Topics

Retrofit consult


Richard Engbersen
 

Hi EMCO friends around the globe,

First of all I really appreciate everybody’s input and contribution in this group. I read all the messages and it is because of this group’s support I was able to start up my EMCO F1 CNC mill and EMCO Compact 5 CNC lathe 6 years ago.

Both these machines are the red color (latest original EMCO controls) and still 100% original. I make many RC related, mainly aluminium parts and tools on these machines. I also have an EMCO Compact 8 lathe.

Now my question. I really enjoy programming in G-code and the traditional controls. It is reliable, nostalgic and very appealing to me, I would like to keep that manual G-code programming as an option, as it works really well and almost therapeutic for me. Simultaniously I would like to have the option for a modern control and possibly using a CAM interface in some cases.

Any recommendations for “Retrofit EMCO F1 and C5 for dummies” would be really appreciated.

Thanks a lot,
Richard (from The Netherlands)



arjan.dijk
 

Hi Richard,

You can run the F1 and C5 perfectly with CAM (Fusion 360 for example), but you might run into issues with processing speed and memory.

Dus je kunt de machine gewoon met CAM aansturen.

Regards, Arjan (from the Netherlands)

Op di 8 dec. 2020 om 12:17 schreef Richard Engbersen <engbersenr@...>:

Hi EMCO friends around the globe,

First of all I really appreciate everybody’s input and contribution in this group. I read all the messages and it is because of this group’s support I was able to start up my EMCO F1 CNC mill and EMCO Compact 5 CNC lathe 6 years ago.

Both these machines are the red color (latest original EMCO controls) and still 100% original. I make many RC related, mainly aluminium parts and tools on these machines. I also have an EMCO Compact 8 lathe.

Now my question. I really enjoy programming in G-code and the traditional controls. It is reliable, nostalgic and very appealing to me, I would like to keep that manual G-code programming as an option, as it works really well and almost therapeutic for me. Simultaniously I would like to have the option for a modern control and possibly using a CAM interface in some cases.

Any recommendations for “Retrofit EMCO F1 and C5 for dummies” would be really appreciated.

Thanks a lot,
Richard (from The Netherlands)



Richard Engbersen
 

Hi Arjan,

I know that is possible, I did that before, but as you know the standaard EMCO no. of lines is really limited (F1: 160 and C5: 210 lines). Any CAM software is creating easily 10.000+ lines, not efficient programming in smart cycles and subroutines, because memory is no issue in modern control systems.

Regards,
Richard

Op di 8 dec. 2020 om 12:52 schreef arjan.dijk <arjan.dijk@...>

Hi Richard,

You can run the F1 and C5 perfectly with CAM (Fusion 360 for example), but you might run into issues with processing speed and memory.

Dus je kunt de machine gewoon met CAM aansturen.

Regards, Arjan (from the Netherlands)

Op di 8 dec. 2020 om 12:17 schreef Richard Engbersen <engbersenr@...>:
Hi EMCO friends around the globe,

First of all I really appreciate everybody’s input and contribution in this group. I read all the messages and it is because of this group’s support I was able to start up my EMCO F1 CNC mill and EMCO Compact 5 CNC lathe 6 years ago.

Both these machines are the red color (latest original EMCO controls) and still 100% original. I make many RC related, mainly aluminium parts and tools on these machines. I also have an EMCO Compact 8 lathe.

Now my question. I really enjoy programming in G-code and the traditional controls. It is reliable, nostalgic and very appealing to me, I would like to keep that manual G-code programming as an option, as it works really well and almost therapeutic for me. Simultaniously I would like to have the option for a modern control and possibly using a CAM interface in some cases.

Any recommendations for “Retrofit EMCO F1 and C5 for dummies” would be really appreciated.

Thanks a lot,
Richard (from The Netherlands)



gonzalezpineiro@...
 

Hi Richard. 
I also have a red Emco F1, and I am using it with the original controller. I write the programs in MFI (Mike's Free Interface). 
Since I could never find any compatible post-processor, I am also considering the option of a retrofit. 
The first idea was to make an alternative control in which the milling machine could be plugged in without any mechanical modification (to be able to use both controls, the original and the new one)
But I did not find current drivers that can work correctly with the stepper motors that the
 F1, so sadly I had to scrap this idea. 
Now I was thinking of using Triple Beast and Beamicom2 for the retrofit. 
While I'm just making up my mind I'm doing the home and limit switches.

Regards, Hugo


Richard Engbersen
 

Hi Hugo,

From your e-mail address I guess you are from Spain, thanks for your reaction. I would consider sacrificing the original controller, but I really like the option of old school G-code programming. I use NCEDIT, which is not more than a txt editor, with communication interface from my laptop USB port to the RS232 port of both machines. I use MFI for simulation of toolpath to defect and filter out major programming mistakes. See attached photo of my setup.


I am quite technical to be honest and educated as a mechanical engineer, but have no idea yet how to start and what works for a retrofit.

It woud be nice if somebody in this very much appreciated group has good experience and could advise us on the required components and get us started.

Cheers,
Richard

Op di 8 dec. 2020 om 21:26 schreef <gonzalezpineiro@...>

Hi Richard. 
I also have a red Emco F1, and I am using it with the original controller. I write the programs in MFI (Mike's Free Interface). 
Since I could never find any compatible post-processor, I am also considering the option of a retrofit. 
The first idea was to make an alternative control in which the milling machine could be plugged in without any mechanical modification (to be able to use both controls, the original and the new one)
But I did not find current drivers that can work correctly with the stepper motors that the
 F1, so sadly I had to scrap this idea. 
Now I was thinking of using Triple Beast and Beamicom2 for the retrofit. 
While I'm just making up my mind I'm doing the home and limit switches.

Regards, Hugo


gonzalezpineiro@...
 

Hi Richard
I live in Spain, in Barcelona. This is my Emco F1. 



I was not aware of the NcEdit software. 
Does NcEdit have an advantage over MFI to use it? 
Today I downloaded it and I have the feeling that it does not understand the Emco F1 syntax, it is how you say a "text editor", it is like opening it with Word. 
Regarding the retrofit, for me it would be the first conversion I make of a machine. 
The motors it carries are Nema 23, the original ones are 0.42 Nm, so using 1Nm motors would be a good option.


Richard Engbersen
 

NcEdit works very well for me, I use it all the time, because for instance when programming subroutines I can simpy copy / paste parts of the program. I just use an existing program to start so the format is correct and save them as TXT files. Then for simulation I use MFI, just to check any major programming errors.

For me it would also be my first ever retrofit that’s why any advise of experience and guidance would be very much appreciated, so that I do not have to re-invent the wheel.

I am familiar with NEMA23 steppers, I have probably 20 of them at home. But I do not know which part(s) of the existing control unit to use and what electronics to add and which software to use. I am looking for an efficient and proven retrofit. Any help to get me started or where I can find such info is very much appreciated.

Cheers,
Richard 

Op wo 9 dec. 2020 om 22:32 schreef <gonzalezpineiro@...>

Hi Richard
I live in Spain, in Barcelona. This is my Emco F1. 



I was not aware of the NcEdit software. 
Does NcEdit have an advantage over MFI to use it? 
Today I downloaded it and I have the feeling that it does not understand the Emco F1 syntax, it is how you say a "text editor", it is like opening it with Word. 
Regarding the retrofit, for me it would be the first conversion I make of a machine. 
The motors it carries are Nema 23, the original ones are 0.42 Nm, so using 1Nm motors would be a good option.


Richard Engbersen
 

Hi Guys,
I talked to some friend with more experience on electronics and I decided to proceed with a retrofit myself on my ENCO F1 CNC machine.
Yesterday I have ordered 1x Machifit 4 Axis CNC Motion Controller TC55H. At home already I have 3x M542 microstep drivers and 3x Nema23 steppers. See attached pictures.
Also I have already downloaded Mach 3 software. Let’s see if I can make this work. My plan is to fist test the new hardware separately. As soon as it works I will work on the hardware, which is not a big issue for me being a mechanical engineer.
I will keep you posted.
Cheers, Richard

Op wo 9 dec. 2020 om 22:44 schreef Richard Engbersen via groups.io <engbersenr=gmail.com@groups.io>

NcEdit works very well for me, I use it all the time, because for instance when programming subroutines I can simpy copy / paste parts of the program. I just use an existing program to start so the format is correct and save them as TXT files. Then for simulation I use MFI, just to check any major programming errors.

For me it would also be my first ever retrofit that’s why any advise of experience and guidance would be very much appreciated, so that I do not have to re-invent the wheel.

I am familiar with NEMA23 steppers, I have probably 20 of them at home. But I do not know which part(s) of the existing control unit to use and what electronics to add and which software to use. I am looking for an efficient and proven retrofit. Any help to get me started or where I can find such info is very much appreciated.

Cheers,
Richard 

Op wo 9 dec. 2020 om 22:32 schreef <gonzalezpineiro@...>
Hi Richard
I live in Spain, in Barcelona. This is my Emco F1. 



I was not aware of the NcEdit software. 
Does NcEdit have an advantage over MFI to use it? 
Today I downloaded it and I have the feeling that it does not understand the Emco F1 syntax, it is how you say a "text editor", it is like opening it with Word. 
Regarding the retrofit, for me it would be the first conversion I make of a machine. 
The motors it carries are Nema 23, the original ones are 0.42 Nm, so using 1Nm motors would be a good option.


gonzalezpineiro@...
 

Interesting project Richard, as I am also retrofitting the Emco F1 (although with other electronics) so we can exchange data. Will you leave the original spindle motor? I'll leave it for a while with an HQ-SXPWM-A type drive, which I haven't tested yet. You can see how the project is going in the thread "emco f1" of this forum or in

http://forometalaficion.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=249

Regards
Hugo


Richard Engbersen
 

I am ordering all parts, still several are pending, while I am preparing the retrofit of my EMCO F1 CNC. See attached  picture of parts that have already arrived.

QUESTION: any of you can advise how to connect the WPM controller for the tool spindle to the controller in such a way that I can control the RPM from the program?

Parts picture attached.


Thanks,
Richard 

Op zo 31 jan. 2021 om 14:10 schreef <gonzalezpineiro@...>

Interesting project Richard, as I am also retrofitting the Emco F1 (although with other electronics) so we can exchange data. Will you leave the original spindle motor? I'll leave it for a while with an HQ-SXPWM-A type drive, which I haven't tested yet. You can see how the project is going in the thread "emco f1" of this forum or in

http://forometalaficion.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=249

Regards
Hugo