Date   

Re: Number of members doesn’t match

mcmggroups@...
 

No way that could explain it.  These are new members who don't know the product at all, and wouldn't be deleting anything.  I am wondering if it is because of subgroups.  Could the total number be including those in subgroups, just counting those subgroup members who are NOT also in the main group?


Re: Member listing/directory URL parameter help #membership #customize

Bruce Bowman
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 03:15 PM, Christos G. Psarras wrote:
Is there a Wiki or how-to link on how to modify the URL parameter setup on the member screens?
Christos -- This is known as a query string.

What you've provided in your message is as extensive as I've seen, but I'm sure the parameters can vary greatly depending on the destination page.

And is there anyway that defaults for these can be set, or they have to be entered each time? (in which case, bookmarking will take care of that)
Some of them (e.g.: items per page) are established in your account preferences (https://groups.io/account?page=prefs)...others by a sort order selection, start/end record identifiers, etc.

 For example, https://<groupURL>/members?p=joined,pending,,20,2,0,0

I figured out a few of these parameters but not sure on the rest, and what values can be used on them, and I'd like to find out so I can create bookmarks for quick use.
Before I create a bookmark (or paste a link into a message), I usually just remove any query string. But if you want to document them, have at it...the GMF wiki pages are editable by any subscriber. By sequentially clicking on the various column headers and/or manually changing entries you should be able to figure them out.

Regards,
Bruce


Re: Member listing/directory URL parameter help #membership #customize

Duane
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 02:15 PM, Christos G. Psarras wrote:
Is there a Wiki or how-to link on how to modify the URL parameter setup on the member screens?
No.  But, as you've discovered, many of them can be figured out by watching what appears as you select various display modes.  I do that on pages sometimes, just to see what happens.  You're welcome to start a Wiki page for the different 'views' around the site.  URL Parameters might be a good name.

You might also pick up more detail by exporting your member list to a csv and checking the header line at the top.

Duane
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Re: Inhibit users from using "Delete message" #messages #issue #howto

Duane
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 12:46 PM, Frances wrote:
if you disable editing, you disable deleting.
Nope.  Editing is disabled on beta, but I can still delete my own messages.

Duane
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Member listing/directory URL parameter help #membership #customize

 

Hello folks,

Is there a Wiki or how-to link on how to modify the URL parameter setup on the member screens?  And is there anyway that defaults for these can be set, or they have to be entered each time? (in which case, bookmarking will take care of that)
 
For example, https://<groupURL>/members?p=joined,pending,,20,2,0,0

I figured out a few of these parameters but not sure on the rest, and what values can be used on them, and I'd like to find out so I can create bookmarks for quick use.

This is what I've figured out so far by trial and error and (developer) educated guess:


?p=P1,P2,P3,P4,P5,P6,P7

P1: List display sorting criteria; allowable values are joined (DateApplied), delivery (EmailDeliveryType), email (EmailAddy), fullname (DisplayName); if blank or none of these, default is joined (SortAscending-oldest first)

P2: Who to display; allowable values are: members, mods, pending, bouncing, banned, removed; if blank or none of these, default is members.

P3: ???

P4: How many entries/rows to display per page; no blank is allowed***, if 0, default is 20.

P5: Sorting order for P1; allowable values are: 1 (SortAscending-oldest first) or 2 (SortDescending-newest first), no blank is allowed***, if 0, default is 2.

P6: ???

P7: ???

*** if this parameter is blank, the list returns no rows.


Thanks for any help!

Cheers,
Christos


Re: How to recover a lost or abandoned Yahoo Group and transfer it to Groups.io

Samuel Murray
 

On Tue, Feb 6, 2018 at 12:50 AM, harryhef3@... wrote:
Alternatively, is there any way for a user (not the moderator) to copy everything over to a new groups.io account?
If I remember correctly, IgnoredAmbience's python scripts can download the files and messages of groups even if you're not a member of those groups, as long as the information that you're trying to download is available to the public.  I remember how I accidentally downloaded content from public groups that I was not a member of (typos...!).  The IgnoredAmbience scripts download content as JSON files, and some time in future there will be scripts with which to convert that into other formats, which you can make available in the Files section.

I wonder what is the database size limit (for storing old e-mails in the database).

Samuel


Re: deleting messages - image attachment unlimited storage and it's not the same as E-Mail Photos

SP4149
 

At this time it does not appear that images in attachments do not count toward the 1GB maximum image storage for a Basic (FREE) list.
I belong to a Free list that has 

3.4 GB for attachments storage and is
Using 231 MB for photos storage
 
Obviously the E-mail Photos Album does not have 3.4GB (3400Mb) in image storage as the total of all the Photo Albums is only 231 MB. 
And the E-mail Photos album is the only album that does not display the storage total for the album.

If this bug is ever fixed, then there will have to be a way for a list owner to strip image attachments from messages,
even being able to search messages for those with attachments and size of attachments would help.

Another glitch is that video files, much larger than photo images, do not seem to be counted toward the image storage limits for Free lists.
--
ken clark

www.shastasprings.com


Re: How to recover a lost or abandoned Yahoo Group and transfer it to Groups.io

BMaverick
 

Wilson,
 
Yes, and agree.  I've experienced this with our renegade group that was abandoned a decade ago by the owner and later by the last standing moderator.
 
PGO is the only way we have found to accomplish the most data gathering from YG.  We've tried the Github Phython scripts to no avail.  The 4 know ones no longer work. We tried the Chrome ext too, it was a no-go as well.
 
Other than the GroupsIO transfer, PGO was the only other way to go.

Looking forward to the message uploader with PGO of the Yahoo data to GroupsIO in the near future. :)
 
BMaverick
 


Re: text in post not showing on digest

Herb Gellis
 

Frances I appreciate your suggestion, and am aware of those options, but the thing is most of the people in my group do not want to logon, period. They just want to communicate back and forth with email. Some have even indicated they really did not like forums! (not my opinion) Asking them not only to logon for muting and such, and to fuss over each message to mute/follow them, would cause a riot!

I don't know what the typical constitution of Groups.io groups were before the YG exodus, though I'm sure it was a mix of email vs forum users. My unofficial guess for the YG flood of new folks would be they want email operation, without the extra work. So, since GIO already knows how to trim messages (to some extent), and obviously also must have the full message to begin with, it would seem reasonable to have the option to get either trim or whole messages in the digest.

The only extra work a digest reader ends up with is if there's too much quoted text, as I mentioned, quotes of quotes ad nauseum, et. al., which really is on us as administrators to get on the posters to stop doing that (or face the consequences).


Re: How to Import Links to database

Tony Moody
 

How to Import clickable links to Database.

Briefly
  • Data must be in a .csv file arranged as URL,Title ,Description in that order, without column headers.
  • Create the the database which must have only one column, which must be of Type "Links". Delete the other columns.
  • Click the "+Import Rows" button; Browse to and select the .csv file. Do not select "File has  Headers"  . Click "Import"

You should get a database, each "line" consisting of the  clickable Title over the Description.

Neat!

ok,
Tony


Re: text in post not showing on digest

Frances
 

There is another option that I have found useful.

I get just the first full message in any thread and then I can opt to follow. It is in the email footer to the message. It does bring you to the web to confirm.

You can also delete your followed messages list. 

To set this up, see this about Advanced Preferences (Subscriptions):
https://groups.io/static/help#subscription-options

And this about muting and following:
https://groups.io/static/help#muting

And finally, here' about managing muting and following:
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Managing-Muted-and-Followed-Topics

I think so highly of this approach, that is the default setting for some of my groups that I own. 

BTW, if you get single messages, you can also use the mute this thread in the footer of this email.

Frances

--
FAQ on Moving from YahooGroups
GMF Wiki: (unofficial) Help for members (and would-be members) and group managers


Re: text in post not showing on digest

Herb Gellis
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 11:28 AM, ro-esp wrote:
TECHNICALLY the only two options there are are
automatically deleting everything under the last unindented line, and no autotrimming at all.

If it were up to me, the individual messages would be autotrimmed too
Well, I think it's relatively clear that different folks have different ideas of what they want a digest to have, without even considering the technical difficulties in trimming or not.

In particular, if people want to use Groups.io as a forum, and always logon online to check on stuff, there generally won't be a problem (or for people who get single messages). For people who want to use email to interact (more common to our brethren now escaping from YG), there is a different story, and digests in particular.

Perhaps we should have an option on whether to trim digest messages or not? Subject to implementation issues. To put it simply, the whole point of a group/forum is to discuss, post messages back and forth. If you cut off the information we can't do that.

Those of us on the admin side of our groups should also have the responsibility to ding bad actors who, e.g., quote whole digests or texts that quote other texts ad nauseum. Sure it takes a moment to cut and paste what one is referring to, but the lazy way of not doing that can be quite annoying to the recipients, so that is on our heads.


Re: Inhibit users from using "Delete message" #messages #issue #howto

Frances
 
Edited

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 07:46 AM, Raphael Vowles wrote:
Hey Frances. Ive just looked on beta. I see the More menu at the foot of all messages. What are you looking at?

You've got me confused. Are you telling me the option is available on beta. Is it coming. Do you even know? 

This is vital.
Okay, nothing about EU privacy rules!

Please note - this is incorrect. I was wrong. Plain wrong. My testing method was incorrect.

I just tested and if you disable editing, you disable deleting. Both on my laptop and on my iPhone.

This is true in Beta, both on my laptop (Mac) and on my iPhone, I do NOT get a delete message option on a particular message. (I am not talking about exporting, but just the option to delete a specific email.) 
I can delete on GMF.
 
In Admin, Settings, Message Policies.

Further down, there is also a checkbox - Allow Members To Download Archives
Allow group members to download the message archives.

Frances
--
FAQ on Moving from YahooGroups
GMF Wiki: (unofficial) Help for members (and would-be members) and group managers


Re: Inhibit users from using "Delete message" #messages #issue #howto

Raphael Vowles on IO
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 06:49 AM, Duane wrote:
Thank you Duane, You said: I believe the most recent discussion is the one at https://beta.groups.io/g/main/topic/34280436
I shall take this discussion to Beta. I think we have established that right now, users cannot be inhibited from deleting their own messages.
GIO already has GDPR compliance. However, the facility is still desired by this (my) group.
To effect a means to do this properly,  would require some changes. viz.
  • Group settings, (Unsubscribe member delete/keep), (If delete allowed.)
  • moderator privileges, -to delete messages. Probably defaults to NO
  • user privileges, - probably defaults to YES but subject to group settings
  • bulk delete from Member Message Search
  • an evidence trail for compliance proof and audit
  • consideration about if/how a deleted message is evidenced in messages. "This message was removed by subscriber" etc,

That completes this topic here. See you in beta. This conversation risks falling in to a debate and is not helpful.
I trust it is OK to summarise the topic in this way.

Dear moderators - please lock this topic because it is transferring elsewhere more relevant.
Thank you for all for looking. Raphael


Re: text in post not showing on digest

ro-esp
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 05:27 PM, Herb Gellis wrote:


I just noticed this type of thing today. We're having a discussion about
something, and another poster responds to me partially by quoting my message,
but showing his suggested edits within the quoted part - and the quoted part
is completely missing from the digest. So, a digest person would have to logon
to the site to see the full message. This is really really bad! A discussion
back and forth should not be truncated.
yes, and that's why you sign your mails, UNDER the parts you want to send


I remember seeing something here about placing text under the quoted text so
all would be included (well, I seem to remember that), but enforcing that is
dicey.
No it is not, and it certainly wasn't in usenet (which I never used, but that aside).

The real problem is that certain commercial circles started to PRESCRIBE answering
ABOVE the quote , and to NOT trim quote at all.


One of the features of a good GUI is not to expect the user to remember
how to do things, it should just flow from the options on screen, etc. OK,
enough preaching ;-) So, does "at least for now" mean there might be some
consideration to making sure quoted text stays put in digests?
Consideration has nothing to do with it. TECHNICALLY the only two options there are are
automatically deleting everything under the last unindented line, and no autotrimming at all.

If it were up to me, the individual messages would be autotrimmed too

groetjes, Ronaldo


Re: text in post not showing on digest

Duane
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:59 AM, Herb Gellis wrote:
When Mark says quoting in digests is a headache, is that simply due to the size? I noticed another thread on this topic that indicated that is why digests now only have 12 messages in them (was 25, like YG before).
Apparently it's very difficult to be sure what's quoted and what's not programmatically because different clients/programs use different (or no) distinguishing marks.

There were some email services that didn't like digests with 25 messages, due to size IIRC, so it was cut to 12.  This change and justification was mentioned on the beta group.

Duane
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Re: text in post not showing on digest

Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 04:59 PM, Herb Gellis wrote:
people seem hard to train at times to edit their quoted text.
...people seem hard impossible to train at times to edit their quoted text.

FTFY...

Chris


Re: Detailed Instructions on How to Conduct a Yahoo Transfer

Marie-Christine
 

Thank you Frances!  I do pay for a month here and there, and did for this one.  Partly because sometimes we have large events and get 50 people signing up at once, it's worth not having to check they all got in.  And also because I have a lot of seniors in these groups, and getting them to even read the mail can be a struggle, so signing up is best done by someone else :-).  The direct add is well worth it, apart from shepherding a couple people here and there, I highly recommend it.
--
Marie-Christine


Re: New UI instructions?

Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 04:46 PM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
There is a section for Advice to Group Members, including a Quick-Start Guide. I will be the first to admit that it isn't comprehensive.
Charles: it is worth bearing in mind that producing a "unified" set of instructions might be well - nigh impossible. There might need to be a set for Owners; another set for Moderators, but it would have all sorts of caveats built into it to cover the differing Permissions that moderators can have, and yet another set for Users with a larger set of caveats covering what they can or (sometimes) cannot do depending on all the settings under the owner's control.

And my quotation earlier Time spent on reconnaissance is rarely wasted was an inadvertent misquote; it should have been Time spent on reconnaissance is seldom wasted and it was Erwin Rommel who said it. The underlying sentiment remains unchanged...

Chris


Re: text in post not showing on digest

Herb Gellis
 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:31 AM, Duane wrote:
The whole idea of digests is to minimize the size of the message sent.
Well that's one definition. The whole idea for me is to not be peppered all day with individual messages! As a new owner/moderator right now, I'm getting both digests and single messages (different email accounts) in order to test how things are going. When someone posts back to me to "see my edits below" and I get zip that's very frustrating.

When Mark says quoting in digests is a headache, is that simply due to the size? I noticed another thread on this topic that indicated that is why digests now only have 12 messages in them (was 25, like YG before). Clearly I hate it when someone responds to a digest and the entire digest is quoted, people seem hard to train at times to edit their quoted text.

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