QRZ again?


eddy on5jk
 

Hello Dave,
This morning i had QSO with OM6ES, activating a FF-aerea.
On the QRZ page (vie PF) i noticed: “Alias for OK1ES”, togheter with all info abt OK1ES.
The Capture stayed blanco, nothing filled in.
It seems a bit like the former error, when the Callsign of the contacted station contained a slash.
Challenge for our magician?
Eddy ON5JK

Virusvrij. www.avg.com


Dave AA6YQ
 

AA6YQ comments below
-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 9:00 AM
To: YahooGroup DXLabs
Subject: [dxlab] QRZ again?

This morning i had QSO with OM6ES, activating a FF-aerea.
On the QRZ page (vie PF) i noticed: “Alias for OK1ES”, togheter with all info abt OK1ES.
The Capture stayed blanco, nothing filled in.
It seems a bit like the former error, when the Callsign of the contacted station contained a slash.
Challenge for our magician?

When I configure the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window to use "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", type OM6ES into the Capture window, and strike the Enter key, the Capture window is populated with the correct name, QTH, "QSL Via", "Grid 1", continent, CQ zone, and ITU zone. Logging the QSO shows that the correct postal address is also present.
If that's not working for you, Eddy, that means QRZ is returning information differently for different users, which means that Pathfinder cannot reliably "scrape" callbook information from QRZ.com.
Over the past month, dealing with the changes to QRZ.com has delayed enhancements to Commander, DXView, DXKeeper, and SpotCollector by weeks. Given the several supported alternatives to "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", perhaps the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option should be removed from the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window.
73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Danny Douglas <n7dc@...>
 

I have had no problems with QRZ.com searches at all.  I normally have dxlabs set up to automatically search BUCK, but then often reach up and click manually  on the QRZ tab, and the search come up correct, immediately.    Some of the reason for this is that I often run out of the freebie searches during the 24 hour period, from BUCK, or I want to see the ops email address and/or send him an email by clicking on his address.    I would hate to not have a capability, so hopefully there is a way to keep it,  or have another spot to click, to do so.     I am still using Windows 7, by the way, and am slowly researching all the info to get dxlabs over to the new Windows 10 machine, but again, after yesterday fiasco of an update from MS, and screwing up my Firefox page, I am not sure I ever want to use them, until it is no longer possible to use W7. 



N7DC@...
Ex WN5QMX,WA5UKR,ET2US,ET3USA,SV0WPP,VS6DD,N7DC/YV5/G5CTB
QSL Bureau, DIRECT, LOTW Preferred, eQSL used but upload at a courtesy only, as do not use the system for awards.

On July 14, 2017 at 12:31 PM "'Dave AA6YQ' aa6yq@... [dxlab]" <dxlab@...> wrote:

 

>>>AA6YQ comments below

-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 9:00 AM
To: YahooGroup DXLabs
Subject: [dxlab] QRZ again?

This morning i had QSO with OM6ES, activating a FF-aerea.
On the QRZ page (vie PF) i noticed: “Alias for OK1ES”, togheter with all info abt OK1ES.
The Capture stayed blanco, nothing filled in.
It seems a bit like the former error, when the Callsign of the contacted station contained a slash.
Challenge for our magician?

>>>When I configure the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window to use "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", type OM6ES into the Capture window, and strike the Enter key, the Capture window is populated with the correct name, QTH, "QSL Via", "Grid 1", continent, CQ zone, and ITU zone. Logging the QSO shows that the correct postal address is also present.

>>>If that's not working for you, Eddy, that means QRZ is returning information differently for different users, which means that Pathfinder cannot reliably "scrape" callbook information from QRZ.com.

>>>Over the past month, dealing with the changes to QRZ.com has delayed enhancements to Commander, DXView, DXKeeper, and SpotCollector by weeks. Given the several supported alternatives to "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", perhaps the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option should be removed from the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


 


w6de
 

I must say I see a large number of requests for QRZ.com Pathfinder help and thus diversion of Dave's, AA6YQ, time to respond to and fix these requests.

However, fixing this may be an ethical issue, not a convenience to DXKeeper users issue.

The DXLab community possibly doesn't understand that the QRZ errors come from Pathfinder's attempt to read a web site intended for human consumption and extracting it's best guess what is the desired QSL/contact/location information. QRZ occasionally changes the format of the data presentation for security, style, and software updates. It is their right to do so. Microsoft changes their offerings regularly. So why can't QRZ?

Guess what? QRZ doesn't want DXLabs or any other program to programmatically access their Web Site. QRZ wants users who desire automated access to their data base to use their paid XML subscription service. Who knows, maybe QRZ allows the user freedom to put their bad constructs on their QRZ pages and makes some of their changes to limit to limit programmatic access to their Web site.
QRZ offers Developer support for their XML service but none for the Free or measured service. This is QRZ's way of telling the user community: if you want automated QRZ service, buy XML service. The bottom line is the QRZ service is NOT FREE, somebody, in this case Dave, AA6YQ, has to pay something, his labor, to make the seemingly free service work. Dave is right, the DXLab community should follow QRZ's lead to use the XML queries.

Quotes from QRZ's Web site:

"XML Logbook Data Service"
"About this Service"
"Our XML Logbook Data service provides a superior, high performance back-end connection to the QRZ database. It is widely supported by most of the top logging and contest programs . With the XML Logbook Data service, your logging program will automatically fetch detailed name, address, and QSL information from our extensive collection of more than 1.3 million callsigns."
.
.
.
"The QRZ XML data port provides callsign info, biography information, and QSL image data in a raw streaming format that connects to a variety of third party software products. The XML interface is fully documented so that programmers can easily adapt the interface to their projects.
How much does a subscription cost?
A full year subscription to the XML Logbook Data service costs just. . ."

So the ethical issue is: does Dave continue to invest his time in a free program to gain free access to another vendor's source of information when that provider prefers automated access by a paid subscription?

I'd recommend that Pathfinder simply pare down the offerings to use only QRZ's XML service. Just like the other paid services in Pathfinder.
This would also make the preferred browser choice issue go away, which is another topic Pathfinder brings up periodically.

Dave, w6de

-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: 14 July, 2017 16:31
To: dxlab@...
Subject: RE: [dxlab] QRZ again?

AA6YQ comments below
-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 9:00 AM
To: YahooGroup DXLabs
Subject: [dxlab] QRZ again?

This morning i had QSO with OM6ES, activating a FF-aerea.
On the QRZ page (vie PF) i noticed: “Alias for OK1ES”, togheter with all info abt OK1ES.
The Capture stayed blanco, nothing filled in.
It seems a bit like the former error, when the Callsign of the contacted station contained a slash.
Challenge for our magician?

When I configure the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window to use "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", type OM6ES into the Capture window, and strike the Enter key, the Capture window is populated with the correct name, QTH, "QSL Via", "Grid 1", continent, CQ zone, and ITU zone. Logging the QSO shows that the correct postal address is also present.
If that's not working for you, Eddy, that means QRZ is returning information differently for different users, which means that Pathfinder cannot reliably "scrape" callbook information from QRZ.com.
Over the past month, dealing with the changes to QRZ.com has delayed enhancements to Commander, DXView, DXKeeper, and SpotCollector by weeks. Given the several supported alternatives to "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", perhaps the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option should be removed from the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window.
73,

Dave, AA6YQ



------------------------------------
Posted by: "Dave AA6YQ" <aa6yq@...>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links


NS9I
 

You mean there is hope or a solution at the end of this miserable tunnel?

73 Dwight NS9I


On 7/14/2017 4:37 PM, 'w6de' w6de@... [dxlab] wrote:
 

I must say I see a large number of requests for QRZ.com Pathfinder help and thus diversion of Dave's, AA6YQ, time to respond to and fix these requests.

However, fixing this may be an ethical issue, not a convenience to DXKeeper users issue.

The DXLab community possibly doesn't understand that the QRZ errors come from Pathfinder's attempt to read a web site intended for human consumption and extracting it's best guess what is the desired QSL/contact/location information. QRZ occasionally changes the format of the data presentation for security, style, and software updates. It is their right to do so. Microsoft changes their offerings regularly. So why can't QRZ?

Guess what? QRZ doesn't want DXLabs or any other program to programmatically access their Web Site. QRZ wants users who desire automated access to their data base to use their paid XML subscription service. Who knows, maybe QRZ allows the user freedom to put their bad constructs on their QRZ pages and makes some of their changes to limit to limit programmatic access to their Web site.
QRZ offers Developer support for their XML service but none for the Free or measured service. This is QRZ's way of telling the user community: if you want automated QRZ service, buy XML service. The bottom line is the QRZ service is NOT FREE, somebody, in this case Dave, AA6YQ, has to pay something, his labor, to make the seemingly free service work. Dave is right, the DXLab community should follow QRZ's lead to use the XML queries.

Quotes from QRZ's Web site:

"XML Logbook Data Service"
"About this Service"
"Our XML Logbook Data service provides a superior, high performance back-end connection to the QRZ database. It is widely supported by most of the top logging and contest programs . With the XML Logbook Data service, your logging program will automatically fetch detailed name, address, and QSL information from our extensive collection of more than 1.3 million callsigns."
.
.
.
"The QRZ XML data port provides callsign info, biography information, and QSL image data in a raw streaming format that connects to a variety of third party software products. The XML interface is fully documented so that programmers can easily adapt the interface to their projects.
How much does a subscription cost?
A full year subscription to the XML Logbook Data service costs just. . ."

So the ethical issue is: does Dave continue to invest his time in a free program to gain free access to another vendor's source of information when that provider prefers automated access by a paid subscription?

I'd recommend that Pathfinder simply pare down the offerings to use only QRZ's XML service. Just like the other paid services in Pathfinder.
This would also make the preferred browser choice issue go away, which is another topic Pathfinder brings up periodically.

Dave, w6de

-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: 14 July, 2017 16:31
To: dxlab@...
Subject: RE: [dxlab] QRZ again?

>>>AA6YQ comments below

-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 9:00 AM
To: YahooGroup DXLabs
Subject: [dxlab] QRZ again?

This morning i had QSO with OM6ES, activating a FF-aerea.
On the QRZ page (vie PF) i noticed: “Alias for OK1ES”, togheter with all info abt OK1ES.
The Capture stayed blanco, nothing filled in.
It seems a bit like the former error, when the Callsign of the contacted station contained a slash.
Challenge for our magician?

>>>When I configure the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window to use "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", type OM6ES into the Capture window, and strike the Enter key, the Capture window is populated with the correct name, QTH, "QSL Via", "Grid 1", continent, CQ zone, and ITU zone. Logging the QSO shows that the correct postal address is also present.

>>>If that's not working for you, Eddy, that means QRZ is returning information differently for different users, which means that Pathfinder cannot reliably "scrape" callbook information from QRZ.com.

>>>Over the past month, dealing with the changes to QRZ.com has delayed enhancements to Commander, DXView, DXKeeper, and SpotCollector by weeks. Given the several supported alternatives to "QRZ.com via Pathfinder", perhaps the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option should be removed from the Callbook tab of DXKeeper's Configuration window.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ

------------------------------------
Posted by: "Dave AA6YQ"
------------------------------------

------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links



Dave AA6YQ
 

AA6YQ comments below
-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 5:38 PM
To: dxlab@...
Subject: RE: [dxlab] QRZ again?

I must say I see a large number of requests for QRZ.com Pathfinder help and thus diversion of Dave's, AA6YQ, time to respond to and fix these requests.

However, fixing this may be an ethical issue, not a convenience to DXKeeper users issue.

The DXLab community possibly doesn't understand that the QRZ errors come from Pathfinder's attempt to read a web site intended for human consumption and extracting it's best guess what is the desired QSL/contact/location information. QRZ occasionally changes the format of the data presentation for security, style, and software updates. It is their right to do so. Microsoft changes their offerings regularly. So why can't QRZ?

QRZ is free to change their web page however and whenever they like.
Guess what? QRZ doesn't want DXLabs or any other program to programmatically access their Web Site.

That's not correct.
I have discussed Pathfinder with QRZ.com owner Fred AA6BQ on several occasions. DXKeeper's free "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option exists with his blessing. Fred can ask me to remove it at any time; were he to do so, I would immediately comply. So far, he's only asked that the rate of callbook lookups via this mechanism be limited to one every 4 seconds -- a policy implemented in DXKeeper several years ago.
Note that Pathfinder displays QRZ's advertising, and thus does not diminish QRZ revenues - as would a scheme that scrapes downloaded HTML without displaying it to the user.
My point earlier today is that if QRZ, for whatever reason, is no longer sending information in the same format to every user, then it may no longer be possible to maintain "QRZ.com via Pathfinder.
Removing the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option from DXKeeper would require no change to Pathfinder, nor would it simplify the web browser issues discussed here in a different thread.
73,

Dave, AA6YQ


eddy on5jk
 

I must confess, dave’s reaction and all other reactions scared me .
Yes i know, taking payed XML subscription could possibly solve many of my personal problems i encountered.
I only thought that my observations could be of any interest to somebody.
Personally i am used to use QRZ., and personally i dont like it to be removed from PF.
From now on, i will take it as it is, and never complain anymore about it.
It only happens with a new Callsign. Once there is a QSO in DXK, next time data are in the log and used so by PF.
 
Still finding that the DXLabSuite is the finest program ever seen.
Sorry for stealing your time Dave.
I apologise.
Eddy ON5JK
 

From: 'Dave AA6YQ' aa6yq@... [dxlab]
Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2017 12:21 AM
To: dxlab@...
Subject: RE: [dxlab] QRZ again?
 
 

>>>AA6YQ comments below

-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2017 5:38 PM
To: dxlab@...
Subject: RE: [dxlab] QRZ again?

I must say I see a large number of requests for QRZ.com Pathfinder help and thus diversion of Dave's, AA6YQ, time to respond to and fix these requests.

However, fixing this may be an ethical issue, not a convenience to DXKeeper users issue.

The DXLab community possibly doesn't understand that the QRZ errors come from Pathfinder's attempt to read a web site intended for human consumption and extracting it's best guess what is the desired QSL/contact/location information. QRZ occasionally changes the format of the data presentation for security, style, and software updates. It is their right to do so. Microsoft changes their offerings regularly. So why can't QRZ?

>>>QRZ is free to change their web page however and whenever they like.

Guess what? QRZ doesn't want DXLabs or any other program to programmatically access their Web Site.

>>>That's not correct.

>>>I have discussed Pathfinder with QRZ.com owner Fred AA6BQ on several occasions. DXKeeper's free "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option exists with his blessing. Fred can ask me to remove it at any time; were he to do so, I would immediately comply. So far, he's only asked that the rate of callbook lookups via this mechanism be limited to one every 4 seconds -- a policy implemented in DXKeeper several years ago.

>>>Note that Pathfinder displays QRZ's advertising, and thus does not diminish QRZ revenues - as would a scheme that scrapes downloaded HTML without displaying it to the user.

>>>My point earlier today is that if QRZ, for whatever reason, is no longer sending information in the same format to every user, then it may no longer be possible to maintain "QRZ.com via Pathfinder.

>>>Removing the "QRZ.com via Pathfinder" option from DXKeeper would require no change to Pathfinder, nor would it simplify the web browser issues discussed here in a different thread.

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Virusvrij. www.avg.com


Patrick Slayton
 



On 7/15/2017 09:03, 'eddy on5jk' Eddy_on5jk@... [dxlab] wrote:
 

I must confess, dave’s reaction and all other reactions scared me .
Yes i know, taking payed XML subscription could possibly solve many of my personal problems i encountered.
I only thought that my observations could be of any interest to somebody.
Personally i am used to use QRZ., and personally i dont like it to be removed from PF.
From now on, i will take it as it is, and never complain anymore about it.
It only happens with a new Callsign. Once there is a QSO in DXK, next time data are in the log and used so by PF.
 
Still finding that the DXLabSuite is the finest program ever seen.
Sorry for stealing your time Dave.
I apologise.
Eddy ON5JK
 

Eddy,
I don't believe that it is your subscription.  I am experiencing look up issues also.  I have a subscription to QRZ and pf is logged into my acocunt.
73
Patrick


Bradley Wallet
 

Since I'm clearly not as smart I as think I am, how do I configure Pathfinder to work with QRZ XML?

Brad


Peter Laws / N5UWY
 

On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 10:12 AM, 'Wallet, Brad C.' bwallet@...
[dxlab] <dxlab@...> wrote:
Since I'm clearly not as smart I as think I am, how do I configure Pathfinder to work with QRZ XML?
Step 1: Pay qrz.com money. :-)

I'm considering it. Screen-scraping works OK, mostly, sometimes, but
it was a hack from the start (no one claimed otherwise) and it's a lot
of work for AA6YQ ... The draw is that QRZ.com has ALL THE CALLSIGNS
- you really can't get that from another single source (that I know
of).


--
Peter Laws | N5UWY | plaws plaws net | Travel by Train!


Bradley Wallet
 

Peter, 

I've got step one complete. They offer a lot so I joined a while ago to support them. What's step two?

Honestly, everything about my DXLab configuration is a mess. Any chance I could get you to come to my house sometime and get me straight?

Brad


On Jul 15, 2017, at 11:10 AM, Peter Laws plaws0@... [dxlab] <dxlab@...> wrote:

 

On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 10:12 AM, 'Wallet, Brad C.' bwallet@...
[dxlab] <dxlab@...> wrote:
> Since I'm clearly not as smart I as think I am, how do I configure Pathfinder to work with QRZ XML?

Step 1: Pay qrz.com money. :-)

I'm considering it. Screen-scraping works OK, mostly, sometimes, but
it was a hack from the start (no one claimed otherwise) and it's a lot
of work for AA6YQ ... The draw is that QRZ.com has ALL THE CALLSIGNS
- you really can't get that from another single source (that I know
of).

--
Peter Laws | N5UWY | plaws plaws net | Travel by Train!


Dave AA6YQ
 

AA6YQ comments below
-----Original Message-----
From: dxlab@... [mailto:dxlab@...]
Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2017 11:12 AM
To: dxlab@...
Subject: Re: [dxlab] QRZ again?

Since I'm clearly not as smart I as think I am, how do I configure Pathfinder to work with QRZ XML?

Step-by-step comments are here:
<http://www.dxlabsuite.com/dxlabwiki/CallbookLookup>

73,

Dave, AA6YQ


Peter Laws / N5UWY
 

On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 11:26 AM, 'Wallet, Brad C.' bwallet@...
[dxlab] <dxlab@...> wrote:


I've got step one complete. They offer a lot so I joined a while ago to support them. What's step two?

Honestly, everything about my DXLab configuration is a mess. Any chance I could get you to come to my house sometime and get me straight?
Dave just posted the URL. :-)

For the rest of you, Brad and I are in the same town and are in the
same club, so it's not as crazy a request as it sounds! Yeah, that's
probably doable. Heck, we could work VHF simplex for that matter. I
guess you missed my DXLab presentation at the meeting the other month?



--
Peter Laws | N5UWY | plaws plaws net | Travel by Train!