Hi
Finally, and thanks for the list of "application interference", the NVIDIA software seems to be the cause of Launcher delay.

On Wed, Jun 29, 2022 at 9:40 AM Peter Laws / N5UWY via groups.io
<plaws0@...> wrote:

my log) was DXKeeper. Both were "slow" to start and terminate. As
someone who has done IT support for years, "slow" means nothing. W10
21H2 for those scoring at home.

I have a work Zoom in a few minutes but will try the recommended "safe
mode + network and see if it is different. And will make notes.

I have been paid to do IT support for almost as long as I've been a
ham (early 1990s). Every day that I work with them, I hate them more.
:-)

I did as suggested in the thread (booted in safe mode + networking).
Lo, and behold, Launcher launched as if it really wanted to reach
escape velocity and DXKeeper was right behind it.

OK, so, dang, now what, I wonder?

Reversed the change to get a normal boot, and booted the usual way.

Lo, and behold, Launcher launched as if it really wanted to reach
escape velocity and DXKeeper was right behind it.

Ehhh ... OK. The only *conscious* change I made was to load the
current Defender files from Update.

But it's all fine now. Hope others had similar, simple fixes!

BTW, my Windows update is set to tell me there are patches and let me
say when rather than just patch away and scramble everything without
me knowing. Everything still gets scrambled, but now I'm ready. :)
And in truth, they don't screw up the USB stuff that often. The other
thing I learned with that setting is that "Security Intelligence
Update for Microsoft Defender Antivirus" gets updated multiple
times/day.






--
Peter Laws | N5UWY | plaws plaws net | Travel by Train!

Had to rescue this thread from the trash because "not affecting me"
... Um, well, yeah, now it is (I haven't been at the station for
several days). I only run W10's Defender so maybe something changed
there, assuming it's anti-malware and not something else. Launcher
was "slow" and the only app I wanted to run (to look something up in
my log) was DXKeeper. Both were "slow" to start and terminate. As
someone who has done IT support for years, "slow" means nothing. W10
21H2 for those scoring at home.

I have a work Zoom in a few minutes but will try the recommended "safe
mode + network and see if it is different. And will make notes.

Peter

--
Peter Laws | N5UWY | plaws plaws net | Travel by Train!

*Advanced Threat Defense* causes the delays in logging, delays in callsign lookups, and slows both application startup and shutdow
so it means that there is no solution?

*TURN OFF* "Advanced Threat Defense" ... that causes Defender to send
all of the internet and interprocess traffic to their cloud servers
for analysis. If your connection is slow/busy, it will greatly delay
any action in DXLab.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 2022-06-28 9:44 AM, f6gcp wrote:

Hi
Why not... I am using only MS Antivirus, and I removed unnecessary SW from boot. Any other software is capable to start in a reasonable time after boot, as I know that MS desktop is shown rapidly even the boot sequence is not fully performed, but no application needs 5mn to start (even 1mn, even 30s).
Question :
2022-06-27 22:11:29 > DXLab Apps :
this line is related to a check if any DXlab Apps are already running ?
*
*Advanced Threat Defense* causes the delays in logging, delays in callsign lookups, and slows both application startup and shutdow
so it means that there is no solution? or can we declare to Defender "safe area / datas / area" not to check" (may be no recommended...)
In fact, I already declared (long time ago) Defender not to scan DXLab folders (because of Winwarbler is getting too slow in RTTY)
I will perform another test later today
73 P@t

+ AA6YQ comments bellow

Why not... I am using only MS Antivirus, and I removed unnecessary SW from boot. Any other software is capable to start in a reasonable time after boot, as I know that MS desktop is shown rapidly even the boot sequence is not fully performed, but no application needs 5mn to start (even 1mn, even 30s).
Question : 

2022-06-27 22:11:29     > DXLab Apps        : 

this line is related to a check if any DXlab Apps are already running ? 

+ Without seeing the context, I can't tell.

+ Please report the result of booting Windows into "Safe mode with networking".

      73,

            Dave, AA6YQ

 

Hi
Why not... I am using only MS Antivirus, and I removed unnecessary SW from boot. Any other software is capable to start in a reasonable time after boot, as I know that MS desktop is shown rapidly even the boot sequence is not fully performed, but no application needs 5mn to start (even 1mn, even 30s).
Question : 

2022-06-27 22:11:29     > DXLab Apps        : 

this line is related to a check if any DXlab Apps are already running ? 

• Advanced Threat Defense causes the delays in logging, delays in callsign lookups, and slows both application startup and shutdow
  so it means that there is no solution? or can we declare to Defender "safe area / datas / area" not to check" (may be no recommended...)
  
  In fact, I already declared (long time ago) Defender not to scan DXLab folders (because of Winwarbler is getting too slow in RTTY)
  
  I will perform another test later today
  73 P@t
  
  
  
  

+ AA6YQ comments below

Safe mode, so it means only one Monitor available
- immediate start (click on Launcher just few seconde after the desktop is displayed)

+ That means one of the applications that Windows is configured to start automatically when booted normally is interfering with the Launcher's startup. The culprit is typically your anti-malware, but other applications can also produce an adverse result. See

https://www.dxlabsuite.com/dxlabwiki/ApplicationInteference

     73,

            Dave, AA6YQ

Hi

Safe mode, so it means only one Monitor available
- immediate start (click on Launcher just few seconde after the desktop is displayed)
- from log : 

A restart in "normal" mode (here 4 minutes)

+ AA6YQ comments below

for months (may be more than 1 year), i have similar issue.

+ Please reboot Windows into "Safe Mode with Networking". Then start the Launcher; how long does it take for the Launcher's Main window to appear?

         73,

               Dave, AA6YQ

Hi
for months (may be more than 1 year), i have similar issue. I made various tests and from logs I made this :

I didn't have this problem -- until tonight.  "Just out of the blue" it was taking DXLabs apps a looooong time to start.  I found that adding an exclusion to Windows Defender corrected it.

Now back to Kubuntu...

Vy 7 3
Earl
KD5XB

e e

Intel acknowledging problems with "Killer" apps:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000058995/ethernet-products/intel-killer-ethernet-products.html

 

+ AA6YQ comments below

I am running windows 11 and found there is a wifi service (KillerAPS and a few other services with "killer" in their name ) that when I kill them - I have no issues running dxlabs .  If these are running - I have the delayed start issues.

+ Those services are provided by Rivet Networks, most recently acquired by Intel:

https://www.engadget.com/intel-rivet-networks-wifi-killer-cards-083538986.html

"Its focus is bandwidth utilization, as well as prioritizing things like gaming or high-bandwidth tasks like video streaming. However, occasionally its driver optimizations and drivers could cause issues too, with preinstalled SmartByte software causing an issue that could severely limit a user’s internet connection".

    73,

          Dave, AA6YQ

 

 

 

 

+ AA6YQ comments below

I found that if I just wait approximately 3-5 minutes after the computer boots, that DXLauncher starts normally.  If I launched it during that period, it would take that long to finally show up. I went through my start up apps and finally narrowed the cause of the delay down to syncthing-gtk, which is a file syncing app that I use to share and keep files up to date between my two computers. Works great as a backup as there is always a current copy of every folder on both computers at all times.  I found even if the other computer was not turned on, the execution of DXLauncher is still delayed by syncthing app.  I tried launching 9 other apps while DXLauncher was still being delayed, including DX4WIN, N1MM, WSJT-X, Outlook, and Word, and all opened at normal speed.  I even let one app that I ran run an update that it detected upon launch and the update downloaded, installed and reran the new version of that app while DXLauncher was still delayed. Bottom line, during the syncthing app’s first 3-5 minutes of launching, it prevents DXLauncher from opening during that period.

+ At startup, the Launcher makes several queries over the internet to determine what releases of DXLab applications are available, and what database versions are available. It also interacts with other running DXLab applications via DDE. 

+ If some other application you're running is preventing the Launcher for executing those functions, that's the fault of that application.

        73,

            Dave, AA6YQ

 

I found that if I just wait approximately 3-5 minutes after the computer boots, that DXLauncher starts normally.  If I launched it during that period, it would take that long to finally show up. I went through my start up apps and finally narrowed the cause of the delay down to syncthing-gtk, which is a file syncing app that I use to share and keep files up to date between my two computers. Works great as a backup as there is always a current copy of every folder on both computers at all times.  I found even if the other computer was not turned on, the execution of DXLauncher is still delayed by syncthing app.  I tried launching 9 other apps while DXLauncher was still being delayed, including DX4WIN, N1MM, WSJT-X, Outlook, and Word, and all opened at normal speed.  I even let one app that I ran run an update that it detected upon launch and the update downloaded, installed and reran the new version of that app while DXLauncher was still delayed. Bottom line, during the syncthing app’s first 3-5 minutes of launching, it prevents DXLauncher from opening during that period.

I captured the attached screenshot   (hope I did the link correctly - if not, the jpeg is in the files directory called: Screenshot DXLab process explorer of Process Explorer)   of when I run DXLauncher and it is stopped to wait. It halts after the execution of wow64win.dll.  I also saved a dump file from it and ran that through WinDbg and its analysis generated the following info below. I fully admit, all of which is out of my league of expertise in Windows.  Just thought it might help someone else. 

 https://groups.io/g/DXLab/files/Screenshot%20DXLab%20process%20explorer.jpg

SYMBOL_NAME:  win32u!NtUserMessageCall+c

 

MODULE_NAME: win32u

 

IMAGE_NAME:  win32u.dll

 

FAILURE_BUCKET_ID:  BREAKPOINT_80000003_win32u.dll!NtUserMessageCall

 

OS_VERSION:  10.0.19041.1

 

BUILDLAB_STR:  vb_release

 

OSPLATFORM_TYPE:  x86

 

OSNAME:  Windows 10

 

IMAGE_VERSION:  10.0.19041.1706

 

FAILURE_ID_HASH:  {480a4842-2575-13e3-cc50-ad5499b14f37}

 

 

I have also found that if I run DXLauncher BEFORE syncthing auto starts, that it will open without delay.  At that point I can then start the other DXLab modules as I need them with no delays.  Thus I will play with seeing if I can include DXLauncher and have it do so prior to syncthing launching.

Thanks and 73!

Ron WU4G

+ AA6YQ comments below

Curious what antivirus protection people are using. I have Bitdefender and I see fairly slow "boot" time when launching the programs. I have the DXL directory excluded from scans etc. This one is running Windows 11 and is a considerably better computer.

I will have to check this against my old computer.

+ All DXLab updates are sent to Microsoft for clearance by the team that operates Windows Defender. If you update your Windows Defender malware definitions before updating to any new public DXLab version -- the first step in each release note -- you should not encounter interference from Windows Defender.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ

I may jumped to an incorrect conclusion that you are executing DXKeeper via DXLauncher. For clarification are you running DXKeeper directly from the Windows applications menu or via DXLauncher?

Like you I run dozens of apps and they all start quickly shortly after boot-up, except DXLauncher on my Win 8.1 desktop.

Though a corrupt log file seems very unlikely, you might consider creating a new log file (.mdb) on the C: drive for test purposes and see what happens.

+ In the 21 years that DXKeeper has been publicly available, a "corrupt log file" has *never* been found to be the root cause of "slow startup". The culprit has almost always been misconfigured or incompetent anti-malware.

+ On startup, DXKeeper invokes TQSL and directs it to report any "news" - like a Callsign Certificate's imminent expiration or the availability of a new version. Some particularly lazy anti-malware considers this to be evidence that DXKeeper is malware.

73,


Dave, AA6YQ