Topics

Elecraft K3S / IC-7610 comparison table

 

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

Paul Dulaff
 

Wayne

I have interest in the IC-7610, but would be interested in your comparison table and data comparing the two rigs.

Best 73's

Paul Dulaff
W2NMI

----- Original Message -----
From: N6KR <n6kr@...>
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Sent: Tue, 03 Jul 2018 22:16:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] Elecraft K3S / IC-7610 comparison table

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

 

Hi Paul,

Attached is the current draft. Looking forward to your comments.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 3, 2018, at 8:27 PM, Paul Dulaff <pdulaff@...> wrote:

Wayne

I have interest in the IC-7610, but would be interested in your comparison table and data comparing the two rigs.

Best 73's

Paul Dulaff
W2NMI

----- Original Message -----
From: N6KR <n6kr@...>
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Sent: Tue, 03 Jul 2018 22:16:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] Elecraft K3S / IC-7610 comparison table

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR





 

My apologies for letting an alias getting the best of me. Didn’t mean to send this to the full list.

Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 3, 2018, at 9:53 PM, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:

Hi Paul,

Attached is the current draft. Looking forward to your comments.

73,
Wayne
N6KR






On Jul 3, 2018, at 8:27 PM, Paul Dulaff <pdulaff@...> wrote:

Wayne

I have interest in the IC-7610, but would be interested in your comparison table and data comparing the two rigs.

Best 73's

Paul Dulaff
W2NMI

----- Original Message -----
From: N6KR <n6kr@...>
To: Elecraft-K3@groups.io
Sent: Tue, 03 Jul 2018 22:16:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Elecraft-K3] Elecraft K3S / IC-7610 comparison table

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR







kd0q
 

Wayne,

Pleased forward the K3S v.s. IC-7610 comparison to me.

Thanks!

73, Glenn - KDØQ


On Tue, Jul 3, 2018 at 9:16 PM N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR



Petr Ourednik
 

Wayne,

I will be happy to get the draft too. Many thanks.

73 - Petr, OK1RP
http://ok1rp.blogspot.com)
(Sierra, K1, K2, K3, KX3, KPA500, KAT500 equipped)

dalej
 

I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?

Dale, K9VUJ

On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

Joe Subich, W4TV
 

On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to
evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Noise power testing *can* be extremely confusing when comparing
direct sampling "receivers" like the Flex or IC-7851/7610/7300
with IF based SDR receivers like the K3.

In practice, proponents of noise power testing reduce the noise
power level until the ADC of the direct sampling receiver no
longer goes into overflow and then measure the IMD products
(increase in noise floor in the "notch" region). With IF/filter
based devices the noise power is not reduced. Effectively, the
two receiver technologies are being tested at different signal
levels.

The direct conversion receiver is being tested at maximum
interfering signal level but not maximum sensitivity while
the IF/Filter receiver is being tested at maximum sensitivity.
None of the tested direct conversion SDRs are capable of 100+
dB "dynamic range" while simultaneously maintaining a MDS of
~ -140 dBm unlike a IF/filter receiver (either analog like the
K2 or DSP like the K3/K3S).

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Dale, K9VUJ
On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.
While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).
The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.
Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.
73,
Wayne
N6KR

Matt Obermayer
 

Data is always good. would love to se the comparison: KFBRC@...

On Jul 3, 2018, at 7:16 PM, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

WA3RSL
 

Hello Wayne.

Please send me the comparison table. 

73

Frank WA3RSL 

Everett N4CY
 

Hi Wayne,

Please send me a copy of the comparison. Everettsharp@...

Everett N4CY

On Jul 4, 2018, at 3:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:

I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?

Dale, K9VUJ





On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR





 

Hi Glenn,

Latest draft attached. Looking forward to your comments/suggestions.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 3, 2018, at 9:58 PM, kd0q <kd0q@...> wrote:

Wayne,

Pleased forward the K3S v.s. IC-7610 comparison to me.

Thanks!

73, Glenn - KDØQ


On Tue, Jul 3, 2018 at 9:16 PM N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR



 

Hi Petr,

Latest draft attached. Looking forward to your comments/suggestions.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 3, 2018, at 11:52 PM, Petr Ourednik <indians@...> wrote:

Wayne,

I will be happy to get the draft too. Many thanks.

73 - Petr, OK1RP
http://ok1rp.blogspot.com)
(Sierra, K1, K2, K3, KX3, KPA500, KAT500 equipped)

 

Hi Everett,

Latest draft attached. Looking forward to your comments/suggestions.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 4, 2018, at 3:05 AM, Everett Sharp via Groups.Io <everettsharp=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hi Wayne,

Please send me a copy of the comparison. Everettsharp@...

Everett N4CY
On Jul 4, 2018, at 3:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:

I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?

Dale, K9VUJ





On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:

In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.

While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).

The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.

Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.

73,
Wayne
N6KR






 

Hi Frank,

Latest draft attached. Looking forward to your comments/suggestions.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jul 4, 2018, at 6:26 AM, WA3RSL <@FrankMD> wrote:

Hello Wayne.

Please send me the comparison table.

73

Frank WA3RSL

dalej
 

When I’ve asked the question blocking dynamic range in other forums they always said the two kinds of receivers can’t be tested the same way :).

Guess that explains it.

Tnx Joe

Dale, K9VUJ

On 04, Jul 2018, at 8:27, Joe Subich, W4TV <lists@...> wrote:


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to
evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Noise power testing *can* be extremely confusing when comparing
direct sampling "receivers" like the Flex or IC-7851/7610/7300
with IF based SDR receivers like the K3.

In practice, proponents of noise power testing reduce the noise
power level until the ADC of the direct sampling receiver no
longer goes into overflow and then measure the IMD products
(increase in noise floor in the "notch" region). With IF/filter
based devices the noise power is not reduced. Effectively, the
two receiver technologies are being tested at different signal
levels.

The direct conversion receiver is being tested at maximum
interfering signal level but not maximum sensitivity while
the IF/Filter receiver is being tested at maximum sensitivity.
None of the tested direct conversion SDRs are capable of 100+
dB "dynamic range" while simultaneously maintaining a MDS of
~ -140 dBm unlike a IF/filter receiver (either analog like the
K2 or DSP like the K3/K3S).

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Dale, K9VUJ
On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.
While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).
The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.
Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.
73,
Wayne
N6KR

Everett N4CY
 

Wayne,

I see no attachment...

Everett N4CY

In a message dated 7/4/2018 9:31:09 AM Central Standard Time, n6kr@... writes:

Hi Everett,

Latest draft attached. Looking forward to your comments/suggestions.

73,
Wayne
N6KR





> On Jul 4, 2018, at 3:05 AM, Everett Sharp via Groups.Io <everettsharp=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
>
> Hi Wayne,
>
> Please send me a copy of the comparison. Everettsharp@...
>
> Everett N4CY
>> On Jul 4, 2018, at 3:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:
>>
>> I���m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers. How does that fit in with the K3 ?
>>
>> Dale, K9VUJ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
>>
>> In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we���ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.
>>
>> While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).
>>
>> The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we���re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we���ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.
>>
>> Please email me directly if you���re interested. I���ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.
>>
>> 73,
>> Wayne
>> N6KR
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>




mikerodgerske5gbc
 

Does the 7610 suffer the same problems as the 7300 with close by transmitters or have they addressed that?

73
Mike R

7!
Absolutely Awesome 

On Jul 4, 2018, at 9:34 AM, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2@...> wrote:

When I’ve asked the question blocking dynamic range in other forums they always said the two kinds of receivers can’t be tested the same way :).

Guess that explains it.

Tnx Joe

Dale, K9VUJ




On 04, Jul 2018, at 8:27, Joe Subich, W4TV <lists@...> wrote:


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to
evaluate receivers.  How does that fit in with the K3 ?

Noise power testing *can* be extremely confusing when comparing
direct sampling "receivers" like the Flex or IC-7851/7610/7300
with IF based SDR receivers like the K3.

In practice, proponents of noise power testing reduce the noise
power level until the ADC of the direct sampling receiver no
longer goes into overflow and then measure the IMD products
(increase in noise floor in the "notch" region).  With IF/filter
based devices the noise power is not reduced.  Effectively, the
two receiver technologies are being tested at different signal
levels.

The direct conversion receiver is being tested at maximum
interfering signal level but not maximum sensitivity while
the IF/Filter receiver is being tested at maximum sensitivity.
None of the tested direct conversion SDRs are capable of 100+
dB "dynamic range" while simultaneously maintaining a MDS of
~ -140 dBm unlike a IF/filter receiver (either analog like the
K2 or DSP like the K3/K3S).

73,

 ... Joe, W4TV


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers.  How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Dale, K9VUJ
On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.
While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).
The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.
Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.
73,
Wayne
N6KR







Petr Ourednik
 

Wayne,

so sorry but I do not see attachment...

73 - Petr, OK1RP

dalej
 

I think the 7610 uses extra band pass filtering ahead of the dsp.  

I wouldn’t give up my K3s for one.  

73
Dale, k9vuj


On 04, Jul 2018, at 9:42, mikerodgerske5gbc via Groups.Io <mikerodgerske5gbc@...> wrote:

Does the 7610 suffer the same problems as the 7300 with close by transmitters or have they addressed that?

73
Mike R

7!
Absolutely Awesome 

On Jul 4, 2018, at 9:34 AM, dalej via Groups.Io <dalej2@...> wrote:

When I’ve asked the question blocking dynamic range in other forums they always said the two kinds of receivers can’t be tested the same way :).

Guess that explains it.

Tnx Joe

Dale, K9VUJ




On 04, Jul 2018, at 8:27, Joe Subich, W4TV <lists@...> wrote:


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to
evaluate receivers.  How does that fit in with the K3 ?

Noise power testing *can* be extremely confusing when comparing
direct sampling "receivers" like the Flex or IC-7851/7610/7300
with IF based SDR receivers like the K3.

In practice, proponents of noise power testing reduce the noise
power level until the ADC of the direct sampling receiver no
longer goes into overflow and then measure the IMD products
(increase in noise floor in the "notch" region).  With IF/filter
based devices the noise power is not reduced.  Effectively, the
two receiver technologies are being tested at different signal
levels.

The direct conversion receiver is being tested at maximum
interfering signal level but not maximum sensitivity while
the IF/Filter receiver is being tested at maximum sensitivity.
None of the tested direct conversion SDRs are capable of 100+
dB "dynamic range" while simultaneously maintaining a MDS of
~ -140 dBm unlike a IF/filter receiver (either analog like the
K2 or DSP like the K3/K3S).

73,

 ... Joe, W4TV


On 2018-07-04 4:02 AM, dalej via Groups.Io wrote:
I’m interested in this noise power ratio test that some use to evaluate receivers.  How does that fit in with the K3 ?
Dale, K9VUJ
On 03, Jul 2018, at 21:16, N6KR <n6kr@...> wrote:
In response to many questions fielded by our sales and support staff we’ve put together a comparison of the K3S vs. the IC-7610.
While all rigs have certain strengths, the K3S has a combination of performance, features, and form factor that provide unique benefits to the operator, especially those who may encounter high-signal conditions or require portability (or both, as in the case of Field Day, DXpeditions, etc.).
The comparison table is in draft form and will continue to evolve, so we’re not posting it on our website just yet. However, we’ll be happy to send the current edition on request to anyone actively weighing the tradeoffs between the K3S and other transceivers.
Please email me directly if you’re interested. I’ll be happy to expand on information presented, whether theoretical or functional. No doubt these discussions will help us refine the table.
73,
Wayne
N6KR