Date   
Possible Underground Lake on Mars

L. Paul Verhage KD4STH
 

Google Maps Issue.

Joe WB9SBD
 

I remember there might be an Issue with tracking systems not being able to use Google Maps in the Future. Well at least for free.

I just ran into a possible alternative. I use a site that used to use Google Maps, it is a real estate site, that you can find lot sizes by drawing boundaries on the map etc.

I just came from there to check on our Field Day site and found this message..

Find Size of a Home Lot or Plat of Land

July 13, 2018 - FindLotSize.com has changed our mapping services to use Apple maps. With Apple, as the maps provider, we can offer our measurement services for free. Please note that street view is not available.

If you prefer to use Google Maps then we offer a paid service at MeasureLotSize.com.

The Maps are dated, Because, in the close up image below is from a good 6 years or so ago. Had a bad roof on my house and had a blue tarp on it back then,  But other than dated the level of quality is not too bad.



Joe WB9SBD



--

The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

Re: Google Maps Issue.

Christopher Rose
 

I use findlotsize.com professionally for property surveys. It tells me (usually) how many buildings may be on a property and approximate sizes of them. The site recently made login and measurement tools changes. More steps involved now. Didn't know the map source had changed.


Chris

KB8UIH

-----------------------------------------

From: "Joe WB9SBD"
To: "GPSL"
Cc:
Sent: Friday July 27 2018 9:31:49AM
Subject: [GPSL] Google Maps Issue.

I remember there might be an Issue with tracking systems not being able to use Google Maps in the Future. Well at least for free.

I just ran into a possible alternative. I use a site that used to use Google Maps, it is a real estate site, that you can find lot sizes by drawing boundaries on the map etc.

I just came from there to check on our Field Day site and found this message..

Find Size of a Home Lot or Plat of Land

July 13, 2018 - FindLotSize.com has changed our mapping services to use Apple maps. With Apple, as the maps provider, we can offer our measurement services for free. Please note that street view is not available.

If you prefer to use Google Maps then we offer a paid service at MeasureLotSize.com.

The Maps are dated, Because, in the close up image below is from a good 6 years or so ago. Had a bad roof on my house and had a blue tarp on it back then,  But other than dated the level of quality is not too bad.



Joe WB9SBD



--
Sig
The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

Re: Important changes to Google Maps API affecting aprs.fi (and others)

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

I've checked aprs.fi intermittently since I posted this and have encountered no issues with it giving me Google Maps underneath.  It looks like a lot of progress has been made on the conversion to OSM.  Should aprs.fi suddenly be unable to map for you, or if you're interested in what the OSM version will look like, check out https://beta.aprs.fi.  Some small changes to interface, rendering, and overall look and feel but it's looking pretty good to me.

73 de Mark N9XTN

On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 11:38 AM Mark Conner <mconner1@...> wrote:
This is a copy of a message posted recently to the APRSSIG e-mail list.  Google has implemented a new pricing structure for Google Maps that are negatively affecting services like aprs.fi.  The current pricing would result in charges of ~$5000/mo to support aprs.fi's traffic.

Also note that a transition to OSM is not as simple as some believe.

If you are counting on aprs.fi for following ARHABs, you may need to reconsider.  

73 de Mark N9XTN

=============================================

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 12:15:05 +0300 (EEST)
From: Heikki Hannikainen <hessu@...>
To: aprssig@...
Subject: Re: [aprssig] aprs.fi and Google Maps API pricing in July
        2018
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.1807181206370.4231@...>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15"; Format="flowed"

On Wed, 18 Jul 2018, Steve Dimse wrote:

>> Is it just here in Reno that we can't use APRS.FI to see the map?
>
> I see a map but it greys out with a tiled message saying "for 
> development purposes only". It seems to work - just hard to read.

Hi,

For some time this morning, Google Maps on aprs.fi displayed a pop-up 
saying "This page can't load Google Maps correctly". The map tiles 
were dark with "For Development Purposes Only" written on them.

This was because of a configuration accident on my part: the aprs.fi 
profile on Google Cloud console was not properly linked to the correct 
payments profile which has my credit card attached. That's now fixed and 
the maps load fine. For a few days (3-5?), starting now.

Due to the volunteer / charitable / non-profit uses in Amateur Radio 
circles (SAR, disaster relief, etc) aprs.fi has had a generous free use 
limit from Google, even after the pricing went up in 2012. With the recent 
pricing model changes for Google Maps APIs, the free use quota got lost, 
because they were not automatically migrated in the transformation. It was 
a bit uncertain whether it'll stay there or not, but now it's obvious it's 
gone.

I'm trying to reach out to them and see if it can be reinstated, or if a 
generous volume discount can be applied. If someone has insider Google 
contacts who are amateur radio operators, please email me and them in 
private.

If not, I might be looking at a bill of 4000-5000? ($4500-6000) per month, 
which obviously is something that I can't do. The billing has now started, 
and I got a small credit for the transition & try-out period, which will 
last for a few days, and I can pay the bill for a few more days after 
that, but then I'll have to turn it off or quickly migrate away.

To reduce the loads a bit, I'll be disabling the Embedded maps feature 
right now.

There is a risk that I'll have to replace Google Maps with something, but 
it'll be a development effort which will take quite some time, and the end 
result might not be quite as smooth; the Google Maps API has been pretty 
great.

Remember folks: It's not just about the map graphics - it's the API, and 
all the software from Google to load the graphics and draw things on top, 
and make them pan and zoom nicely.

    - Hessu, OH7LZB

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 13:55:26 +0300 (EEST)
From: Heikki Hannikainen <hessu@...>
To: aprssig@...
Subject: Re: [aprssig] aprs.fi and Google Maps API pricing in July
        2018
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.1807181340250.4231@...>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

On Wed, 18 Jul 2018, Heikki Hannikainen wrote:

> There is a risk that I'll have to replace Google Maps with something, but 
> it'll be a development effort which will take quite some time, and the end 
> result might not be quite as smooth; the Google Maps API has been pretty 
> great.

And before everyone and their dog yells "Hey, just switch to 
OpenStreetMaps, you have that already in the menu right?", please note 
that:

When you select the "OSM" option from the current aprs.fi menu, it just 
tells Google Maps API to download OSM tiles; that does not stop the paid 
use of the Google Maps API.

The Google Maps API has provided quite a few things:

* The source map material (vector maps drawn by people and algorithms, 
often purchased from other mapping companies)

* PNG map tiles (the source map material drawn and zoomed and rendered as 
small PNG image files), these are what are actually downloaded and 
displayed in the web browser

* The tile servers run in Google's cloud, which convert the source map 
material to the PNG tiles; the web browser downloads the tiles from these 
servers, not aprs.fi!

* The Maps API javascript library, which performs the downloading of the 
tiles in the browser, zooming and panning functions, and draws things like 
APRS symbol graphics on top, and lines between them, when aprs.fi simply 
gives sets of geographical coordinates to the library.

* Address search (what are the coordinates for a street address); need to 
use something like Geonames for that, but it won't be half as good as 
Google's free text address search

>From OSM you only get the first one, the source vector map material. You 
can't simply download map tiles from their tile server all the time (see 
https://operations.osmfoundation.org/policies/tiles/ ).

Then I'll need something like Leaflet to replace the javascript library, 
it's some work to convert to that.

Then I'll need to download the tiles from somewhere, either from one of 
the free or paid tile servers, or perhaps set up my own tile server, which 
takes quite some work and plenty of server capacity to run 
(https://switch2osm.org/serving-tiles/building-a-tile-server-from-packages/ 
- see below "Import map data" and "Hardware" headlines).

https://switch2osm.org/ describes the process quite well. It's plenty of 
work, but I'll have to look into it.

   - Hessu, OH7LZB


Re: Google Maps Issue.

Joe WB9SBD
 

If you are a Paid user it still uses Google Maps by the sounds of things. The Free version is now from Apple Maps.

Joe WB9SBD

The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

On 7/27/2018 9:32 AM, Christopher Rose wrote:

I use findlotsize.com professionally for property surveys. It tells me (usually) how many buildings may be on a property and approximate sizes of them. The site recently made login and measurement tools changes. More steps involved now. Didn't know the map source had changed.


Chris

KB8UIH

-----------------------------------------

From: "Joe WB9SBD"
To: "GPSL"
Cc:
Sent: Friday July 27 2018 9:31:49AM
Subject: [GPSL] Google Maps Issue.

I remember there might be an Issue with tracking systems not being able to use Google Maps in the Future. Well at least for free.

I just ran into a possible alternative. I use a site that used to use Google Maps, it is a real estate site, that you can find lot sizes by drawing boundaries on the map etc.

I just came from there to check on our Field Day site and found this message..

Find Size of a Home Lot or Plat of Land

July 13, 2018 - FindLotSize.com has changed our mapping services to use Apple maps. With Apple, as the maps provider, we can offer our measurement services for free. Please note that street view is not available.

If you prefer to use Google Maps then we offer a paid service at MeasureLotSize.com.

The Maps are dated, Because, in the close up image below is from a good 6 years or so ago. Had a bad roof on my house and had a blue tarp on it back then,  But other than dated the level of quality is not too bad.



Joe WB9SBD



--
Sig
The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com


Re: Important changes to Google Maps API affecting aprs.fi (and others)

Joe WB9SBD
 

Yup looks usable to me too, just no road names. and why they choose to color some areas green is unknown why.

Joe WB9SBD

The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

On 7/27/2018 9:45 AM, Mark Conner N9XTN wrote:
I've checked aprs.fi intermittently since I posted this and have encountered no issues with it giving me Google Maps underneath.  It looks like a lot of progress has been made on the conversion to OSM.  Should aprs.fi suddenly be unable to map for you, or if you're interested in what the OSM version will look like, check out https://beta.aprs.fi.  Some small changes to interface, rendering, and overall look and feel but it's looking pretty good to me.

73 de Mark N9XTN

On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 11:38 AM Mark Conner <mconner1@...> wrote:
This is a copy of a message posted recently to the APRSSIG e-mail list.  Google has implemented a new pricing structure for Google Maps that are negatively affecting services like aprs.fi.  The current pricing would result in charges of ~$5000/mo to support aprs.fi's traffic.

Also note that a transition to OSM is not as simple as some believe.

If you are counting on aprs.fi for following ARHABs, you may need to reconsider.  

73 de Mark N9XTN

=============================================

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 12:15:05 +0300 (EEST)
From: Heikki Hannikainen <hessu@...>
To: aprssig@...
Subject: Re: [aprssig] aprs.fi and Google Maps API pricing in July
        2018
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.1807181206370.4231@...>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15"; Format="flowed"

On Wed, 18 Jul 2018, Steve Dimse wrote:

>> Is it just here in Reno that we can't use APRS.FI to see the map?
>
> I see a map but it greys out with a tiled message saying "for 
> development purposes only". It seems to work - just hard to read.

Hi,

For some time this morning, Google Maps on aprs.fi displayed a pop-up 
saying "This page can't load Google Maps correctly". The map tiles 
were dark with "For Development Purposes Only" written on them.

This was because of a configuration accident on my part: the aprs.fi 
profile on Google Cloud console was not properly linked to the correct 
payments profile which has my credit card attached. That's now fixed and 
the maps load fine. For a few days (3-5?), starting now.

Due to the volunteer / charitable / non-profit uses in Amateur Radio 
circles (SAR, disaster relief, etc) aprs.fi has had a generous free use 
limit from Google, even after the pricing went up in 2012. With the recent 
pricing model changes for Google Maps APIs, the free use quota got lost, 
because they were not automatically migrated in the transformation. It was 
a bit uncertain whether it'll stay there or not, but now it's obvious it's 
gone.

I'm trying to reach out to them and see if it can be reinstated, or if a 
generous volume discount can be applied. If someone has insider Google 
contacts who are amateur radio operators, please email me and them in 
private.

If not, I might be looking at a bill of 4000-5000? ($4500-6000) per month, 
which obviously is something that I can't do. The billing has now started, 
and I got a small credit for the transition & try-out period, which will 
last for a few days, and I can pay the bill for a few more days after 
that, but then I'll have to turn it off or quickly migrate away.

To reduce the loads a bit, I'll be disabling the Embedded maps feature 
right now.

There is a risk that I'll have to replace Google Maps with something, but 
it'll be a development effort which will take quite some time, and the end 
result might not be quite as smooth; the Google Maps API has been pretty 
great.

Remember folks: It's not just about the map graphics - it's the API, and 
all the software from Google to load the graphics and draw things on top, 
and make them pan and zoom nicely.

    - Hessu, OH7LZB

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 13:55:26 +0300 (EEST)
From: Heikki Hannikainen <hessu@...>
To: aprssig@...
Subject: Re: [aprssig] aprs.fi and Google Maps API pricing in July
        2018
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.1807181340250.4231@...>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

On Wed, 18 Jul 2018, Heikki Hannikainen wrote:

> There is a risk that I'll have to replace Google Maps with something, but 
> it'll be a development effort which will take quite some time, and the end 
> result might not be quite as smooth; the Google Maps API has been pretty 
> great.

And before everyone and their dog yells "Hey, just switch to 
OpenStreetMaps, you have that already in the menu right?", please note 
that:

When you select the "OSM" option from the current aprs.fi menu, it just 
tells Google Maps API to download OSM tiles; that does not stop the paid 
use of the Google Maps API.

The Google Maps API has provided quite a few things:

* The source map material (vector maps drawn by people and algorithms, 
often purchased from other mapping companies)

* PNG map tiles (the source map material drawn and zoomed and rendered as 
small PNG image files), these are what are actually downloaded and 
displayed in the web browser

* The tile servers run in Google's cloud, which convert the source map 
material to the PNG tiles; the web browser downloads the tiles from these 
servers, not aprs.fi!

* The Maps API javascript library, which performs the downloading of the 
tiles in the browser, zooming and panning functions, and draws things like 
APRS symbol graphics on top, and lines between them, when aprs.fi simply 
gives sets of geographical coordinates to the library.

* Address search (what are the coordinates for a street address); need to 
use something like Geonames for that, but it won't be half as good as 
Google's free text address search

>From OSM you only get the first one, the source vector map material. You 
can't simply download map tiles from their tile server all the time (see 
https://operations.osmfoundation.org/policies/tiles/ ).

Then I'll need something like Leaflet to replace the javascript library, 
it's some work to convert to that.

Then I'll need to download the tiles from somewhere, either from one of 
the free or paid tile servers, or perhaps set up my own tile server, which 
takes quite some work and plenty of server capacity to run 
(https://switch2osm.org/serving-tiles/building-a-tile-server-from-packages/ 
- see below "Import map data" and "Hardware" headlines).

https://switch2osm.org/ describes the process quite well. It's plenty of 
work, but I'll have to look into it.

   - Hessu, OH7LZB



flighttracker.surfingsatellites.org?

Larry
 

I am watching the weather and thinking about a launch this weekend.  I attempted to get to the subject flight tracker and it did not seem to be available?

Larry
KJ6PBS

First ARHAB/ARHAB collision?

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

NSTAR 18-B (paired with NearSys) and Nebraska Space Grant launched this morning at the Nebraska Star Party south of Valentine NE.  At about 14,000 ft, NSTAR suddenly began descending and landed only a few miles away from the launch site.

In talking with the NSG crew on the way home, they looked at their camera footage and it was clear to them that their payload collided with our balloon at around that altitude.

Here is the track of the two balloons:

I think this could be a first for an ARHAB/ARHAB collision (beyond the trivial case of right after launch, perhaps).  

I don't yet have the video because there is only weak and low-bandwidth cell coverage at the Nebraska Star Party site.  I'll post links once the video is available.

73 de Mark N9XTN



4 Misses and a Hit. The Movie

L. Paul Verhage KD4STH
 

Two balloons had a joust yesterday and one lost at 14,000 feet.

This is the first mid-air collusion between near spacecraft.

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Michael Sibbernsen <msibbernsen2@...>
Date: Wed, Aug 8, 2018, 12:04 AM
Subject: 4 Misses and a Hit. The Movie
To: L. Paul Verhage <nearsys@...>, Mark Conner <mconner1@...>


https://www.dropbox.com/s/fmjtzbq2iz145ii/4%20Misses%20and%20a%20Hit.mov?dl=0

Enjoy!


Michael Sibbernsen
Lecturer of Astronomy- University of Nebraska-Lincoln
Special Projects Facilitator- NASA Nebraska Space Grant
NASA Solar System Ambassador


Re: First ARHAB/ARHAB collision?

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

Here's a frame grab right after the collision.

73 de Mark N9XTN

On Tue, Aug 7, 2018 at 7:20 PM Mark Conner <mconner1@...> wrote:
NSTAR 18-B (paired with NearSys) and Nebraska Space Grant launched this morning at the Nebraska Star Party south of Valentine NE.  At about 14,000 ft, NSTAR suddenly began descending and landed only a few miles away from the launch site.

In talking with the NSG crew on the way home, they looked at their camera footage and it was clear to them that their payload collided with our balloon at around that altitude.

Here is the track of the two balloons:

I think this could be a first for an ARHAB/ARHAB collision (beyond the trivial case of right after launch, perhaps).  

I don't yet have the video because there is only weak and low-bandwidth cell coverage at the Nebraska Star Party site.  I'll post links once the video is available.

73 de Mark N9XTN



Collision video

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

Re: Collision video

Joe WB9SBD
 

Isn't that incredibly interesting.

Has anyone have any idea why the two balloons would be moving so differently in the same air mass?

Joe WB9SBD

The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

On 8/8/2018 10:59 AM, Mark Conner N9XTN wrote:

73 de Mark N9XTN


Re: Collision video

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

I think it's more startling that we filled two separate balloons with very different weights (ours was ~2 lbs, theirs was at least 5) and managed to hit almost exactly the same ascent rate, drift some distance apart, then come back together.  

I'd bet this couldn't be done intentionally, other than having them bump together within seconds after launch (which ours almost did).  Having it happen >10 minutes afterwards?  The odds have to be astronomical.

73 de Mark N9XTN

On Wed, Aug 8, 2018 at 11:48 AM Joe WB9SBD <nss@...> wrote:
Isn't that incredibly interesting.

Has anyone have any idea why the two balloons would be moving so differently in the same air mass?

Joe WB9SBD

The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com

On 8/8/2018 10:59 AM, Mark Conner N9XTN wrote:

73 de Mark N9XTN


Presentations

L. Paul Verhage KD4STH
 

I didn't ask for them at the conference, but please email me your GPSL presentation and Mark Conner can post them online for us.

Thanks

WB4APR-11 over New England

Mark Conner N9XTN
 

360 Balloon Launch

L. Paul Verhage KD4STH
 

I posted a short 360 video I recorded of the balloon launches at the Nebraska Star Party. 

I shared a balloon with NSTAR and the second balloon was launched by the Nebraska Space Grant.

The video is located at, https://youtu.be/--p-FAzLLmo

--
Dr. L. Paul Verhage
Near Space Evangelist

Re: 360 Balloon Launch

Bruce Coates
 

Hi Paul

You had me all worked up for a minute thinking you had flown a 360 degree camera.

Very interesting though.

73, Bruce - VE5BNC

On 2018-08-15 10:30 AM, L. Paul Verhage KD4STH wrote:
I posted a short 360 video I recorded of the balloon launches at the Nebraska Star Party. 

I shared a balloon with NSTAR and the second balloon was launched by the Nebraska Space Grant.

The video is located at, https://youtu.be/--p-FAzLLmo

--
Dr. L. Paul Verhage
Near Space Evangelist

Re: 360 Balloon Launch

Jim Reed
 

We flew a couple 360s a couple years ago. Cool footage. 


I enjoy reading the conversations you folks have. You are a knowledgeable group. We just know how to do it. 😀

Jim


On Aug 16, 2018, at 8:16 PM, Bruce Coates <bruce.coates@...> wrote:

Hi Paul

You had me all worked up for a minute thinking you had flown a 360 degree camera.

Very interesting though.

73, Bruce - VE5BNC

On 2018-08-15 10:30 AM, L. Paul Verhage KD4STH wrote:
I posted a short 360 video I recorded of the balloon launches at the Nebraska Star Party. 

I shared a balloon with NSTAR and the second balloon was launched by the Nebraska Space Grant.

The video is located at, https://youtu.be/--p-FAzLLmo

--
Dr. L. Paul Verhage
Near Space Evangelist

Re: 360 Balloon Launch

L. Paul Verhage KD4STH
 

I will fly one soon, but it may be a huge file when done. 


On Thu, Aug 16, 2018, 7:16 PM Bruce Coates <bruce.coates@...> wrote:
Hi Paul

You had me all worked up for a minute thinking you had flown a 360 degree camera.

Very interesting though.

73, Bruce - VE5BNC

On 2018-08-15 10:30 AM, L. Paul Verhage KD4STH wrote:
I posted a short 360 video I recorded of the balloon launches at the Nebraska Star Party. 

I shared a balloon with NSTAR and the second balloon was launched by the Nebraska Space Grant.

The video is located at, https://youtu.be/--p-FAzLLmo

--
Dr. L. Paul Verhage
Near Space Evangelist

Re: 360 Balloon Launch

Bruce Coates
 

Great stuff.  I'll be watching.

Weather (and forest fire smoke) permitting we're going to fly SABRE-27 next weekend.  Nothing special.  Just a traditional camera payload.

On 2018-08-16 8:11 PM, L. Paul Verhage KD4STH wrote:
I will fly one soon, but it may be a huge file when done. 

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018, 7:16 PM Bruce Coates <bruce.coates@...> wrote:
Hi Paul

You had me all worked up for a minute thinking you had flown a 360 degree camera.

Very interesting though.

73, Bruce - VE5BNC

On 2018-08-15 10:30 AM, L. Paul Verhage KD4STH wrote:
I posted a short 360 video I recorded of the balloon launches at the Nebraska Star Party. 

I shared a balloon with NSTAR and the second balloon was launched by the Nebraska Space Grant.

The video is located at, https://youtu.be/--p-FAzLLmo

--
Dr. L. Paul Verhage
Near Space Evangelist