Date   

Re: Donations accepted -- yearly forum fees due in July 2021

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

UPDATE -- Time to STOP donating -- UPDATE  

Thanks to all that contributed!

We collected $59.46 so have $7.46 to be applied next year in 2022.

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com


Re: Tri EX W-51 vs WT-51

@JC57
 

Gentlemen thank you for your replies. It seems as though I have the W-51 since I've found no ears to tilt the tower. I appreciate your help
 
73 
Jim 
NC0M


Donations accepted -- yearly forum fees due in July 2021

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

If you are new to the this forum you may not know that we have a premium subscription that allows us to have up to 20GB of files and photos.   And for this group the files and photos are very helpful.   The yearly cost is $110.   Every year in July we accept donations but it is not required.  This is a great resource and we'll keep it going either way.  

Last year we ended up with $48 more than we needed so this year our goal is $52.   

If you would like to donate, please keep it to a small amount ( $3 - $5 ).  When we reach the $52 goal, I'll post a STOP update.  And any amount over the $52 will be saved for next year.  You can send a donation to me via PayPal to my email address.   Or send a check or cash via snail mail to:

Al Ludwick
2991 Johnson Road
Loganville, GA 30052 
--
Regards,  Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com


Re: Tri EX W-51 vs WT-51

Kj6y
 

The tower are basically the same.  The T means it has the the ability to use the tilt over fixture.  The dimensions on the towers are the same.  The WT has additional added strength on the bottom section for the tilt over ears.  Both are excellent medium strength tower.   

Skip, KJ6Y
818-522-5421
Communications Service Co
Sent from my IPad

On Jul 6, 2021, at 12:23 AM, jecrowley157@... wrote:

Can anyone tell me the differences between the W-51 and the WT-51. I was led to believe when I bought this used tower that it was a WT-51 however the marking on the winch plate state a W-51 by Tri Ex. All the other accessories I purchased elsewhere were for the WT-51. Confused doesn't begin to describe what is going on. Any help would be appreciated


Re: Tri EX W-51 vs WT-51

Joe Cucuzza
 

Good morning.
I found this link:


http://lists.contesting.com/_towertalk/2011-10/msg00311.html

Note the info about the wall thickness.

Also, I have a old catalog from Tri-Ex.
It shows 3 W series towers. 
The W-51 weighs 355 pounds.
The loading capabilities state:
 "Support 9 square feet of antenna load area in 50 MPH winds at fully extended height.  Maximum weight capacity at top of tower is 150 lbs.
Towers are designed to meet EIA and UBC codes."
Please remember that the wind codes mentioned are old codes.
Please consider emailing 
Norman@...
73
Joe KA8WEP 


Sent from my Metro by T-Mobile 5G Device


-------- Original message --------
From: jecrowley157@...
Date: 7/6/21 2:22 AM (GMT-06:00)
To: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io
Subject: [CrankupTiltoverTowers] Tri EX W-51 vs WT-51

Can anyone tell me the differences between the W-51 and the WT-51. I was led to believe when I bought this used tower that it was a WT-51 however the marking on the winch plate state a W-51 by Tri Ex. All the other accessories I purchased elsewhere were for the WT-51. Confused doesn't begin to describe what is going on. Any help would be appreciated


Tri EX W-51 vs WT-51

@JC57
 

Can anyone tell me the differences between the W-51 and the WT-51. I was led to believe when I bought this used tower that it was a WT-51 however the marking on the winch plate state a W-51 by Tri Ex. All the other accessories I purchased elsewhere were for the WT-51. Confused doesn't begin to describe what is going on. Any help would be appreciated


Re: DB36

Dennis Klipa
 

Rick,

Thanks for the link to your lock.  I have visited your site before but had not seen your cleverly designed lock.  I like the fact that it keeps the antenna from flapping in the wind and is relatively inexpensive.  Nicely done.  Next time I tilt my tower over, I will see if I can mount one on my plate, which I built along with the KARLock.  I followed Al's tapered design so not sure if I have room to mount the long retaining bolt.

Best Regards,
Dennis, N8ERF

On Sun, Jul 4, 2021, 10:10 AM Richard &#92;(Rick&#92;) Karlquist &#92;(N6RK&#92;) <richard@...> wrote:
Thanks Dennis for posting the excellent narrative of the
interaction of the horizontal truss with the Karlock.
I had a conversion with NN4ZZ at Dayton in 2014
about that, and my understanding is that you have
to rig the truss such that at rest under calm
wind conditions, the boom is actually bowed
somewhat to one side.  And it has to be the
correct side, such that gravity works to disengage
the Karlock.

I built a homebrew tilt plate for my MonstIR that
is similar to the one you can buy now.  Instead
of a Karlock, I use a homebrew latch of my own
design that positively/rigidly locks the tilt plate in
the correct position to make the elements horizontal
when the tower is vertical.  Unlike the Karlock,
it is not "smart".  I use a 20 foot aluminum
pole to reach up to the latch and latch/unlatch
it.  Sometimes "dumb" is better than "smart".
You can see my latch on n6rk.com if you want to
build your own out of hardware store parts.
When you consider the cost of the double truss
in addition to the cost of the Karlock, for my
money, I'm happy to build my own latch.

73
Rick N6RK



On 7/4/2021 1:10 AM, Dennis Klipa wrote:

> The horizontal truss for the DB36 is, in my opinion, an essential
> addition to the beam when you have a tilt plate and most of us do.  They
> did not offer one at the time so I built my own for my DB36.  What can
> happen is that, with some wind coming from the tilt plate side of the
eeded for the DB36.
>
> Best Regards,
> Dennis, N8ERF






Re: DB36

Richard &#92;(Rick&#92;) Karlquist &#92;(N6RK&#92;)
 

Thanks Dennis for posting the excellent narrative of the
interaction of the horizontal truss with the Karlock.
I had a conversion with NN4ZZ at Dayton in 2014
about that, and my understanding is that you have
to rig the truss such that at rest under calm
wind conditions, the boom is actually bowed
somewhat to one side. And it has to be the
correct side, such that gravity works to disengage
the Karlock.

I built a homebrew tilt plate for my MonstIR that
is similar to the one you can buy now. Instead
of a Karlock, I use a homebrew latch of my own
design that positively/rigidly locks the tilt plate in
the correct position to make the elements horizontal
when the tower is vertical. Unlike the Karlock,
it is not "smart". I use a 20 foot aluminum
pole to reach up to the latch and latch/unlatch
it. Sometimes "dumb" is better than "smart".
You can see my latch on n6rk.com if you want to
build your own out of hardware store parts.
When you consider the cost of the double truss
in addition to the cost of the Karlock, for my
money, I'm happy to build my own latch.

73
Rick N6RK



On 7/4/2021 1:10 AM, Dennis Klipa wrote:

The horizontal truss for the DB36 is, in my opinion, an essential addition to the beam when you have a tilt plate and most of us do.  They did not offer one at the time so I built my own for my DB36.  What can happen is that, with some wind coming from the tilt plate side of the
eeded for the DB36.
Best Regards,
Dennis, N8ERF


Re: DB36

Al N6TA
 

Al,

Perfect!  Thank you for the clarity.  This is finally clear along with the lateral truss as well, which is not a SteppIr feature but is useful when using the TiltPlate.

 

73 de Al

N6TA

 

From: Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
Sent: Sunday, July 4, 2021 2:03 AM
To: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io
Subject: Re: [CrankupTiltoverTowers] DB36

 

On Sun, Jul 4, 2021 at 01:19 AM, Al N6TA wrote:

"The boom double truss kit comes standard with the DB42 and is an available upgrade option for the DB36 when utilizing the antenna in high wind and ice loading conditions. The boom double truss not only counteracts vertical loads, but also counteracts horizontal loading to the boom."

I try to get definition from the DB42 pages and not even a picture.


Here is a picture of the double truss kit on my web page:  http://www.nn4zz.com/Lateral%20Strut%20Mount.htm

The new T-BAR truss is  standard on the DB42 and available as an option on the DB36.   It can also be ordered to retrofit on the older antennas.  Here are the pricing details for adding the T-Bar option of one of the other SteppIR models. Thanks to Adam at SteppIR for this  Information. 

·         Option on the DB36 -- $383.10

·         Option to retrofit to the 4el SteppIR - about $385

·         Option to retrofit an older MonstIR - about $475




Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com

 


Re: DB36

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

On Sun, Jul 4, 2021 at 01:19 AM, Al N6TA wrote:

"The boom double truss kit comes standard with the DB42 and is an available upgrade option for the DB36 when utilizing the antenna in high wind and ice loading conditions. The boom double truss not only counteracts vertical loads, but also counteracts horizontal loading to the boom."
I try to get definition from the DB42 pages and not even a picture.

Here is a picture of the double truss kit on my web page:  http://www.nn4zz.com/Lateral%20Strut%20Mount.htm

The new T-BAR truss is  standard on the DB42 and available as an option on the DB36.   It can also be ordered to retrofit on the older antennas.  Here are the pricing details for adding the T-Bar option of one of the other SteppIR models. Thanks to Adam at SteppIR for this  Information. 

  • Option on the DB36 -- $383.10

  • Option to retrofit to the 4el SteppIR - about $385

  • Option to retrofit an older MonstIR - about $475




Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com


Re: DB36

Dennis Klipa
 

I don't know what the double truss kit is either but it must be substantial from the description providing both vertical and horizontal support for wind and ice.  The standard truss for the DB36, according to the web site, does neither.  The regular truss kit does a nice job of keeping the elements lined up and looking more aesthetically pleasing.

The horizontal truss for the DB36 is, in my opinion, an essential addition to the beam when you have a tilt plate and most of us do.  They did not offer one at the time so I built my own for my DB36.  What can happen is that, with some wind coming from the tilt plate side of the beam, both ends of the boom can flex away from the tilt plate causing the center of gravity to be offset from the boom axis.  This will cause the tilt plate to rise up a bit.  Now, the center of gravity also drops, reinforcing the bow/flex of the boom until the KARLock engages and the antenna will stay flexed and tilted that way until you get a good wind, from the opposite side from the tilt plate, to straighten out the boom again. Just rotating the beam will get you there.  If you try to tilt your tower over in this flexed/tilted condition, the KARLock will not disengage and the Tilt Plate can't do its job to keep the beam horizontal as you lower the tower.

This is a problem for the DB36 and DB42 but has not been a problem for the DB18E which I also have.  The addition of the horizontal truss has eliminated this problem for me.  If you don't use a tilt plate the horizontal truss isn't needed for the DB36.

Best Regards,
Dennis, N8ERF

On Sun, Jul 4, 2021, 1:19 AM Al N6TA <al.n6ta@...> wrote:
Grant,
I wish I knew what it was!  When trying to order the DB36, you are presented with this:
"The boom double truss kit comes standard with the DB42 and is an available upgrade option for the DB36 when utilizing the antenna in high wind and ice loading conditions. The boom double truss not only counteracts vertical loads, but also counteracts horizontal loading to the boom."
I try to get definition from the DB42 pages and not even a picture.
I was unable to get anyone on the phone yesterday and their sale price expires Tuesday.  A bit frustrating (to be expected with SteppIr!)
I do not want to re-engineer it but do have the Leeson book and ought to look at it.  In 1989, I nearly bought a house on the same ridge as Dave but got nervous when I say the Spanish tiles all tied with wire to the facia boards!
Your inputs are appreciated here as well as on TowerTalk which I monitor from time to time.
73,
Al

-----Original Message-----
From: Grant Saviers <grants2@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 3, 2021 5:57 PM
To: Al N6TA <al.n6ta@...>
Subject: DB36

I have the element truss on each DB36 element which splits into a V truss at the trombone ends.  Is that what you mean by "double truss"?  I highly recommend these.

If they really offer a "double boom truss" you might do better with what Leeson W6NL recommends in his book.  A three way truss, one down and two up to restrain uplift winds, a major failure mode.  However, his station is on a really exposed ridge.

For my 86ft 80m rotatable dipole above the DB36, I have a T truss support about 4ft up and 4ft wide with Phillystran four ways to where the M2 linear loading used to attach.  I did re-engineer it mechanically as the M2 design was quite weak, 65 mph predicted failure with YagiMech.
  Up 9 years.

Grant KZ1W







Re: DB36

Al N6TA
 

Grant,
I wish I knew what it was! When trying to order the DB36, you are presented with this:
"The boom double truss kit comes standard with the DB42 and is an available upgrade option for the DB36 when utilizing the antenna in high wind and ice loading conditions. The boom double truss not only counteracts vertical loads, but also counteracts horizontal loading to the boom."
I try to get definition from the DB42 pages and not even a picture.
I was unable to get anyone on the phone yesterday and their sale price expires Tuesday. A bit frustrating (to be expected with SteppIr!)
I do not want to re-engineer it but do have the Leeson book and ought to look at it. In 1989, I nearly bought a house on the same ridge as Dave but got nervous when I say the Spanish tiles all tied with wire to the facia boards!
Your inputs are appreciated here as well as on TowerTalk which I monitor from time to time.
73,
Al

-----Original Message-----
From: Grant Saviers <grants2@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 3, 2021 5:57 PM
To: Al N6TA <al.n6ta@...>
Subject: DB36

I have the element truss on each DB36 element which splits into a V truss at the trombone ends. Is that what you mean by "double truss"? I highly recommend these.

If they really offer a "double boom truss" you might do better with what Leeson W6NL recommends in his book. A three way truss, one down and two up to restrain uplift winds, a major failure mode. However, his station is on a really exposed ridge.

For my 86ft 80m rotatable dipole above the DB36, I have a T truss support about 4ft up and 4ft wide with Phillystran four ways to where the M2 linear loading used to attach. I did re-engineer it mechanically as the M2 design was quite weak, 65 mph predicted failure with YagiMech.
Up 9 years.

Grant KZ1W


Re: DB36 with tilt plate and double boom truss

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

Hi Al,
Just saw this post....

Rick is correct "The tilt plate suggested for the DB36 is the HD or Monster model."  

Specs here on the TiltPlates.  The DB36 is a very large antenna (very heavy and high wind load) and the suggested TiltPlate is the Monster model.    Several of the smaller SteppIRs are listed for the standard model.

http://www.nn4zz.com/TiltPlate%20Specifications.htm

More tips on the DB36 setup here:

http://www.nn4zz.com/Lateral%20Strut%20Mount.htm


If you are set on the DB36 you can probably sell the standard model and order one of the Monster models from Guenther who is now supplying the TiltPlates.

Good luck with your project...

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com


CLICK here to email DEGEN DESIGNS:  tiltplate@...

CLICK here to go to the DEGEN DESIGNS web page: www.degendesigns.com

 



Re: DB36 with tilt plate and double boom truss

Al N6TA
 

Oh dear!  When I bought the Tilt Plate I did not plan for the DB36.  In fact, I had no idea what I was doing but wanted one fearing I would not get another chance.

So, I will ask about the large size and hope those that have also bought the large one are happy with how it works.

My project keeps getting more costly but one day I will be thankful!

73,
Al -N6TA

 

From: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io <CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io> On Behalf Of Rick NK7I
Sent: Saturday, July 3, 2021 1:22 PM
To: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io
Subject: Re: [CrankupTiltoverTowers] DB36 with tilt plate and double boom truss

 

The tilt plate suggested for the DB36 is the HD model, more needed in high winds.  The DB36 is heavy and long elements provides a lot of torque at the mast. 

 

I’m not sure the single plate is adequate. 

 

I don’t have the double truss but haven’t seen winds above 47 mph either. 

73,

Rick NK7I



Email spiel Czech corruptions happen



On Jul 3, 2021, at 1:09 PM, Al N6TA <al.n6ta@...> wrote:

I am about to buy a new DB36 and want to configure it for a robust install in my high wind location.  SteppIr offers a double boom truss but does not show or explain it.  I have seen information about a lateral truss and a T-bar truss.
I bought a new tilt plate from Al before exited.  It is the 'standard', not mini or extra HD version and hope it will work with this new DB36.  I have the bent mast (if I can find it!).  My interest is in knowing which truss options are recommended.  Going on a DX-70 and do not plan anything above the DB36.
Thanks folks!
Al- N6TA


Re: New DX-70

Vin
 

I watched all 3 videos.  Congratulations on a super installation Damon.

 

Vin, 73

K1VC

 

From: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io [mailto:CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io] On Behalf Of Damon - KJ7E via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, July 3, 2021 11:51 AM
To: CrankupTiltoverTowers@groups.io
Subject: Re: [CrankupTiltoverTowers] New DX-70

 

I did post a few videos to YouTube, one with an overall overview of the install and project, here;
https://youtu.be/cmy7mb9LBI0

One of the first full extension after the install, the chickens seemed to like it.  Sorry about the camera placement and missing the top on the last few feet;
https://youtu.be/6tvdaRT9IVc

And my wife took a little video of the crane lifting the tower into place;
https://youtu.be/e6G8gWEWY8M

One of the reasons I'm posting all of this is because when I was looking at the DX70, I could not find a single video or any info on this tower online at all.  So hope this can help someone else in the future.

Just for the fun of it;


Re: New guy update - EZ-Way

Dennis Shubitowski
 

The Wonderpole is not there. There is a cement base with a base unit and two solid bars connecting to the hinge. I will check into the Wonderpole and see.

Dennis NS8H 


Re: DB36 with tilt plate and double boom truss

Rick NK7I
 

The tilt plate suggested for the DB36 is the HD model, more needed in high winds.  The DB36 is heavy and long elements provides a lot of torque at the mast. 

I’m not sure the single plate is adequate. 

I don’t have the double truss but haven’t seen winds above 47 mph either. 

73,
Rick NK7I

Email spiel Czech corruptions happen

On Jul 3, 2021, at 1:09 PM, Al N6TA <al.n6ta@...> wrote:

I am about to buy a new DB36 and want to configure it for a robust install in my high wind location.  SteppIr offers a double boom truss but does not show or explain it.  I have seen information about a lateral truss and a T-bar truss.
I bought a new tilt plate from Al before exited.  It is the 'standard', not mini or extra HD version and hope it will work with this new DB36.  I have the bent mast (if I can find it!).  My interest is in knowing which truss options are recommended.  Going on a DX-70 and do not plan anything above the DB36.
Thanks folks!
Al- N6TA


DB36 with tilt plate and double boom truss

Al N6TA
 

I am about to buy a new DB36 and want to configure it for a robust install in my high wind location.  SteppIr offers a double boom truss but does not show or explain it.  I have seen information about a lateral truss and a T-bar truss.
I bought a new tilt plate from Al before exited.  It is the 'standard', not mini or extra HD version and hope it will work with this new DB36.  I have the bent mast (if I can find it!).  My interest is in knowing which truss options are recommended.  Going on a DX-70 and do not plan anything above the DB36.
Thanks folks!
Al- N6TA


Re: New DX-70

Damon - KJ7E
 

I did post a few videos to YouTube, one with an overall overview of the install and project, here;
https://youtu.be/cmy7mb9LBI0

One of the first full extension after the install, the chickens seemed to like it.  Sorry about the camera placement and missing the top on the last few feet;
https://youtu.be/6tvdaRT9IVc

And my wife took a little video of the crane lifting the tower into place;
https://youtu.be/e6G8gWEWY8M

One of the reasons I'm posting all of this is because when I was looking at the DX70, I could not find a single video or any info on this tower online at all.  So hope this can help someone else in the future.

Just for the fun of it;


Re: New DX-70

Dave <w0dr@...>
 

I agree with everyone else, great looking job my friend!
My commendations, W0DR, Dave R


On Jul 2, 2021, at 3:17 PM, W4ABC - Jon Pearl <jonpearl@...> wrote:

Great job and great selection for your very first attachment!


73,


Jon Pearl - W4ABC


On 7/2/2021 3:01 PM, Damon - KJ7E via groups.io wrote:
Good news, it fit exactly as I had expected and measured.  I love it when a plan comes together!  Going to be a few days before I have coax and cables run, then Ill move over some antennas.  But the tower is up and it makes a fine looking flag pole for now!


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