Topics

locked Cal Fire Moves to Dismantle Ham Radio System, Endangering Lives Amid Blackouts and Wildfires | Trending

Arv Evans
 

Thomas Sharka
 

On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 05:34:59 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:


Jack, W8TEE
 

I sure hope the hams say no to this $7500 tax plus annual lease costs. The day will come when these bureaucrats see the folly of their ways. I just pray lives aren't lost because of it.

Jack, W8TEE

On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 5:35:00 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:



--
Jack, W8TEE

Terry Morris
 

Thought I belonged to this group. Waiting for approval.

Terry - KB8AMZ
Brimfield Twp, OH USA EN91hd
Linux User# 412308, Ubuntu User# 34905, PCARS#78, NAQCC#6668, QRP-ARCI#8855, SKCC#14195


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 8:50 PM Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io <jjpurdum=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I sure hope the hams say no to this $7500 tax plus annual lease costs. The day will come when these bureaucrats see the folly of their ways. I just pray lives aren't lost because of it.

Jack, W8TEE


--
Jack, W8TEE

Ken Hansen
 

As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?

It doesn't.

Ken, N2VIP

Ken Hansen
 

Terry, your message came thru, meaning you are a member.

Ken, N2VIP

On Oct 15, 2019, at 21:18, Terry Morris <terry.kb8amz@...> wrote:


Thought I belonged to this group. Waiting for approval.

Terry - KB8AMZ
Brimfield Twp, OH USA EN91hd
Linux User# 412308, Ubuntu User# 34905, PCARS#78, NAQCC#6668, QRP-ARCI#8855, SKCC#14195


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 8:50 PM Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io <jjpurdum=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I sure hope the hams say no to this $7500 tax plus annual lease costs. The day will come when these bureaucrats see the folly of their ways. I just pray lives aren't lost because of it.

Jack, W8TEE


--
Jack, W8TEE

Jerry Gaffke
 

Normally you could take this up with the group moderator.
But in this case, perhaps your best plan is to start your own forum.  ;-)

95% of the messages here aren't of much interest to me.
That's OK.
So long as it remains civil.
Think I"ll go get a beer and kick off this thread again:  https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/18584402 

Jerry, KE7ER


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 08:01 PM, Ken Hansen wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.
 
It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.
 
How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?
 
It doesn't.

Ken, N2VIP

Edward Reynolds
 

I agree that while this is not the forum for local government issues, I’m glad it was posted. We in the state of Oregon probably would not have heard about this issue. Thankfully the Oregon leaders realize the reliability of the ham repeaters and their roll in times of backup communication needs vs a system that is over priced and not reliable.
Thanks to the group for their time, I read every post on this site, lots of great information I’ve got a UBITX ver. 5 I’m playing with. Keep up the great posts
Cheers
Ed N7SNT 


On Oct 15, 2019, at 9:31 PM, Jerry Gaffke via Groups.Io <jgaffke@...> wrote:

Normally you could take this up with the group moderator.
But in this case, perhaps your best plan is to start your own forum.  ;-)

95% of the messages here aren't of much interest to me.
That's OK.
So long as it remains civil.
Think I"ll go get a beer and kick off this thread again:  https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/18584402 

Jerry, KE7ER


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 08:01 PM, Ken Hansen wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.
 
It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.
 
How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?
 
It doesn't.

Ken, N2VIP

Jack, W8TEE
 

I think you're wrong, Ken. Just because it doesn't directly pertain to someone in Europe doesn't mean those in the US--a fairly large number, BTW--shouldn't hear about it. I'm assuming that those who are not interested in the thread are smart enough not to read it. Also, the US is replete with examples of "one state" setting precedent for other states to follow. Nipping that trend in the bud is often critical and, to do that, one needs to know about the gathering clouds on the horizon.

I don't apologize for the posting and see it as keeping fellow hams informed about something that might bite them in the butt down the road.

Jack, W8TEE

On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 11:01:42 PM EDT, Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:


As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?

It doesn't.

Ken, N2VIP

On Oct 15, 2019, at 16:35, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:


--
Jack, W8TEE

Arv Evans
 

Occasionally there are actions that have great potential to affect ham radio as a whole
but start as small local changes.  Maybe the topic for posts about these events should
be labeled "info-topic" so that those with very narrow fields of interest can avoid reading
them. 

We do have quite a few "off-topic" posts from time to time.  Maybe the solution would
be for moderators to allow the particular topic to run for a few days and then lock the
topic so that no more re-posts on that topic would be allowed.  This seems reasonable
but does potentially block later readers from commenting (good?, bad?).

Arv  K7HKL
_._


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 9:01 PM Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?

Jack, W8TEE
 

I disagree Arv. I started a new thread specifically so I wouldn't tread on an existing post and members could judge their interest in the topic. Personally, I think every ham should care about the topic, but some won't, perhaps because they see it as a State problem and, hence, not affecting them. As I recall, HOA antenna restrictions started out the same way, and soon spread throughout the US. Anyway, I think my subject line clearly stated the thread's content and is more informative than a generic "info-topic" subject line would be. I think the additional details makes it easier for someone to simply erase the post if they're not interested.

Jack, W8TEE

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 3:19:09 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:


Occasionally there are actions that have great potential to affect ham radio as a whole
but start as small local changes.  Maybe the topic for posts about these events should
be labeled "info-topic" so that those with very narrow fields of interest can avoid reading
them. 

We do have quite a few "off-topic" posts from time to time.  Maybe the solution would
be for moderators to allow the particular topic to run for a few days and then lock the
topic so that no more re-posts on that topic would be allowed.  This seems reasonable
but does potentially block later readers from commenting (good?, bad?).

Arv  K7HKL
_._


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 9:01 PM Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?


--
Jack, W8TEE

Evan Hand
 

I agree with Jack that as long as the topic is clear, it is easy enough to ignore.  In this case I view it as a reminder that we need to constantly prove our worth for not just the space to install gear, but more importantly, the allocation of spectrum.  It can start with getting kicked out of emergency services locations, to then questioning why there are so "few" who get value out of the spectrum, to not being able to have a hobby.  I know that is extreme, however it serves to let everyone know that we need to prove our worth to keep our current privileges.  They are not rights, and must be continuously earned.

My thoughts, you are entitled to your own.
73
Evan
AC9TU

Murray Wills (ZL2IQ)
 

How does this relate to BITx and those of us outside the USA?
Murray ZL2IQ


From: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io> on behalf of Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io <jjpurdum@...>
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 9:06:54 AM
To: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Cal Fire Moves to Dismantle Ham Radio System, Endangering Lives Amid Blackouts and Wildfires | Trending
 
I disagree Arv. I started a new thread specifically so I wouldn't tread on an existing post and members could judge their interest in the topic. Personally, I think every ham should care about the topic, but some won't, perhaps because they see it as a State problem and, hence, not affecting them. As I recall, HOA antenna restrictions started out the same way, and soon spread throughout the US. Anyway, I think my subject line clearly stated the thread's content and is more informative than a generic "info-topic" subject line would be. I think the additional details makes it easier for someone to simply erase the post if they're not interested.

Jack, W8TEE

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 3:19:09 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:


Occasionally there are actions that have great potential to affect ham radio as a whole
but start as small local changes.  Maybe the topic for posts about these events should
be labeled "info-topic" so that those with very narrow fields of interest can avoid reading
them. 

We do have quite a few "off-topic" posts from time to time.  Maybe the solution would
be for moderators to allow the particular topic to run for a few days and then lock the
topic so that no more re-posts on that topic would be allowed.  This seems reasonable
but does potentially block later readers from commenting (good?, bad?).

Arv  K7HKL
_._


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 9:01 PM Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?


--
Jack, W8TEE

Evan Hand
 

It relates to the use of the uBITX as a part of the armature radio hobby, and what can happen here can happen elsewhere. (BTW, I do not live in California, so am not directly impacted, YET)

It seems to me that using multiple means to publish information like this is a good thing.  Is it really so difficult to just delete the messages?  I know there are many topics that stretch the uBITX theme that I ignore when they come up.  Real simple to delete based on the subject.

Again, My thoughts, others are entitled to theirs.
73
Evan
AC9TU

Jack, W8TEE
 

Probably doesn't, so read the subject line, then delete it...although I suppose you could face similar problems over there, too.

Jack, W8TEE

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 4:23:19 PM EDT, Murray Wills (ZL2IQ) <murray@...> wrote:


How does this relate to BITx and those of us outside the USA?
Murray ZL2IQ


From: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io> on behalf of Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io <jjpurdum@...>
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 9:06:54 AM
To: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Cal Fire Moves to Dismantle Ham Radio System, Endangering Lives Amid Blackouts and Wildfires | Trending
 
I disagree Arv. I started a new thread specifically so I wouldn't tread on an existing post and members could judge their interest in the topic. Personally, I think every ham should care about the topic, but some won't, perhaps because they see it as a State problem and, hence, not affecting them. As I recall, HOA antenna restrictions started out the same way, and soon spread throughout the US. Anyway, I think my subject line clearly stated the thread's content and is more informative than a generic "info-topic" subject line would be. I think the additional details makes it easier for someone to simply erase the post if they're not interested.

Jack, W8TEE

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 3:19:09 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:


Occasionally there are actions that have great potential to affect ham radio as a whole
but start as small local changes.  Maybe the topic for posts about these events should
be labeled "info-topic" so that those with very narrow fields of interest can avoid reading
them. 

We do have quite a few "off-topic" posts from time to time.  Maybe the solution would
be for moderators to allow the particular topic to run for a few days and then lock the
topic so that no more re-posts on that topic would be allowed.  This seems reasonable
but does potentially block later readers from commenting (good?, bad?).

Arv  K7HKL
_._


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 9:01 PM Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:
As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?


--
Jack, W8TEE

--
Jack, W8TEE

Tom, wb6b
 

I suppose this has some relevance here, as some people here are getting groups of hams set up with uBitx radios to form emergency communication networks. 

So lets look at this from the myopic perspective of the government agencies. Their view of the world is so the police cars driving around and the fire trucks going to calls can communicate. They have no interest in handling messages for the citizens. Or providing a communications lifeline for citizens when all other forms of communications for the general public have gone down. 

That is the importance of Ham radio, to provide the communications lifeline to the citizens during emergencies. Because the Amateur Radio operators have taken it upon themselves to develop an independent communications network and give of their time to maintain the equipment, train and organize the people to provide this communication service to the people that the official agencies will not provide.  

So, it may be best to just forget about the idea that we have any use to the official agencies and all their fancy communication networks as they drive around in their vehicles. (Admittedly a very important thing.) And concentrate on Amateur Radio as being the communication lifeline for the population at large, who will be left behind as far as communication needs, when disaster strikes. 

Tom wb6b

Murray Wills (ZL2IQ)
 

All good, you are correct – IO has the ability to ignore threads so that’s all fine.

Pretty much history here. You guys have a far better relationship and understanding with fire and law enforcement which would be the envy of other countries including New Zealand, so it is worth fighting to retain it.

Murray Zl2IQ

 

From: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, 17 October 2019 9:57 AM
To: BITX20@groups.io
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Cal Fire Moves to Dismantle Ham Radio System, Endangering Lives Amid Blackouts and Wildfires | Trending

 

Probably doesn't, so read the subject line, then delete it...although I suppose you could face similar problems over there, too.

 

Jack, W8TEE

 

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 4:23:19 PM EDT, Murray Wills (ZL2IQ) <murray@...> wrote:

 

 

How does this relate to BITx and those of us outside the USA?

Murray ZL2IQ

 


From: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io> on behalf of Jack, W8TEE via Groups.Io <jjpurdum@...>
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 9:06:54 AM
To: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Cal Fire Moves to Dismantle Ham Radio System, Endangering Lives Amid Blackouts and Wildfires | Trending

 

I disagree Arv. I started a new thread specifically so I wouldn't tread on an existing post and members could judge their interest in the topic. Personally, I think every ham should care about the topic, but some won't, perhaps because they see it as a State problem and, hence, not affecting them. As I recall, HOA antenna restrictions started out the same way, and soon spread throughout the US. Anyway, I think my subject line clearly stated the thread's content and is more informative than a generic "info-topic" subject line would be. I think the additional details makes it easier for someone to simply erase the post if they're not interested.

 

Jack, W8TEE

 

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 3:19:09 PM EDT, Arv Evans <arvid.evans@...> wrote:

 

 

Occasionally there are actions that have great potential to affect ham radio as a whole

but start as small local changes.  Maybe the topic for posts about these events should

be labeled "info-topic" so that those with very narrow fields of interest can avoid reading

them. 

 

We do have quite a few "off-topic" posts from time to time.  Maybe the solution would

be for moderators to allow the particular topic to run for a few days and then lock the

topic so that no more re-posts on that topic would be allowed.  This seems reasonable

but does potentially block later readers from commenting (good?, bad?).

 

Arv  K7HKL

_._

 

 

On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 9:01 PM Ken Hansen <ken@...> wrote:

As an international mail list (reflector) threads like this don't belong here.

 

It's specific to one state of one country, and there are literally dozens of more suitable venues than this for any discussion of this subject.

 

How does the policy of CalFire in California, USA Regarding repeater space on public land n the state of California impact the Lithuanian trying to assemble an HF station based on a uBitx or Bitx40?

 


--
Jack, W8TEE


--
Jack, W8TEE

Jack, W8TEE
 

Tom:

Perhaps things are different there than here, but we have a very close working relationship with police, fire, and other emergency agencies. We work with hospitals to provide coms between medical support stations for everything from local marathon races to parades and other public events. This frees both EMT and police manpower to be deployed more effectively. While we have independence in our assets, we work in concert with local agencies when asked to do so. We even had local police and fire chiefs attend our local meetings so we can inform them of our capabilities. They genuinely appreciate such efforts.

Your view that our job is to handle messages for citizens is far too narrow. Our ARES services do very little of that. We augment public emergency services, not replace it. We see our abilities as an adjunct to their facilities and can help direct those resources where they may be needed most. During an emergency, they may be stretched so thin that they can't deploy enough manpower to know the real danger spots. We can help with that.

My guess is that some percentage of µBITX users also have a 2M HT or bases that can touch a repeater. It would be a shame for expensive applications, fees, and rents to lessen that ability should an emergency arise.

Jack, W8TEE

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 5:15:44 PM EDT, Tom, wb6b <wb6b@...> wrote:


I suppose this has some relevance here, as some people here are getting groups of hams set up with uBitx radios to form emergency communication networks. 

So lets look at this from the myopic perspective of the government agencies. Their view of the world is so the police cars driving around and the fire trucks going to calls can communicate. They have no interest in handling messages for the citizens. Or providing a communications lifeline for citizens when all other forms of communications for the general public have gone down. 

That is the importance of Ham radio, to provide the communications lifeline to the citizens during emergencies. Because the Amateur Radio operators have taken it upon themselves to develop an independent communications network and give of their time to maintain the equipment, train and organize the people to provide this communication service to the people that the official agencies will not provide.  

So, it may be best to just forget about the idea that we have any use to the official agencies and all their fancy communication networks as they drive around in their vehicles. (Admittedly a very important thing.) And concentrate on Amateur Radio as being the communication lifeline for the population at large, who will be left behind as far as communication needs, when disaster strikes. 

Tom wb6b

--
Jack, W8TEE

Martin KM6TCD
 

I don't mind a single post informing us of something of importance to us all.
 
What I mind the 15 - 20 posts arguing about who is more righteous than thou.
 
That, I consider spam.
 

Tom, wb6b
 

On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 08:14 PM, Jack, W8TEE wrote:
very close working relationship with police, fire, and other emergency agencies
Yes, perhaps I'm being a little hard on the official agencies. They do their official duties well, are dedicated and fortunately (hopefully) have modern communication systems that will let do their work efficiently and reliability. But, especially in a bigger state the people and the government become isolated from each other. So, people that recognize this and may be more political savvy (in a good way) may be reaching out and help put the advantages of volunteer groups and official agencies working together back in the awareness of the people that prepare for disaster. The Hams will have an important role in providing communication for the general population and the more coordinated with the official agencies the better. I think locally, here, the comment was made about responsibility if a volunteer got hurt and insurance (whether this reported reason was official, I'm not totally sure). In a disaster situation the people worrying about insurance will be overridden by the desire for the volunteer services to fill in these gaps. 

Tom, wb6b