moderated How can I remote my own K3s?


Peter Dougherty
 

Hi all,

While my K3s was out at the Mothership for repair, a good friend loaned me his Flex 6500, which I put through its paces during the 6 weeks the rig was off at the spa. While it's definitely a different way of playing radio, I had one great experience that I'm trying to recreate with my K3s if that's possible. For CQWW-CW, I was sitting in my best friend's living room 350 miles away, with a Maestro connected to Wifi, my Dell XPS-13 on my lap and operating the contest with the same ease as if I was sitting in my own shack. I could get used to that! 

Is it possible to achieve the same end result with a K3/0 Mini, and if so, how would I do it, and what hardware, other than the mini, do I need to purchase and any specific software? I bought the RemoteHams RCFOrb device that I can plug a paddle into and remote in that way, but having a proper remote solution for my Elecraft gear similar to what I could do with that Flex equipment would really be ideal. 

Thanks in advance!


KE8G
 

Hi Peter,
Yes, very possible.  I have been operating my K3 and now K3s remotely for years.

I started off with 2 K3 rigs and the remote rig boxes, but decided to go a different way a couple of years ago.  I now use all software and 2 pieces of hardware.  A webswitch to turn the rig on and a Winkeyer.  All the rest is software driven.  

If you are interested, I can point you in that direction.

73 de Jim - KE8G 



On Sat, Dec 15, 2018 at 9:05 PM Peter Dougherty <lists@...> wrote:

Hi all,

While my K3s was out at the Mothership for repair, a good friend loaned me his Flex 6500, which I put through its paces during the 6 weeks the rig was off at the spa. While it's definitely a different way of playing radio, I had one great experience that I'm trying to recreate with my K3s if that's possible. For CQWW-CW, I was sitting in my best friend's living room 350 miles away, with a Maestro connected to Wifi, my Dell XPS-13 on my lap and operating the contest with the same ease as if I was sitting in my own shack. I could get used to that! 

Is it possible to achieve the same end result with a K3/0 Mini, and if so, how would I do it, and what hardware, other than the mini, do I need to purchase and any specific software? I bought the RemoteHams RCFOrb device that I can plug a paddle into and remote in that way, but having a proper remote solution for my Elecraft gear similar to what I could do with that Flex equipment would really be ideal. 

Thanks in advance!


john ni0k
 

Jim,

Please share! I'm working on that myself. The locals all use RCForb.

-John NI0K

James Blanca wrote on 12/16/2018 12:52 AM:

Hi Peter,
Yes, very possible.  I have been operating my K3 and now K3s remotely for years.

I started off with 2 K3 rigs and the remote rig boxes, but decided to go a different way a couple of years ago.  I now use all software and 2 pieces of hardware.  A webswitch to turn the rig on and a Winkeyer.  All the rest is software driven.  

If you are interested, I can point you in that direction.

73 de Jim - KE8G 



On Sat, Dec 15, 2018 at 9:05 PM Peter Dougherty <lists@...> wrote:

Hi all,

While my K3s was out at the Mothership for repair, a good friend loaned me his Flex 6500, which I put through its paces during the 6 weeks the rig was off at the spa. While it's definitely a different way of playing radio, I had one great experience that I'm trying to recreate with my K3s if that's possible. For CQWW-CW, I was sitting in my best friend's living room 350 miles away, with a Maestro connected to Wifi, my Dell XPS-13 on my lap and operating the contest with the same ease as if I was sitting in my own shack. I could get used to that! 

Is it possible to achieve the same end result with a K3/0 Mini, and if so, how would I do it, and what hardware, other than the mini, do I need to purchase and any specific software? I bought the RemoteHams RCFOrb device that I can plug a paddle into and remote in that way, but having a proper remote solution for my Elecraft gear similar to what I could do with that Flex equipment would really be ideal. 

Thanks in advance!



Peter Dougherty
 

That would be interesting, but I'm more interested in the K3/0 Mini solution, where I have the physical controls in front of me. I'd like to get remotehams.com out of the equation if I can, which is what I'm currently using, and go with a purely hardware solution, similar to how Flex connects its Maestro. 

While remotehams if functional and has allowed me to operate contests in the past, it's far from ideal for me. I'm no fan of their software and its finicky settings. I'm after a more robust "it's always there and it always works" solution if I can get it.


Olli
 

Take a look at www.remoterig.com ... been using their controllers for almost 10 years now and works ufb with K3/0 mini.

73, Olli - DH8BQA
https://www.dh8bqa.de/




Sonntag, 16. Dezember 2018, 16:55 +0100 von lists@... <lists@...>:

That would be interesting, but I'm more interested in the K3/0 Mini solution, where I have the physical controls in front of me. I'd like to get remotehams.com out of the equation if I can, which is what I'm currently using, and go with a purely hardware solution, similar to how Flex connects its Maestro. 

While remotehams if functional and has allowed me to operate contests in the past, it's far from ideal for me. I'm no fan of their software and its finicky settings. I'm after a more robust "it's always there and it always works" solution if I can get it.


Mitch Wolfson
 

If you want that kind of user experience, then the gold standard is using the RemoteRig RRC boxes with hundreds of installations in Place. Using the K3/0 Mini will allow you to operate as if you are sitting in front of the K3.

Here are some advantages of RemoteRig:
- Embedded device - set and forget. User can not mess-up the interface such as they can on a PC running Windows.
- No PC needs to be running at the remote site
- Small size and low power consumption (2.2 watts using 13.8 volts)
- No issue with installing and running in a rough environment such as a mountaintop
- High quality audio (using SIP protocol) with selectable CODEC's
- Extremely low latency (about 20 ms). I know of users that use RemoteRig for QSK CW at 40 WPM over the internet
- Built-in CW keyer allowing the use of a paddle, also includes Winkeyer emulation
- Built-in serial port servers for CAT control remotely
- Support for multiple locations (profiles) to switch between remote station locations on the fly
- Support for a virtual FSK COM port, and/or the operator can use digital modes (e.g. AFSK, PSK31, FT8, etc.) by connecting an audio cable to the control RRC box
- Dongle (RRC Micro PC Client) and Android app (RRC Nano) available

The disadvantages would be:
- Initial cost of purchasing a set with cables
- The initial installation requires network configuration at radio location (once done, becomes plug and play thereafter)
- No integrated method of using a P3 remotely (there are other methods such as using Win4K3Suite)

RemoteRig RRC's can be purchased from Elecraft or HRO.

73,
Mitch K7DX / DJ0QN


Bill KO7SS
 

I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS


Andy Bonnot K5QR
 

Hi Jim,

Yes, please share ... I would be very interested in the configuration you are using.

I've been remoting in via TeamViewer, Skype and running Win4K3Suite on the server side.  It works but I'm really looking for a better solution that would allow for a CW paddle (and local sidetone) and a radio tuning knob at the client end, ideally without having to drag around a lot of hardware in addition to the laptop.  Since I don't use my home station remotely very frequently I would prefer something that doesn't require re-configuring/re-cabling the station when I'm gone for a few days and want to remote into the radio.

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

73, 
Andy - K5QR


KE8G
 

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

I wholeheartedly agree! 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 
I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73
Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS


Jeff Clarke KU8E
 

I guess I really don't understand your guys problem with this?

People guest operating from someones big gun station in contests has been happening for years. Many of the elite operators, who are usually younger, don't have the funds to build a big station. Usually you need to have a relationship with the owner to be able to operate their station. With the remote radio sites that are out there like RemoteHamRadio.com and BeLoud.Us you no longer need to have have that relationship with the owner to be able to operate a big gun station. You just need put out the cash to do it.  Some will say that's not fair that someone can pay to do this.  My logic on this subject is contesting and DXing isn't fair to begin with. Some people can spend ten of thousands of dollars or more the build the best station money can buy and others can't. So why would it make a difference if you are at a station in person or renting a station to operate remotely thru the internet?  You are saving a lot of money and labor to maintain a station by renting one of these remote stations if you have the means to do it.

Sorry to break the news to you but this is the future of contesting if you want to be competitive and be considered to be an "elite" contester. If not then just do contesting for fun with what you have.

Happy Holidays , Jeff KU8E


On 12/16/2018 08:34 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree! 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 
I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73
Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS
--
Jeff Clarke
Information Technology Professional
Ellerslie, Georgia

KU8E.com


Bob McGraw - K4TAX
 

I'll just call the DX on the cell phone and log it as a 900 MHz contact.  Much less expensive too. 

This makes as much sense as paid time on a big gun DX station.  


Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 9:39 PM, Jeff Clarke <ku8e@...> wrote:

I guess I really don't understand your guys problem with this?

People guest operating from someones big gun station in contests has been happening for years. Many of the elite operators, who are usually younger, don't have the funds to build a big station. Usually you need to have a relationship with the owner to be able to operate their station. With the remote radio sites that are out there like RemoteHamRadio.com and BeLoud.Us you no longer need to have have that relationship with the owner to be able to operate a big gun station. You just need put out the cash to do it.  Some will say that's not fair that someone can pay to do this.  My logic on this subject is contesting and DXing isn't fair to begin with. Some people can spend ten of thousands of dollars or more the build the best station money can buy and others can't. So why would it make a difference if you are at a station in person or renting a station to operate remotely thru the internet?  You are saving a lot of money and labor to maintain a station by renting one of these remote stations if you have the means to do it.

Sorry to break the news to you but this is the future of contesting if you want to be competitive and be considered to be an "elite" contester. If not then just do contesting for fun with what you have.

Happy Holidays , Jeff KU8E


On 12/16/2018 08:34 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree! 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 
I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73
Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS
--
Jeff Clarke
Information Technology Professional
Ellerslie, Georgia

KU8E.com


Martin Sole
 

There's a couple of points I'll make on this.

I've tried remote operating, using a remote station to work some dx, both me and the remote station were in the same dxcc entity so at least there was that. I probably wouldn't have made that band/mode slot without the significantly superior remote station. The whole thing left me feeling cold and disconnected.

I recall someone mentioned explaining FT8 or some such to someone, I think his comment in reply was along the lines of "How do you know when you're having fun?"
I found remote operating another station in the same vein. The fun bit seemed to be missing.

I'll put anther twist in this though. If it were my station here at home that' I've put together myself, with my antennas and whilst I'm elsewhere I was able to connect to my home station and operate it remotely I feel that's a bit different.

Martin, HS0ZED


On 17/12/2018 11:19, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
I'll just call the DX on the cell phone and log it as a 900 MHz contact.  Much less expensive too. 

This makes as much sense as paid time on a big gun DX station.  


Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 9:39 PM, Jeff Clarke <ku8e@...> wrote:

I guess I really don't understand your guys problem with this?

People guest operating from someones big gun station in contests has been happening for years. Many of the elite operators, who are usually younger, don't have the funds to build a big station. Usually you need to have a relationship with the owner to be able to operate their station. With the remote radio sites that are out there like RemoteHamRadio.com and BeLoud.Us you no longer need to have have that relationship with the owner to be able to operate a big gun station. You just need put out the cash to do it.  Some will say that's not fair that someone can pay to do this.  My logic on this subject is contesting and DXing isn't fair to begin with. Some people can spend ten of thousands of dollars or more the build the best station money can buy and others can't. So why would it make a difference if you are at a station in person or renting a station to operate remotely thru the internet?  You are saving a lot of money and labor to maintain a station by renting one of these remote stations if you have the means to do it.

Sorry to break the news to you but this is the future of contesting if you want to be competitive and be considered to be an "elite" contester. If not then just do contesting for fun with what you have.

Happy Holidays , Jeff KU8E


On 12/16/2018 08:34 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree! 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 
I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73
Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS
--
Jeff Clarke
Information Technology Professional
Ellerslie, Georgia

KU8E.com



Mal
 

I’m doing that for worked all states.

Oh I have to go now my computer just told me I just got DXCC on 40m FT-8

Isn’t ham radio great these days.

 

73 de Mal WA2TWA

 

From: Elecraft-K3@groups.io <Elecraft-K3@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2018 11:19 PM
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Subject: Re: [Elecraft-K3] How can I remote my own K3s?

 

I'll just call the DX on the cell phone and log it as a 900 MHz contact.  Much less expensive too. 

This makes as much sense as paid time on a big gun DX station.  

 

 

Bob, K4TAX

 

 


On Dec 16, 2018, at 9:39 PM, Jeff Clarke <ku8e@...> wrote:

I guess I really don't understand your guys problem with this?

People guest operating from someones big gun station in contests has been happening for years. Many of the elite operators, who are usually younger, don't have the funds to build a big station. Usually you need to have a relationship with the owner to be able to operate their station. With the remote radio sites that are out there like RemoteHamRadio.com and BeLoud.Us you no longer need to have have that relationship with the owner to be able to operate a big gun station. You just need put out the cash to do it.  Some will say that's not fair that someone can pay to do this.  My logic on this subject is contesting and DXing isn't fair to begin with. Some people can spend ten of thousands of dollars or more the build the best station money can buy and others can't. So why would it make a difference if you are at a station in person or renting a station to operate remotely thru the internet?  You are saving a lot of money and labor to maintain a station by renting one of these remote stations if you have the means to do it.

Sorry to break the news to you but this is the future of contesting if you want to be competitive and be considered to be an "elite" contester. If not then just do contesting for fun with what you have.

Happy Holidays , Jeff KU8E

 

On 12/16/2018 08:34 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:

I wholeheartedly agree! 

 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 

I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73

Bob, K4TAX

 

 


On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

 

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

 

73 de Jim - KE8G

 

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS

--
Jeff Clarke
Information Technology Professional
Ellerslie, Georgia

KU8E.com


Richard Lawn
 

I'd be interested in more detail as well.
Rick. W2JAZ 


Rick NK7I
 

My opinion won’t be popular, but unless there are specific situations (HOA, other housing or lot restrictions), using a rented remote is immoral.  Period. 

If a contact is made from a rented or borrowed station is used for any award, that shameful.   No, you don’t get it.  It’s a matter of ethics and standards.

You live where you live and part of that is learning to best use the propagation of your home area then adapting your station to improve what can be improved.  Sometimes it is all in your favor, sometimes you have to try harder, just like life. 

Many of us start our ham lives with simple basic stations, which because we compete with everyone else for contacts, DX or contesting, teaches propagation, techniques and more, which can still be applied as the station grows.

If you borrow a local ham station, you don’t deserve the DX credit or award.  The owner of that station does, you didn’t build the station. 

Remote ops or borrowed stations also lower the value of the DXCC or other awards.   Any award granted using a rented remote should have an asterisk.  You’re buying the award, not earning it.  Shame on you. 

One exception is if it’s a club station, used under the club call not an individuals call. 

The DXCC committee itself has lowered the bar by allowing remote rented stations.  That’s shameful too and a considerable mistake making ham radio profitable, for those renting out station time.   Multi-band DXCC in a weekend?  Easy.  Just add cash. 

Earning the awards of any type is intended to take time and effort; not a large bank account better used to improve your station. 

And whining about FT8 being computer run; you’re right.  But so are more than 95% of RTTY contacts today.  Neither mode is fully automated but FT8 demands specific timing, beyond many hams ability.   Get over it, green key days are almost over (yep had that too).  CW readers are used as well, boo hoo, these computer tools enhance, not detract; they do nothing to increase output power, affect propagation, technique or anything else. 

EVERY contact in my log was made with a station I assembled, piece by piece, at home, work or vehicle.  I’ve never used a full power, multi-tower super station yet have DXCC on most bands.  I didn’t switch coasts at the flip of a switch because propagation stunk. 

I earned every contact, I didn’t buy a single one.   That is my level of ethics if you agree or not.  But I’m the only one I have to live with. 

Rick WA6NHC

Smell Czech correction happen

On Dec 16, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Richard Lawn <rjlawn@...> wrote:

I'd be interested in more detail as well.
Rick. W2JAZ 


Everett N4CY
 

I took at using a remote and paying for it is like cheating on your wife, it just isn’t right. 

Everett N4CY

On Dec 16, 2018, at 11:55 PM, Rick WA6NHC <wa6nhc@...> wrote:

My opinion won’t be popular, but unless there are specific situations (HOA, other housing or lot restrictions), using a rented remote is immoral.  Period. 

If a contact is made from a rented or borrowed station is used for any award, that shameful.   No, you don’t get it.  It’s a matter of ethics and standards.

You live where you live and part of that is learning to best use the propagation of your home area then adapting your station to improve what can be improved.  Sometimes it is all in your favor, sometimes you have to try harder, just like life. 

Many of us start our ham lives with simple basic stations, which because we compete with everyone else for contacts, DX or contesting, teaches propagation, techniques and more, which can still be applied as the station grows.

If you borrow a local ham station, you don’t deserve the DX credit or award.  The owner of that station does, you didn’t build the station. 

Remote ops or borrowed stations also lower the value of the DXCC or other awards.   Any award granted using a rented remote should have an asterisk.  You’re buying the award, not earning it.  Shame on you. 

One exception is if it’s a club station, used under the club call not an individuals call. 

The DXCC committee itself has lowered the bar by allowing remote rented stations.  That’s shameful too and a considerable mistake making ham radio profitable, for those renting out station time.   Multi-band DXCC in a weekend?  Easy.  Just add cash. 

Earning the awards of any type is intended to take time and effort; not a large bank account better used to improve your station. 

And whining about FT8 being computer run; you’re right.  But so are more than 95% of RTTY contacts today.  Neither mode is fully automated but FT8 demands specific timing, beyond many hams ability.   Get over it, green key days are almost over (yep had that too).  CW readers are used as well, boo hoo, these computer tools enhance, not detract; they do nothing to increase output power, affect propagation, technique or anything else. 

EVERY contact in my log was made with a station I assembled, piece by piece, at home, work or vehicle.  I’ve never used a full power, multi-tower super station yet have DXCC on most bands.  I didn’t switch coasts at the flip of a switch because propagation stunk. 

I earned every contact, I didn’t buy a single one.   That is my level of ethics if you agree or not.  But I’m the only one I have to live with. 

Rick WA6NHC

Smell Czech correction happen

On Dec 16, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Richard Lawn <rjlawn@...> wrote:

I'd be interested in more detail as well.
Rick. W2JAZ 


Dale, K9VUJ
 

Thanks Rick, I agree 100 percent.  To add, this business of contesting has become an ego building thing.  Not only that, it’s unhealthy, sitting for hours on end repeating the same message over and over again.  Even automated stations the operator can sit back with a can of beer or coffee pushing a button on a keyboard and sending a recorded message out every few seconds repeating over and over again until some one calls for a …..  _.  _.  (5NN).  What a time waster, IMHO.

DXing is a little better at least there’s some degree of chasing and variability.    

Dale, K9VUJ


On 16, Dec 2018, at 23:55, Rick WA6NHC <wa6nhc@...> wrote:

My opinion won’t be popular, but unless there are specific situations (HOA, other housing or lot restrictions), using a rented remote is immoral.  Period. 

If a contact is made from a rented or borrowed station is used for any award, that shameful.   No, you don’t get it.  It’s a matter of ethics and standards.

You live where you live and part of that is learning to best use the propagation of your home area then adapting your station to improve what can be improved.  Sometimes it is all in your favor, sometimes you have to try harder, just like life. 

Many of us start our ham lives with simple basic stations, which because we compete with everyone else for contacts, DX or contesting, teaches propagation, techniques and more, which can still be applied as the station grows.

If you borrow a local ham station, you don’t deserve the DX credit or award.  The owner of that station does, you didn’t build the station. 

Remote ops or borrowed stations also lower the value of the DXCC or other awards.   Any award granted using a rented remote should have an asterisk.  You’re buying the award, not earning it.  Shame on you. 

One exception is if it’s a club station, used under the club call not an individuals call. 

The DXCC committee itself has lowered the bar by allowing remote rented stations.  That’s shameful too and a considerable mistake making ham radio profitable, for those renting out station time.   Multi-band DXCC in a weekend?  Easy.  Just add cash. 

Earning the awards of any type is intended to take time and effort; not a large bank account better used to improve your station. 

And whining about FT8 being computer run; you’re right.  But so are more than 95% of RTTY contacts today.  Neither mode is fully automated but FT8 demands specific timing, beyond many hams ability.   Get over it, green key days are almost over (yep had that too).  CW readers are used as well, boo hoo, these computer tools enhance, not detract; they do nothing to increase output power, affect propagation, technique or anything else. 

EVERY contact in my log was made with a station I assembled, piece by piece, at home, work or vehicle.  I’ve never used a full power, multi-tower super station yet have DXCC on most bands.  I didn’t switch coasts at the flip of a switch because propagation stunk. 

I earned every contact, I didn’t buy a single one.   That is my level of ethics if you agree or not.  But I’m the only one I have to live with. 

Rick WA6NHC

Smell Czech correction happen

On Dec 16, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Richard Lawn <rjlawn@...> wrote:

I'd be interested in more detail as well.
Rick. W2JAZ 


AJ3O
 

This will allow you to remote YOUR personal station. Free free free




On Monday, December 17, 2018, 6:51:18 AM EST, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2@...> wrote:


Thanks Rick, I agree 100 percent.  To add, this business of contesting has become an ego building thing.  Not only that, it’s unhealthy, sitting for hours on end repeating the same message over and over again.  Even automated stations the operator can sit back with a can of beer or coffee pushing a button on a keyboard and sending a recorded message out every few seconds repeating over and over again until some one calls for a …..  _.  _.  (5NN).  What a time waster, IMHO.

DXing is a little better at least there’s some degree of chasing and variability.    

Dale, K9VUJ


On 16, Dec 2018, at 23:55, Rick WA6NHC <wa6nhc@...> wrote:

My opinion won’t be popular, but unless there are specific situations (HOA, other housing or lot restrictions), using a rented remote is immoral.  Period. 

If a contact is made from a rented or borrowed station is used for any award, that shameful.   No, you don’t get it.  It’s a matter of ethics and standards.

You live where you live and part of that is learning to best use the propagation of your home area then adapting your station to improve what can be improved.  Sometimes it is all in your favor, sometimes you have to try harder, just like life. 

Many of us start our ham lives with simple basic stations, which because we compete with everyone else for contacts, DX or contesting, teaches propagation, techniques and more, which can still be applied as the station grows.

If you borrow a local ham station, you don’t deserve the DX credit or award.  The owner of that station does, you didn’t build the station. 

Remote ops or borrowed stations also lower the value of the DXCC or other awards.   Any award granted using a rented remote should have an asterisk.  You’re buying the award, not earning it.  Shame on you. 

One exception is if it’s a club station, used under the club call not an individuals call. 

The DXCC committee itself has lowered the bar by allowing remote rented stations.  That’s shameful too and a considerable mistake making ham radio profitable, for those renting out station time.   Multi-band DXCC in a weekend?  Easy.  Just add cash. 

Earning the awards of any type is intended to take time and effort; not a large bank account better used to improve your station. 

And whining about FT8 being computer run; you’re right.  But so are more than 95% of RTTY contacts today.  Neither mode is fully automated but FT8 demands specific timing, beyond many hams ability.   Get over it, green key days are almost over (yep had that too).  CW readers are used as well, boo hoo, these computer tools enhance, not detract; they do nothing to increase output power, affect propagation, technique or anything else. 

EVERY contact in my log was made with a station I assembled, piece by piece, at home, work or vehicle.  I’ve never used a full power, multi-tower super station yet have DXCC on most bands.  I didn’t switch coasts at the flip of a switch because propagation stunk. 

I earned every contact, I didn’t buy a single one.   That is my level of ethics if you agree or not.  But I’m the only one I have to live with. 

Rick WA6NHC

Smell Czech correction happen

On Dec 16, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Richard Lawn <rjlawn@...> wrote:

I'd be interested in more detail as well.
Rick. W2JAZ 


Wes
 

Wow, where to begin.  Of course you don't understand the personal ethics of some of us.  That's okay, they are personal, some of us have them some of us don't.

In what follows, I'm speaking as a DXer, contests make my eyes glaze over.

In my case, my stations were constructed and operated by me.  During much of my 60 year ham career, a lot, or in the case of 2-meter EME all, of my equipment was designed and built by me.  All of my DXCC contacts have been made from locations within a ten mile radius in Tucson.  For more on this my bio on QRZ expands and I won't elaborate here.

So, my accomplishments are mine, and that's the way I want it.  Sure, I have friends who were off the air for various reasons, and used another's station, or worse had the other guy work the DX for them, so they maintained their lofty perch on the top of the "Honor" Roll.  I had one local ask me on the air to call him on the telephone once.  He them reported that "I" had worked such-and-such DXpedition on a particular band and time.  He worked them using my call and thought that I would be pleased.  I read him the riot act and of course did not claim the QSO.  Others did, however.  Got to stay on top doncha ya know,

I certainly have no beef with fellows who build huge multi-op stations, they are tremendous technical achievements. That said, I doubt (or hope) that those guest ops aren't claiming credits toward their own stats.  If they are---well---see comments on ethics above.

Wes  N7WS

On 12/16/2018 8:39 PM, Jeff Clarke wrote:

I guess I really don't understand your guys problem with this?

People guest operating from someones big gun station in contests has been happening for years. Many of the elite operators, who are usually younger, don't have the funds to build a big station. Usually you need to have a relationship with the owner to be able to operate their station. With the remote radio sites that are out there like RemoteHamRadio.com and BeLoud.Us you no longer need to have have that relationship with the owner to be able to operate a big gun station. You just need put out the cash to do it.  Some will say that's not fair that someone can pay to do this.  My logic on this subject is contesting and DXing isn't fair to begin with. Some people can spend ten of thousands of dollars or more the build the best station money can buy and others can't. So why would it make a difference if you are at a station in person or renting a station to operate remotely thru the internet?  You are saving a lot of money and labor to maintain a station by renting one of these remote stations if you have the means to do it.

Sorry to break the news to you but this is the future of contesting if you want to be competitive and be considered to be an "elite" contester. If not then just do contesting for fun with what you have.

Happy Holidays , Jeff KU8E


On 12/16/2018 08:34 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree! 

Radios, antennas, and me at my QTH .   I hear them, I work them. No 'rent a station' for me. 
I agree "rent a station" contacts should not qualify for anything except ones ego. 

73
Bob, K4TAX



On Dec 16, 2018, at 7:28 PM, James Blanca <ke8g.jim@...> wrote:

Nope, I wouldn’t even consider trying something like that...to me it is 100% against everything I believe amateur radio to be!  I remotely operate the station I built, the antennas I assembled, the auxiliary equipment I assembled.  It’s mine, no one else’s!  

If you can’t hear a station transmitting at your QTH, switch to a “rent a station “ and make the QSO.  IMHO, that is cheating!

73 de Jim - KE8G

On Sun, Dec 16, 2018 at 5:54 PM Bill KO7SS via Groups.Io <ko7ss=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I don't know where you live, no call sign in the posting, but RemoteHamRadio.com has direct connectivity from your K3/0 Mini or K3S to their
K3's located on the East Coast, with big antennas and big amps. No extra software or hardware. Their proprietary software is amazing. Pricing
is per minute of use, Discounts for contest periods.

73, Bill KO7SS
--
Jeff Clarke
Information Technology Professional
Ellerslie, Georgia

KU8E.com