Date   

Re: Elad Duo Overload Performance Measurements

Clint Chron
 

Hi Klaus,

 

The author of the article was Rob.  I have a 2020 email from Rob with the same Elad Duo report.  I was comparing notes with Rob on a couple of questionable performance areas – I had much better test results of my Duo.  Rob acknowledged that perhaps he had a defective Duo and would test again if he could get hold of a more recent unit.

 

I like the QST product reviews – lots of good measured technical specs, but I cannot totally depend upon those reviews to give the complete picture on the performance of a radio.  Sometimes, the written review does not totally match with the measured specs.  A typical example would be some of the noisy transmitters that have been reviewed.  The specs plainly show the noise trash, but no mention is made of this noise trash in the write-up.  A much older example is the SGC SG-2020 transceiver.  The ones with the ADSP-II module always sounded terrible on SSB.  I owned four of them at different times – I wanted to make sure that I did not have a bad unit.  I went back and reviewed the QST product review.  No mention was made of the terrible sounding audio, but the measured receiver audio response identified the problem.  Today, when someone asks me about the SG-2020, I tell them it is a great radio but the audio on SSB sounds terrible and the alignment procedure is impossible unless you get the customized cal settings from SGC.

 

ARRL is in a difficult position.  The organization exists because of advertising dollar revenue.  If they upset the big manufacturers by writing critical reviews, then ARRL will soon be out of business.  Some radio manufacturers never submitted their radios to QST for testing.  Typical examples would be the Atlas 210 series and the Swan series.  I can only guess that the QST testing process would turn up a number of serious issues.  Conversely, I never saw any reviews for the Collin’s S line and the Drake TR series of transceiver.   I think that it also should be noted that much of the current Product Review receiver testing process is a direct result of push-back from Rob and Adam Farson.  It took them several years to convince the product testers to update their testing process to more accurately depict actual receiver performance.

 

So to balance the info in QST product reviews, I also have to read the write-up from Rob and Adam Farson.  For Rob’s receiver result test site, one can easily rank the radios on other factors.  I feel confident that his current ranking is accurate and Rob will tell you that any of the top ten radios would work good for just about anyone.

 

The Elad Duo is in a unique niche market – it does things that no other radio will do.  I have an IC-7300 and I like the radio.  Its overload performance is slightly better than the Elad Duo.  I keep going back to the Elad Duo because of the finely detailed spectrum display with the SW2 software, the small size, the 0 dbm output signal generator, and the product support.    

 

73

Clint

W7KEC

 

 

 

 

 

From: EladSDR@groups.io [mailto:EladSDR@groups.io] On Behalf Of Klaus Brosche
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 2:56 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io
Subject: Re: [EladSDR] Elad Duo Overload Performance Measurements

 

Hi Clint,

 

It was ME!

 

In Sherwoods 'official' list, which he calls 'Receiver Test Data', there is no entry about the DUO.
Thats for sure, I've just checked that list again just a minute ago.

 

The data published re. the link you've provided are from 2015, as far as the date code is concerned,
and it is totally unclear to me who the author of this writing was!

 

This writing is not signed by Sherwood nor does any DUO performance entries show up at
Sherwoods list!

 

For any performance ratings of the DUO, I'd rather rely on the QST reviews dated May 2016.

 

IMHO, QST reviews have a coherent testing methodology which is also published and explained.

 

However, sometimes you need to read 'between the lines' or definitely read their 'sidebars' ;-)

 

Klaus, DK3QN

 

 

Am 17.10.2020 um 16:46 schrieb Clint Chron:

Someone mentioned that there was not any receiver test reports for the Elad Duo on Rob Sherwood's site.  Rob provided test results in this link:
https://www.dj0ip.de/sherwood-forest/sherwood-hf-xcvr-tests/elad-ftm-duo/

The Elad S2 receiver has the same basic receiver as the Duo.  In this link, Adam Farson provides test results for the S2:

https://www.ab4oj.com/sdr/elad/fdm_s2_notes.pdf

The overload capability of the Elad Duo compares very favorably with other high end SDR radios.  If you add a receiver band pass filter, the overload results are among the best of the class.

Please note that the high end analog transceivers still have better overload performance than most SDR receivers.

73
Clint
W7KEC

 


Re: Duo with pc headset ssb #eladduo

Neil Smith G4DBN
 

Hi Paul I use a G4DDK Anglian transverter to get the DUO on to 144, but it is quite simple to get around the mathematical and technological issues with the DUO at 144 MHz.  Running 144 MHz on a 122.88 MHz sampled A/D converter means you lose a lot of sensitivity simply because of the way sampling works. The noise figure of the DUO at 144 MHz is extremely poor as a result.  Also there is aliasing, so you get noise from the image frequency as well, and Band 2 FM broadcast breakthrough from around 100 MHz.

Andy G4JNT has designed a filter and amplifier board to improve the DUO performance on 144. Have a look at http://www.g4jnt.com/FDM-DUO_at_VHF.pdf <http://www.g4jnt.com/FDM-DUO_at_VHF.pdf> where all is explained...

Neil G4DBN

On 17/10/2020 23:19, Paul Andrews wrote:
Neil,

Do you use a 144 MHz IF with your 10 GHz system.   I tried using my FDM-DUO configured for 144 MHz with a Khune transverter.  I was not successful looking for the beacon.

73 - Paul - W2HRO


Re: Need Help with FDM SW2 Load Please

Pete
 

Bill
THANK YOU!!
After a day and a half of fruitless pounding my head against the wall you have solved my problem. IT NOW WORKS!
This forum is an endless source of information.
Again, thank you my friend.

Pete


Re: Duo with pc headset ssb #eladduo

Paul Andrews
 

Neil,

Do you use a 144 MHz IF with your 10 GHz system.   I tried using my FDM-DUO configured for 144 MHz with a Khune transverter.  I was not successful looking for the beacon.

73 - Paul - W2HRO

On Sat, Oct 17, 2020, 17:28 Neil Smith G4DBN <neil@...> wrote:

Hi Mark, have you tried enabling Advanced TX mode and setting the input device to your headset?

Mine looks like this with my Sennheiser headset. I use a footswitch on transmit, wired into the RJ45, but you can enable VOX or use the PTT button on the Advanced TX panel.  I just sang myself a few notes into the Mow Cop WebSDR on 10 GHz, 150 km away over the Pennines, using the DUO as the IF driver for my 10 GHz transverter and it worked fine. 

It also works if you pipe the audio stream via a Virtual Audio Cable instead of using the headset mic device and pick the VAC as the audio in device.  Can't say I ever do it this way in live use because I prefer my Heil Pro7, which plugs into the RJ45 and the headphone jack.

Neil
http://g4dbn.uk

On 17/10/2020 12:24, Mark Wickens wrote:
Hi

My first post. I haven't found an answer on the internet. Is not possible to use a pc headset to transmit SSB via the duo? I have a SunSDR2 Pro and can operate that completely remotely via the pc and headset. Appreciate that with the three usb interfaces the pc will need to be connected direct to the transceiver. 

Many thanks for the help. 

Mark.


Re: Need Help with FDM SW2 Load Please

Bill Nollman
 

Pete;

 

If you only installed the 53MiB v3.045 without first installing a complete earlier release that would explain your problem.

Install the 113 MiB v3.027 first - http://eladit.com/download/sdr/FDM-sw2%20Software/Current%20release/3_027_FDM-SW2_Complete%20(first%20installation).zip

Then install v3.045 and you should have all of the dependencies.

 

Bill

 

From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> On Behalf Of Pete
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 5:37 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io
Subject: [EladSDR] Need Help with FDM SW2 Load Please

 

A little background info first: My new S3 will run on my old clunky i5 computer with v3.045 but it struggles with the wider bandwidths.
I got a new (to me) i5 Gen 8 with 8 GB RAM Win 10 machine and then downloaded v3,045 from the ELAD site.
The problem is when FDM SW2 is launched I get the Microsoft.NET Framework error "Could not load file or assembly 'BasicIFDLib.dll' or one of its dependencies. The specified module could not be found".  I checked and found the .dll in the X86  Program files ELAD folder. Suspecting that it was corrupted I copied the .dll from my old computer on to a thumb drive and replaced the .dll in the new machine. No joy.
I then deleted all ELAD files from the new machine, then copied 'ELAD_FDMSW2Setup_v3_045.msi' to the thumbdrive from the my old machine and loaded and launched SW2 in the new machine. SAME THING.
The problem is with the new machine. I allowed 'ELAD FDMSW2' and 'ELADSampler'  in Windows Defender Firewall to communicate. Again no joy.
I am at my wits end. Could one of you computer gurus (and I know you're out there) PLEASE HELP? I would be eternally grateful.

Pete


Re: Elad Duo Overload Performance Measurements

Klaus Brosche, DK3QN
 

Hi Clint,

It was ME!

In Sherwoods 'official' list, which he calls 'Receiver Test Data', there is no entry about the DUO.
Thats for sure, I've just checked that list again just a minute ago.

The data published re. the link you've provided are from 2015, as far as the date code is concerned,
and it is totally unclear to me who the
author of this writing was!

This writing is not signed by Sherwood nor does any DUO performance entries show up at
Sherwoods list!

For any performance ratings of the DUO, I'd rather rely on the QST reviews dated May 2016.

IMHO, QST reviews have a coherent testing methodology which is also published and explained.

However, sometimes you need to read 'between the lines' or definitely read their 'sidebars' ;-)

Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 16:46 schrieb Clint Chron:

Someone mentioned that there was not any receiver test reports for the Elad Duo on Rob Sherwood's site.  Rob provided test results in this link:
https://www.dj0ip.de/sherwood-forest/sherwood-hf-xcvr-tests/elad-ftm-duo/

The Elad S2 receiver has the same basic receiver as the Duo.  In this link, Adam Farson provides test results for the S2:

https://www.ab4oj.com/sdr/elad/fdm_s2_notes.pdf

The overload capability of the Elad Duo compares very favorably with other high end SDR radios.  If you add a receiver band pass filter, the overload results are among the best of the class.

Please note that the high end analog transceivers still have better overload performance than most SDR receivers.

73
Clint
W7KEC



Need Help with FDM SW2 Load Please

Pete
 

A little background info first: My new S3 will run on my old clunky i5 computer with v3.045 but it struggles with the wider bandwidths.
I got a new (to me) i5 Gen 8 with 8 GB RAM Win 10 machine and then downloaded v3,045 from the ELAD site.
The problem is when FDM SW2 is launched I get the Microsoft.NET Framework error "Could not load file or assembly 'BasicIFDLib.dll' or one of its dependencies. The specified module could not be found".  I checked and found the .dll in the X86  Program files ELAD folder. Suspecting that it was corrupted I copied the .dll from my old computer on to a thumb drive and replaced the .dll in the new machine. No joy.
I then deleted all ELAD files from the new machine, then copied 'ELAD_FDMSW2Setup_v3_045.msi' to the thumbdrive from the my old machine and loaded and launched SW2 in the new machine. SAME THING.
The problem is with the new machine. I allowed 'ELAD FDMSW2' and 'ELADSampler'  in Windows Defender Firewall to communicate. Again no joy.
I am at my wits end. Could one of you computer gurus (and I know you're out there) PLEASE HELP? I would be eternally grateful.

Pete


Re: Duo with pc headset ssb #eladduo

Neil Smith G4DBN
 

Hi Mark, have you tried enabling Advanced TX mode and setting the input device to your headset?

Mine looks like this with my Sennheiser headset. I use a footswitch on transmit, wired into the RJ45, but you can enable VOX or use the PTT button on the Advanced TX panel.  I just sang myself a few notes into the Mow Cop WebSDR on 10 GHz, 150 km away over the Pennines, using the DUO as the IF driver for my 10 GHz transverter and it worked fine. 

It also works if you pipe the audio stream via a Virtual Audio Cable instead of using the headset mic device and pick the VAC as the audio in device.  Can't say I ever do it this way in live use because I prefer my Heil Pro7, which plugs into the RJ45 and the headphone jack.

Neil
http://g4dbn.uk

On 17/10/2020 12:24, Mark Wickens wrote:
Hi

My first post. I haven't found an answer on the internet. Is not possible to use a pc headset to transmit SSB via the duo? I have a SunSDR2 Pro and can operate that completely remotely via the pc and headset. Appreciate that with the three usb interfaces the pc will need to be connected direct to the transceiver. 

Many thanks for the help. 

Mark.


Duo with pc headset ssb #eladduo

Mark Wickens <mark@...>
 

Hi

My first post. I haven't found an answer on the internet. Is not possible to use a pc headset to transmit SSB via the duo? I have a SunSDR2 Pro and can operate that completely remotely via the pc and headset. Appreciate that with the three usb interfaces the pc will need to be connected direct to the transceiver. 

Many thanks for the help. 

Mark. 


Re: New Duo X

PAUL-M7PVS
 

Ahh ok :) well it’s a shame there is no native Mac app for this as a Mac user as well as windows and Linux but I think flex have got it wrong by having a. Free app for windows and a pay for app for the flex but as we all know software developers cost lots of money


From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> on behalf of Mike Chace-Ortiz <mchaceortiz@...>
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 3:28:59 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [EladSDR] New Duo X
 
It was Paul, 

I was addressing the other Paul (Elad USA) about my experience with the SunSDR. macOS native software but RX lacking compared to FDM-S2.

73
—mco

On Oct 17, 2020, at 10:22, PAUL-M7PVS <psloper@...> wrote:

I thought it was something to do with apple ;)


From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> on behalf of Klaus Brosche <klaus.brosche@...>
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 3:19:31 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [EladSDR] New Duo X
 
Besides the international standard of 'Q code' abbreviations, there are quite
a number of ham radio specific abbreviations used in CW traffic.
That is to speed up the communication flow.

The word "sorry" in morse code would be sent like this:
...  ---  .-.  .-.  -.--  (5 letters)

"sri" looks like this:
...  .-.  ..   (3 letters)

A list of these specific ham radio abbreviations can be found here:
https://cwops.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/CW-Abbreviations.pdf

72, Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Paul White:
"sri"?
What am I missing?




New Elad FDM-S3

Larry Dodd
 

First impressions include a super receiver and software. Well done Elad team. The spectrograph is clean and sensitive. I don’t have any numbers to share now but will in the weeks to come. What a beautiful receiver. I’m using a nanosecond accurate GPS receiver as an input reference signal. Working exactly as it should. Takes time to learn the software. It also works well on Simon Browns SDRConsole. Thanks Elad!
Larry, K4LED


Elad Duo Overload Performance Measurements

Clint Chron
 

Someone mentioned that there was not any receiver test reports for the Elad Duo on Rob Sherwood's site.  Rob provided test results in this link:
https://www.dj0ip.de/sherwood-forest/sherwood-hf-xcvr-tests/elad-ftm-duo/

The Elad S2 receiver has the same basic receiver as the Duo.  In this link, Adam Farson provides test results for the S2:

https://www.ab4oj.com/sdr/elad/fdm_s2_notes.pdf

The overload capability of the Elad Duo compares very favorably with other high end SDR radios.  If you add a receiver band pass filter, the overload results are among the best of the class.

Please note that the high end analog transceivers still have better overload performance than most SDR receivers.

73
Clint
W7KEC


Re: New Duo X

Mike Chace-Ortiz
 

It was Paul, 

I was addressing the other Paul (Elad USA) about my experience with the SunSDR. macOS native software but RX lacking compared to FDM-S2.

73
—mco

On Oct 17, 2020, at 10:22, PAUL-M7PVS <psloper@...> wrote:

I thought it was something to do with apple ;)


From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> on behalf of Klaus Brosche <klaus.brosche@...>
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 3:19:31 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [EladSDR] New Duo X
 
Besides the international standard of 'Q code' abbreviations, there are quite
a number of ham radio specific abbreviations used in CW traffic.
That is to speed up the communication flow.

The word "sorry" in morse code would be sent like this:
...  ---  .-.  .-.  -.--  (5 letters)

"sri" looks like this:
...  .-.  ..   (3 letters)

A list of these specific ham radio abbreviations can be found here:
https://cwops.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/CW-Abbreviations.pdf

72, Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Paul White:
"sri"?
What am I missing?




Re: New Duo X

PAUL-M7PVS
 

I thought it was something to do with apple ;)


From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> on behalf of Klaus Brosche <klaus.brosche@...>
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 3:19:31 PM
To: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [EladSDR] New Duo X
 
Besides the international standard of 'Q code' abbreviations, there are quite
a number of ham radio specific abbreviations used in CW traffic.
That is to speed up the communication flow.

The word "sorry" in morse code would be sent like this:
...  ---  .-.  .-.  -.--  (5 letters)

"sri" looks like this:
...  .-.  ..   (3 letters)

A list of these specific ham radio abbreviations can be found here:
https://cwops.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/CW-Abbreviations.pdf

72, Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Paul White:
"sri"?
What am I missing?



Re: New Duo X

Klaus Brosche, DK3QN
 

Besides the international standard of 'Q code' abbreviations, there are quite
a number of ham radio specific abbreviations used in CW traffic.
That is to speed up the communication flow.

The word "sorry" in morse code would be sent like this:
...  ---  .-.  .-.  -.--  (5 letters)

"sri" looks like this:
...  .-.  ..   (3 letters)

A list of these specific ham radio abbreviations can be found here:
https://cwops.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/CW-Abbreviations.pdf

72, Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Paul White:

"sri"?
What am I missing?



Re: New Duo X

Klaus Brosche, DK3QN
 

"sri"

It's a CW morse code abbreviaton, short form for "sorry".

Klaus, DK3QN


Am 17.10.2020 um 15:32 schrieb Paul White:

"sri"?
What am I missing?



Re: New Duo X

Paul White
 

"sri"?
What am I missing?


Re: S3 versus S2 -- What are the advantages of the S3?

hf_linkz
 

Actually a Dell E5510 laptop with i5 M560 2.67GHz SSD 8GB RAM
but main problem is : no native USB3

I'm still having fun with the S2 on a daily basis, since 2014. FDM-SW2 is the best software I've ever met, it is so customizable, thanks for that

For the story of my S2:
March 2019 I've made an error, I've sent RF power in the HF RX input so of course it killed some components (visually detected: D1 & U4 "283")
I'm not electronician and not equiped to work on SMD size components but I've tried and "successfully" sacrified the VHF input by moving U8 to U4 location and that worked, what a surprise hehe..
But something else has probably burnt in the filter board as I get wide and ugly spurious images from the 88-108 wFM band all over the HF spectrum
Problem solved with a high quality 70MHz LP filter from SV1AFN in the HF coax line..

My device has suffered a lot but it continues to give me a lot of pleasure, I'll probably upgrade to a S3 later but I'm gonna have to spend a lot of money for the computer upgrade and the SDR options (waiting for the downconverter)
I'm sure it will be worth it

&linkz


Re: New Duo X

Klaus Brosche, DK3QN
 

Hi Guillermo,

And sri to the group for this brief off topic ;-)

G90 is known to me, not personally, but from YouTube and web posts.

TX-500 by lab599 is completely new to me. Watched some videos on
YT today and I'm not daring to judge on this "From Russia with Love"
(James Bond movie, hi).

Anyway, thanks for your post and stay safe!

Klaus, DK3QN


Am 16.10.2020 um 00:39 schrieb Guillermo via groups.io:

Hi Klaus.

I got a Xiegu G90 and a few days ago I received a lab599 TX-500.  The latter one is incredible!  Both were way less expensive than the FDM-DUO (which I still like very much) and offered other things like an internal tuner (G90) not found in the Elad.  The TX-500 has no tuner but either with a resonant antenna or a small manual tuner (i.e. ZM-2 ATU) they work perfectly.

I operate portable and on batteries out in the countryside.  Lately with a 9:1 unun and a long wire.  Best operating I´ve done in a long time.  All SSB.   Power is from 1 to 20W maximum, depending on what radio I take with me.  The G90 is 20W and the TX-500 is 10W.  And no, life is NOT too short to work QRP!  It tells me a lot about the other hams' antenna system and working conditons.  If anyone can hear me they have a good station and my hat is off to them!  If all they can hear are the 59+ stations, meh!

Recently a group of my ham friends and I did testing on the 40M band here.  There were seven of us in different parts  of our region and at different altitudes above sea level.  All had different types of antennas, different rigs, etc.  I was the only one portable.  Also the time at which we tested (10 am to 12pm) was not the best for that band.  Distances between stations were from 20-400km.  Nevertheless we could all copy each other with low power, 5W or less.  The furthest station from me (400km) could copy me at 5W.  Some were so bold as to use only 400mW and we could still copy each other.  Then without any preamp on TX and we coul still copy some.  So the old rule of "use only the power needed to make the contact" proves true.

73 de Guillermo - HK4KM



Re: SW2 v3.45

Bill Nollman
 

384k in WBFM REALLY !!???!!

It’s not even Christmas yet.

THANK YOU!!!

Bill

 

A screenshot of a computer

Description automatically generated

 

From: EladSDR@groups.io <EladSDR@groups.io> On Behalf Of Vianney Colombat
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2020 9:41 AM
To: EladSDR@groups.io
Subject: [EladSDR] SW2 v3.45

 


Hello,

here http://sdr.eladit.com/download/FDM-sw2%20Software/Under%20test/index.php?lang=EN you can find SW2 version 3.45 with the new WBFM demodulation extended to 384k.

Regards,

Vianney

1201 - 1220 of 19579