Topics

RS232 Splitter


Bob Chortek
 

Elecraft People!

Can I use an RS232 splitter on the K3 RA232 Jack and simultaneously run both the P3 AND CAT control with WSJT-X?

Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 


Ken K6MR
 

Why do that?  Plug the computer into the PC jack on the P3 and the K3 into the XCVR into the XCVR jack on the P3.  Easy peasy.

 

Ken K6MR

 

From: Bob Chortek
Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2020 12:51
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] RS232 Splitter

 

Elecraft People!

Can I use an RS232 splitter on the K3 RA232 Jack and simultaneously run both the P3 AND CAT control with WSJT-X?

Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 

 


Bob Chortek
 

Thanks Ken!

I realized that shortly after I posted the message!

73,

Bob AA6VB 


Rick NK7I
 

To what point?

The PC->P3->K3 serial port by itself works, both ways.

The PC (which runs the WSJT-X program) can either use the serial port stand alone or via other software (HRD, N1MM+ etc) for CAT.

The P3 is (mostly) a pass through for the serial data; it does the majority of it's work via the ACC and K3 IF out cables, not serial.

Which means there is no need for a splitter for WSJT-X but that the software will either work alone or play nicely with other software while the display data comes from ACC/IF cables; two entirely different arenas.

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 11:14 AM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Elecraft People!

Can I use an RS232 splitter on the K3 RA232 Jack and simultaneously run both the P3 AND CAT control with WSJT-X?

Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 


Ken K6MR
 

One small correction. The ACC port does not connect to the P3.

Ken K6MR


From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> on behalf of Rick NK7I <Rick.NK7I@...>
Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2020 2:43:06 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] RS232 Splitter
 

To what point?

The PC->P3->K3 serial port by itself works, both ways.

The PC (which runs the WSJT-X program) can either use the serial port stand alone or via other software (HRD, N1MM+ etc) for CAT.

The P3 is (mostly) a pass through for the serial data; it does the majority of it's work via the ACC and K3 IF out cables, not serial.

Which means there is no need for a splitter for WSJT-X but that the software will either work alone or play nicely with other software while the display data comes from ACC/IF cables; two entirely different arenas.

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 11:14 AM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Elecraft People!

Can I use an RS232 splitter on the K3 RA232 Jack and simultaneously run both the P3 AND CAT control with WSJT-X?

Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 


Rick NK7I
 

Oops.  You’re right; I got in a rush.   The P3 gets freq data and filter config on the RS232 cable to display both. 

Rick NK7I

Email spiel Czech corruptions happen

On Nov 29, 2020, at 3:34 PM, Ken K6MR <k6mr@...> wrote:


One small correction. The ACC port does not connect to the P3.

Ken K6MR


From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> on behalf of Rick NK7I <Rick.NK7I@...>
Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2020 2:43:06 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] RS232 Splitter
 

To what point?

The PC->P3->K3 serial port by itself works, both ways.

The PC (which runs the WSJT-X program) can either use the serial port stand alone or via other software (HRD, N1MM+ etc) for CAT.

The P3 is (mostly) a pass through for the serial data; it does the majority of it's work via the ACC and K3 IF out cables, not serial.

Which means there is no need for a splitter for WSJT-X but that the software will either work alone or play nicely with other software while the display data comes from ACC/IF cables; two entirely different arenas.

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 11:14 AM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Elecraft People!

Can I use an RS232 splitter on the K3 RA232 Jack and simultaneously run both the P3 AND CAT control with WSJT-X?

Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 


Bob Chortek
 

Thanks Rick,

I’ve ordered a USB to RS232 cable and plan to run it from my P3 to my PC.

BTW - Do you know if I can then run WSJTX with the K3 over the USB cable (which is what I’m doing with my 7851) or will I STILL need the Line In/Out cables ( which I cannot get to work after hours of fiddling).  I have enabled the Line In in the Menu and set the rig in Data A, etc.  

Thanks for the help!

73,

Bob/AA6VB 


Rick NK7I
 

Hi Bob,

If you have the new i/o and audio card in a K3, or have the K3S, then yes, you can do audio and CAT in one USB cable.  In that case, someone else will have to walk you through the how-to, I don't have the updated card.  There are details that must be paid attention to.

The serial cable (either order from Elecraft or use FTDI chips and nothing else!!!) will go to your P3, with the P3 then connecting (with another cable, get that from Elecraft also if you need one) to the K3.  Then it will play properly.  For most software (other than the P3 utility app), only the K3 is 'seen' (for CAT etc).

Now, do yourself a HUGE favor; label EACH end of EVERY cable (in the shack) according to where it connects (P3 RS-232 PC end; K3 to P3 RS-232 etc) so when you shuffle things around later (and you WILL), you save a few more moments of sanity in the process. 

(Now, was this the 160M coax or the 2M or is it the 20M???  Where the frack does THIS belong?  Is this audio, paddles or is this the amp cutoff from the SteppIR?)  Trust me, it matters; do it right the first time. 

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 4:09 PM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Thanks Rick,

I’ve ordered a USB to RS232 cable and plan to run it from my P3 to my PC.

BTW - Do you know if I can then run WSJTX with the K3 over the USB cable (which is what I’m doing with my 7851) or will I STILL need the Line In/Out cables ( which I cannot get to work after hours of fiddling).  I have enabled the Line In in the Menu and set the rig in Data A, etc.  

Thanks for the help!

73,

Bob/AA6VB 


Bob Chortek
 

Hi Rick,

Funny you should suggest it, but I spent several hours last week on “cable management” for the very reason you suggested and also reorganized the shack to improve the ergonomics.

Ive also been upgrading the shack.  


About the last thing on my list was to get the K3 running on WSJTX (been using the Icom on FT8 band F4 for a while now.  Has ZERO trouble getting the Icom to work on WSJTX but the Elecraft has been a huge frustration.  Don’t understand why the Icom was so easy and the K3 so difficult.

Anyway, I’ve gotten the thing to RX finally, but I’m dead in the water on TX.  Hoping the USB/RS232 cable with solve the TX problem.  If not I’ll either give up or hire a local ham to finish the set up in about 30 seconds because he will know “what’s missing”.  I could spend a lifetime and not figure it out. 

Honestly, I have a Love/Hate relationship with the K3.

Thanks for the advice.

73 es DX,

Bob/ AA6VB 


Rick NK7I
 

Bob,

Cable management is a fallicy; it'll always be messy looking but one can try.  Most hams don't have the space (or will power or interest or ability) to keep everything neat and tidy.  I'm still building the shack, have the space (anything behind the desk) and there are so many (audio, rotor, antenna controller, coax, power, straight key, paddles... ACK!) cables; it's near impossible to keep tidy.  I'm content just not seeing it.

How are you getting the K3 to transmit without RS-232 to use CAT?

How are you connecting the audio?  Please don't use the computer sound system; I hear voice audio often when I listen to a JT mode, because someone is doing it wrong (or you hear the beeps, belches or whatever from the OS).  [It's NOT in the US phone band, nudge nudge.]

I would suggest you just chillax until the cable arrives (if you didn't get it from Elecraft, make SURE SURE SURE that you ONLY use FTDI chipped cables).  With the correct cable in hand, you won't have to do this twice.  Please report back when you have that new cable.

Because there are more than two controls (on each end) that need to be set correctly; it's a process.  (LIN IN, LIN OUT and a couple more in Windows that are not intuitive or simple to find.)  Ultimately, it won't be a lot different than the Icom; but there ARE some differences that matter.

If someone hasn't made a how-to sheet for using WSJT-X on the K3(S) with USB; it won't take long to whip one up for the group to comment on and then store in the files section once it's agreed as correct.

One tip, set the WSJT-X 'power' control to MAX and NEVER touch it again.  Adjusting output power by lowering audio is a poor method on a modern radio and WILL cause problems on an Elecraft radio.  If you want to lower your output power; use the radio controls for that, that's WHY it's there!

73,
Rick NK7I


73,
Rick NK7I



On 11/29/2020 9:04 PM, Bob Chortek wrote:

Hi Rick,

Funny you should suggest it, but I spent several hours last week on “cable management” for the very reason you suggested and also reorganized the shack to improve the ergonomics.

Ive also been upgrading the shack.  


About the last thing on my list was to get the K3 running on WSJTX (been using the Icom on FT8 band F4 for a while now.  Has ZERO trouble getting the Icom to work on WSJTX but the Elecraft has been a huge frustration.  Don’t understand why the Icom was so easy and the K3 so difficult.

Anyway, I’ve gotten the thing to RX finally, but I’m dead in the water on TX.  Hoping the USB/RS232 cable with solve the TX problem.  If not I’ll either give up or hire a local ham to finish the set up in about 30 seconds because he will know “what’s missing”.  I could spend a lifetime and not figure it out. 

Honestly, I have a Love/Hate relationship with the K3.

Thanks for the advice.

73 es DX,

Bob/ AA6VB 


Bob Chortek
 

Hi Rick,

I will do a write up IF I ever get it working. 


How do I get the rig to transmit?  I can’t.   That’s the problem I’m trying to solve.  I’m not using CAT since I don’t yet have the correct cable (my computer only has USB plugs and no RS232 ports).

Someone posted that they successfully used two stereo line in line out cables between the K3 and the computer and used VOX to key the transmitter.  I assume he was using the WSJTX software and clicked on a CQ message (for example) and the software created the audio tones which then went to the K3 and triggered the VOX which then put the rig into transmit.

Anyway, I used two stereo cables (TRS) one from K3 line out to the PC Line in (Mic) and the other from the K3 Line In to the PC Line Out (Headphones).

I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss.  No problems there.  It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.

BTW - I did order the correct cable.  It’s made by SABRENT and has the correct chipset.

Always use the power control to set the output power, whether it’s driving an amp or WSJTX.

I am using the sound card in the computer.  I disable other computer sounds for the very reason you mentioned.

Thanks for you help.  I’ve spent so many hours on this with so little progress I getting very frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.

73,

Bob/AA6VB 



Rick NK7I
 

Have you played with the VOX settings then?  Gain, level, antivox... and turned VOX on?  ;-)

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 9:55 PM, Bob Chortek wrote:

Hi Rick,

I will do a write up IF I ever get it working. 


How do I get the rig to transmit?  I can’t.   That’s the problem I’m trying to solve.  I’m not using CAT since I don’t yet have the correct cable (my computer only has USB plugs and no RS232 ports).

Someone posted that they successfully used two stereo line in line out cables between the K3 and the computer and used VOX to key the transmitter.  I assume he was using the WSJTX software and clicked on a CQ message (for example) and the software created the audio tones which then went to the K3 and triggered the VOX which then put the rig into transmit.

Anyway, I used two stereo cables (TRS) one from K3 line out to the PC Line in (Mic) and the other from the K3 Line In to the PC Line Out (Headphones).

I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss.  No problems there.  It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.

BTW - I did order the correct cable.  It’s made by SABRENT and has the correct chipset.

Always use the power control to set the output power, whether it’s driving an amp or WSJTX.

I am using the sound card in the computer.  I disable other computer sounds for the very reason you mentioned.

Thanks for you help.  I’ve spent so many hours on this with so little progress I getting very frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.

73,

Bob/AA6VB 



Henk PA0C
 

Hi Bob,

You can decode, OK.
Did you check the PC output e.g. with headphone or small speaker.
Just to make sure audio is actually generated to the connector
73 Henk

Henk


From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> on behalf of Bob Chortek <RLC@...>
Sent: Monday, November 30, 2020 6:55:23 AM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] RS232 Splitter
 

Hi Rick,

I will do a write up IF I ever get it working. 


How do I get the rig to transmit?  I can’t.   That’s the problem I’m trying to solve.  I’m not using CAT since I don’t yet have the correct cable (my computer only has USB plugs and no RS232 ports).

Someone posted that they successfully used two stereo line in line out cables between the K3 and the computer and used VOX to key the transmitter.  I assume he was using the WSJTX software and clicked on a CQ message (for example) and the software created the audio tones which then went to the K3 and triggered the VOX which then put the rig into transmit.

Anyway, I used two stereo cables (TRS) one from K3 line out to the PC Line in (Mic) and the other from the K3 Line In to the PC Line Out (Headphones).

I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss.  No problems there.  It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.

BTW - I did order the correct cable.  It’s made by SABRENT and has the correct chipset.

Always use the power control to set the output power, whether it’s driving an amp or WSJTX.

I am using the sound card in the computer.  I disable other computer sounds for the very reason you mentioned.

Thanks for you help.  I’ve spent so many hours on this with so little progress I getting very frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.

73,

Bob/AA6VB 



Joe Subich, W4TV
 

Bob,

I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss. No problems
there. It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.
Start from the beginning and take it one step at a time.

1) Select DATA mode on the K3
2) Set Sub mode to AFSK_A
3) Tap MENU, turn VFO B to MIC SEL and select Line IN with VFO A
4) turn on the K3 VOX
5) In WSJTX set the PWR slider to 100%
6) In WSJTX select File -> Settings -> Audio and set
Output to the Speaker endpoint of the sound card to
which you have connected the the K3 Line In
(Please use a second sound card - not the sound card
used for Windows sounds, streaming audio, etc.)
7) In Windows, right click on the speaker Icon and select
Open Volume Mixer. Under Device, select Speakers for
the sound card to which you have connected the K3 Line IN
and set the level to 75-80%
8) In WSJTX set the TX Offset around 1600 Hz
9) click "Tune" - the K3 should switch to TX. If not tap
Menu, Use VFO B to select VOX GN and adjust VFO A until
the K3 switches to TX.
10) Tap the Speed/Mic encoder to select Mic
11) Rotate the Speed/Mic encoder to adjust ALC for 4 bars
the fifth can flash occasionally.
12) Adjust power output to the desired level with the PWR
encoder.

Unless you are using CAT for frequency control, there is no
need to connect to the USB/RS232 ports to use WSJTX with the K3.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2020-11-30 12:55 AM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Hi Rick,
I will do a write up IF I ever get it working.
How do I get the rig to transmit?  I can’t.   That’s the problem I’m trying to solve.  I’m not using CAT since I don’t yet have the correct cable (my computer only has USB plugs and no RS232 ports).
Someone posted that they successfully used two stereo line in line out cables between the K3 and the computer and used VOX to key the transmitter.  I assume he was using the WSJTX software and clicked on a CQ message (for example) and the software created the audio tones which then went to the K3 and triggered the VOX which then put the rig into transmit.
Anyway, I used two stereo cables (TRS) one from K3 line out to the PC Line in (Mic) and the other from the K3 Line In to the PC Line Out (Headphones).
I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss.  No problems there.  It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.
BTW - I did order the correct cable.  It’s made by SABRENT and has the correct chipset.
Always use the power control to set the output power, whether it’s driving an amp or WSJTX.
I am using the sound card in the computer.  I disable other computer sounds for the very reason you mentioned.
Thanks for you help.  I’ve spent so many hours on this with so little progress I getting very frustrated.
Thanks for all the advice.
73,
Bob/AA6VB


Wes
 

That was my question.  VOX is developed after the mic/level control, so the VOX gain may (probably) needs to be adjusted per mode.  I begged for VOX gain per mode to be included in firmware but it never happened.


So, in WSJT does using Test turn on the TX light?  Note:  I ran my old K3 on RTTY for years with just two audio cables into a laptop sound card using VOX.  No fuss no muss.  Went from zero to 200+ DXCC countries on RTTY using this setup.

Wes  N7WS


On 11/30/2020 1:23 AM, Rick NK7I wrote:
X-Warn-ReplyTo-From-Different: true X-SCA-Stop: [cust-FFB8544E0C1C4C2486794DA934D21B76,134,39,0]

Have you played with the VOX settings then?  Gain, level, antivox... and turned VOX on?  ;-)

73,
Rick NK7I


On 11/29/2020 9:55 PM, Bob Chortek wrote:

Hi Rick,

I will do a write up IF I ever get it working. 


How do I get the rig to transmit?  I can’t.   That’s the problem I’m trying to solve.  I’m not using CAT since I don’t yet have the correct cable (my computer only has USB plugs and no RS232 ports).

Someone posted that they successfully used two stereo line in line out cables between the K3 and the computer and used VOX to key the transmitter.  I assume he was using the WSJTX software and clicked on a CQ message (for example) and the software created the audio tones which then went to the K3 and triggered the VOX which then put the rig into transmit.

Anyway, I used two stereo cables (TRS) one from K3 line out to the PC Line in (Mic) and the other from the K3 Line In to the PC Line Out (Headphones).

I know lines are correct because it decodes like a boss.  No problems there.  It just won’t transmit - even in TEST MODE.

BTW - I did order the correct cable.  It’s made by SABRENT and has the correct chipset.

Always use the power control to set the output power, whether it’s driving an amp or WSJTX.

I am using the sound card in the computer.  I disable other computer sounds for the very reason you mentioned.

Thanks for you help.  I’ve spent so many hours on this with so little progress I getting very frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.

73,

Bob/AA6VB 




Bob Chortek
 

Hi Joe,

Thanks for your reply. Much appreciated.

I’m lost.  What does this mean:


“ 6) In WSJTX select File -> Settings -> Audio and set
Output to the Speaker endpoint of the sound card to
which you have connected the the K3 Line In”

I don’t know how to interpret that statement. I read the words but I don’t understand them.  Shows how little I know about computers.


(Please use a second sound card - not the sound card

used for Windows sounds, streaming audio, etc.)

DOES MY COMPUTER HAVE MORE THAN ONE SOUND CARD? Are you suggesting I should buy an outboard sound card. I can do that but I’d still like to get my K3 running on the sound card in my computer.

“7) In Windows, right click on the speaker Icon and select
Open Volume Mixer. Under Device, select Speakers for
the sound card to which you have connected the K3 Line IN
and set the level to 75-80%”

Again, do I have more than one sound card in my computer?  How would I tell?

No matter what I do, the K3 will not go into TX.

VOX set to 100, Antivox to 0, all other suggestions followed to the best of my ability but it seems no audio is getting from the computer to the K3 to put it into TX.


Thanks for your help.  Much appreciated!

Bob AA6VB 


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

“ 6) In WSJTX select File -> Settings -> Audio and set
Output to the Speaker endpoint of the sound card to
which you have connected the the K3 Line In”

I don’t know how to interpret that statement. I read the words but I
don’t understand them. Shows how little I know about computers.
I'm flabbergasted ... that statement is about as straight forward as
it can be. Perhaps the pictures on page 2 of this document will
help: <http://www.microham.com/Downloads/U3_WSJT-X_Setup.pdf>;

DOES MY COMPUTER HAVE MORE THAN ONE SOUND CARD?
Probably not.

Are you suggesting I should buy an outboard sound card.
*ABSOLUTELY* Without it you will be just another of those *illegally*
(if you are licensed in the Unites States) transmitting Windows
"noises", streaming audio and other garbage on the digital windows -
particularly if you are using VOX to control your transceiver.

Using a single (Windows Default) sound card with VOX leaves your
transmitter out of your control.

I wish K1JT et al would program WSJTX so it would refuse to generate
audio on the sound card designated as either the "Default" Sound Card or
"Default Communications Device". That would go a long way to cleaning
up the bands.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2020-11-30 11:28 AM, Bob Chortek wrote:
Hi Joe,
Thanks for your reply. Much appreciated.
I’m lost.  What does this mean:
“ 6) In WSJTX select File -> Settings -> Audio and set
Output to the Speaker endpoint of the sound card to
which you have connected the the K3 Line In”
I don’t know how to interpret that statement. I read the words but I don’t understand them.  Shows how little I know about computers.
(Please use a second sound card - not the sound card
used for Windows sounds, streaming audio, etc.)
DOES MY COMPUTER HAVE MORE THAN ONE SOUND CARD? Are you suggesting I should buy an outboard sound card. I can do that but I’d still like to get my K3 running on the sound card in my computer.
“7) In Windows, right click on the speaker Icon and select
Open Volume Mixer. Under Device, select Speakers for
the sound card to which you have connected the K3 Line IN
and set the level to 75-80%”
Again, do I have more than one sound card in my computer?  How would I tell?
No matter what I do, the K3 will not go into TX.
VOX set to 100, Antivox to 0, all other suggestions followed to the best of my ability but it seems no audio is getting from the computer to the K3 to put it into TX.
Thanks for your help.  Much appreciated!
Bob AA6VB


Chuck Miller
 

I use the sound card on the computers motherboard for the radio, and use a USB cound card for operating systems sounds. You do have to keep an eye on it though as Windows likes to change things around during updates.
73, Chuck
N0NC