Topics

winlink error on TX #cat #digital #v4


Don - KM4UDX
 

hello!  Trying to get WINLINK working onmy V4.  Others have done it, so it can be done.  WSJTX/Fldigi all work grand. So I have CAT control working for other apps.  
CEC1.1, V4, stock hardward other than nextion, WIN10, WINLINK Express 1.5.26.

Totally new to WINLINK. 

WINLINK RX and freq change seem to work great with normal external sound dongle. So I think I have audio i/o correct. Freq changes per winlink, so that seems to work. But when it trys to TX, my uBITX ignores the call to TX.  I get this msg.  Below are pics of the status screen, audio, radio, TX and RX stuff...

Where is the error of my ways, of WINLINK gurus???

(and a million thanks as always...)


Gordon Gibby
 

suggest you use a sound detector vox type circuit to close the push to talk.   Not sure what you connected there....easier to do it with a signalink type device.  Also, "radio-only" is NOT probably what you want.   

Be sure to turn volume UP on the output to your codec on the pc so the push to talk circuit gets to see the audio.    

Done this many times with my version 3.

Cheers
gordon



On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:22 PM Don - KM4UDX <dontAy155@...> wrote:
hello!  Trying to get WINLINK working onmy V4.  Others have done it, so it can be done.  WSJTX/Fldigi all work grand. So I have CAT control working for other apps.  
CEC1.1, V4, stock hardward other than nextion, WIN10, WINLINK Express 1.5.26.

Totally new to WINLINK. 

WINLINK RX and freq change seem to work great with normal external sound dongle. So I think I have audio i/o correct. Freq changes per winlink, so that seems to work. But when it trys to TX, my uBITX ignores the call to TX.  I get this msg.  Below are pics of the status screen, audio, radio, TX and RX stuff...

Where is the error of my ways, of WINLINK gurus???

(and a million thanks as always...)


Don - KM4UDX
 

Gordon (and team), 

I use a el-cheap-o external sound card dongle (cause my laptop headphone jack was long ago busted by my daughter...gurrrr) hooked up the normal way. 
As I mentioned, all other digital modes trigger the TX just fine. The CAT -based PPT works without a problem on all the other digital apps with the normal setting.

I went back to normal winmore winlink (I tried the radio only just to see what it was, and it didn't matter actually -- got the same error at the same place.)

The winlink error msg is "Timeout in T>R Latency measuremer"


which seems like a normal msg if the uBITX never goes into TX mode...the latency is infinite, hahah. 
I actually don't know that, just uninformed speculation, haha.

Anyway, here are my WXJT-X settings which work with CAT controlled PPT for TXing all day long. Is there something about winlink that the PPT doesn't work the same way as the other digital apps work?  The literature suggests that winlink PPT function works fine over USB CAT control.  I have to assume I am doing something stupid. As that is the case 95% of the time. So I have a lot of history to back me up here. hahah.


Gordon Gibby
 

Sorry, I only know what works for me, a diode, a transistor, a few capacitors etc.  i use a $4.75 sound dongle.  But I built a push to talk circuit

Perhaps someone else here knows another way to help you, that’s the only one I know.  


On Feb 21, 2020, at 15:09, Don - KM4UDX <dontAy155@...> wrote:

Gordon (and team), 

I use a el-cheap-o external sound card dongle (cause my laptop headphone jack was long ago busted by my daughter...gurrrr) hooked up the normal way. 
As I mentioned, all other digital modes trigger the TX just fine. The CAT -based PPT works without a problem on all the other digital apps with the normal setting.

I went back to normal winmore winlink (I tried the radio only just to see what it was, and it didn't matter actually -- got the same error at the same place.)

The winlink error msg is "Timeout in T>R Latency measuremer"
<winlink winmore timeout error msg.JPG>


which seems like a normal msg if the uBITX never goes into TX mode...the latency is infinite, hahah. 
I actually don't know that, just uninformed speculation, haha.

Anyway, here are my WXJT-X settings which work with CAT controlled PPT for TXing all day long. Is there something about winlink that the PPT doesn't work the same way as the other digital apps work?  The literature suggests that winlink PPT function works fine over USB CAT control.  I have to assume I am doing something stupid. As that is the case 95% of the time. So I have a lot of history to back me up here. hahah.

<wsjtx radio config settings used for winlink as well.JPG>


AndyH
 

Hi Don,

   I use Winlink/Winmor with my V3.  I can't find a setting within Winmor for a VOX PTT option the way WSJT-X allows.  My recollection is that Winmor requires using an external device, like a WinLink, to handle PTT.  I use a WinLink and it 'just works'.

   I did notice, though, that the PTT Port drop-down includes the option to use the same port for PTT that's used for CAT.  I selected it and got the message that this might not work with all radios.  I didn't try it - maybe you can give it a shot?

  Otherwise, I'd get with Doc Gibby to see what he crafted.

  Good luck!
  73, Andy, KG5RKP
   


Gordon Gibby
 

I think he meant, like a signal link. Not like a WINLINK. 


On Feb 21, 2020, at 15:36, AndyH <awhecker@...> wrote:

Hi Don,

   I use Winlink/Winmor with my V3.  I can't find a setting within Winmor for a VOX PTT option the way WSJT-X allows.  My recollection is that Winmor requires using an external device, like a WinLink, to handle PTT.  I use a WinLink and it 'just works'.

   I did notice, though, that the PTT Port drop-down includes the option to use the same port for PTT that's used for CAT.  I selected it and got the message that this might not work with all radios.  I didn't try it - maybe you can give it a shot?

  Otherwise, I'd get with Doc Gibby to see what he crafted.

  Good luck!
  73, Andy, KG5RKP
   


AndyH
 

Yessir - spell checked myself to uselessness.  hihi

Thanks for the catch.  I'd edit...but...sigh.


On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 03:39 PM, Gordon Gibby wrote:
I think he meant, like a signal link. Not like a WINLINK. 

 

On Feb 21, 2020, at 15:36, AndyH <awhecker@...> wrote:

Hi Don,

   I use Winlink/Winmor with my V3.  I can't find a setting within Winmor for a VOX PTT option the way WSJT-X allows.  My recollection is that Winmor requires using an external device, like a WinLink, to handle PTT.  I use a WinLink and it 'just works'.

   I did notice, though, that the PTT Port drop-down includes the option to use the same port for PTT that's used for CAT.  I selected it and got the message that this might not work with all radios.  I didn't try it - maybe you can give it a shot?

  Otherwise, I'd get with Doc Gibby to see what he crafted.

  Good luck!
  73, Andy, KG5RKP
   


Don - KM4UDX
 

I've looked everywhere for a PTT config in winmore like there is in WSJTX/etc.  I did try the "use same port for PTT" but it made no difference in outcomes...

i thought some folks used winlink with just the $7.99 USB sound card...and CAT did the control functions over the USB cable....

but, if that doesn't actually work....then....I have a easydigi with a optical isolated PTT circuit.  I know zip, nada, nul, about the PTT bit.  I just use the two transformers on the easydigi board for audio isolation.  

So whatever a signallink can do, the easydigi can do (I think).  I just have to figure out how....gurrrrrrr....

i don't even know how to wire the PTT part of the board to the uBITX...gurrrrrr....

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....


AndyH
 

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Don - KM4UDX wrote:

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....
Likely overkill, but apparently works.  The DuinoVOX uses an Arduino to sense transmit sound and 'push' the PTT.
http://kb9rlw.blogspot.com/2016/08/cheap-and-easy-to-build-digital-modes.html

   This is an option as well, I'm guessing (is there a doctor in the house? hihi).  One can get 5 boards from JLCPCB for about $7.25.:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/free_gerber_files_for_sound/19351002?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,19351002

   Both let one use the sound dongle of their choice - bonus!

   73, Andy


Dean Souleles
 

Hey neighbor -

I went through the setup and got to the same place you did.  It connects to the Mighty uBITX and even sets the frequency - but does not want to switch to  transmit on send.

Keep noodling....

73,
Dean
KK4DAS


Gordon Gibby
 

yup.   Unfortunately you may discover that the winlink software simply doesn't enable the CAT TX control.   I dunno.   All I know is virtually everyone does it with either a signalink or a very simple circuit.   I took a simple design that a fellow in England made, and we created our our printed circuit boards and routinely crank these things out.   The easy-digi will do fine, it only lacks physical volume controls.   

The instruction manual for the one we use locally his here and the schematic (hand drawn) is on page 7:   https://qsl.net/nf4rc/2019/SmallBoxSoundCardInterfaceManual2.2.pdf    Should only take you 30 minutes to hand create the ptt portion.   You can use optical isolation, an easy-digi, or a relay.    Using a transistor works, but is susceptible to radio frequency interference.    

The soundcard folks sell SO MANY of their product that they don't even have to discount them.   That gives a bit of a hint.  

73,
gordon gibby kx4z


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 2:13 AM Dean Souleles <dsouleles@...> wrote:
Hey neighbor -

I went through the setup and got to the same place you did.  It connects to the Mighty uBITX and even sets the frequency - but does not want to switch to  transmit on send.

Keep noodling....

73,
Dean
KK4DAS


Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...>
 

Anytime VOX is used there is a serious lag component introduced to PTT for digital work that is why PC-ALE gurus warned ot to use SignalinkUSB built in VOX to activate PTT

On 2020-02-22 12:44 a.m., AndyH wrote:
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Don - KM4UDX wrote:

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....
Likely overkill, but apparently works.  The DuinoVOX uses an Arduino to sense transmit sound and 'push' the PTT.
http://kb9rlw.blogspot.com/2016/08/cheap-and-easy-to-build-digital-modes.html

   This is an option as well, I'm guessing (is there a doctor in the house? hihi).  One can get 5 boards from JLCPCB for about $7.25.:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/free_gerber_files_for_sound/19351002?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,19351002

   Both let one use the sound dongle of their choice - bonus!

   73, Andy


Gordon Gibby
 

Andy, there is a bit of a delay, but winmor tolerates up to almost 200 ms, and most of my transceivers run at 80 ms or less.   I think an enormous number of people have been doing this for a decade or more   My gateway station operates that way, and it is pretty highly used. 




On Feb 22, 2020, at 06:18, Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...> wrote:



Anytime VOX is used there is a serious lag component introduced to PTT for digital work that is why PC-ALE gurus warned ot to use SignalinkUSB built in VOX to activate PTT

On 2020-02-22 12:44 a.m., AndyH wrote:
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Don - KM4UDX wrote:

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....
Likely overkill, but apparently works.  The DuinoVOX uses an Arduino to sense transmit sound and 'push' the PTT.
http://kb9rlw.blogspot.com/2016/08/cheap-and-easy-to-build-digital-modes.html

   This is an option as well, I'm guessing (is there a doctor in the house? hihi).  One can get 5 boards from JLCPCB for about $7.25.:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/free_gerber_files_for_sound/19351002?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,19351002

   Both let one use the sound dongle of their choice - bonus!

   73, Andy


Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...>
 

WE just go with what works for our needs. The PC-ALE digital stuff has some receive scanning and transmit sampling that doesn't tolerate delay well when in automatic mode intended for unattended use I guess whereas winlinkexpress is a bit more forgiving.


On 2020-02-22 5:33 a.m., Gordon Gibby wrote:
Andy, there is a bit of a delay, but winmor tolerates up to almost 200 ms, and most of my transceivers run at 80 ms or less.   I think an enormous number of people have been doing this for a decade or more   My gateway station operates that way, and it is pretty highly used. 




On Feb 22, 2020, at 06:18, Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...> wrote:



Anytime VOX is used there is a serious lag component introduced to PTT for digital work that is why PC-ALE gurus warned ot to use SignalinkUSB built in VOX to activate PTT

On 2020-02-22 12:44 a.m., AndyH wrote:
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Don - KM4UDX wrote:

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....
Likely overkill, but apparently works.  The DuinoVOX uses an Arduino to sense transmit sound and 'push' the PTT.
http://kb9rlw.blogspot.com/2016/08/cheap-and-easy-to-build-digital-modes.html

   This is an option as well, I'm guessing (is there a doctor in the house? hihi).  One can get 5 boards from JLCPCB for about $7.25.:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/free_gerber_files_for_sound/19351002?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,19351002

   Both let one use the sound dongle of their choice - bonus!

   73, Andy


Gordon Gibby
 

Andy, you may well be correct there!  I don’t have much experience with pc-ale 

Thank you for the input 


On Feb 22, 2020, at 06:38, Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...> wrote:



WE just go with what works for our needs. The PC-ALE digital stuff has some receive scanning and transmit sampling that doesn't tolerate delay well when in automatic mode intended for unattended use I guess whereas winlinkexpress is a bit more forgiving.


On 2020-02-22 5:33 a.m., Gordon Gibby wrote:
Andy, there is a bit of a delay, but winmor tolerates up to almost 200 ms, and most of my transceivers run at 80 ms or less.   I think an enormous number of people have been doing this for a decade or more   My gateway station operates that way, and it is pretty highly used. 




On Feb 22, 2020, at 06:18, Andy_501 <andrew.webb.501.ve4per@...> wrote:



Anytime VOX is used there is a serious lag component introduced to PTT for digital work that is why PC-ALE gurus warned ot to use SignalinkUSB built in VOX to activate PTT

On 2020-02-22 12:44 a.m., AndyH wrote:
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Don - KM4UDX wrote:

please..for the love of all that is sacred...there must be a way to use winlink express with just a cheap USB sound card and a USB cable....(he said in pathetic desperation..hahahah).....
Likely overkill, but apparently works.  The DuinoVOX uses an Arduino to sense transmit sound and 'push' the PTT.
http://kb9rlw.blogspot.com/2016/08/cheap-and-easy-to-build-digital-modes.html

   This is an option as well, I'm guessing (is there a doctor in the house? hihi).  One can get 5 boards from JLCPCB for about $7.25.:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/free_gerber_files_for_sound/19351002?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,19351002

   Both let one use the sound dongle of their choice - bonus!

   73, Andy


Don - KM4UDX
 

I submit to the overwhelming wisdom.  (He said "uncle!", hahahah)

Do i I hook the easydigi PPT pad to the orange wire/ PPT pin 7 in our beloved uBITX?  

On on the computer side there are three wires....and I keep seeing discussions "inverting the signal" but I just close my eyes then....back to the three wires....do I hack a USB cable from the laptop to get the computer side hookup,  or do I need a special FTDI (whatever) USB cable to hack out the right connections?  Be gentle, I am but a humble pilgrim....


KC2UKU ED
 

Hi I don't do this, but easydigi I use and make one like them...as for the Ubitx I can't help on right now but as for the the computer
you will need a converter usb to rs232 or you can build something like this cir. 

On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 9:22 AM Don - KM4UDX <dontAy155@...> wrote:
I submit to the overwhelming wisdom.  (He said "uncle!", hahahah)

Do i I hook the easydigi PPT pad to the orange wire/ PPT pin 7 in our beloved uBITX?  

On on the computer side there are three wires....and I keep seeing discussions "inverting the signal" but I just close my eyes then....back to the three wires....do I hack a USB cable from the laptop to get the computer side hookup,  or do I need a special FTDI (whatever) USB cable to hack out the right connections?  Be gentle, I am but a humble pilgrim....



--
ED W2ELM


Joe Puma
 

Call me crazy but I thought you can TX with CAT control on the uBitx. I swore I got wsjtx doing PTT using CAT. 

If WinLink does not allow PTT as well as radio cat control then I’m shocked. I guess I may have used a serial interface as well since I have interfaces made for computer/radio hookups. 

Joe
KD2NFC 



On Feb 22, 2020, at 3:36 AM, Gordon Gibby <docvacuumtubes@...> wrote:


yup.   Unfortunately you may discover that the winlink software simply doesn't enable the CAT TX control.   I dunno.   All I know is virtually everyone does it with either a signalink or a very simple circuit.   I took a simple design that a fellow in England made, and we created our our printed circuit boards and routinely crank these things out.   The easy-digi will do fine, it only lacks physical volume controls.   

The instruction manual for the one we use locally his here and the schematic (hand drawn) is on page 7:   https://qsl.net/nf4rc/2019/SmallBoxSoundCardInterfaceManual2.2.pdf    Should only take you 30 minutes to hand create the ptt portion.   You can use optical isolation, an easy-digi, or a relay.    Using a transistor works, but is susceptible to radio frequency interference.    

The soundcard folks sell SO MANY of their product that they don't even have to discount them.   That gives a bit of a hint.  

73,
gordon gibby kx4z


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 2:13 AM Dean Souleles <dsouleles@...> wrote:
Hey neighbor -

I went through the setup and got to the same place you did.  It connects to the Mighty uBITX and even sets the frequency - but does not want to switch to  transmit on send.

Keep noodling....

73,
Dean
KK4DAS


Mick
 

Joe,
Your not crazy, I’m currently using wsjtx cat control to Enable ptt on my v6 with KD8CEC arduino software.  I don’t know about winlink though.
Mick


AndyH
 

Andy - what sort of hardware do you use for PC-ALE?

73, Andy, KG5RKP


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 05:38 AM, Andy_501 wrote:

WE just go with what works for our needs. The PC-ALE digital stuff has some receive scanning and transmit sampling that doesn't tolerate delay well when in automatic mode intended for unattended use I guess whereas winlinkexpress is a bit more forgiving