Date   
Furnace article ommission

John Waite <jwaite@...
 

Hi All,
Curtis just pointed out to me that there was a printer's error in the
furnace article. I just checked it out and it was a pretty sizable
ommission. Here is the text as it should be (I'll include this correction in
the next Stemwinder):

The Carnegie Furnace was apparently the second Bessemer-type blast furnace
to be constructed in Tennessee, and maybe the South. One Johnson City writer
boasted that there was "but one other furnace of this kind in the South,"
apparently referring to the Bessemer furnace constructed at Chattanooga in
1887. However, within the next few years Bessemer furnaces were constructed
throughout the South, mainly at Birmingham.

The Carnegie Furnace featured a 75-foot high furnace, three hot-blast
stoves, a 160-foot high chimney, three 600 horsepower boilers, three 200
horsepower steam blast engines, and two enormous open sheds for the cast
house and stock house. The stock house held the ore, coke, and limestone.
Water for the steam engines was to come from an adjacent man-made pond fed
by Brush Creek.

The furnace was built to have a 125-ton capacity, meaning that it could
produce 125 tons of steel per day. This was more than double the production
capacity of the coke-fueled blast furnace Wilder built at Rockwood, and it
was more than either of the large blast furnaces he constructed at Dayton.

Hope you all enjoyed this issue of the Stemwinder, look forward to hearing
from you.
John Waite Technology Coordinator
De Soto Public Schools De Soto, Missouri
Home: 1-314-586-4573 Work: 1-314-586-1005
E-Mail: jwaite@...
vdd000@...

Stemwinder and the Furnace

Curtis Brookshire <curtis.brookshire@...>
 

I got my Stemwinder yesterday, so you should be seeing yours soon also (I
always thought I was the last to get them). The furnace is featured this
issue.

I enjoy discovering the story behind the people that influenced the ET&WNC
and its communities. Reading about the industrialists like John Wilder adds
a big time perspective to the same road that gave us the legends of Cy
Crumley and Sherman Pippin. Thanks to John and those who contribute to the
Stemwinder for opening these windows for us great unwashed.

It astonishes me whenever I consider the amount of heavy industry
concentrated in the Johnson City/Elizabethton area especially at the turn of
the century. It's incredible to see that the bucolic narrow gauge that
served the isolated mountains also served heavy industry. It's equally
unbelievable to see a blast furnace with a narrow gauge serving it. The
fact that the Southern had the majority connection makes it more credible.
But here is another modelling possibility for those who are square footage
challenged as well as those who have a gym sized room. It's fairly easy to
design a shelf switching layout just with heavy industry, never leaving the
Johnson City area and be completely occupied.

Enjoy your reading,
Curtis

[rrdiana] Need help with a Climax... and Viagra won't help

Bob Webber <RSWEBBER@...>
 

Saw this on the RRDIANA list - if anyone has information, could they pass
it on to the list & Matt? Thanks ,Bob


Can anyone help trace a Climax locomotive from Thermal City, North Carolina?
I have a source that says it was sold to the narrow gauge Lawndale Railway &
Industrial Company in 1899, and then sold to unknown parties in 1902.

Help!!!!

Thanks,

Matt Bumgarner

Re: No.12

Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>
 

Ken,

You all be sure and thank those shop boys for all that hard work they do.
It is hot, hard, heavy, dirty work and they all take a lot of pride in what
they do and do a damn fine job.
Thank them all for me too. When I saw the work being done in the shop
I was very impressed. There is no substitute for skilled workers and
good tools. Without the workers the tools are useless; with them they
sing.

Have a great weekend everyone. I'll be there in spirit at least. Be
sure and take lots of photos and send me some to put up on the web
page!

Cheers,
Rick
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Rick Blanchard
rick@...
San Diego, CA

My East Tennessee and Western North Carolina web site:
http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/etwnc.html

Re: No.12

mwest@...
 

Ken, Thanks so much for that very detailed explanation of replacing tubes!
It is good we have such diversity of experience in our little group and such
information is certainly appreciated by those of us with interest but not
presence. Thanks again!.mw

----------
From: ken290[SMTP:ken290@...]
Reply To: Tweetsie@...
Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 10:09 AM
To: Tweetsie@...
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12

From: "ken290" <ken290@...>

Hi you all-

Bad news about the 12 for sure, but nothing that a little work won't cure.

When your tubes or firebox sheets get leaky it is a big aggrevation as the
engine won't steam well. The crew has done a magnificent job on the 12 as
I have stated before. The crew is small and has responsibilities besides
the 2 locomotives--they have a whole park to keep up as well as the total
rebuild of their customer's locomotives. That pays the bills!!

Tube jobs are not a very big deal compared to what all has just been
completed on 12. A tube job does, however, require a lot of room as you
have to take the smokebox front completely off and remove all the netting,
table plates, petticoat pipe, and blower lines. The tubes are cut loose
at
both ends and driven out the front end and then pulled out the smokebox
end. I think the little 12 has 188 tubes so you can see this takes at
least 2 and probably 3 men a couple of days at best probably more like a
week. It just takes time and room!

After the tubes are removed (all but 4 to keep the tube sheets in place)
the tube sheets are cleaned up and the holes (188 at each end) dressed
clean. Another day or two for 2 guys. While you have them out you always
go down the steam dome (when you are young and thin like I used to be-I
am
probably too fat to get thru the manhole now!) and inspect the interior of
the boiler for grooving, pitting, or other deterioration. This inspection
is what got the ET&WNC Number 7 taken out of service and scrapped. Now a
days this inpection can and is made with an ultrasound test but there is
no
substitiute for getting in there and looking around.

The new tubes are passed back into the smokebox and thru the front sheet.
One man is inside the boiler and sends the new tube into the proper hole
in
the firebox tube sheet. After they are all inserted they are rolled in
and
seal welded. Copper ferrules are used most of the time on the smokebox
end
but not on 12. Give her a hydro, put the smokebox appliances back in,
button her up and go take the gold to Fort Boone!!!

I hope you can see how much time this can take. The TRR crew did an
incredibly complicated job on all the machinery on 12 taking many months
and WHILE they were doing contract work and park work. They wanted to
have
12 on to start the season and you just have to roll the dice on what gets
done and what does not when you have a deadline to meet. The old tubes
should have made it longer than this weekend but they didn't. They pulled
her off a couple weeks ago to try to get her stopped up enough to run her
for you all but it just wasn't enough to make it happen.

You can't make a leaky engine steam worth a flip and, while a boiler
explosion does not come from a broken tube, the men in the cab can get
scalded if one was to break and we sure don't want that to happen.

While you are at Tweetsie the engine in the shop is dimensionally the same
as the first ET&WNC number 8. The 8 was about 5 years older, but they are
the same baldwin engine. Give you some idea about what she looked like.

You all be sure and thank those shop boys for all that hard work they do.
It is hot, hard, heavy, dirty work and they all take a lot of pride in
what
they do and do a damn fine job.

Ken Riddle
----------
From: johnny graybeal <johnnyg@...>
To: Tweetsie@...
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12
Date: Monday, June 14, 1999 7:26 AM

From: "johnny graybeal" <johnnyg@...>

Rick,
Nice idea on the surface. Put yourself in their place. Would you
go
to
that much trouble, not to mention the danger of doing that on 4-5%
grades,
for 50-100 people, while 2-3000 are standing around wondering what is
holding up their train. We are too small potatoes for that much
trouble.
Johnny Graybeal
-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>
To: Tweetsie@... <Tweetsie@...>
Date: Monday, June 14, 1999 1:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12


From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>

johnny,

I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had
problems
with flues leaking.
Any point in asking Tweetsie to push #12 around in front of #190 for
almost a double header? Make a little steam, make a little smoke, but
leave it in neutral. :o}

Have a good time everyone!

Cheers,
Rick
(wishing I could be there)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Rick Blanchard
rick@...
San Diego, CA

My East Tennessee and Western North Carolina web site:
http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/etwnc.html
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Re: No.12

ken290 <ken290@...>
 

Hi you all-

Bad news about the 12 for sure, but nothing that a little work won't cure.
When your tubes or firebox sheets get leaky it is a big aggrevation as the
engine won't steam well. The crew has done a magnificent job on the 12 as
I have stated before. The crew is small and has responsibilities besides
the 2 locomotives--they have a whole park to keep up as well as the total
rebuild of their customer's locomotives. That pays the bills!!

Tube jobs are not a very big deal compared to what all has just been
completed on 12. A tube job does, however, require a lot of room as you
have to take the smokebox front completely off and remove all the netting,
table plates, petticoat pipe, and blower lines. The tubes are cut loose at
both ends and driven out the front end and then pulled out the smokebox
end. I think the little 12 has 188 tubes so you can see this takes at
least 2 and probably 3 men a couple of days at best probably more like a
week. It just takes time and room!

After the tubes are removed (all but 4 to keep the tube sheets in place)
the tube sheets are cleaned up and the holes (188 at each end) dressed
clean. Another day or two for 2 guys. While you have them out you always
go down the steam dome (when you are young and thin like I used to be-I am
probably too fat to get thru the manhole now!) and inspect the interior of
the boiler for grooving, pitting, or other deterioration. This inspection
is what got the ET&WNC Number 7 taken out of service and scrapped. Now a
days this inpection can and is made with an ultrasound test but there is no
substitiute for getting in there and looking around.

The new tubes are passed back into the smokebox and thru the front sheet.
One man is inside the boiler and sends the new tube into the proper hole in
the firebox tube sheet. After they are all inserted they are rolled in and
seal welded. Copper ferrules are used most of the time on the smokebox end
but not on 12. Give her a hydro, put the smokebox appliances back in,
button her up and go take the gold to Fort Boone!!!

I hope you can see how much time this can take. The TRR crew did an
incredibly complicated job on all the machinery on 12 taking many months
and WHILE they were doing contract work and park work. They wanted to have
12 on to start the season and you just have to roll the dice on what gets
done and what does not when you have a deadline to meet. The old tubes
should have made it longer than this weekend but they didn't. They pulled
her off a couple weeks ago to try to get her stopped up enough to run her
for you all but it just wasn't enough to make it happen.

You can't make a leaky engine steam worth a flip and, while a boiler
explosion does not come from a broken tube, the men in the cab can get
scalded if one was to break and we sure don't want that to happen.

While you are at Tweetsie the engine in the shop is dimensionally the same
as the first ET&WNC number 8. The 8 was about 5 years older, but they are
the same baldwin engine. Give you some idea about what she looked like.

You all be sure and thank those shop boys for all that hard work they do.
It is hot, hard, heavy, dirty work and they all take a lot of pride in what
they do and do a damn fine job.

Ken Riddle
----------
From: johnny graybeal <johnnyg@...>
To: Tweetsie@...
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12
Date: Monday, June 14, 1999 7:26 AM

From: "johnny graybeal" <johnnyg@...>

Rick,
Nice idea on the surface. Put yourself in their place. Would you go
to
that much trouble, not to mention the danger of doing that on 4-5%
grades,
for 50-100 people, while 2-3000 are standing around wondering what is
holding up their train. We are too small potatoes for that much trouble.
Johnny Graybeal
-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>
To: Tweetsie@... <Tweetsie@...>
Date: Monday, June 14, 1999 1:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12


From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>

johnny,

I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had
problems
with flues leaking.
Any point in asking Tweetsie to push #12 around in front of #190 for
almost a double header? Make a little steam, make a little smoke, but
leave it in neutral. :o}

Have a good time everyone!

Cheers,
Rick
(wishing I could be there)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Rick Blanchard
rick@...
San Diego, CA

My East Tennessee and Western North Carolina web site:
http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/etwnc.html

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Unsubscribe for vacation

Jim King <jking@...>
 

Hi all,

I'm leaving tomorrow morning on vacation and won't be back "on line"
until at least 6/28. I'm temporarily stopping all emails beginning
tonight. I will not be checking personal emails after tonight, either,
so if you send something, I won't respond until at least 6/28.

Ya'll have fun debating the pros and cons of modeling while I'm enjoying
Savannah's beach!!

Jim King
Smoky Mountain Model Works

The Convention

J. L. Walker <WEBSTERCLASSICMODELS@...>
 

Well, we will be there for sure - Mary Jo and I are coming and bringing
kits for ET&WNC structures on sale as well as the Linville kits. (We just
might have to work in a round of golf.... ). Look forward to seeing you
all - and to the fellowship. Great time!
Les Walker dba Webster Classic Models

Convention

Jim King <jking@...>
 

Hi all,

I 2nd Chris Ford's comments that the convention shouldn't be skipped
just because the 12 is down. It's inevitable that a 75+ year-old
assemblage of steel is going to need repairs during "our" convention.
Besides, the 190 is still steam and still sounds good. The fellowship
of conventioneers makes the weekend worth the effort even without any
steam at all, in my opinion. 'nough of the soap box!!

I plan on bringing some of my new On3 ET 38' flat car kits to sell. If
anyone reading this list in interested in buying one, two, etc., let me
know now, so I can have a suitable quantity with me. I will bring the
pilot model so everyone can see what the kit builds into.

The kit is available in 3 options: fully loaded ($64), less decals
($59) and less decals, couplers and Grandt 4'8" trucks ($49). Please be
specific about the type of kit you want. Also, be sure to include 6% NC
sales tax in your calculations.

Thanks,

Jim King
SMMW

Convention

C Ford <cfordart@...>
 

Hey y'all,
All this talk about #12 has got me bothered. Sure hope nobody cancels
their trip to the convention just because #12 won't be running. There's
other stuff to do besides watch her all day Saturday. Blowing Rock is a
nice place to visit if you like antiques and stuff. All the fellowship is
worth it for me. An impromptu ROW tour on Saturday might be good for
anyone who hasn't been in a while (lot of folks have to leave on Sunday
and don't get to participate).

Whatever, I'll be there, just to get out of town (and away from work :)
for a long weekend. Heck, just the thought of the free breakfast at the
Greystone is enough to get me to come :)

Hope to see all y'all there!

Oh, and if Peter Jobusch is on this group, I sure would like to get a
print of the photo of me on top of the Blevins bridge. Everybody else
pretend you didn't read this :)


Chris


-----------------------
Chris Ford
cfordart@...

http://www.mindspring.com/~cfordart/etwnc/home.html

N&W employee mags for sale

Jim King <jking@...>
 

Hi all,

I have many issues of N&W employee magazines for sale as a **GROUP**,
not individually. They are in good shape and span mid-50s to early 70s
but are not complete. Contact me off list if you are interested.

Thanks,
Jim King

Re: No.12

johnny graybeal <johnnyg@...>
 

Rick,
Nice idea on the surface. Put yourself in their place. Would you go to
that much trouble, not to mention the danger of doing that on 4-5% grades,
for 50-100 people, while 2-3000 are standing around wondering what is
holding up their train. We are too small potatoes for that much trouble.
Johnny Graybeal

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>
To: Tweetsie@... <Tweetsie@...>
Date: Monday, June 14, 1999 1:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Tweetsie] No.12


From: Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>

johnny,

I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had
problems
with flues leaking.
Any point in asking Tweetsie to push #12 around in front of #190 for
almost a double header? Make a little steam, make a little smoke, but
leave it in neutral. :o}

Have a good time everyone!

Cheers,
Rick
(wishing I could be there)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Rick Blanchard
rick@...
San Diego, CA

My East Tennessee and Western North Carolina web site:
http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/etwnc.html

------------------------------------------------------------------------
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http://www.onelist.com
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Re: No.12

Rick Blanchard <bdesign@...>
 

johnny,

I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had problems
with flues leaking.
Any point in asking Tweetsie to push #12 around in front of #190 for
almost a double header? Make a little steam, make a little smoke, but
leave it in neutral. :o}

Have a good time everyone!

Cheers,
Rick
(wishing I could be there)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Rick Blanchard
rick@...
San Diego, CA

My East Tennessee and Western North Carolina web site:
http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/etwnc.html

Re: No.12

Michael Paschall <michael@...>
 

Thanks for the update Johnny. Your point about risk to the people is well
taken, but may I point out that a boiler explosion would not do No. 12 any
good either.

-----Original Message-----
From: johnny graybeal <johnnyg@...>
To: tweetsie@... <tweetsie@...>
Date: Sunday, June 13, 1999 1:59 PM
Subject: [Tweetsie] No.12


From: "johnny graybeal" <johnnyg@...>

Everyone,
I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had problems
with flues leaking. The flues were the one thing that was not redone in
the
last year and a half. As of yesterday (Sat) the official word was that
they
were going to wait until after our weekend to take her off. They had been
able to slow the leaking of four, but seven more were leaking too.
I received a call just a few minutes ago, letting me know that the
situation had become worse, and the engine would be off line by the end of
the day. The work had already been contracted out when I was there
yesterday, with the time required being three weeks.
I want to say that TRR management and shop personnel were trying hard
to
leave the engine on for us. Trying very hard. 12 has performed very well
the last month, and I was looking forward to all of you seeing her back in
steam. Unfortunately that will not be this year.
I wanted the group to know. Too many will come now and be
disappointed,
since it is too late to do any kind of newsletter, except for e-mail.
Spread the word and pass along TRRs apologies.
The alternative is to risk more springing loose going around the track,
which could lead to a boiler explosion. Ken Riddle will back me up on
this.
50-100 of us is not worth risking something deadly to hundreds of people.
We will just have to wait.
Johnny Graybeal
Pres. ET&WNC RR HS


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No.12

Karl & Edwina Kleeman <kleenc@...>
 

Can we replace our ride behind number 12 with a "forum" of sorts in which
several of you experts show pictures and give talks about the ET&WNC. I
would certainly appreciate it. We could do that Friday evening.

On Saturday could we trace the roadbed through the Grandfather mountain
area. I have some very good maps that I got from the book "Grandfather
Community, Its People and Historical Data" by Ted Shook. Maybe we could
even get Ted to assist. The book is in the county library in Boone.

We could team up on some historic research and it would be great fun. The
map shows all homes along the right of way, many of which may still exist.
If we could get some locals to assist, I think we would all enjoy it. I
would be happy to send or fax maps to anyone who wanted to participate.

Karl Kleeman 919-782-1533 kleenc@...

No.12

johnny graybeal <johnnyg@...>
 

Everyone,
I have some bad news. Since the season opened, No. 12 has had problems
with flues leaking. The flues were the one thing that was not redone in the
last year and a half. As of yesterday (Sat) the official word was that they
were going to wait until after our weekend to take her off. They had been
able to slow the leaking of four, but seven more were leaking too.
I received a call just a few minutes ago, letting me know that the
situation had become worse, and the engine would be off line by the end of
the day. The work had already been contracted out when I was there
yesterday, with the time required being three weeks.
I want to say that TRR management and shop personnel were trying hard to
leave the engine on for us. Trying very hard. 12 has performed very well
the last month, and I was looking forward to all of you seeing her back in
steam. Unfortunately that will not be this year.
I wanted the group to know. Too many will come now and be disappointed,
since it is too late to do any kind of newsletter, except for e-mail.
Spread the word and pass along TRRs apologies.
The alternative is to risk more springing loose going around the track,
which could lead to a boiler explosion. Ken Riddle will back me up on this.
50-100 of us is not worth risking something deadly to hundreds of people.
We will just have to wait.
Johnny Graybeal
Pres. ET&WNC RR HS

Linville Depot Kit

J. L. Walker <WEBSTERCLASSICMODELS@...>
 

The photo of the completed kit will be on my web page tonight - if it all
works like it is supposed to. How does it look? It is ready to ship. We
will see youall in Boone - and we will bring kits.
Les Walker dba Webster Classic Models

new Carnegie Hotel

C Ford <cfordart@...>
 

Hey gang,
I got a tip about a new Carnegie Hotel in JCity the other day and sent it
on to Robbie Jones, a Historian in the Environmental Planning Dept of the
Tennesse Department of Transportation. He found out some more about it
and sent me this note:


chris: I found lots of info. on the new Carnegie Hotel in Johnson City.
Go to the Kingsport Times-News Online page (follow the links in the
yahoo.com newspaper page). Then in their search engine, just type
"Carnegie" or "Carnegie Hotel." I found a half-dozen articles on the new
Carnegie Hotel, which is being constructed adjacent to the new Centre at
Millennium Park (Convention Center) on State of Franklin Boulevard next
to the VA Hospital and across from ETSU. Lots of cool stuff, including
pix of the new Convention Center, but none of the hotel that I could
find. Should be very interesting and I can't wait to get up there and
check it out.


I found it interesting because the newest issue of the Stemwinder (which
is at the printer right now) has a large article about the Carnegie
Addition in JCity and the Carnegie Hotel. Anyway, it may be something to
see if you're going to the convention in June.

Just a tidbit,
Chris


-----------------------
Chris Ford
cfordart@...

http://www.mindspring.com/~cfordart/etwnc/home.html

Re: Gon Plan

C Ford <cfordart@...>
 

It's not too late to submit a photo for the book, Curtis, if it's one
that John thinks would add to the chapter. You might contact him and
check.

Regards and see ya in Boone,
Chris


-----------------------
Chris Ford
cfordart@...

http://www.mindspring.com/~cfordart/etwnc/home.html

Gon Plan

Curtis Brookshire <curtis.brookshire@...>
 

The May/June Narrow Gauge and Shortline Gazette features an Edward H. Cass
plan of ET&WNC gondola 188.

BTW, saw a slide last night of ET&WNC 210 taken around 1972 in Elizabethton.
It's in the Southern Railway black/white scheme. Had I known my friend had
that slide, I would have submitted it for publication in John's book.

Memorial Day Greetings,
Curtis