Topics

SWR meter problem on K3

Lawrence Stringer
 

Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.

Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

Thanks in advance,

Lawrence   G4GZG

Mike Flowers
 

Hi Lawrence,

 

One thing to check is that the K3 has selected the correct antenna.

 

I’ve had this situation when my antenna was on ANT1 but somehow my K3 was on ANT2.

 

- 73 and good DX de Mike, K6MKF, NCDXC Secretary

 

From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> On Behalf Of Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 09:39
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.

Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

Thanks in advance,

Lawrence   G4GZG

Wes Stewart
 

I'm a bit confused.  Is the 5:1 reading on the K3 display?  If so, you say you read 5:1 on your VNA, so there seems to be agreement there.  But you say the dummy load reads 5:1; is that on the K3?  What does the VNA read on the dummy load?

Wes  N7WS

On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 10:39:12 AM MST, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io <g4gzg@...> wrote:


Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.

Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

Thanks in advance,

Lawrence   G4GZG

Dave Cole
 

Hi Lawrence,

Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue... Here is why...

1. The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
2. The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.

I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner... If so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the antenna or feedline is at fault.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:
Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.
Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
Thanks in advance,
Lawrence   G4GZG

Ray Maxfield
 

I Agree  WA6VAB 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Dave Cole
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

Hi Lawrence,

 

Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is why...

 

1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.

2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.

 

I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If

so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the

antenna or feedline is at fault.

 

73, and thanks,

Dave (NK7Z)

https://www.nk7z.net

ARRL Volunteer Examiner

ARRL Technical Specialist

ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

 

On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:

> Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I

> turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than

> 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked

> the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and

> after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what,

> still over 5:1 SWR.

>

> Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Lawrence   G4GZG

>

 

 

 

Wes Stewart
 

So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?

Wes  N7WS

On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield <wa6vab@...> wrote:


I Agree  WA6VAB 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Dave Cole
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

Hi Lawrence,

 

Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is why...

 

1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.

2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.

 

I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If

so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the

antenna or feedline is at fault.

 

73, and thanks,

Dave (NK7Z)

https://www.nk7z.net

ARRL Volunteer Examiner

ARRL Technical Specialist

ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

 

On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:

> Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I

> turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than

> 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked

> the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and

> after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what,

> still over 5:1 SWR.

>

> Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Lawrence   G4GZG

>

 

 

 

Dave Cole
 

Hi Wes,

Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a unambiguous test point.

Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio, was it hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc... The exact statement was:

"I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is the Dummy Load. Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
However, the comment:

"...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"

No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is correct, the K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR. So it is not the K3-- and hence-- yes, I am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?
Wes  N7WS
On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield <wa6vab@...> wrote:
I Agree  WA6VAB
Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10
*From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@...>
*Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
*To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
*Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3
Hi Lawrence,
Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is why...
1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.
I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If
so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the
antenna or feedline is at fault.
73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:

> Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I

> turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than

> 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked

> the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and

> after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what,

> still over 5:1 SWR.

>

> Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Lawrence   G4GZG

>

Wes Stewart
 

OK.  Well there is one thing you're correct about, there isn't enough information, which is why I asked for more before jumping to a conclusion about the solution.  But that's just me being silly.



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 4:45:00 PM MST, Dave Cole <dave@...> wrote:


Hi Wes,

Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a
unambiguous test point.

Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio, was it
hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the
end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc...  The exact
statement was:

"I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is the
Dummy Load.  Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
However, the comment:

"...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"

No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was
connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is correct, the
K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR.  So it is not the K3-- and hence-- yes, I
am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
> So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?
>
> Wes  N7WS
>
> On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield
> <wa6vab@...> wrote:
>
>
> I Agree  WA6VAB
>
> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
> Windows 10
>
> *From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@...>
> *Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
> *To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
> *Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3
>
> Hi Lawrence,
>
> Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is why...
>
> 1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
>
> 2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.
>
> I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If
>
> so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the
>
> antenna or feedline is at fault.
>
> 73, and thanks,
>
> Dave (NK7Z)
>
> https://www.nk7z.net
>
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>
> ARRL Technical Specialist
>
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:
>
>  > Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I
>
>  > turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than
>
>  > 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked
>
>  > the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and
>
>  > after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what,
>
>  > still over 5:1 SWR.
>
>  >
>
>  > Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
>
>  >
>
>  > Thanks in advance,
>
>  >
>
>  > Lawrence   G4GZG
>
>  >
>
>



Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

Yep, all of this testing using the K3, the VNA, and Dummy load would seem to point to a coax jumper being used for each test is likely at fault.   Could be a PL-259 of which the "new good looking" ones are exactly that "good looking".  I have found machine tolerance errors, poor machining, poor plating, not to mention poor installation of connectors.   And I have found that finger tight for a PL-259 is not good enough. I always snug with a pair of 4" Channel Lock pliers.

73

Bob, K4TAX


On 12/21/2019 4:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?

Wes  N7WS

On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield <wa6vab@...> wrote:


I Agree  WA6VAB 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Dave Cole
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

Hi Lawrence,

 

Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is why...

 

1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.

2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.

 

I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If

so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the

antenna or feedline is at fault.

 

73, and thanks,

Dave (NK7Z)

https://www.nk7z.net

ARRL Volunteer Examiner

ARRL Technical Specialist

ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

 

On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:

> Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I

> turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than

> 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked

> the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and

> after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess what,

> still over 5:1 SWR.

>

> Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Lawrence   G4GZG

>

 

 

 

Steve VE3RX
 

If he used the same cable to the dummy load, and still gets 5:1, then odds are 99.9% that he has a bad cable.
Change cables, test with ATU in and out, test with VNA with different cables to dummy load to determine where the high SWR comes from...

73
Steve VE3RX

Wes Stewart
 

You may well be correct but the OP did say, "I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that,"


On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 6:32:13 PM MST, Steve VE3RX <ve3cwj@...> wrote:


If he used the same cable to the dummy load, and still gets 5:1, then odds are 99.9% that he has a bad cable.
Change cables, test with ATU in and out, test with VNA with different cables to dummy load to determine where the high SWR comes from...

73
Steve VE3RX
_._,_._,_


Dave Cole
 

Hi again Wes,
But there is enough info... The OP was referring to his K3 as a possible faultpoint, and he triaged that out with the VNA test.

So there was plenty of information to remove the K3 from the list of possibles.

The only hole in that logic is if the OP somehow was able to use the VNA, through the K3, which while is probably possible, is remote as a method of testing, so there was enough data to answer his question. There however was not enough data to actually tell him what it was, only what it was not.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 4:08 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
OK.  Well there is one thing you're correct about, there isn't enough information, which is why I asked for more before jumping to a conclusion about the solution.  But that's just me being silly.
On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 4:45:00 PM MST, Dave Cole <dave@...> wrote:
Hi Wes,
Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a
unambiguous test point.
Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio, was it
hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the
end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc...  The exact
statement was:
"I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is the
Dummy Load.  Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
However, the comment:
"...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"
No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was
connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is correct, the
K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR.  So it is not the K3-- and hence-- yes, I
am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.
73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
> So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?
>
> Wes  N7WS
>
> On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield
> <wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>> wrote:
>
>
> I Agree  WA6VAB
>
> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
> Windows 10
>
> *From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>>
> *Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
> *To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>
> *Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3
>
> Hi Lawrence,
>
> Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is
why...
>
> 1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
>
> 2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.
>
> I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If
>
> so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the
>
> antenna or feedline is at fault.
>
> 73, and thanks,
>
> Dave (NK7Z)
>
> https://www.nk7z.net
>
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>
> ARRL Technical Specialist
>
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:
>
>  > Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I
>
>  > turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than
>
>  > 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked
>
>  > the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and
>
>  > after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess
what,
>
>  > still over 5:1 SWR.
>
>  >
>
>  > Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
>
>  >
>
>  > Thanks in advance,
>
>  >
>
>  > Lawrence   G4GZG
>
>  >
>
>

Ray Maxfield
 

Start with the Smallest Subsystem First.

VNA to Cable to Dummy  Load.   Now TEST !

Wa6vab 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Steve VE3RX
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 5:32 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

If he used the same cable to the dummy load, and still gets 5:1, then odds are 99.9% that he has a bad cable.
Change cables, test with ATU in and out, test with VNA with different cables to dummy load to determine where the high SWR comes from...

73
Steve VE3RX

 

Wes Stewart
 

If he actually has a VNA and not a VIA and IF the cable was common in all measurements, then this is the time to leave the dummy load out of it and characterize just the cable.  I would be very interested to know what it measured.

Wes  N7WS



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 9:29:48 PM MST, Ray Maxfield <wa6vab@...> wrote:


Start with the Smallest Subsystem First.

VNA to Cable to Dummy  Load.   Now TEST !

Wa6vab 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Steve VE3RX
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 5:32 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

If he used the same cable to the dummy load, and still gets 5:1, then odds are 99.9% that he has a bad cable.
Change cables, test with ATU in and out, test with VNA with different cables to dummy load to determine where the high SWR comes from...

73
Steve VE3RX

 

southdaleus
 

It sounds like a simple problem with a simple solution.  I’ve been following this, it’s become very intriguing. 

I hope we find the solution…

Dale k9vuj



On 22, Dec 2019, at 8:18, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io <n7ws@...> wrote:

If he actually has a VNA and not a VIA and IF the cable was common in all measurements, then this is the time to leave the dummy load out of it and characterize just the cable.  I would be very interested to know what it measured.

Wes  N7WS



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 9:29:48 PM MST, Ray Maxfield <wa6vab@...> wrote:


Start with the Smallest Subsystem First.

VNA to Cable to Dummy  Load.   Now TEST !

Wa6vab 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Steve VE3RX
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 5:32 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

 

If he used the same cable to the dummy load, and still gets 5:1, then odds are 99.9% that he has a bad cable.
Change cables, test with ATU in and out, test with VNA with different cables to dummy load to determine where the high SWR comes from...

73
Steve VE3RX


 

Wes Stewart
 

Hi Dave,

OK agreed, the K3 is innocent.  I guess the reaction of loyal Elecraft owners is to play defense until the K3 is exonerated, and then call it a day, but the original question was:

"Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?"

Since the OP says he changed the source, (K3 > VNA)  changed the cable and changed the load (antenna > DL) and still has the problem I'm going to suggest cockpit trouble.  He's been completely silent during this discussion so maybe I'm correct.

Wes



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 8:06:57 PM MST, Dave Cole <dave@...> wrote:


Hi again Wes,
But there is enough info...  The OP was referring to his K3 as a
possible faultpoint, and he triaged that out with the VNA test.

So there was plenty of information to remove the K3 from the list of
possibles.

The only hole in that logic is if the OP somehow was able to use the
VNA, through the K3, which while is probably possible, is remote as a
method of testing, so there was enough data to answer his question.
There however was not enough data to actually tell him what it was, only
what it was not.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 4:08 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
> OK.  Well there is one thing you're correct about, there isn't enough
> information, which is why I asked for more before jumping to a
> conclusion about the solution.  But that's just me being silly.
>
>
>
> On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 4:45:00 PM MST, Dave Cole
> <dave@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Wes,
>
> Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a
> unambiguous test point.
>
> Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio, was it
> hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the
> end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc...  The exact
> statement was:
>
> "I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is the
> Dummy Load.  Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
> However, the comment:
>
> "...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"
>
> No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was
> connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is correct, the
> K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR.  So it is not the K3-- and hence-- yes, I
> am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.
>
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
>  > So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?
>  >
>  > Wes  N7WS
>  >
>  > On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield
>  > <wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>> wrote:
>  >
>  >
>  > I Agree  WA6VAB
>  >
>  > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>  > Windows 10
>  >
>  > *From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>>
>  > *Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
>  > *To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
> <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>
>  > *Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3
>  >
>  > Hi Lawrence,
>  >
>  > Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is
> why...
>  >
>  > 1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
>  >
>  > 2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.
>  >
>  > I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or tuner...  If
>  >
>  > so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the
>  >
>  > antenna or feedline is at fault.
>  >
>  > 73, and thanks,
>  >
>  > Dave (NK7Z)
>  >
>  > https://www.nk7z.net
>  >
>  > ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>  >
>  > ARRL Technical Specialist
>  >
>  > ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>  >
>  > On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:
>  >
>  >  > Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However, when I
>  >
>  >  > turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR  greater than
>  >
>  >  > 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that, checked
>  >
>  >  > the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and
>  >
>  >  > after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess
> what,
>  >
>  >  > still over 5:1 SWR.
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Thanks in advance,
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Lawrence   G4GZG
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >
>
>
>
>



Dave Cole
 

Hi Wes,

I am not a card carrying Elecraft owner, but I am a happy Elecraft owner! I love the radio, I would not have another-- for now, but, I don't sign my emails with my K3 serial number either, as I have seen.

For me, today, the K3 is the best rig, but all rigs break, all rigs positions change in what is considered best, and all logic is final...

In the original question, the implication was the K3 was the issue, as stated, before the actual question was asked... So I answered in the vain of, was the K3 the issue. I would have answered that way for any rig, not just a K3. The logic of the process dictated that answer.

This is a simple logic issue, start at the antenna, and work back, rig type does not matter... The fact that we are all discussing it as much as we are, only points out how bored we all are because of no Sunspots!

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/22/19 6:35 AM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
Hi Dave,
OK agreed, the K3 is innocent.  I guess the reaction of loyal Elecraft owners is to play defense until the K3 is exonerated, and then call it a day, but the original question was:
"Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?"
Since the OP says he changed the source, (K3 > VNA)  changed the cable and changed the load (antenna > DL) and still has the problem I'm going to suggest cockpit trouble.  He's been completely silent during this discussion so maybe I'm correct.
Wes
On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 8:06:57 PM MST, Dave Cole <dave@...> wrote:
Hi again Wes,
But there is enough info...  The OP was referring to his K3 as a
possible faultpoint, and he triaged that out with the VNA test.
So there was plenty of information to remove the K3 from the list of
possibles.
The only hole in that logic is if the OP somehow was able to use the
VNA, through the K3, which while is probably possible, is remote as a
method of testing, so there was enough data to answer his question.
There however was not enough data to actually tell him what it was, only
what it was not.
73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
On 12/21/19 4:08 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
> OK.  Well there is one thing you're correct about, there isn't enough
> information, which is why I asked for more before jumping to a
> conclusion about the solution.  But that's just me being silly.
>
>
>
> On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 4:45:00 PM MST, Dave Cole
> <dave@... <mailto:dave@...>> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Wes,
>
> Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a
> unambiguous test point.
>
> Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio, was it
> hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the
> end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc...  The exact
> statement was:
>
> "I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is the
> Dummy Load.  Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
> However, the comment:
>
> "...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"
>
> No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was
> connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is correct, the
> K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR.  So it is not the K3-- and hence-- yes, I
> am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.
>
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
>  > So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?
>  >
>  > Wes  N7WS
>  >
>  > On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield
>  > <wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>
<mailto:wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>>> wrote:
>  >
>  >
>  > I Agree  WA6VAB
>  >
>  > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>  > Windows 10
>  >
>  > *From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>
<mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>>>
>  > *Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
>  > *To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>
> <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>>
>  > *Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3
>  >
>  > Hi Lawrence,
>  >
>  > Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue...  Here is
> why...
>  >
>  > 1.  The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.
>  >
>  > 2.  The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.
>  >
>  > I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or
tuner...  If
>  >
>  > so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the
>  >
>  > antenna or feedline is at fault.
>  >
>  > 73, and thanks,
>  >
>  > Dave (NK7Z)
>  >
>  > https://www.nk7z.net
>  >
>  > ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>  >
>  > ARRL Technical Specialist
>  >
>  > ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>  >
>  > On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:
>  >
>  >  > Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S.  However,
when I
>  >
>  >  > turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR
greater than
>  >
>  >  > 5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that,
checked
>  >
>  >  > the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1.  So, I got out my DMM and
>  >
>  >  > after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess
> what,
>  >
>  >  > still over 5:1 SWR.
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Thanks in advance,
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >  > Lawrence   G4GZG
>  >
>  >  >
>  >
>  >
>
>
>
>

KE1F Lou
 

Have anybody considered to use a VOM and check for DC resistance from the plug that is used to connect the load to the K3?

Lou KE1F

On 12/22/2019 10:38 AM, Dave Cole wrote:
Hi Wes,

I am not a card carrying Elecraft owner, but I am a happy Elecraft owner! I love the radio, I would not have another-- for now, but, I don't sign my emails with my K3 serial number either, as I have seen.

For me, today, the K3 is the best rig, but all rigs break, all rigs positions change in what is considered best, and all logic is final...

In the original question, the implication was the K3 was the issue, as stated, before the actual question was asked... So I answered in the vain of, was the K3 the issue. I would have answered that way for any rig, not just a K3. The logic of the process dictated that answer.

This is a simple logic issue, start at the antenna, and work back, rig type does not matter... The fact that we are all discussing it as much as we are, only points out how bored we all are because of no Sunspots!

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/22/19 6:35 AM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
Hi Dave,

OK agreed, the K3 is innocent. I guess the reaction of loyal Elecraft owners is to play defense until the K3 is exonerated, and then call it a day, but the original question was:

"Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?"

Since the OP says he changed the source, (K3 > VNA) changed the cable and changed the load (antenna > DL) and still has the problem I'm going to suggest cockpit trouble. He's been completely silent during this discussion so maybe I'm correct.

Wes



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 8:06:57 PM MST, Dave Cole <dave@...> wrote:


Hi again Wes,
But there is enough info... The OP was referring to his K3 as a
possible faultpoint, and he triaged that out with the VNA test.

So there was plenty of information to remove the K3 from the list of
possibles.

The only hole in that logic is if the OP somehow was able to use the
VNA, through the K3, which while is probably possible, is remote as a
method of testing, so there was enough data to answer his question.
There however was not enough data to actually tell him what it was, only
what it was not.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 4:08 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
OK. Well there is one thing you're correct about, there isn't enough
information, which is why I asked for more before jumping to a
conclusion about the solution. But that's just me being silly.



On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 4:45:00 PM MST, Dave Cole
<dave@... <mailto:dave@...>> wrote:


Hi Wes,

Yes, there was not enough info to use the Dummy Load comment as a
unambiguous test point.

Was the DL hooked up using a double male connector to the radio,
was it
hooked up using a jumper, was the jumper bad, was it hooked up at the
end of the coax at the at the antenna feed-point, etc... The exact
statement was:

"I connected it and guess what, still over 5:1 SWR.", where "it" is
the
Dummy Load. Tells me nothing about how or where the was hooked up...
However, the comment:

"...checked the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1"

No mention of the K3, and I specified that I was assuming the VNA was
connected directly to the antenna, thus if my assumption is
correct, the
K3 is not causing the 5:1 SWR. So it is not the K3-- and hence--
yes, I
am ignoring the dummy load comment completely.

73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 1:48 PM, Wes Stewart via Groups.Io wrote:
So you guys are totally ignoring the dummy load comments?

Wes N7WS

On Saturday, December 21, 2019, 12:00:58 PM MST, Ray Maxfield
<wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>
<mailto:wa6vab@... <mailto:wa6vab@...>>> wrote:


I Agree WA6VAB

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10

*From: *Dave Cole <mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>
<mailto:dave@... <mailto:dave@...>>>
*Sent: *Saturday, December 21, 2019 10:42 AM
*To: *Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
<mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io <mailto:Elecraft-K3@groups.io>>>
*Subject: *Re: [Elecraft-K3] SWR meter problem on K3

Hi Lawrence,

Assuming your data is correct your antenna has an issue... Here is
why...

1. The K3 shows 5:1, tests K3, antenna, and feedline.

2. The VNA shows 5:1, tests the feedline, and antenna.

I am assuming you had your VNA connected to the antenna or
tuner... If

so, then the K3 is out of line, and you still show 5:1, hence the

antenna or feedline is at fault.

73, and thanks,

Dave (NK7Z)

https://www.nk7z.net

ARRL Volunteer Examiner

ARRL Technical Specialist

ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/21/19 9:39 AM, Lawrence Stringer via Groups.Io wrote:

Recently I reverted to usin g my K3 over my TS890S. However,
when I

turned on the K3 and keyed up, the SWR meter showed SWR
greater than

5:1. I suspected the cabling so checked and changed all that,
checked

the antenna on my VNA and still over 5:1. So, I got out my DMM
and

after measuring my dummy load as 50 ohms, I connected it and guess
what,

still over 5:1 SWR.
Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the solution ?
Thanks in advance,
Lawrence G4GZG