Date   

Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Richard Fjeld <rpfjeld@...>
 

I realize now that I mis-understood.   Please dis-regard.

Dick, n0ce


    
On 4/10/2016 8:40 PM, Richard Fjeld wrote:
I hate to reveal my ignorance, but isn't that one of the reasons I have a low pass filter in-line to my antenna system?
I would welcome a brief explanation if the low pass filter is not effective. 

Also, forgive me for posting a reply before I have read the entire list.  I jumped the gun awhile ago.

Dick, n0ce
On 4/10/2016 4:43 PM, ab2tc@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:
 

Hi Rob again,


Yes, the higher order products are the worst problem with most solid state transmitters. In tube transmitters there is the 3rd order and very little after that. In most solid state transmitters the spectrum goes on and on and on... This requires attention by mainstream companies, including Elecraft. I'd really like to see Elecraft take the lead with respect to SSB transmitter distortion. If there is ever a K4 it ought to have a clean transmitter. I don't really care about the receiver. If a direct sampling receiver saves them money and retains or improves the performance, kudos to them.


AB2TC - Knut






Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Rob Sherwood
 

I posted it earlier, but here it is again.  Rob, NC0B

Here is how N7US figured out how to sort my web table.

In case anyone else wants to download Sherwood's Receiver Test Data
(http://www.sherweng.com/table.html) into an Excel spreadsheet, there's an
easy way to do it if you have Excel 2007.

Open a new worksheet and select the Data ribbon. Then click on "From Web"
in the "Get External Data" box and copy in the URL into the pop-up box. It
will see the table on the web page and highlight it so you can select and
import the data. You still have to pretty it up but the data is pulled in
without entering it manually.

Jim N7US

 

73, Rob, NC0B

 

 

From: Elecraft_K3@... [mailto:Elecraft_K3@...]
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 7:28 PM
To: Elecraft_K3@...
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

 

 

I'd like to have those as well.  Thanks, Dick, n0ce

 

On 4/10/2016 4:03 PM, Rob Sherwood. rob@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:

 

You can sort it with Excel. I'll send instructions later. Rob, NC0B



> On Apr 10, 2016, at 2:23 PM, "dalej dj2001x@... [Elecraft_K3]" wrote:
>
>
>
> How true Rob.
>
> BTW, thanks for your receiver tests. It's the only one that I feel has consistency and that makes it easy at least for me to judge what is the best rig. I do wish I could sort it, but it's fine the way you have it.
>
> 73
> Dale, K9VUJ
>
> On 10, Apr 2016, at 15:06, Rob Sherwood.
rob@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:
>
> Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.
>
> Rob, NC0B
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> If this email is spam, report it to
> https://support.onlymyemail.com/view/report_spam/ODExMjI6MTg3MTA4ODQ3MDpyb2JAbmMwYi5jb206ZGVsaXZlcmVk
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Re: [Elecraft_K3] K3s S Meter Accuracy

kk7p
 

The procedure is part of K3 Utility, and has not changed with the K3S.

73,

Lyle KK7P


 

I have found no reference to the S9+40 optional cal procedure in the K3s owner's manual. ...I wonder if the K3s procedure was changed from the original K3 procedure.



Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

miscwrc@...
 

When I made the comment I made "K-Line" referred to a fully decked out K3s with subreceiver and loaded with the good filters, the KAT500, the KPA-500 etc. Actually that is way over $7,000 I suspect. I have the KAT500 and KPA-500 and priced out a full bore K3s w good filters at $6,500 as I recall. That is less than the direct  competitor's offering,

I never said it was overpriced. What I said was, I'll add color now, from looking at Rob's most excellent rankings it appears the 6700 and K3s are statistically in a dead heat. I do not believe the 7300 is in the same league as either. However, if I were to listen to one play the violin, I wouldn't be able to tell whether they were using a Stradivarius or something from Walmart. At what point is a radio 'good enough'? On the other forum I asked that question, several times. Not to be provocative but because I couldn't tell. The answer I, essentially, got back was if you don't know, you don't deserve to own one. From what I understand, the IC-7300 comes in 3 flavors, 100w, 50w and 10w? Buy the 50w version and plug it into the KPA-500 and you have a 500w SDR for, likely, under $1,000 (out of pocket), complete with panadapter, knobs, dials, and rocker switches. That it isn't in win, place, or show on Rob's list? I am not sure that matters. How does it compare to the 590sg? I am certain Rob will let us know.

Walt


Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Richard Fjeld <rpfjeld@...>
 

I hate to reveal my ignorance, but isn't that one of the reasons I have a low pass filter in-line to my antenna system?
I would welcome a brief explanation if the low pass filter is not effective. 

Also, forgive me for posting a reply before I have read the entire list.  I jumped the gun awhile ago.

Dick, n0ce


    
On 4/10/2016 4:43 PM, ab2tc@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:
 

Hi Rob again,


Yes, the higher order products are the worst problem with most solid state transmitters. In tube transmitters there is the 3rd order and very little after that. In most solid state transmitters the spectrum goes on and on and on... This requires attention by mainstream companies, including Elecraft. I'd really like to see Elecraft take the lead with respect to SSB transmitter distortion. If there is ever a K4 it ought to have a clean transmitter. I don't really care about the receiver. If a direct sampling receiver saves them money and retains or improves the performance, kudos to them.


AB2TC - Knut





Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Richard Fjeld <rpfjeld@...>
 

I'd like to have those as well.  Thanks, Dick, n0ce


    
On 4/10/2016 4:03 PM, Rob Sherwood. rob@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:
 

You can sort it with Excel. I'll send instructions later. Rob, NC0B



> On Apr 10, 2016, at 2:23 PM, "dalej dj2001x@... [Elecraft_K3]" wrote:
>
>
>
> How true Rob.
>
> BTW, thanks for your receiver tests. It's the only one that I feel has consistency and that makes it easy at least for me to judge what is the best rig. I do wish I could sort it, but it's fine the way you have it.
>
> 73
> Dale, K9VUJ
>
> On 10, Apr 2016, at 15:06, Rob Sherwood. rob@... [Elecraft_K3] wrote:
>
> Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.
>
> Rob, NC0B
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> If this email is spam, report it to
> https://support.onlymyemail.com/view/report_spam/ODExMjI6MTg3MTA4ODQ3MDpyb2JAbmMwYi5jb206ZGVsaXZlcmVk
>



Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Dean LaClair
 

15k, Harry ? That's a "cheapie" hihi
73 Dean K2WW

On Apr 10, 2016 3:57 PM, "harry latterman harrylatterman@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:
 

I have a friend (none ham) who has over $15,000 invested in his bass board, trailer, motor, poles, reels and we are not even adding in the truck that hauls it... Hobbies can be expensive. 

2 cent
Harry  K7ZOV



From: "dalej dj2001x@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...>
To: Elecraft_K3@...
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 12:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Really?  Is the Elecraft K3 $7000 now??  Or did I misread again.

BTW, I've read about some hams spending $10000 plus on a rig and complaining about the price of a PL259, hi.

Dale, K9VUJ


On 10, Apr 2016, at 12:22, miscwrc@... [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:



This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons.  A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.

I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.






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FS: 2 KFL3-6K filters

pmoore44@...
 

For sale:

Two KFL3-6K AM/ESSB 8-Pole filters
$100 each
Please contact me off the reflector at:
AL7L at ARRL dot NET

TNX es 73 de AL7L



Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

mikerodgerske5gbc
 

Has icom been able to improve its barn door roofing filters or SDR equivalent ?

73
Mike R

Find me on "Zello", a walkie talkie or handi talkie type app. I'm listed as KE5GBC. I'm mostly on late at night. 

On Apr 10, 2016, at 6:45 PM, "w2blc@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:

 

A K3S and a P3 set up as I have my K3/P3 will run you about $4700. Although I really do think my rig is great - I seriously do wonder how the Elecraft will compare to the ICOM 7300 when the going gets tough.

Will I replace my Elecraft? Sure - you can pry it from my cold dead fingers!

Will I get an ICOM 7300 as a backup rig - quite possible. Just need to learn more. After all, I could just grab one of the older K3 rigs that ops are selling as they upgrade to the K3S.

No decisions are made quickly here. I prefer to be an educated buyer. And this seems to be the place to learn.

Bill W2BLC K-Line


Re: Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Tom Fitzgerald <kd0bcf@...>
 

Dale, I sure hope you're right about that price decrease on the IC-7300! That would be awesome and a refreshing change from the usual, "price increase notification" we all get from time to time from Elecraft and other companies...wouldn't it?

"Another point, who says Elecraft products are "overpriced"? How does one make that judgement anyway?"

Well, I say so, that's who! You're right about "one" needing to make that judgement for themselves though. I can afford any radio currently in production but I learned early on that a fool and his money are soon parted. That said, I think that most of the radios in production now (along with many other products on the market) are WAY overpriced. The way I make that judgement is very simple really. Most working class Americans haven't had a genuine pay raise in decades when you factor in the ever increasing & outpacing cost of living. When your income doesn't go up to keep up while everything else from cars to homes to food to health insurance to meds to fuel to whatever (ham radios) continues to go up and up and up toward the stratosphere and beyond to infinity...guess what? Look around you next time you're at a hamfest. The percentage of operators involved in the hobby that have unlimited disposable income to spend (and are WILLING to do so) is quite small, certainly not enough to support the entire industry, particularly with all the usual suspects pumping out these $3,000, 4,5,6,7,8,9 & $10,000 or more radios! No way no how! Sorry Charlie (Dale), "it's the economy stupid" as someone once said. ICOM probably wants to be the last company standing. They'll be just that too IMO unless these other companies follow suit and make more affordable products that still perform well. 

What/who exactly is on the air these days that justifies spending $3K or more to listen to and or talk to anyway???? Is hearing Goober talking to BillyJoeBobbySue about his latest gun purchase and the 327,568 rounds of ammo he has hidden around his property for when the zombie apocalypse begins worth spending $3K on? Really? Ah, must be the various extremist nets that dot the bands? No? Do you need to spend that sort of cash to say hi to your ham friends on the weekly or nightly net and let them know what you did today? Maybe you need to spend it for that 3.5 second contest contact? To send a CW or digital transmission? Nah...I think it's mostly ego and bragging rights. Just my opinion though and you know what "they" say about opinions. Thank you ICOM. 

kd0bcf

                


Re: [Elecraft_K3] K3s S Meter Accuracy

billincolo73@...
 

Knut,

I have found no reference to the S9+40 optional cal procedure in the K3s owner's manual. The K3s procedure only calls out input signal levels of 50uv and 1uv. If the optional high level procedure is called out somewhere other than the manual, could you pass along where it is located. Also, the K3s CONFIG menu only lists four SMTR xx options, and none of them refer to a high level cal. I wonder if the K3s procedure was changed from the original K3 procedure.

Thanks,


Bill  N0CU


Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

w2blc@...
 

A K3S and a P3 set up as I have my K3/P3 will run you about $4700. Although I really do think my rig is great - I seriously do wonder how the Elecraft will compare to the ICOM 7300 when the going gets tough.

Will I replace my Elecraft? Sure - you can pry it from my cold dead fingers!

Will I get an ICOM 7300 as a backup rig - quite possible. Just need to learn more. After all, I could just grab one of the older K3 rigs that ops are selling as they upgrade to the K3S.

No decisions are made quickly here. I prefer to be an educated buyer. And this seems to be the place to learn.

Bill W2BLC K-Line


Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

dalej <dj2001x@...>
 

Not sure how or what that compares to. My K3 sure didn't cost $7000.

73
Dale, K9VUJ

On 10, Apr 2016, at 17:28, "Oliver Dröse droese@necg.de [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Dale,


he wrote the K-Line is $7000, not the K3S. ;-)


73, Olli - DH8BQA


Contest, DX & radio projects: http://www.dh8bqa.de




Am 10.04.2016 um 21:31 schrieb dalej dj2001x@comcast.net [Elecraft_K3]:
Really? Is the Elecraft K3 $7000 now?? Or did I misread again.

BTW, I've read about some hams spending $10000 plus on a rig and complaining about the price of a PL259, hi.

Dale, K9VUJ


On 10, Apr 2016, at 12:22, miscwrc@ct.metrocast.net [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons. A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.

I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.





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Posted by: =?UTF-8?Q?Oliver_Dr=c3=b6se?= <droese@necg.de>
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Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

William Conkling <bconk75@...>
 

And how is that relevant. I realize you didn't write the original but I don't think the new ICOM is a 500 Watt transceiver. That's like comparing  GM and FORD with an Escalade and an Explorer. 

...nr4c. bill


On Apr 10, 2016, at 6:28 PM, Oliver Dröse droese@... [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:

 

Dale,

he wrote the K-Line is $7000, not the K3S. ;-)

73, Olli - DH8BQA

Contest, DX & radio projects: http://www.dh8bqa.de

Am 10.04.2016 um 21:31 schrieb dalej dj2001x@... [Elecraft_K3]:
> Really? Is the Elecraft K3 $7000 now?? Or did I misread again.
>
> BTW, I've read about some hams spending $10000 plus on a rig and complaining about the price of a PL259, hi.
>
> Dale, K9VUJ
>
>
> On 10, Apr 2016, at 12:22, miscwrc@... [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons. A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.
>
> I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>


Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Olli
 

Dale,


he wrote the K-Line is $7000, not the K3S. ;-)


73, Olli - DH8BQA


Contest, DX & radio projects: http://www.dh8bqa.de




Am 10.04.2016 um 21:31 schrieb dalej dj2001x@comcast.net [Elecraft_K3]:

Really? Is the Elecraft K3 $7000 now?? Or did I misread again.

BTW, I've read about some hams spending $10000 plus on a rig and complaining about the price of a PL259, hi.

Dale, K9VUJ


On 10, Apr 2016, at 12:22, miscwrc@ct.metrocast.net [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons. A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.

I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.





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------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links




Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

ab2tc
 

Hi Rob again,


Yes, the higher order products are the worst problem with most solid state transmitters. In tube transmitters there is the 3rd order and very little after that. In most solid state transmitters the spectrum goes on and on and on... This requires attention by mainstream companies, including Elecraft. I'd really like to see Elecraft take the lead with respect to SSB transmitter distortion. If there is ever a K4 it ought to have a clean transmitter. I don't really care about the receiver. If a direct sampling receiver saves them money and retains or improves the performance, kudos to them.


AB2TC - Knut



---In Elecraft_K3@..., <rob@...> wrote :

Knut,

 

How true, with few exceptions.  A Yaesu in class A, if NO ALC or processing is run is quite clean, the ANAN has pre-distortion that helps a lot, but otherwise it has been down hill from the Collins 32S-3.  The FT-450 is 29 dB worse on 9th order than the 32S-3.  

 

Rob, NC0B

 

From: Elecraft_K3@... [mailto:Elecraft_K3@...]
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 2:54 PM
To: Elecraft_K3@...
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

 

 

Hi Rob,

 

I agree with you on the progress in receivers. On SSB they are now *way* better than can ever be utilized as transmitters are way too dirty. Unfortunately on the TX side there has been no progress, just the opposite. Today's solid state  transmitters (including Elecraft's) on SSB are *way* dirtier than the tube ones of the past. It *can* be done in solid state. A number of technologies have been suggested but none have been adopted by mainstream companies. It's a real pity.

 

AB2TC - Knut



---In Elecraft_K3@..., <rob@...> wrote :

Everyone's disposable income is different. As I neared retirement, I bought a house on 10 acres out in the sticks to play ham radio. How crazy is that?  If we look at the top radios on my web site, once I get the IC-7851 posted, they are the Flex 6700, the K3S and the IC-7851. Hard to argue one is significantly better than the other. Different architectures: direct sampling, down conversion and up conversation.  Price ranges in round numbers $3K to $7K to $14K.  

 

The Apache ANAN is also a good radio and they don't have to pay a dime for software. 

 

Operationally the user interfaces are different, and I know I cannot watch 7 bands at once. I doubt I could do SO2R !  We can now buy a really nice TS-590SG for $$1300, and an IC-7300 for $1500, less if you want to wait a month or two.  Lots of choices for radios that all perform well in adverse conditions.  Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.

 

Rob, NC0B

 

On Apr 10, 2016, at 1:03 PM, "miscwrc@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:

 

This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons.  A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.

I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.

 

If this email is spam, report it to www.OnlyMyEmail.com

 

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Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

dalej <dj2001x@...>
 

I wish I were a 25 year old today, hi.

Thanks for all you guys do.

Dale, k9vuj

On 10, Apr 2016, at 16:13, Rob Sherwood. rob@nc0b.com [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Here is how N7US figured out how to sort my web table.

In case anyone else wants to download Sherwood's Receiver Test Data
(http://www.sherweng.com/table.html) into an Excel spreadsheet, there's an
easy way to do it if you have Excel 2007.

Open a new worksheet and select the Data ribbon. Then click on "From Web"
in the "Get External Data" box and copy in the URL into the pop-up box. It
will see the table on the web page and highlight it so you can select and
import the data. You still have to pretty it up but the data is pulled in
without entering it manually.

Jim N7US

73, Rob, NC0B

From: Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 3:03 PM
To: <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300


You can sort it with Excel. I'll send instructions later. Rob, NC0B
On Apr 10, 2016, at 2:23 PM, "dalej dj2001x@comcast.net [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



How true Rob.

BTW, thanks for your receiver tests. It's the only one that I feel has consistency and that makes it easy at least for me to judge what is the best rig. I do wish I could sort it, but it's fine the way you have it.

73
Dale, K9VUJ

On 10, Apr 2016, at 15:06, Rob Sherwood. rob@nc0b.com [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.

Rob, NC0B

Sent from my iPad


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Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Rob Sherwood
 

Here is how N7US figured out how to sort my web table.

 

In case anyone else wants to download Sherwood's Receiver Test Data
(http://www.sherweng.com/table.html) into an Excel spreadsheet, there's an
easy way to do it if you have Excel 2007.

Open a new worksheet and select the Data ribbon. Then click on "From Web"
in the "Get External Data" box and copy in the URL into the pop-up box. It
will see the table on the web page and highlight it so you can select and
import the data. You still have to pretty it up but the data is pulled in
without entering it manually.

Jim N7US

 

73, Rob, NC0B

 

From: Elecraft_K3@... [mailto:Elecraft_K3@...]
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 3:03 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

 

 

You can sort it with Excel. I'll send instructions later. Rob, NC0B



> On Apr 10, 2016, at 2:23 PM, "dalej dj2001x@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> How true Rob.
>
> BTW, thanks for your receiver tests. It's the only one that I feel has consistency and that makes it easy at least for me to judge what is the best rig. I do wish I could sort it, but it's fine the way you have it.
>
> 73
> Dale, K9VUJ
>
> On 10, Apr 2016, at 15:06, Rob Sherwood. rob@... [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:
>
> Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.
>
> Rob, NC0B
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> If this email is spam, report it to
> https://support.onlymyemail.com/view/report_spam/ODExMjI6MTg3MTA4ODQ3MDpyb2JAbmMwYi5jb206ZGVsaXZlcmVk
>

 


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Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Rob Sherwood
 

Knut,

 

How true, with few exceptions.  A Yaesu in class A, if NO ALC or processing is run is quite clean, the ANAN has pre-distortion that helps a lot, but otherwise it has been down hill from the Collins 32S-3.  The FT-450 is 29 dB worse on 9th order than the 32S-3.  

 

Rob, NC0B

 

From: Elecraft_K3@... [mailto:Elecraft_K3@...]
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2016 2:54 PM
To: Elecraft_K3@...
Subject: Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

 

 

Hi Rob,

 

I agree with you on the progress in receivers. On SSB they are now *way* better than can ever be utilized as transmitters are way too dirty. Unfortunately on the TX side there has been no progress, just the opposite. Today's solid state  transmitters (including Elecraft's) on SSB are *way* dirtier than the tube ones of the past. It *can* be done in solid state. A number of technologies have been suggested but none have been adopted by mainstream companies. It's a real pity.

 

AB2TC - Knut



---In Elecraft_K3@..., <rob@...> wrote :

Everyone's disposable income is different. As I neared retirement, I bought a house on 10 acres out in the sticks to play ham radio. How crazy is that?  If we look at the top radios on my web site, once I get the IC-7851 posted, they are the Flex 6700, the K3S and the IC-7851. Hard to argue one is significantly better than the other. Different architectures: direct sampling, down conversion and up conversation.  Price ranges in round numbers $3K to $7K to $14K.  

 

The Apache ANAN is also a good radio and they don't have to pay a dime for software. 

 

Operationally the user interfaces are different, and I know I cannot watch 7 bands at once. I doubt I could do SO2R !  We can now buy a really nice TS-590SG for $$1300, and an IC-7300 for $1500, less if you want to wait a month or two.  Lots of choices for radios that all perform well in adverse conditions.  Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.

 

Rob, NC0B

 

On Apr 10, 2016, at 1:03 PM, "miscwrc@... [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@...> wrote:

 

This is such an interesting topic for a variety of reasons.  A question I've been asking, for what seems like forever, is "so just how are SDR radios better. The take away from Rob Sherwood's most excellent web page (table) is (I will be sent to hell for this) they aren't. Not on the technical merits. Here's what I think, from the perspective of the vendor, ABSOLUTELY, because they are far less expensive to manufacture. Yes, the software is expensive, especially if you put it in one radio. But if the software engineering effort is spread across thousands of radios the per radio software cost is low. I am, for the sake of this discussion, discounting multiple simultaneously opened bands, despite the fact you can only talk on one of them. People will come back with it has a panadapter to graphically display the band segment. Yep, and so does the $1,000 IC-730.

I think it is a myth that ham radio operators are cheap. They will drop $9,000 on a Flex, $7,000 on a K-line, $10,000 on a MonsterIR, and some additional thousands on a tower. And that's for the ones that don't build out a farm. All on the mistaken belief more expensive is better. I suspect the real benefit of SDR accrues to the manufacturer. In that sense, I suspect the IC-7300 will be ICOM's most profitable ham radio. It may not be their best but I suspect it is their most profitable...as will the IC-7351 when it becomes their top of the line radio.

 

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Re: [Elecraft_K3] Compare the K3 with the IC-7300

Rob Sherwood
 

You can sort it with Excel. I'll send instructions later. Rob, NC0B

On Apr 10, 2016, at 2:23 PM, "dalej dj2001x@comcast.net [Elecraft_K3]" <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



How true Rob.

BTW, thanks for your receiver tests. It's the only one that I feel has consistency and that makes it easy at least for me to judge what is the best rig. I do wish I could sort it, but it's fine the way you have it.

73
Dale, K9VUJ

On 10, Apr 2016, at 15:06, Rob Sherwood. rob@nc0b.com [Elecraft_K3] <Elecraft_K3@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Look how far we have come from when the Orion broke new ground in 2003 after 20+ years of mediocre 70 dB radio, and then the K3 in 2008.

Rob, NC0B

Sent from my iPad


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