FW: [RTTY] 2Tone Update


Dave AA6YQ
 

David G3YYD recently posted the following message on the RTTY discussion group. My comments are preceded by + below.

----

I have issued an update to 2Tone for Windows 8 and later, which can be downloaded here:

https://www.rttycontesting.com/downloads/2tone/ Thank you to Don AA5AU for hosting.

I have updated the documentation that comes with 2Tone. Pease read even if you are an expert you may learn something.

2Tone.exe is a 32 bit image
2Tone64.exe is a 64 bit image and requires a CPU with the AVX instruction set.

These images will only work with Windows 8 and later. Before Windows 8 use an older version of 2Tone.

CPUs designed after about 2012 should have the AVX instruction set. Can test for it by downloading CPUID CPU-Z the middle front of
which shows the instructions sets available on the CPU. Using this instruction set with the 64 bit image uses the CPU cores more
efficiently. CPU-Z | Softwares | CPUID <https://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html> . If in doubt use the 32 bit version.

If you think you have found a bug, or I could make something clearer in the documentation then please email me your comments -
g3yyd@btopenworld.com

73 David G3YYD & M7T

----

+ The current public version of WinWarbler (9.3.3) includes 2Tone version 15.05a, which runs on all versions of Windows on which
WinWarbler can run.

+ My plan for supporting the new versions of 2Tone.exe announced above is to

1. continue including 2Tone version 15.05a in future WinWarbler releases

2. extend the next version of WinWarbler to look in its folder for a version a 2Tone named

My2Tone.exe

+ and use this version if it is present.

+ Thus ops who wish to use one of the new versions announced above would

a. delete the 2Tone.exe in their WinWarbler folder

b. download the desired new version of 2Tone into their WinWarbler folder, and rename it My2Tone.exe

+ Upgrading to a subsequent new version of WinWarbler would restore the deleted 2Tone.exe, but WinWarbler would ignore it and run
My2Tone.exe.


+ This approach enables those able to run the new versions of 2Tone to do so with a one-time action, while permitting those still
using older versions of Windows to continue using a version of 2Tone that works with these older versions.


+ Many thanks to David G3YYD for continuing to move 2Tone forward!

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

On 2021-02-14 2:51 AM, Dave AA6YQ wrote:
+ This approach enables those able to run the new versions of 2Tone to do so with a one-time action, while permitting those still using older versions of Windows to continue using a version of 2Tone that
works with these older versions.
Since all versions of Windows prior to Windows 8 are long out of
extended support and no longer receive security updates from Microsoft,
their continued use is a threat to all other users. The 32 bit version
of 2Tone 21.02a will run on any hardware that supports 2Tone 15.05a or
later so why not begin including it instead of 2Tone 15.05a?

Including the 32 bit version of 2Tone 15.05a will mean one less manual
change for users with older hardware.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-14 2:51 AM, Dave AA6YQ wrote:
David G3YYD recently posted the following message on the RTTY discussion group. My comments are preceded by + below.
----
I have issued an update to 2Tone for Windows 8 and later, which can be downloaded here:
https://www.rttycontesting.com/downloads/2tone/ Thank you to Don AA5AU for hosting.
I have updated the documentation that comes with 2Tone. Pease read even if you are an expert you may learn something.
2Tone.exe is a 32 bit image
2Tone64.exe is a 64 bit image and requires a CPU with the AVX instruction set.
These images will only work with Windows 8 and later. Before Windows 8 use an older version of 2Tone.
CPUs designed after about 2012 should have the AVX instruction set. Can test for it by downloading CPUID CPU-Z the middle front of
which shows the instructions sets available on the CPU. Using this instruction set with the 64 bit image uses the CPU cores more
efficiently. CPU-Z | Softwares | CPUID <https://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html> . If in doubt use the 32 bit version.
If you think you have found a bug, or I could make something clearer in the documentation then please email me your comments -
g3yyd@btopenworld.com
73 David G3YYD & M7T
----
+ The current public version of WinWarbler (9.3.3) includes 2Tone version 15.05a, which runs on all versions of Windows on which
WinWarbler can run.
+ My plan for supporting the new versions of 2Tone.exe announced above is to
1. continue including 2Tone version 15.05a in future WinWarbler releases
2. extend the next version of WinWarbler to look in its folder for a version a 2Tone named
My2Tone.exe
+ and use this version if it is present.
+ Thus ops who wish to use one of the new versions announced above would
a. delete the 2Tone.exe in their WinWarbler folder
b. download the desired new version of 2Tone into their WinWarbler folder, and rename it My2Tone.exe
+ Upgrading to a subsequent new version of WinWarbler would restore the deleted 2Tone.exe, but WinWarbler would ignore it and run
My2Tone.exe.
+ This approach enables those able to run the new versions of 2Tone to do so with a one-time action, while permitting those still
using older versions of Windows to continue using a version of 2Tone that works with these older versions.
+ Many thanks to David G3YYD for continuing to move 2Tone forward!
73,
Dave, AA6YQ


Dave AA6YQ
 

+ AA6YQ comments below
Since all versions of Windows prior to Windows 8 are long out of
extended support and no longer receive security updates from Microsoft,
their continued use is a threat to all other users.
+ Older versions of WIndows are only a threat if they are running on computers connected to the internet.

The 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a will run on any hardware that supports 2Tone 15.05a or
later so why not begin including it instead of 2Tone 15.05a?

+ My understanding is that the new 32-bit version of 2-Tone is limited to Windows 8 and 10. I'll check with David G3YYD. If you're right, then yes, it would be better to include the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a with future versions of WinWarbler, instead of including 2Tone 15.05a.

     73,

           Dave, AA6YQ


Dave AA6YQ
 

+ AA6YQ comments below

Since all versions of Windows prior to Windows 8 are long out of extended support and no longer receive security updates from Microsoft, their continued use is a threat to all other users. The 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a will run on any hardware that supports 2Tone 15.05a or later so why not begin including it instead of 2Tone 15.05a?

+ The 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a will not execute on versions of Windows earlier than Windows 8.

Including the 32 bit version of 2Tone 15.05a will mean one less manual change for users with older hardware.

+ Perhaps the next version of WinWarbler should include

2Tone.exe (the same version 15.05a included with current versions of WinWarbler)

2Tone32_21.02a.exe (new 32-bit version that requires Windows 8 or later)

2Tone64_21.02a.exe (new 64-bit version that requires Windows 8 or later)

+ and be extended to enable the user to choose which version of 2Tone to use (defaulting to 2Tone.exe)

+ This will add ~700 Kbytes to the size of a WinWarbler update that is currently 4.5 Mbytes; the 15% increase would likely be unnoticeable.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

+ Older versions of WIndows are only a threat if they are running on computers connected to the internet.
Anyone using SpotCollector or Pathfinder would be using the internet.
Anyone using an on-line log book in DXKeeper would be using the
internet. Anyone uploading/syncing with LotW, ClubLog, eQSL is using
the internet. As such, DXLab Suite is significantly crippled without
internet access and it should be assumed any user is (or should be)
running Windows 8 or 10.

+ My understanding is that the new 32-bit version of 2-Tone is
limited to Windows 8 and 10.
hardware <> Operating System. One can run Windows 8 or 10 on older
processors (processors without AVX) but that hardware and Win8/10
will still run the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a.

It would seem to me that the vast majority of DXLab Suite users
would be running Windows 8 or 10. I do not see a justification
to make them "jump through hoops" to take advantage of 2Tone 21.02a.
Instead the minority running on XP (gag) or 7 can easily download
2Tone 15.05a (or 16.x) from AA5AU's web site and replace 21.02a in
the WinWarbler directory (they're obviously willing to roll their
own if they are still using unsupported operating systems).

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-14 2:41 PM, Dave AA6YQ wrote:
+ AA6YQ comments below


Since all versions of Windows prior to Windows 8 are long out of
extended support and no longer receive security updates from Microsoft,
their continued use is a threat to all other users.
+ Older versions of WIndows are only a threat if they are running on computers connected to the internet.


The 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a will run on any hardware that supports
2Tone 15.05a or
later so why not begin including it instead of 2Tone 15.05a?
+ My understanding is that the new 32-bit version of 2-Tone is limited to Windows 8 and 10. I'll check with David G3YYD. If you're right, then yes, it would be better to include the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a with future versions of WinWarbler, instead of including 2Tone 15.05a.
73,
Dave, AA6YQ


Dave AA6YQ
 

@ AA6YQ comments below
Anyone using SpotCollector or Pathfinder would be using the internet.
Anyone using an on-line log book in DXKeeper would be using the
internet. Anyone uploading/syncing with LotW, ClubLog, eQSL is using
the internet. As such, DXLab Suite is significantly crippled without
internet access and it should be assumed any user is (or should be)
running Windows 8 or 10
+ There are ops with Commander and WinWarbler installed on computers without internet access.
Windows 8 and 10.hardware <> Operating System. One can run Windows 8 or 10 on older
processors (processors without AVX) but that hardware and Win8/10
will still run the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a.

It would seem to me that the vast majority of DXLab Suite users
would be running Windows 8 or 10. I do not see a justification
to make them "jump through hoops" to take advantage of 2Tone 21.02a.
Instead the minority running on XP (gag) or 7 can easily download
2Tone 15.05a (or 16.x) from AA5AU's web site and replace 21.02a in
the WinWarbler directory (they're obviously willing to roll their
own if they are still using unsupported operating systems).

@ If the next version of WinWarbler includes the current version of 2Tone and the two new versions (as I'm now thinking), then users wishing to use one of the two new versions of 2Tone will have one button to click - once. That's not "jumping through hoops".

       73,

               Dave, AA6YQ


w6de
 

I agree with Joe, it is time to move on. N1MM contesting software is making non-backwards compatible upgrades and they aren't attempting to provide a work-around for Win-XP users.
The default should be for Windows-10. Don't penalize the up-to-date users by making them jump through hoops to accommodate obsolete and unsupported versions of Windows.
Microsoft doesn't advertise it but users can still upgrade for free from Windows-7 and Windows-8 to Windows-10.

73,
Dave, w6de

-----Original Message-----
From: DXLab@groups.io [mailto:DXLab@groups.io] On Behalf Of Joe Subich, W4TV
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2021 23:28
To: DXLab@groups.io
Subject: Re: [DXLab] FW: [RTTY] 2Tone Update


+ Older versions of WIndows are only a threat if they are running on
computers connected to the internet.
Anyone using SpotCollector or Pathfinder would be using the internet.
Anyone using an on-line log book in DXKeeper would be using the
internet. Anyone uploading/syncing with LotW, ClubLog, eQSL is using
the internet. As such, DXLab Suite is significantly crippled without
internet access and it should be assumed any user is (or should be)
running Windows 8 or 10.

+ My understanding is that the new 32-bit version of 2-Tone is
limited to Windows 8 and 10.
hardware <> Operating System. One can run Windows 8 or 10 on older
processors (processors without AVX) but that hardware and Win8/10
will still run the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a.

It would seem to me that the vast majority of DXLab Suite users
would be running Windows 8 or 10. I do not see a justification
to make them "jump through hoops" to take advantage of 2Tone 21.02a.
Instead the minority running on XP (gag) or 7 can easily download
2Tone 15.05a (or 16.x) from AA5AU's web site and replace 21.02a in
the WinWarbler directory (they're obviously willing to roll their
own if they are still using unsupported operating systems).

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-14 2:41 PM, Dave AA6YQ wrote:
+ AA6YQ comments below


Since all versions of Windows prior to Windows 8 are long out of
extended support and no longer receive security updates from Microsoft,
their continued use is a threat to all other users.
+ Older versions of WIndows are only a threat if they are running on computers connected to the internet.


The 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a will run on any hardware that supports
2Tone 15.05a or
later so why not begin including it instead of 2Tone 15.05a?
+ My understanding is that the new 32-bit version of 2-Tone is limited to Windows 8 and 10. I'll check with David G3YYD. If you're right, then yes, it would be better to include the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a with future versions of WinWarbler, instead of including 2Tone 15.05a.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Dave AA6YQ
 

+ AA6YQ comments below
I agree with Joe, it is time to move on. N1MM contesting software is making non-backwards compatible upgrades and they aren't attempting to provide a work-around for Win-XP users.
The default should be for Windows-10. Don't penalize the up-to-date users by making them jump through hoops to accommodate obsolete and unsupported versions of Windows.
+ The one-time need to click a new "2Tone version" button in the 2Tone panel on the RTTY tab of WinWarbler's Configuration window would not be "jumping through hoops". Even if support for the current version of 2Tone were completely abandoned, it would still be appropriate to let users choose between the new 32-bit and 64-bit versions of 2Tone (rather than having to download and copy the correct .exe file into your WinWarbler folder, which is a lot closer to hoop-jumping than what's now proposed).  Providing a third option (the current version of 2Tone) would inconvenience no one.

           73,

               Dave, AA6YQ


Joe Subich, W4TV
 

@ If the next version of WinWarbler includes the current version of 2Tone and the two new versions (as I'm now thinking), then users wishing to use one of the two new versions of 2Tone will have one button to click - once. That's not "jumping through hoops".
I'm not convinced that the extra 350 kB +/- of payload is justified
to support obsolete operating systems. Both the 32 and 64 bit versions
of 2Tone 21.02a should be included to cover non AVX CPUs but I believe
it is time to cut loose the unsupported operating systems.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2021-02-14 8:00 PM, Dave AA6YQ wrote:
@ AA6YQ comments below


Anyone using SpotCollector or Pathfinder would be using the internet.
Anyone using an on-line log book in DXKeeper would be using the
internet. Anyone uploading/syncing with LotW, ClubLog, eQSL is using
the internet. As such, DXLab Suite is significantly crippled without
internet access and it should be assumed any user is (or should be)
running Windows 8 or 10
+ There are ops with Commander and WinWarbler installed on computers without internet access.


Windows 8 and 10.hardware <> Operating System. One can run Windows 8 or 10
on older
processors (processors without AVX) but that hardware and Win8/10
will still run the 32 bit version of 2Tone 21.02a.

It would seem to me that the vast majority of DXLab Suite users
would be running Windows 8 or 10. I do not see a justification
to make them "jump through hoops" to take advantage of 2Tone 21.02a.
Instead the minority running on XP (gag) or 7 can easily download
2Tone 15.05a (or 16.x) from AA5AU's web site and replace 21.02a in
the WinWarbler directory (they're obviously willing to roll their
own if they are still using unsupported operating systems).
@ If the next version of WinWarbler includes the current version of 2Tone and the two new versions (as I'm now thinking), then users wishing to use one of the two new versions of 2Tone will have one button to click - once. That's not "jumping through hoops".
73,
Dave, AA6YQ


William Liporace WC2L
 

I played with 2-Tone and MMTTY for only a few Qs.  I saw both have pros and cons.
At least with N1MM. I would always use both..

Will WC2L


Dave AA6YQ
 

+ AA6QY AA6YQ comments below

I played with 2-Tone and MMTTY for only a few Qs. I saw both have pros and cons.
At least with N1MM. I would always use both..

+ WinWarbler has long supported the simultaneous use of MMTTY, 2Tone, and an external RTTY demodulator (e.g. KAM, PK232). Being able to see the output of three RTTY demodulators is quite helpful for RTTY DXing.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Jamie WW3S
 

2Tone saved my bacon more than once this weekend, but MMTTY Fluttered FIR was pretty good as well.....

------ Original Message ------
From: "Dave AA6YQ" <aa6yq@ambersoft.com>
To: DXLab@groups.io
Sent: 2/14/2021 9:28:19 PM
Subject: Re: [DXLab] FW: [RTTY] 2Tone Update

+ AA6QY AA6YQ comments below

I played with 2-Tone and MMTTY for only a few Qs. I saw both have pros and cons.
At least with N1MM. I would always use both..

+ WinWarbler has long supported the simultaneous use of MMTTY, 2Tone, and an external RTTY demodulator (e.g. KAM, PK232). Being able to see the output of three RTTY demodulators is quite helpful for RTTY DXing.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ