RMJ says the speed is 24.8 MPH and derates the score because of this. I guess this all goes back to the very old argument as to how fast engines should run. I would suspect that the Aces spent most of their lives at around 25 mph however RMJ says it "could" reach 69 mph.
And personally I would like it to run at 69 mph if my RR was 6 real miles long however the normal model RR isn't even close.

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


SP Intermountan AC-12 Disassemly and Remotoring

Ken Clark
 

Like many, I recently bought one of these highly detailed models. Several
other modelers
complained of it running too slow. When I went to investigate, I couldn't
figure out how to get at the mechanism. Fortunately, Jason on the Espee group
provided clear instructions and I was able to get
inside and check her out. Following are the disassembly instructions and my
remotoring discussion.

IM AC-12 Disassembly
Posted by: "Jason Hill" _hilljason@yahoo.hil_ (mailto:hilljason@yahoo.com)
HillJason
Sun May 27, 2007 12:14 pm (PST)
OK, I've been inside my AC-12 once... Let me tell you
of the perils. <VBG>

The three screws that hold the boiler top on are located under the steam
turret, main steam dome, and
superheater on the end of the smokebox. The front two are easy to remove,
just grip gentely and lift the
domes off. The superheater casting is burried under about five pipes that
must be carefuly disconnected
and pulled back. Also disconnect the hot water pipes from the hot water pump
at the bottom of the smokebox.

There are two screws located under the ladders of the cab. To reach them you
must remove the front coupler
and pilot and front silver panel of of the cab front. This part sounds worse
that it is. The cab is still
attached by the wire bundle for the five LEDs in the cab. So be careful not
to break any of them unless
you are going to relight the engine.

Once the boiler top is loose, you can remove it leaving the cab, lower
portion of the boiler, and
running gear. Three screws hold the top boiler weight to the bottom one.
Remove these three screws. The
wiring for the motor and lighting run along the top of the top boiler
weight.

I have not removed the top weight on my engine yet, but was able to see
everything I needed to before the
"open heart" to replace either the motor or main gearbox. I will carefully
remove the wires by
unsoldering them from the motor and cutting the factory lighting wires, as I
will replace the lighting
system. Once the wires are clear the top boiler weight should come off
easily. The motor is in the fire box
and just forward of the fixed cylinders is the main gear tower. I am not
sure how the gear tower is
secured into the lower boiler and frame drive shafts to the wheels.

At any rate, there is the basics of how to get into one of these engines.

Jason Hill
www.geocities.www.geocities.

Jason,
Thanks for the detailed instructions. My AC-12 is now somewhere between test
run and a basket case.
I went farther and removed the motor to test RPMs. The motor reaches 11,500
RPM at 15 volts DC.
This is slightly faster than a NWSL 2032 which reaches about 10,000 RPM at
this voltage. It is a flat can motor,
but unlike some flat can motors that reach a maximum RPM around 8 or 9
volts, this motor continued to
increase speed all the way to 15 volts.
Dimensions:
Motor shaft 2 mm
Flat side width 18.5 mm
Round side width 23.2 mm
Length 33.9 mm
NWSL used to make a high speed 2032 can motor which should fit fairly easily
into the motor space. It had a 12 volt speed of 16,000 RPM,
which should boost engine speed about 40%. The new NWSL 2032 motors I
believe have a 2 mm shaft so all the drive components can be reused.
The IM motor is held in place by two O rings mounted in collars at each end
of the motor; the O rings fit into recesses in the frame. A
new motor could be held in place by silicone sealer just as well. My major
concern is motor power, I have never needed to use the high
speed 2032 motors, but the old Sagami 2032s were marginal in Akane AC-9s, I
always used 2236 or larger can motors in my KTM Mallets. The
new NWSL 2032 motors are rated with more torque so they just may do the
trick. Unfortunately NWSL has not marketed a larger 16,000 RPM
motor than the 2032 can motor (#20328-9). On a positive side NWSL rates the
HiSpeed 2032 with 33% more torque than a standard 2032 can
motor and only 10% less than a 2236 can motor.
For those disappointed in the speed of The Intermountain AC-12 engines, this
looks to be by far the easiest fix. Be careful in
removing the flywheel, it is part of the universal drive and must be reused.
I expect the remotored model will be noisier than before, but
for speed addicts this will be an acceptable tradeoff. Some noise may also
come from the Universal drive to the gearbox, these components
look comparatively crude, the cup of one end of the universal looks like it
is aluminum. Some noise reduction could be achieved by a
quieter universal drive. However since the universal drive is surrounded by
the boiler weight the noise is dampened. Some of the
upper boiler weight may have to be carved away to allow fitting of the 2032
can motor, but this isn't unusual in remotoring projects. I
test fit an older Sagami 2032 and it was within 1/64th of fitting; I think I
could clamp the motor between the upper and lower weights
without any gap, but the new NWSL motors may be slightly different in
dimensions so plan on some metal carving to fit. This could be easily
removed from the top boiler weight (to avoid getting metal chips into the
mechanism), This could also be removed from the bottom of the
motor mount, there is enough extra metal both places.
PS. My upper boiler weight was attached at one end only, it was missing the
screw on the smokebox end, this may have made the model
slightly noisier.

...in the far south and west...
...........ken.......................





************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


Southern Pacific brass steam locos on eBay

Greg Baxter <pasoslim@...>
 

I have 3 SP brass locos listed on eBay if anyone's interested; ebay
item # 120114213458, 120114213501, and 120114213479. I'm narrowing my
focus more to Sn3 and need to trim down on my HO and HOn3 collection.
The locos include an Alco Models C-15 2-8-0, a Westside T-1 4-6-0, and
a Sunset S-8 0-6-0. If you have any questions please contact me at the
email address listed below as I rarely check my Yahoo email. Thanks!

G. Scott Baxter
bindle-stiff@sbcglobal.net


Misrepresented 50's HO trucks on E-bay.

jbevin4923 <jrb@...>
 

FYI to all,

A seller named THEDIECAST is selling 50's pick-up trucks as HO 1:87
scale. Unfortunately, they are not HO. They are too big. Please feel
free to contact me if you would like to see a comparative photo with
other known brands of trucks. Thanks, John


4 undec steamers for sale

Bernie Halloran <bfhalloran@...>
 

Guys,
I've got two Athearn 2-8-2 mikes, undecorated, that have never been run
and two undec Bachmann heavy 4-8-2s that have never been run for sale.
$60 each for the mikes and $90 each for the mountains, plus posage.
Anybody interested?

Bernie Halloran
NYK&W

1021 - 1040 of 4786