Topics

NO RTTY Keying


Chuck
 

GE,

Old age or crumbling mind syndrome is has caught up with me again.

A month or so ago I move equipment around on my desk and am have no luck getting FSK RTTY TX-keying.

I have a MicroKeyer (original) a K3s, N1MM+, and of course MMTTY. 

Working:  PTT, RX, TX carrier output.

Not working:  no keying heard on the K3s, however see keying on the MMTTY window in the RTTY Engine.

I have a KPA1500 to add to the mix now once I get the keying. 

Any help appreciated.

=============
Tks.  73, Chuck N7BV


Mike Flowers
 

Hi Chuck,

 

FSK D is keyed through the ACC socket.  Is it possible that the plug into the ACC socket is not fully seated?

 

 

- 73 and good DX de Mike, K6MKF, NCDXC Secretary

 

From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> On Behalf Of Chuck
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2021 22:48
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] NO RTTY Keying

 

GE,

Old age or crumbling mind syndrome is has caught up with me again.

A month or so ago I move equipment around on my desk and am have no luck getting FSK RTTY TX-keying.

I have a MicroKeyer (original) a K3s, N1MM+, and of course MMTTY. 

Working:  PTT, RX, TX carrier output.

Not working:  no keying heard on the K3s, however see keying on the MMTTY window in the RTTY Engine.

I have a KPA1500 to add to the mix now once I get the keying. 

Any help appreciated.

=============
Tks.  73, Chuck N7BV


Chuck
 

UGH,  you're right - with the new KPA1500 the K3s ACC is connected to the KPA1500 now.  Guess I will have to hunt down a Y-cable to allow both the computer and the KPA to connect to the ACC.  Think I have an old one for the SteppIR if it is correct pin out.  
=============
73, Chuck N7BV


Jim Brown
 

On 2/12/2021 11:30 AM, Chuck wrote:
UGH,  you're right - with the new KPA1500 the K3s ACC is connected to the KPA1500 now.  Guess I will have to hunt down a Y-cable to allow both the computer and the KPA to connect to the ACC.
The KAT500, KPA500, and KPA1500 all sense RF, detect the frequency with a single dit or tap on the mic, and go into TX mode when they sense RF. There is NO need for an ACC connection for them. The only benefits that I'm aware of are that the amps and tuner follow the rig's RX frequency and auto switch BEFORE getting RF to sense.

I was a KAT500 beta tester, and have used both amps in my station since they were introduced. I've never used an ACC cable, only PTT from K3 to amp.

73, Jim K9YC


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

On 2021-02-12 2:39 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
The only benefits that I'm aware of are that the amps and tuner
follow the rig's RX frequency and auto switch BEFORE getting RF to
sense.
You forget the ability to set drive level appropriately when the
KPA500 or KPA1500 switches from standby (or off) to operate and
return the K3/K3S drive level to its preset level when the amplifier
is bypassed or turned off. That's a big one!

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-12 2:39 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
On 2/12/2021 11:30 AM, Chuck wrote:
UGH,  you're right - with the new KPA1500 the K3s ACC is connected to the KPA1500 now.  Guess I will have to hunt down a Y-cable to allow both the computer and the KPA to connect to the ACC.
The KAT500, KPA500, and KPA1500 all sense RF, detect the frequency with a single dit or tap on the mic, and go into TX mode when they sense RF. There is NO need for an ACC connection for them. The only benefits that I'm aware of are that the amps and tuner follow the rig's RX frequency and auto switch BEFORE getting RF to sense.
I was a KAT500 beta tester, and have used both amps in my station since they were introduced. I've never used an ACC cable, only PTT from K3 to amp.
73, Jim K9YC


K9MA
 

Without the ACC cable, if the ATU has to change settings, the beginning of the transmission may be cut off, or at best sent at low power. (I experienced this when the ACC cable communication accidentally got turned off.) This is mainly an issue in contesting, not casual operation.

As far as I can tell, here's what happens without the ACC cable:

Full power transmission starts
High SWR and/or frequency change detected
PIN diodes hot-switch to bypass (very quickly)
ATU relays switch (not so quickly)
PIN diodes switch to operate

With the ACC cable, about 0.5 second after you stop tuning, the above sequence starts, but without the hot switching, assuming transmission hasn't already started.

I know the PIN diode switches are designed to tolerate hot switching, but I prefer to avoid it.

73,
Scott K9MA

----------

Scott Ellington

--- via iPad

On Feb 12, 2021, at 1:40 PM, Jim Brown <k9yc@audiosystemsgroup.com> wrote:

On 2/12/2021 11:30 AM, Chuck wrote:
UGH, you're right - with the new KPA1500 the K3s ACC is connected to the KPA1500 now. Guess I will have to hunt down a Y-cable to allow both the computer and the KPA to connect to the ACC.
The KAT500, KPA500, and KPA1500 all sense RF, detect the frequency with a single dit or tap on the mic, and go into TX mode when they sense RF. There is NO need for an ACC connection for them. The only benefits that I'm aware of are that the amps and tuner follow the rig's RX frequency and auto switch BEFORE getting RF to sense.

I was a KAT500 beta tester, and have used both amps in my station since they were introduced. I've never used an ACC cable, only PTT from K3 to amp.

73, Jim K9YC





Chuck
 

Thanks for the input.  I have not been able to find the Y-cable I bought for the SteppIR years ago, however, just realize it would be DB-9 plugs so that will not mate to the K3s ACC.
 
I really like some of the safety of using the K3s to KPA ACC link.

Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??
=============
73, Chuck N7BV


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

I believe the correct ACC cable sequence is;   K3S to KAT500 then to KPA500.   Reference: KAT500 manual, page 5, Figure 1.

73

Bob, K4TAX


On 2/12/2021 4:23 PM, Chuck wrote:
Thanks for the input.  I have not been able to find the Y-cable I bought for the SteppIR years ago, however, just realize it would be DB-9 plugs so that will not mate to the K3s ACC.
 
I really like some of the safety of using the K3s to KPA ACC link.

Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??
=============
73, Chuck N7BV

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??
The proper Y cable. Elecraft used to sell them (and include them with
the KPA500 cable set) but unfortunately seem to have stopped some time
ago.

This cable is known to work:

https://www.cablewholesale.com/products/vga-cable/vga-splitters/product-10h1-27708.php

The N6TV Y Box is also a possibility (although considerably more
expensive).

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-12 5:23 PM, Chuck wrote:
Thanks for the input.  I have not been able to find the Y-cable I bought for the SteppIR years ago, however, just realize it would be DB-9 plugs so that will not mate to the K3s ACC.
I really like some of the safety of using the K3s to KPA ACC link.
Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??
=============
73, Chuck N7BV


K9MA
 

That one should work, as the drawing shows all pins connected. (Not all are on some VGA cables.)

Here's the one Elecraft used to sell:

https://www.winford.com/products/cdy15hd.php

(A bit more expensive)

You don't need one for the K3, KAT500, KPA500, or KPA1500 unless you need to make another connection to pick of the band data, etc.


73,
Scott K9MA


On 2/12/2021 5:05 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:

Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and
> continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??

The proper Y cable.  Elecraft used to sell them (and include them with
the KPA500 cable set) but unfortunately seem to have stopped some time
ago.

This cable is known to work:

https://www.cablewholesale.com/products/vga-cable/vga-splitters/product-10h1-27708.php

The N6TV Y Box is also a possibility (although considerably more
expensive).

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-12 5:23 PM, Chuck wrote:
Thanks for the input.  I have not been able to find the Y-cable I bought for the SteppIR years ago, however, just realize it would be DB-9 plugs so that will not mate to the K3s ACC.

I really like some of the safety of using the K3s to KPA ACC link.

Any suggestions on how I could use the MicroKeyer to key the K3s and continue using the KPA1500-K3s ACC link??
=============
73, Chuck N7BV








-- 
Scott  K9MA

k9ma@...


Jeff VE3CV
 

I  do FSK RTTY with my K3 and N1MM and use  a home brew 15pin ACC cable to a FTDI USB adapter for a dedicated COM port.  Works great with MMTTY and 2Tone.  You have to remember to set the COM port in MMTTY to EXTFSK64 for newer computer or EXTFSK for 32 bit machine.  Download what ever version you need if not already installed.  That is what stumped me.
Good Luck
Jeff VE3CV


Chuck
 

GD,

Just to tie an ending to this thread. 

After trying all weekend I was not able to get N1MM+ to work on FSK

Today, Monday I decided to drop back and start all over.  Figuring I must have messed things up enough.

1.  Started with Elecrafts' "Radio Codec Test by AA3B"  Rev 2a - /21/17 found on Elecraft.com K3 K3s sound card settings.  I did not do the Testing phase because it was based on wave files.

2.  I then moved on to VE3KI input from GroupsIO titled "Re:  K3s and RTTY Contesting with N1MM+/MMTTY" from Feb 06,2016.  I could not get FSK to work but when I follow VE3KI's info for AFSK everything came together.

I sort of expected this might happen as throughout this ordeal WSJT-x has worked find.  I also suspect my main problem was the KPA1500 which takes the Accy from the K3s, and without a Y-adapter left the MicroHam Keyer no path to generate the FSK signal to the K3.   I expect to receive a y-cable mid week and will try to find time to confirm this.

Thank you for all the input, am just sorry I didn't get to partake in the RTTY contest.

=============
73, Chuck N7BV


Wes Stewart
 

Why didn't you stop there?  AFSK on a K3 is a dream and delivers a superb signal.

Wes  N7WS


On Mon, Feb 15, 2021 at 05:47 PM, Chuck wrote:
I could not get FSK to work but when I follow VE3KI's info for AFSK everything came together.


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

Using MMTTY or HRD/DM780 or FLDIGI I've been running AFSK with great success.  Encodes and decodes are very successful and reliable.   I see no reason to employ a hardware interface just to use FSK.

73

Bob, K4TAX


On 2/16/2021 7:34 AM, Wes Stewart via groups.io wrote:
Why didn't you stop there?  AFSK on a K3 is a dream and delivers a superb signal.

Wes  N7WS

On Mon, Feb 15, 2021 at 05:47 PM, Chuck wrote:
I could not get FSK to work but when I follow VE3KI's info for AFSK everything came together.

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Kenneth Stovesand
 

Marginally related to the topic...  I used my P3/SVGA keyboard for working a bit in last weekends RTTY contest...  Not as efficient as using N1MM logging, of course, but most QSOs were successful...  I really appreciate the RTTY data capability built into the K3...  I have used the paddles in the past, but the P3/SVGA keyboard is really fun...   

Just wondering if anyone else uses the P3/SVGA for data modes, or is it just not that good for serious use?   

73 ES GOD BLESS U ES URS DE KEN N4OI  


Wes
 

Indeed. I got tired of waiting for a K4 and wanting to treat myself to one last new rig, opted for a TS-890.  The K3S is on standby and the K3 is a backup to the backup,

One thing I do miss is the ease of operating RTTY with the Elecrafts. I started using RTTY after 40+ years in the hobby using the K3 and two audio cables into a laptop sound card.  Piece of cake.

The Kenwood runs FSK, with a lot of fussing with ports, RTS, RTTY keying, etc.  It performs extremely well, but is a PITA initially.

Wes  N7WS

On 2/16/2021 7:17 AM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:

Using MMTTY or HRD/DM780 or FLDIGI I've been running AFSK with great success.  Encodes and decodes are very successful and reliable.   I see no reason to employ a hardware interface just to use FSK.

73

Bob, K4TAX


On 2/16/2021 7:34 AM, Wes Stewart via groups.io wrote:
Why didn't you stop there?  AFSK on a K3 is a dream and delivers a superb signal.

Wes  N7WS

On Mon, Feb 15, 2021 at 05:47 PM, Chuck wrote:
I could not get FSK to work but when I follow VE3KI's info for AFSK everything came together.


Jim AC0E
 

Chuck,
I bought two of the Y-cables from Winford Engineering  ( $22.00/ea + shipping?) as recommended by Elecraft people I talked to a month or so ago.

Do you also have the "key-line" interrupter installed at one end of the AUX cable..? If you have a STEPP-IR, or  other device needing to control the amp keying, then you already know about the need for the "keyl-line" interrupter.

I have a  K3 at 2 different locations.  They both use Microham MK-II to generate and Key FSK. Location #1 K3- KAT-KPA/500. Location #2 K3-KPA1500.
I have the key line interrupter at both sites and use the K3 KEYOUT to Key the amps.
Once you get it working you will say "Now wasn't that easy"  Happy diddling.
73,
Jim AC0E


Jim Brown
 

On 2/16/2021 5:34 AM, Wes Stewart via groups.io wrote:
Why didn't you stop there?  AFSK on a K3 is a dream and delivers a superb signal.
Strongly agree. All that is required after making the connections is carefully setting levels. I've used this method, with VOX for PTT, for all digital modes for more than ten years. 1450 QSOs in WPX RTTY this past weekend.

73, Jim K9YC


Jim Brown
 

On 2/16/2021 6:32 AM, Kenneth Stovesand wrote:
 I used my P3/SVGA keyboard for working a bit in last weekends RTTY contest...  Not as efficient as using N1MM logging, of course, but most QSOs were successful.
PLEASE don't do that -- being on the other end of a QSO like that is painful. Just because you can doesn't mean that you should.

73, Jim K9YC


Wes Stewart
 

Good job!  I just did S&P for DX only, for limited time.  Caught a few South Americans on a very short 10-meter opening, which was nice.

Wes  N7WS

On Tuesday, February 16, 2021, 12:59:00 PM MST, Jim Brown <k9yc@...> wrote:


On 2/16/2021 5:34 AM, Wes Stewart via groups.io wrote:
> Why didn't you stop there?  AFSK on a K3 is a dream and delivers a
> superb signal.

Strongly agree. All that is required after making the connections is
carefully setting levels. I've used this method, with VOX for PTT, for
all digital modes for more than ten years. 1450 QSOs in WPX RTTY this
past weekend.

73, Jim K9YC