The Bachmann Mountain will be MOPAC??????? WHOO HOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
Okay...I'll try to contain my excitement...does the Bachmann website have a
picture of the upcoming Mountain? First Athearn...which from what I have
seen, that 2-8-2 will look great, to the new Bachmann Consolidation, which a
friend of mine purchased today (an undec. no less), the Mopac is getting
wonderful recognition in the reasonably-priced steam category, which is great
to see.

Brad Bourbina


I see the Bachmann 4-8-2 will be available as a NC&StL as well as a MoP. I'm
sure I'll select one of those two roads if I get one of the Mountains.

Look forward to the list discussion.

Ken
St Louis



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In a message dated 99-04-30 23:47:38 EDT, you write:

<< I figured I'd start off a discussion of Bachmann's upcoming 4-8-2 and
Athearn's 2-8-2. >>


I just finally bought an undec Bachmann 2-8-0 last week. Will turn it in to
a SLSF Consolidation - doing research now to see which of the 1200's or
1300's would be the best match. Any ideas?

Have ordered an Athearn light USRA Mike in the Frisco colors - the 4000's.
We'll see how that turns out.

I see the Bachmann 4-8-2 will be available as a NC&StL as well as a MoP. I'm
sure I'll select one of those two roads if I get one of the Mountains.

Look forward to the list discussion.

Ken
St Louis

Hi, All!

Some time ago I attempted to generate some interest on the <espee list> for a
plastic Vandy tender or two for us SP guys who can't fford or do not want to
spend the big bucks for so-so brass.

I for one, after years of wanting, have accepted the Bachman Consolidation with
open arms. Any 1930-1950 era SP layout needs a bunch of good running 2-8-0s but
all we got were mikes and consol's that looked terrible and ran worse.

My Bachmans needed some major work (especially for DCC) but are a heck of a lot
better than nothing. With a couple of Rivarossi 4-8-8-2's, some "War babys" and
2-8-0 s, I can present a reasonable approximation of my Tehachapai layout of
the '39-44 era.

Now, if I could just find some good plastic Vandy tenders, I could probably use
at least one or two of the Athern units and hope for more.

Jack Wilson, Prescott, AZ



Leonello Pesce wrote:

I believe the numbers you mention were in fact Heavy Mikes.

Differences mainly are in the diameter of the boiler, but there are
others I am sure.

Leo

From: "Stefan" <stefan@...>

As far as i understand it, the WP class MK60 #306-310 were the USRA

engines

bought from the Elgin, Joliet & Eastern(#802-806) in 1920. These should be
similar to the Athearn 2-8-2s (r perhaps the Rivs--see below) and may be a
good model with some modifications. These were oil burners. However, at
320000lbs total engine wt. are these Heavy Mikes? What is the division of
heavy vs. light for theseUSRA types?
Best regards

Stefan Lerche'
Duncan, B.C. Canada

I should add that the Western Pacific was not one of those railroads that
needed reduced axle loadings because a) it was built relatively late as
compared to other railroads, and thus was built to more modern standards and
b) was mostly mainline with almost no small branchlines. WP could easily
accommodate very heavy engines.

Thomas

Hi Stefan,

I believe the distinction between light and heavy was one of axle loading.
Both used the same running gear, but many railroads had lighter rail that
necessitated the use of a smaller boiler to reduce the overall per-axle
load. At the moment I forget what the axle loadings were.

Regards,
Thomas Beutel
San Francisco

As far as i understand it, the WP class MK60 #306-310 were the USRA engines
bought from the Elgin, Joliet & Eastern(#802-806) in 1920. These should be
similar to the Athearn 2-8-2s (r perhaps the Rivs--see below) and may be a
good model with some modifications. These were oil burners. However, at
320000lbs total engine wt. are these Heavy Mikes? What is the division of
heavy vs. light for theseUSRA types?
Best regards

Stefan Lerche'
Duncan, B.C. Canada

The current Rivarossi ones (with RP25 wheels) are heavy Mikes.
I believe in the old days, they made both, and the light became
the IHC one.

As for WP, the 2-8-2 lasted for a short time, but they may have
gotten the Elesco feedwater heater.

I remember when I had the Sunset light Mike, I was considering this
option, but I never worked with brass, so eventually I sold it for
SP steam. But now, with the Athearn boiler in plastic, the possibilities
are many.

As for the 4-8-2, check out Frisco 1522 stats:

http://members.aol.com/slsta/1522stat.htm

It shows 69" drivers. You can check the pictures for an idea of their
size. A friend of mine said that the difference is not very noticeable
between 69" and 72".

I would wait till the engine is out to compare it to the Bowser kit. If the
difference is minimal, I would go with the Bachmann and modify the
accessories to make into a WP one. (again, plastic is better that metal
to make modifications big and small)

Cheers
Leo

From: Thomas Beutel <Thomas.Beutel@...>

My understanding is that WP did have exact copies of the USRA 2-8-2, but
only for about two years around WWI. IIRC, they were lights and were
eventually sold to Wabash.

It hardly counts though. ;-)

By the way, is the Rivarossi 2-8-2 model (not the IHC) a light or heavy?

I'm more interested in the possibility of detailing the Bachmann 4-8-2 to

a

#170 class WP engine. These were the former Florida East Coast engines

that

WP bought during the depression era. A cursory look shows that the FEC
engines have some dimensional differences from the USRA, particularly the
driver size (69" vs. 72" I think). Perhaps a Bowser kit would be a better
start?

Thomas Beutel

My understanding is that WP did have exact copies of the USRA 2-8-2, but
only for about two years around WWI. IIRC, they were lights and were
eventually sold to Wabash.

It hardly counts though. ;-)

By the way, is the Rivarossi 2-8-2 model (not the IHC) a light or heavy?

I'm more interested in the possibility of detailing the Bachmann 4-8-2 to a
#170 class WP engine. These were the former Florida East Coast engines that
WP bought during the depression era. A cursory look shows that the FEC
engines have some dimensional differences from the USRA, particularly the
driver size (69" vs. 72" I think). Perhaps a Bowser kit would be a better
start?

Thomas Beutel

Sorry Ken, but my comment was specific to SP (and possibly WP and ATSF),
not in general.

I am sure that the engine will be bought and run at the club anyway,
with Southern Pacific on its coal tender, and maybe even in Daylight
colors. We have a member that has a GG1 in Daylight colors.

Besides, one can always make a "plausible" model out of it. If it
looks right, it is enough for some.

Cheers
Leo

From: KenRClark@...

HO steam modelers,
It is unfortunate when a group of individuals or club decides that a

model

has no potential before it is released. Even more unfortunate is that the

<snip>

ken clark

Yes, and check out the following company: Weinert

They have a web site at http://www.weinert.net

Some amazing steam engine kits.

Cheers
Leo

PS. engines are German steam, not USA or others.

From: "Stefan" <stefan@...>

<snip>

though! it does seem that we are finally catching up to the Europeans who
have had a fine selection for many years.
Best regards

Stefan Lerche'

Hi Nelson, and all,

Well .... at the club we pretty much decided that the Athearn
Mikado does not have potential, even by just getting the
bottom part and scrap the top. Tender is for the junk box.

For the Mountain, we have not seen it, just the info from
the Bachmann site and the poor pictures I have see so far.
It is a light USRA, so this also may not be a candidate
for SP. Now if it was a Heavy, that would be different.

Of course, both were part of a number of eastern RR and with
some minor modifications one can model a good number of RR.
Not being an eastern expert, I stop here.

Cheers
Leo

From: Nelson Kennedy <nelsonk@...>

HO steam modelers,
It is unfortunate when a group of individuals or club decides that a model
has no potential before it is released. Even more unfortunate is that the
same model has convinced a brass importer that HO steam has limited potential
for low cost models and to look elsewhere for sales. I talked yesterday with
Sunset Models, because of the Athearn genesis model, they will not be doing
their next planned models the USRA 2-8-2s. I can't say I am surprised. It
seems they are stepping away from the HO scale field again, so don't expect
their announced SP AC-9s to appear anytime soon. If they had been as well
done as their F-3/4/5s they would have been a very desirable model.
Admittedly I have not purchased any of the new state of the art articulateds
recently imported, as much due to price (they cost more than what a Sunset
AC-6 would have cost me in "O" scale) as to my satisfaction with the more
rugged mechanisms of the older Japanese models.
As far as the USRA light 2-8-2 model goes, some Western roads did not
operate close copies of this generic engines, including "up" and WP.
Comparing pictures of the El Paso and Southwestern mikes to the USRA engines
show a similar boiler silhouette, and they originally had rectangular
tenders. I don't expect to find a reasonably priced model of such obscure
engines, but they became SP classes Mk-7/8/9 (25 total) and the Athearn model
gives a shot and a representative model. I suppose I could kitbash a couplt
of the W&R mikes and come as close, but throwing away major parts of $1200
models hurts more than discarding some parts of a $120 model.

ken clark

In a message dated 4/30/99 12:10:56 AM, HOsteam@... writes:

<<
Volume/pressure is self-regulating. In the original design, the
high-pressure and low-pressure cylinders are made to proportions which
will represent the desired match - usually half the pressure in the l-p
system as in the h-p, but if there were an imbalance, the actual working
pressure in the l-ps would simply rise or drop to equalize with the
volume . . . no problem.

Some Mallets could also be started by directing high-pressure steam into the
low-pressure cylinders.

Perhaps the plumbing necessary to accomplish that function was helpful in the
conversion of these Mallets to simple articulated late in the career of those
locomotives.

On Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:16:54 +1200, you wrote:>

But.....but...... SP didn't have these USRA types (mumble mumble)

Um, well, there is going to be a Missouri Pacific. Is that close
enough?

...Keith


If it ain't pulled by steam, it ain't a real train.

At 02:59 PM 4/29/99 -0700, you wrote:

From: Thomas Beutel <Thomas.Beutel@...>
It is encouraging to notice that Bachmann points out of their removable
domes. It means they are (finally) aware that modelers like to modify their
locos. I certainly hope that Athearn's model will also have removable domes.
Any thoughts on kitbashes for these two locos?

Regarding the Bachmann URL,
If you look carefully at the photo (though small) it seems that the taper
in the boiler is not very great thereby possibly making it a better
candidate for more kitbashes. I'm not sure about the glowing firebox idea
though! it does seem that we are finally catching up to the Europeans who
have had a fine selection for many years.
Best regards

Stefan Lerche'
Duncan, B.C. Canada

The brief discussion that we had yesterday about Mallets sent me home
looking for a picture of the Taupo Totara Timber Company 2-4-4-2 that I
mentioned as being high on the 'cute' list. I couldn't find a picture that
was suitable for scanning.

Can I ask if one of the other NZ listers (I know there are some here!) has
an image of that loco that they might upload it to the shared files area
for us to see.

And I have a challenge.

When we think of Mallet we usually think of massive machinery, huh? My
challenge is 'who can come up with an image of the smallest Mallet?' and
upload it to the shared files area for us to look at.

What's this got to do with HO? Well, they are all potential subjects for
modelling. The TTT 2-4-4-2 has been done here in Sn3.5 to run on HO track
(correct scale to gauge relationship). It featured in MR many moons ago -
back in the days before colour pictures in MR. I think small artics have a
charm of their own.


Nelson Kennedy, Christchurch, New Zealand
Ferrymead Trams, 0 gauge NZR trains and a little Espee H0 are at:
http://DownUnder.Railfan.net

Well, the list is 24 hours old and has attracted 27 members in that time.
With the limited publicity it has had I reckon that is a good start.

I have been taken gently to task about the bias towards HO sized models.
I've posted my reasons for that in my welcome and have also said that I'm
not going to be heavy handed in 'controlling' the list. I'm happy for it
to go where the members want to take it.

Onelist has a shared files facility which has been enabled for this list.
Accepted Netiquette is that file attaches not be posted with list messages
and there is no need to have to do so here on Onelist because, in order to
share a document or image with one another, all we have to do is place it
in the shared files area and draw attention to it in a posting. That way
list members are left with the choice of whether to download the file or not.

Keep the faith!


Nelson Kennedy, Christchurch, New Zealand
Ferrymead Trams, 0 gauge NZR trains and a little Espee H0 are at:
http://DownUnder.Railfan.net

At 15:00 29/04/99 -0700, you wrote:

From: Elden Baker <eldenbaker@...>

... responding to Leo re new Genesis and Spectrum releases

I hope its trend starting. I haven't seen either of these engines but,
they did pick a good model to be the first release. I'm hoping to pick
up the Athearn unit when its available. I'll do a "product review" as
soon as I do.

But.....but...... SP didn't have these USRA types (mumble mumble)

What do you reckon Leo - might they be candidates for some sort of
conversion to SP types?


Nelson Kennedy, Christchurch, New Zealand
Ferrymead Trams, 0 gauge NZR trains and a little Espee H0 are at:
http://DownUnder.Railfan.net

It's just JIM dandy with ME!!! :)

Brad Bourbina


keith@... (R. Keith Heinsohn) wrote:
From: keith@... (R. Keith Heinsohn)

On Fri, 30 Apr 1999 11:16:54 +1200, you wrote:>

But.....but...... SP didn't have these USRA types (mumble mumble)

Um, well, there is going to be a Missouri Pacific. Is that close
enough?

...Keith


If it ain't pulled by steam, it ain't a real train.

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