setting up MMTTY to K3s via single USB cable Win10


Jim AC0E
 

Help needed.
I am trying to get  a new install of MMTTY ver 1.68A installed on a Win10 pc to operate on a K3s for a friend. The RX side is workin appears to be working as I was decoding Stations during the Makrothen RTTY test yesterday.
I have been using FSK for many years without a problem...
New trick; Old dog.....
I have the K3s audio selected for Data-A, AFSK, 45.45 bps, but need advise about the rest of the items. I want to get MMTTY operating correctly as a standalone before adding N1MMLogger+ to the mix.
I have been cruising through the manual but have not yet gotten to the Ah-Haw page/moment
Thanks in advance for any help.
73,
Jim AC0E
ham@...
620-272-7620 cell/text


Jim Brown
 

On 10/10/2021 12:36 PM, Jim AC0E wrote:
I have the K3s audio selected for Data-A, AFSK, 45.45 bps, but need advise about the rest of the items.
I run all computer-assisted operation of my K3 (original, not -S) feeding the line input with VOX for PTT. That includes playback of SSB messages, RTTY, and WSJT modes. I use a Tascam US100 USB-connected audio interface. This means that I need only interface for rig control.

The stuff that must be adjusted are baud rate RS-232 (computer and radio must match, I think I use 38,400), RTTY baud rate and tone frequencies, audio level and VOX gain.

I prefer to use low audio tones (less fatiguing, makes it easier to tune in stations by ear), and one major gotcha in MMTTY is that there are two .ini files that include those tone frequencies. All of them have high tones as default, so they must be edited in a simple text editor (like Notepad in Windows). They are Mmtty.ini and USERPARA.ini In Notepad, search for DefMarkFreq=2.125000e+03 and replace 2.125000e+3 with 9.15000e+2 and save them with their original filenames and extension.

The K3S has a built-in USB audio interface, and I don't know anything about setup using it. RTFM is a great starting place. I suspect that it is capable of PTT and rig control as well as audio. It must be selected in Windows as input and output for MMTTY. It's possible for RTTY and other digital modes to be decoded via the built-in mic picking up sound from the radio's speaker, which may be selected by default, so it's important to make sure you're set to the K3S USB.

BTW -- 2Tone is an awfully nice RTTY interface, is MUCH simpler than MMTTY, is an excellent decoder, and accepts stereo inputs and outputs. Many serious RTTY contesters run both programs, with multiple decode screens, because it's quite common for either of them to decode signals that the other misses. Among other things, there's no need to mess with editing .ini files.

I'm using 2Tone as my Primary RTTY software (that is, I transmit through it, using MMTTY only for receive in a second window, because I do SO2R, and MMTTY is mono output only. This allows me to do SO2R with both radios on the same computer. It's a 5-year old but pretty powerful Thinkpad (i7 and 16GB) with an external monitor to provide more screen real estate.

Here's the 2Tone download pare. I would choose the latest version, 21.03a

https://www.rttycontesting.com/downloads/2tone/

https://www.contestuniversity.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/13.-W0YK-Pursuing-RTTY-Contesting-to-the-Limit-2018.pdf

https://rsgb.org/main/about-us/committees/hf-contest-committee/getting-starting-in-contesting/3-choosing-your-first-contest/3-1-data-contesting-techniques/

73, Jim K9YC


Jim AC0E
 

Jim,
Thanks for the reply... I have downloaded the K3s manual and have done some reading....
Like I said in my original posting I have been using FSK since the stone age and never really paid attention to the
USB capabilities when they came on the scene since I had what I needed and it worked very well.
In the next few days I will get the manual printed and sit down again.
Since this is a new (used) radio my friend got I will download the K3 utility (and K3_EZ) 1st and see just what /how the rig is setup.
Was hoping I would stumble across the "magic bullet" and things would fall into place.....Guess that's why I don't buy lottery tickets....
73,
Jim AC0E


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

Jim,

Bottom line ... you can not run RTTY on the K3S with *only* a single USB
cable *unless* you do AFSK. There is no FSK input to the rig via USB
(CW and PTT only).

You will need a second USB to serial adapter or other interface for the
FSK signal.


73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 2021-10-10 8:11 PM, Jim AC0E wrote:
Jim,
Thanks for the reply... I have downloaded the K3s manual and have done some reading....
Like I said in my original posting I have been using FSK since the stone age and never really paid attention to the
USB capabilities when they came on the scene since I had what I needed and it worked very well.
In the next few days I will get the manual printed and sit down again.
Since this is a new (used) radio my friend got I will download the K3 utility (and K3_EZ) 1st and see just what /how the rig is setup.
Was hoping I would stumble across the "magic bullet" and things would fall into place.....Guess that's why I don't buy lottery tickets....
73,
Jim AC0E


Max NG7M
 

Hi Jim, in 2018 I made a very detailed YouTube video that covers everything you are looking for. (as in almost 2 hours of detail)  It's been a pretty popular video any time there is an RTTY contest that rolls around.  It's focused on the FSK setup of a K3/K3S.  Plus, (and I'm bias of course) it will give folks a much better understanding of how the pieces fit together... including using the lower tones etc... For the video, make sure and use the J and L keys to jump backwards and forwards 10 seconds at a time and the K key will pause.  The space bar pauses and the left and right arrow keys will jump back and forth 5 seconds.  Plus you can speed up or slow down the video as usual in the YouTube interface.  Based on all the email I have received over the years it has helped a number of hams.  Direct link to the video: https://youtu.be/EToCJ5GeZSE

You will need a different USB to serial cable for the K3/K3S to key the FSK line input on the K3/S pin 1 of the ACC port as others have already mentioned.  Incidentally, and this won't help, but on the K4, you can key FSK on either of the two USB FTDI serial ports or external serial port on the K4.

I also have videos that DEMONSTRATE and debunk the myth of FSK timing from a USB to serial port (jitter used to be a favorite term folks threw around ad-nauseum)... any computer that's been around for awhile / multi core etc that supports the HPET option as implemented by windows is very, vary unlikely to have any timing issues... videos on my YouTube channel about this topic, make your own conclusions.  I have yet to have anyone challenge my results. 

I also have videos related to TinyFSK and MORTTY.  Good stuff to check out if you like the idea of FSK at the radio where you won't need to worry about ALC levels like AFSK.  And yeah, before the AFSK lovers get their hair all in a dander... I know all the pros and cons of both FSK and AFSK.  A good AFSK / ALC driven signal is great too.  So let's not start the holy war again from years ago.  Different strokes for different folks.  Just worry about your on air signal and how clean it is above all else.  We already know the K3/K3S has probably the cleanest FSK signal there is. (newer firmware of course)  And by the way if you worked NG7M this weekend in the Makrothen RTTY contest, that was FSK from TinyFSK/MORTTY driving the ACC pin one line on a K4.  For what it's worth.  Max NG7M


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

I would be glad to send you some screenshots of the various MMTTY set-up pages.    Respond to me via private e-mail
rmcgraw @  benlomand  .  net

73
Bob, K4TAX


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

I just sent Jim some screenshots of my configuration.  No need for extensive verbalization or videos.   I use only ONE USB cable between my computer and radio.  Thus I do use AFSK and use the Elecraft recommendation for setting audio levels.   

Unless "others" have an Elecraft radio, their information on setting the TX audio level is most likely very incorrect.    With an Elecraft radio, one should have 4 bars of audio showing on the ALC scale.  The 5th bar should be flickering.  At this point, one HAS NOT reached the threshold of ALC.    ALC action starts AFTER the 5th bar.  

73
Bob, K4TAX


Jim AC0E
 

Thanks Max,.
 That's precisely what I need...
all the excruciating details... 
As my old buddy Jimmie Platt used to say  "tell me 3 times; and hit me in the head with a brick and I've got it". 
73,
Jim AC0E 


Jim AC0E
 

FYI.... Been using FSK since the early 80s..(b4 that USASA).. ..60ma loop HAL ST-6000 Homebrew TU,, Model 28ASR, Model 19 Desk.... This "new fangled stuff...??

Jim AC0E


Mel Marcus
 

Bob

I sure would love to see those screenshots  for the k3 (i have the kio3b interface) and mmtty. I am new at this stuff and would really appreciate the assistance.

Mel Marcus
NE9A
melm@...


From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> on behalf of Bob McGraw - K4TAX via groups.io <rmcgraw@...>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2021 9:30 AM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] setting up MMTTY to K3s via single USB cable Win10
 
I just sent Jim some screenshots of my configuration.  No need for extensive verbalization or videos.   I use only ONE USB cable between my computer and radio.  Thus I do use AFSK and use the Elecraft recommendation for setting audio levels.   

Unless "others" have an Elecraft radio, their information on setting the TX audio level is most likely very incorrect.    With an Elecraft radio, one should have 4 bars of audio showing on the ALC scale.  The 5th bar should be flickering.  At this point, one HAS NOT reached the threshold of ALC.    ALC action starts AFTER the 5th bar.  

73
Bob, K4TAX


Jim Brown
 

On 10/12/2021 6:15 PM, Jim AC0E wrote:
FYI.... Been using FSK since the early 80s..(b4 that USASA).. ..60ma loop HAL ST-6000 Homebrew TU,, Model 28ASR, Model 19 Desk.... This "new fangled stuff...??
My first encounter with RTTY was back in Chicago in the '70s, with a HAL and a MONSTER floor-standing TTY machine that had obviously come out of a broadcast or print newsroom. It took 3 men and a boy to move it, both into my basement shack and from there to the alley when I moved out. And it sat in the alley for a week.

73, Jim K9YC


Max NG7M
 

Jim, in March of 2020 (hard to forget that month!) there was a thread by Joe N9OK who needed some help on the AFSK setup on a K3 (KIO3B) or K3S.  And there was all this conjecture and consternation in the thread claiming that something was broken in the K3S AFSK implementation (or something like that, I can't remember).  Anyway,  it was pretty much a train wreck of a thread.  So I made a custom video for Joe to show the setup for AFSK RTTY with a K3S, MMTTY and N1MM.  Guess what?  Joe called me on the phone to thank me for the video... it resolved his issue (imagine that!) and that was the end of the train wreck thread.  You can, probably still find the thread... I can't remember if it was on groups.io or the classic Elecraft K3 reflector.  All of the screen shots that nobody (has posted yet to of MMTTY) are already in the video.  Use the J and L keys to jump band and forth 10 seconds in the video and the K or space bar to pause.  The left/right arrow keys jump back and forth 5 seconds.

So if someone's attention span is less than 15 minutes (I doubt your attention span is less than 15 minutes!), they might want to skip this video.  It's not published on my YouTube channel by the way, you need the link:

K3 AFSK A setup with KIO3B USB Interface PTT via VOX with MMTTY and N1MM Logger+ Setup - YouTube

If your attention span is more than 15 minutes, like Joe's was... watch the video and it will show you all the screen shots in MMTTY and N1MM etc... and even demos a live contact after the setup.  A pictures speaks a 1000 words as they say, but sometimes a video that you can pause, reverse and fast forward in high resolution speaks 100,000 words... that's my conjecture. ;)  Maybe someone can pause my video and get the screen shots that Jim is looking for... wink, wink... :)

Max NG7M


Jim AC0E
 

Success  with Phase I .... !!
MMTTY Standalone working FB TX/RX to with my FSK setup on the other side of the room via Dummy Loads.
Thanks to Bob, K4TAX,  Max, NG7M,  Don, W3FPR, (reread  his audio setup guide on w3fpr.com) and
Bob, N2BC,SK, (K3_EZ).... I finally got the MMTTY standalone version v1.70 up and running on the  new (used) PC and new(used) K3s... with the "easier (fewer cables)" USB.....
The new(used) K3s, with the help of K3_EZ and the K3 utility program ID'd a couple of items that needed attention.
Bob's Screenshots of the MMTTY setup, which I had 98% correct, "close" only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.
And to Max for the Youtube videos which I will delve into again soon....
I am reluctant to call myself an "old guy" in this group being only "70" and retired but a year now.
I am, however,now an official member of the "Ralph Kramdon Club" as I drive a bus 3 days a week for our local "City-link ~ Minibus" program. I have to leave for work now and will be back later to request, or pass out sage advice, on matters of interest.
73,
Jim AC0E


Jim AC0E
 

Jim,
The test of true friendship is when they actually come and help move your Model 28ASR out of your basement...When the Marines and the Navy are friends it is never a bad day. Unless you run out of beer.....
73,
Jim AC0E


john ni0k
 

Had one back in the day.... HEAVY!

Mine was geared at 100 WPM and had a UT-4 with my ST-6. Da bomb for that day.


--
73,
-de John NI0K in rural Debs, MN USA

Jim AC0E via groups.io wrote on 10/14/2021 8:44 AM:

Jim,
The test of true friendship is when they actually come and help move your Model 28ASR out of your basement...When the Marines and the Navy are friends it is never a bad day. Unless you run out of beer.....
73,
Jim AC0E