Topics

Grounding shematic for a Metal Chassis, which is the right way to wire up?

sdr freak
 

Hello again HAM's !

I have an really important question for all HAM's here, who have their Ubitx in a metal housing or have the knowledge about the grounding options for this way i looking for..

It's like..I want to have my Ubitx in an aluminium chassis and ground everything to this like i see in athread here in forum(i hope its ok to post the pics here), perfect showing what i mean and what i search to understand this correct wire up, look here please:

https://groups.io/g/BITX20/attachment/44890/2/IMG_4811.JPG

https://groups.io/g/BITX20/attachment/44890/3/IMG_4812.JPG

https://groups.io/g/BITX20/attachment/44890/8/IMG_4817.JPG


this is my problem, and i see enough metal cased ubitx's but only few pics with this grounding.. and this is what i look for but i don't understand this whit the logic of the wire up v1.9 in this forum, look here:

https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0

also i want ask for a picture to wiring the grounding when use a metal chassis, because i doesn't unterstand the wire up shematic(v1.7;v1.8,v1.9) here in forum. because in all this wire up shematic, i read that it's the best to use metal chassis and but be careful of 'ground loops' and then the 'sleeves are grounded'...
so that is really dificult for me to understand this shematic what does it mean whit Ground Loops and so on..

and now i don't know what is the 'wire up shematic for metal chassis' and which cable should have to stay at the place when i wish to build a nice grounded ubitx, like a chassis which is grounded + have a grounding-screw at the backside plate to ground the whole ubitx at the main ground in my home, for any secure and on the other side a have a nice grounded chassis where all the things have their ground like 'mic/ptt-jack , keyer-jack , audio-jack, ,the encoder-button, the turning resistor for nf voulume,  possibly additional switches, antenna conection,..

ok i think you can be understand what i mean, i look for all things in the ubitx they are have ground connect, few things directly  to the raduino or the main board, and the raduino and the board + display are also this things which i doesn't understand to ground this when use metal chassis and i look for my idea to make all grounding to a main chassis-ground-screw..

Can anybody help me there, so that i don't make mistakes who destroy anthing in the ubitx..? Is there possibly anyone who have a ubitx in metall case and can say what he does in this obstacle. please don't laughing at me ...
(i'm really read for weeks and its not like a have not search for, but i'm really confused with this 'Grounding Chassis and make it Right' so now i must hope for all help of anybody who is know i feel whit this problem like ''why i'm don't understand..why? is it like,..humm..sh*t why does i find no way in this alone..'' .. it's like a war in me and feels like there is no way to get smarter.. but i would love to get this smartness, to understand this things mostly complete at my self alone.. but sometimes it shouldn't be..)

ok i don't make it any larger - i hope for help thanks!!

Best regards Fabian !

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

Fabian,

All the ground cables have more DC and RF resistance then the aluminum plate!
As a result they look impressive but mean nothing.

The board has 4 mounting holes each is ground so if mounted to a metallic plate
with metal spacers and screws the board is grounded.  Anything more than
maybe using star washers is pointless.

The use of a metallic box is however a good thing and insure there are grill or
holes for airflow as the finals do require airflow.

Using insulated mounting kits for the finals and mounting them to a grounded
heat sink of some larger radiating area is also a good procedure.

Allison

sdr freak
 

Hi!

First i want thank you for your fast answer :-) Ok i have a new question about this.. In the Wire Up Shematic v1.9 i read this:

1. "the Ubitx board should be grounded in a metal case or a common ground if using plastic case.."

2. "IRF510 tabs have DC voltage and SHOULD NOT be grounded to metal case"

3. "Rotary encoder, audio & keyer jack wires....If using metal case jack ground wires can be omitted.The SLEEVE is grounded to the case"   <-- how becomes the case ground and what's about the other jack, the mic/ptt jack and the volume switch? Means that if the GND wires from raduino/mainboard to the jack sleeves are not anymore conected when i have grounding my ubitx main board have contact if screwed together on the 4 holes with the aluminium bottom plate where it is mounted on?

And if it was my plan to make a other additional PTT-Button and Encoder-switch button, i've seen in the v1.9 shematic, how would I wire that if I put this on 'the thing with the previously mentioned sentence' in the context that "all jack are grounded over the housing"?

When the ground wires can be omitted then their must be ground on metal case.. <<---This i would realize whit a soldered cable direct from the 'black DC-input cable' which was mounted with a cableshoe
(..it say in germany "kabelschuhe") on the case with a nice brass screw. Is this right what i have say?

..and this would be my case-main-ground-port-connection-point, for other things like a back plate brass screw for ground the whole ubitx to my home, and for sure this is a must be when i was have outdoor ham sessions, so that I can ground the whole ubitx directly over the earth floor with for example a metal bar and i like to transmit with kite antenna, long wire antenna high in trees and when this doing, i read, there should be a main ground to the earth ground.

next was point 5. in den v1.9 wire up shematic, It is important to finally have clarity..ok look please here:

5. DC-power cable should be twisted.(yes i ve do this at begin of assemble ubitx with all cable) (but now this-->) The negative (Black) wire should be lager size!

On other website i have read and see this on few ubitx build's but i missing a wire up shematic which have directly draw all these or describe a little bit more information about this whole "Grounded Case Wire Up Shematic" (when i have enough knowledge about this, then my idea is to make this wire up plan..), ...so i have no idea which cable diameter should be used for this "thicker, lager sized negative black dc-power cable.." Can someone help me with the necessary data of a diameter for this cable?

Which construction idea is the best for beginner? Only use a metal case and wire up the same like describe in the v1.7/1.9 wire up shematic here: https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0 and ignore the informations in the plan, like i see most metal cased ubitx pics where i never see the construction instructions with the thick black DC cable, the omission of the grounding cable at the Jack-Sleeves and encoder, grounding mount screw, just everything that I ask here wasn't see at the most picture of metal cased ubitx.. but why is wrote in the wire up instructions (v1.7-1.9) about all these important hints if then almost no one does this and still the normal wiring plan is made despite the metal box, because what I mean at all are yes then this ground loops of what is being warned ... I do not understand now..

ok last point here, warning for ' be careful of groundloops'...On another page I read that it has to do with the thick black DC cable and thus diminished, but not as it is now in the exact context with the rest of the history of the cable and the word ground loops does not tell me how to classify it in Regarding my questions about the individual points .. that would just be the point why it is so important to me to get help because I could not find it to understand. Thank you

Ok these are my question.

Ah yeah.. It is really an interesting and very demanding hobby we have.. or is it just me who is think this :D yae yae yae...hard long way to get this ubitx for rx/tx function..


I hope anyone can help me :)

Best Regards Fabian



iz oos
 

Thanks for the book. Chapter 2 is very important. If you want to use the chassis you need to be sure you insulate the tabs from the chassis.


Il 04/set/2018 13:26, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
Hi!

First i want thank you for your fast answer :-) Ok i have a new question about this.. In the Wire Up Shematic v1.9 i read this:

1. "the Ubitx board should be grounded in a metal case or a common ground if using plastic case.."

2. "IRF510 tabs have DC voltage and SHOULD NOT be grounded to metal case"

3. "Rotary encoder, audio & keyer jack wires....If using metal case jack ground wires can be omitted.The SLEEVE is grounded to the case"   <-- how becomes the case ground and what's about the other jack, the mic/ptt jack and the volume switch? Means that if the GND wires from raduino/mainboard to the jack sleeves are not anymore conected when i have grounding my ubitx main board have contact if screwed together on the 4 holes with the aluminium bottom plate where it is mounted on?

And if it was my plan to make a other additional PTT-Button and Encoder-switch button, i've seen in the v1.9 shematic, how would I wire that if I put this on 'the thing with the previously mentioned sentence' in the context that "all jack are grounded over the housing"?

When the ground wires can be omitted then their must be ground on metal case.. <<---This i would realize whit a soldered cable direct from the 'black DC-input cable' which was mounted with a cableshoe
(..it say in germany "kabelschuhe") on the case with a nice brass screw. Is this right what i have say?

..and this would be my case-main-ground-port-connection-point, for other things like a back plate brass screw for ground the whole ubitx to my home, and for sure this is a must be when i was have outdoor ham sessions, so that I can ground the whole ubitx directly over the earth floor with for example a metal bar and i like to transmit with kite antenna, long wire antenna high in trees and when this doing, i read, there should be a main ground to the earth ground.

next was point 5. in den v1.9 wire up shematic, It is important to finally have clarity..ok look please here:

5. DC-power cable should be twisted.(yes i ve do this at begin of assemble ubitx with all cable) (but now this-->) The negative (Black) wire should be lager size!

On other website i have read and see this on few ubitx build's but i missing a wire up shematic which have directly draw all these or describe a little bit more information about this whole "Grounded Case Wire Up Shematic" (when i have enough knowledge about this, then my idea is to make this wire up plan..), ...so i have no idea which cable diameter should be used for this "thicker, lager sized negative black dc-power cable.." Can someone help me with the necessary data of a diameter for this cable?

Which construction idea is the best for beginner? Only use a metal case and wire up the same like describe in the v1.7/1.9 wire up shematic here: https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0 and ignore the informations in the plan, like i see most metal cased ubitx pics where i never see the construction instructions with the thick black DC cable, the omission of the grounding cable at the Jack-Sleeves and encoder, grounding mount screw, just everything that I ask here wasn't see at the most picture of metal cased ubitx.. but why is wrote in the wire up instructions (v1.7-1.9) about all these important hints if then almost no one does this and still the normal wiring plan is made despite the metal box, because what I mean at all are yes then this ground loops of what is being warned ... I do not understand now..

ok last point here, warning for ' be careful of groundloops'...On another page I read that it has to do with the thick black DC cable and thus diminished, but not as it is now in the exact context with the rest of the history of the cable and the word ground loops does not tell me how to classify it in Regarding my questions about the individual points .. that would just be the point why it is so important to me to get help because I could not find it to understand. Thank you

Ok these are my question.

Ah yeah.. It is really an interesting and very demanding hobby we have.. or is it just me who is think this :D yae yae yae...hard long way to get this ubitx for rx/tx function..


I hope anyone can help me :)

Best Regards Fabian



sdr freak
 

On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 05:01 AM, iz oos wrote:

Thanks for the book. Chapter 2 is very important. If you want to use the chassis you need to be sure you insulate the tabs from the chassis.

Thank you for your answer!

Well, does not post from a book, i have write my words and the things from the wire up shematic v1.9, is this not ok? does i make anything wrong whit dataprotect? please help there, i just thought to describe my problem it's ok to post this? Ok my english is not the best, but my opinion was i've described the question good as i can to read this from english speaking HAM or do you mean with book the large post i made or even that nobody can figure out whats about the question of the whole points i ask for??

thank you all for more ideas, i'm at the momemt in my custom room and work on the ubitx.. so there it is a good moment for further answers to that, which I can then implement immediately and can install or change.

Is it better to post some picture of my ubitx build? (i think always picture does not even say always the knowlegde which i can learn when read oder write here in forum.. but if you want pics, please say :-)

Regards Fabian, DO6FAB

iz oos
 

Fabian, no problem at all, your English is very good and you described your doubts very well. With 'book' I was a bit kidding on the length of the post. In any case you rised a good point. Grounding is important and sometimes critical and your doubts are the same doubts of other at least 100 users.


Il 04/set/2018 17:56, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 05:01 AM, iz oos wrote:

Thanks for the book. Chapter 2 is very important. If you want to use the chassis you need to be sure you insulate the tabs from the chassis.

Thank you for your answer!

Well, does not post from a book, i have write my words and the things from the wire up shematic v1.9, is this not ok? does i make anything wrong whit dataprotect? please help there, i just thought to describe my problem it's ok to post this? Ok my english is not the best, but my opinion was i've described the question good as i can to read this from english speaking HAM or do you mean with book the large post i made or even that nobody can figure out whats about the question of the whole points i ask for??

thank you all for more ideas, i'm at the momemt in my custom room and work on the ubitx.. so there it is a good moment for further answers to that, which I can then implement immediately and can install or change.

Is it better to post some picture of my ubitx build? (i think always picture does not even say always the knowlegde which i can learn when read oder write here in forum.. but if you want pics, please say :-)

Regards Fabian, DO6FAB

W5CTD
 

I am sorry to be so ignorant but what exactly are you talking about with the IRF510 Tabs?   Can you show a picture of how to properly ground (or not ground) the device and the PC Board in general?


All the best to you

Charles T Dennis 



From: BITX20@groups.io <BITX20@groups.io> on behalf of iz oos <and2oosiz2@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 7:01 AM
To: BITX20@groups.io
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Grounding shematic for a Metal Chassis, which is the right way to wire up?
 

Thanks for the book. Chapter 2 is very important. If you want to use the chassis you need to be sure you insulate the tabs from the chassis.


Il 04/set/2018 13:26, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
Hi!

First i want thank you for your fast answer :-) Ok i have a new question about this.. In the Wire Up Shematic v1.9 i read this:

1. "the Ubitx board should be grounded in a metal case or a common ground if using plastic case.."

2. "IRF510 tabs have DC voltage and SHOULD NOT be grounded to metal case"

3. "Rotary encoder, audio & keyer jack wires....If using metal case jack ground wires can be omitted.The SLEEVE is grounded to the case"   <-- how becomes the case ground and what's about the other jack, the mic/ptt jack and the volume switch? Means that if the GND wires from raduino/mainboard to the jack sleeves are not anymore conected when i have grounding my ubitx main board have contact if screwed together on the 4 holes with the aluminium bottom plate where it is mounted on?

And if it was my plan to make a other additional PTT-Button and Encoder-switch button, i've seen in the v1.9 shematic, how would I wire that if I put this on 'the thing with the previously mentioned sentence' in the context that "all jack are grounded over the housing"?

When the ground wires can be omitted then their must be ground on metal case.. <<---This i would realize whit a soldered cable direct from the 'black DC-input cable' which was mounted with a cableshoe
(..it say in germany "kabelschuhe") on the case with a nice brass screw. Is this right what i have say?

..and this would be my case-main-ground-port-connection-point, for other things like a back plate brass screw for ground the whole ubitx to my home, and for sure this is a must be when i was have outdoor ham sessions, so that I can ground the whole ubitx directly over the earth floor with for example a metal bar and i like to transmit with kite antenna, long wire antenna high in trees and when this doing, i read, there should be a main ground to the earth ground.

next was point 5. in den v1.9 wire up shematic, It is important to finally have clarity..ok look please here:

5. DC-power cable should be twisted.(yes i ve do this at begin of assemble ubitx with all cable) (but now this-->) The negative (Black) wire should be lager size!

On other website i have read and see this on few ubitx build's but i missing a wire up shematic which have directly draw all these or describe a little bit more information about this whole "Grounded Case Wire Up Shematic" (when i have enough knowledge about this, then my idea is to make this wire up plan..), ...so i have no idea which cable diameter should be used for this "thicker, lager sized negative black dc-power cable.." Can someone help me with the necessary data of a diameter for this cable?

Which construction idea is the best for beginner? Only use a metal case and wire up the same like describe in the v1.7/1.9 wire up shematic here: https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0 and ignore the informations in the plan, like i see most metal cased ubitx pics where i never see the construction instructions with the thick black DC cable, the omission of the grounding cable at the Jack-Sleeves and encoder, grounding mount screw, just everything that I ask here wasn't see at the most picture of metal cased ubitx.. but why is wrote in the wire up instructions (v1.7-1.9) about all these important hints if then almost no one does this and still the normal wiring plan is made despite the metal box, because what I mean at all are yes then this ground loops of what is being warned ... I do not understand now..

ok last point here, warning for ' be careful of groundloops'...On another page I read that it has to do with the thick black DC cable and thus diminished, but not as it is now in the exact context with the rest of the history of the cable and the word ground loops does not tell me how to classify it in Regarding my questions about the individual points .. that would just be the point why it is so important to me to get help because I could not find it to understand. Thank you

Ok these are my question.

Ah yeah.. It is really an interesting and very demanding hobby we have.. or is it just me who is think this :D yae yae yae...hard long way to get this ubitx for rx/tx function..


I hope anyone can help me :)

Best Regards Fabian



sdr freak
 

@ iz oos

ok, good to hear this, but a few more answer to the problem that i ask for was better ;D

@ WA5ZTD

i was talking about the heatsink from the IRF510, so i read it in this shematic uploaded here in forum, the v.1.9...

i have no picture or shematic for the grounding should be, that's what i ask for! my problem is that i doesn't have one! i need a couple of information about this whole things about, like grouding the metal case, what about avoid grounding loops and for important the wire up with the jacks and their sleeves in front of the grounded case.. these are my problems, when i say it shortly,... today i've tried to say it shortly

so please have anyone a few info about, please?

iz oos
 

I think the optimal solution is an entire metal case. I can talk only about what I did and my case is hybrid, it's metal except for the front and the back panels that are plastic. Why did I choose that? Simply it was nice, the right size and I had it some years taking dust. All connectors are mounted either on the front or on the back panel. I kept things as simple as possible, so the heatsinks are the originals and the board is mounted inside so I don't use the case for thermal cooling. Unless you are certain how to keep insulated the tabs of the finals (which have DC voltage if I am correct) I wouldn't mount the finals to the metal chassis. But that depends also on how you want to use the uBitx. If you use it for RTTY or digital modes, you might need a better cooling, drill holes on the chassis and/or add a vent. I mostly use SSB and CW and what I did was not optimal but adequate. In the case my finals would fail, I will spend 2 euros and half an hour to replace them.



Il 05/set/2018 12:15, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
@ iz oos

ok, good to hear this, but a few more answer to the problem that i ask for was better ;D

@ WA5ZTD

i was talking about the heatsink from the IRF510, so i read it in this shematic uploaded here in forum, the v.1.9...

i have no picture or shematic for the grounding should be, that's what i ask for! my problem is that i doesn't have one! i need a couple of information about this whole things about, like grouding the metal case, what about avoid grounding loops and for important the wire up with the jacks and their sleeves in front of the grounded case.. these are my problems, when i say it shortly,... today i've tried to say it shortly

so please have anyone a few info about, please?

sdr freak
 

Hello again!

First thanks, i'm anytime be glad for answer! And these kind of answer is still hepl me. So thanks.

ok, sorry but what is the word "Finals" ,in your post, mean for? Do you mean the IRF510? The heatsink and the metal case doesn't have contact but when this was corectly built up, so is there more insulation at anypoint a must be? like the board screw holes when mounted on bottom alumium plate, like other conections there?? For real its only the concact between the heatsink of both IRF510 to the back plate and when it's securly built up, then it should be all fine, or does i missed up anything?

The ventilation in my case is on bottom many little holes and on back plate are ventilation lines milled, in the hight of the 2 heatsinks. I work on the idea to install a little processor fan.
But in my workshop room it's caos.. (When you look at my profile pic, and make bit larger you can see the workshop room a little bit, ok not much you can see on it, but the milling machine should be able to see. I have in times before come to HAM, learned Metal-Worker Job and it was a interest to make little things from metal with mill and lathe or other machine.. But now when then ubitx works anyday i want to build a few Antenna and Variable Capacitor for Mag Loop with the mill, so i was lucky to bought these machine and hasn't do waste the money for party or so, in years ago, when have the job and was able to bought this things for look at future. Now i'm proud about that i was think so and see a chance for work with this things on HAM homebrew build things...) Just a story about this..

ok back to topic..

These things like Ground Loops and Grounding a was better understand if i see a shematic which descripe this.
The modes i want do, is SSB mainly and CW in next time when learned this better... But a important thing for me is to make WSPR in next time..This was very nice for me to do it self one day..

ok i hope you can descripe the insulation of the heatsink to the metal case, a little more information for this from your mind was nice.


regards Fabian

iz oos
 

Yes Fabian with 'finals' I mean the power amplifier transistors, the IRF510. My UBitx had the heatsinks just put on the back of IRF510. If I had used a metal case in place of the heatsink I could not just screw (sounds bad hihi) the IRF510 on the metal case. There are small plastic kits to DC isolate the transistors and allow heat dissipation at the same time. If you live in Germany, Conrad shops should have them for sure. I haven't found ground loop issues with my Ubitx, but ground loops depend on the things, accessories, PC, connected to the Ubitx. I have had ground loops problems other times. Once with a German 10.7Mhz IF sdr receiver. The antenna ground was connected with the ground of PC and generated any sort of noise. To solve that completely I used a small conventional RF 1:1 transformer at the antenna input. It happens, when you see an increase of noise it may be due to ground loops.


Il 05/set/2018 19:31, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
Hello again!

First thanks, i'm anytime be glad for answer! And these kind of answer is still hepl me. So thanks.

ok, sorry but what is the word "Finals" ,in your post, mean for? Do you mean the IRF510? The heatsink and the metal case doesn't have contact but when this was corectly built up, so is there more insulation at anypoint a must be? like the board screw holes when mounted on bottom alumium plate, like other conections there?? For real its only the concact between the heatsink of both IRF510 to the back plate and when it's securly built up, then it should be all fine, or does i missed up anything?

The ventilation in my case is on bottom many little holes and on back plate are ventilation lines milled, in the hight of the 2 heatsinks. I work on the idea to install a little processor fan.
But in my workshop room it's caos.. (When you look at my profile pic, and make bit larger you can see the workshop room a little bit, ok not much you can see on it, but the milling machine should be able to see. I have in times before come to HAM, learned Metal-Worker Job and it was a interest to make little things from metal with mill and lathe or other machine.. But now when then ubitx works anyday i want to build a few Antenna and Variable Capacitor for Mag Loop with the mill, so i was lucky to bought these machine and hasn't do waste the money for party or so, in years ago, when have the job and was able to bought this things for look at future. Now i'm proud about that i was think so and see a chance for work with this things on HAM homebrew build things...) Just a story about this..

ok back to topic..

These things like Ground Loops and Grounding a was better understand if i see a shematic which descripe this.
The modes i want do, is SSB mainly and CW in next time when learned this better... But a important thing for me is to make WSPR in next time..This was very nice for me to do it self one day..

ok i hope you can descripe the insulation of the heatsink to the metal case, a little more information for this from your mind was nice.


regards Fabian

sdr freak
 

ok thank you!

would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to transmit with the vhf radio when you want it too?

ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a sign of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by this.. very thankfully about these kind of knowledge!

when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by wire up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without extra ground cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves, how i should i understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says the things that makes me crazy.. there is written when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware of ground loops'...

this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make your project by this, by the using of or not using these whole points sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only front is metal ?

hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..  https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0

iz oos
 

Not in Germany but not that far away, I have qsos on VHF with German stations only during contests with big big stations like DR9A... I mostly use qrp and minimal equipment on higher bands as well. Not every time an increase of noise level is due to ground loops. But it happened to me I solved noise issue using for instance isolating audio transformers between the rig and external accessories and especially PC soundcards. My case is all metal except for the front and the back panels so it is surely different from yours. I didn't notice annoying noise that could be due to ground loops. All installations are different. Ground loops may become a problem when too many things are connected together and are not bond together to a common ground point. I am not an expert on this, read the ARRL or equivalent handbooks that treat this topic.


Il 07/set/2018 16:36, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
ok thank you!

would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to transmit with the vhf radio when you want it too?

ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a sign of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by this.. very thankfully about these kind of knowledge!

when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by wire up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without extra ground cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves, how i should i understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says the things that makes me crazy.. there is written when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware of ground loops'...

this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make your project by this, by the using of or not using these whole points sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only front is metal ?

hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..  https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0

iz oos
 

Ok. Think to an audio amplifier in a car. Often you need just the red wire to turn it on. When the metal case of the amplifier is connected to the chassis of the car which in turn is connected to the negative of the battery (please correct me if I am wrong, I think it is correct). If you add another ground wire (the black in our example) is a nuisance that may make a ground loop. The same applies in the uBitx, if the case is all metal some wires are nuisances that may lead to ground loop issues.

when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware of ground loop


Il 07/set/2018 17:50, "iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> ha scritto:

Not in Germany but not that far away, I have qsos on VHF with German stations only during contests with big big stations like DR9A... I mostly use qrp and minimal equipment on higher bands as well. Not every time an increase of noise level is due to ground loops. But it happened to me I solved noise issue using for instance isolating audio transformers between the rig and external accessories and especially PC soundcards. My case is all metal except for the front and the back panels so it is surely different from yours. I didn't notice annoying noise that could be due to ground loops. All installations are different. Ground loops may become a problem when too many things are connected together and are not bond together to a common ground point. I am not an expert on this, read the ARRL or equivalent handbooks that treat this topic.


Il 07/set/2018 16:36, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
ok thank you!

would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to transmit with the vhf radio when you want it too?

ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a sign of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by this.. very thankfully about these kind of knowledge!

when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by wire up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without extra ground cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves, how i should i understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says the things that makes me crazy.. there is written when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware of ground loops'...

this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make your project by this, by the using of or not using these whole points sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only front is metal ?

hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..  https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0


Tim Gorman
 

Respectfully, having fought noise problems in several different cars
and trucks, dependence on the dash to provide a ground or even
depending on the floor pan of the vehicle is a good way to introduce
noise into the rig. Not all body parts are properly connected together
and then connected to the battery and physical stress during car
movement can cause noise generation because of high resistance grounds.
Similar to single point grounds in places like telephone switches or
power substations, a negative lead from the radio directly to the
battery has always worked best for me.

tim ab0wr

On Fri, 7 Sep 2018 09:40:13 -0700
"iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> wrote:

Ok. Think to an audio amplifier in a car. Often you need just the red
wire to turn it on. When the metal case of the amplifier is connected
to the chassis of the car which in turn is connected to the negative
of the battery (please correct me if I am wrong, I think it is
correct). If you add another ground wire (the black in our example)
is a nuisance that may make a ground loop. The same applies in the
uBitx, if the case is all metal some wires are nuisances that may
lead to ground loop issues.

when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow
wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and
and..then big written 'be aware of ground loop

Il 07/set/2018 17:50, "iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> ha scritto:

Not in Germany but not that far away, I have qsos on VHF with German
stations only during contests with big big stations like DR9A... I
mostly use qrp and minimal equipment on higher bands as well. Not
every time an increase of noise level is due to ground loops. But it
happened to me I solved noise issue using for instance isolating
audio transformers between the rig and external accessories and
especially PC soundcards. My case is all metal except for the front
and the back panels so it is surely different from yours. I didn't
notice annoying noise that could be due to ground loops. All
installations are different. Ground loops may become a problem when
too many things are connected together and are not bond together to a
common ground point. I am not an expert on this, read the ARRL or
equivalent handbooks that treat this topic.

Il 07/set/2018 16:36, "sdr freak" <@DO6FAB> ha scritto:

ok thank you!

would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to transmit
with the vhf radio when you want it too?

ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a sign
of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by this.. very
thankfully about these kind of knowledge!

when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by wire
up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without extra ground
cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves, how i should i
understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says the things that
makes me crazy.. there is written when use metal case then jack
sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and
use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware
of ground loops'...

this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make your
project by this, by the using of or not using these whole points
sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only front is
metal ?

hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.
png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0



G
M
T


English German

English German









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iz oos
 

Ok Tim, in that case the chassis of your rig is not connected to the chassis of the car. If bonded to the chassis of the rig and the negative of the battery one would create a ground loop. I think you connected directly the chassis of your radio to the negative of your battery with a wire of at least the same size of the 'red' cable.


Il 07/set/2018 20:49, "Tim Gorman" <tgorman2@...> ha scritto:
Respectfully, having fought noise problems in several different cars
and trucks, dependence on the dash to provide a ground or even
depending on the floor pan of the vehicle is a good way to introduce
noise into the rig. Not all body parts are properly connected together
and then connected to the battery and physical stress during car
movement can cause noise generation because of high resistance grounds.
Similar to single point grounds in places like telephone switches or
power substations, a negative lead from the radio directly to the
battery has always worked best for me.

tim ab0wr

On Fri, 7 Sep 2018 09:40:13 -0700
"iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> wrote:

> Ok. Think to an audio amplifier in a car. Often you need just the red
> wire to turn it on. When the metal case of the amplifier is connected
> to the chassis of the car which in turn is connected to the negative
> of the battery (please correct me if I am wrong, I think it is
> correct). If you add another ground wire (the black in our example)
> is a nuisance that may make a ground loop. The same applies in the
> uBitx, if the case is all metal some wires are nuisances that may
> lead to ground loop issues.
>
> when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow
> wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and
> and..then big written 'be aware of ground loop
>
> Il 07/set/2018 17:50, "iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> ha scritto:
>
> Not in Germany but not that far away, I have qsos on VHF with German
> stations only during contests with big big stations like DR9A... I
> mostly use qrp and minimal equipment on higher bands as well. Not
> every time an increase of noise level is due to ground loops. But it
> happened to me I solved noise issue using for instance isolating
> audio transformers between the rig and external accessories and
> especially PC soundcards. My case is all metal except for the front
> and the back panels so it is surely different from yours. I didn't
> notice annoying noise that could be due to ground loops. All
> installations are different. Ground loops may become a problem when
> too many things are connected together and are not bond together to a
> common ground point. I am not an expert on this, read the ARRL or
> equivalent handbooks that treat this topic.
>
> Il 07/set/2018 16:36, "sdr freak" <sdrfreak55@...> ha scritto:
>
> > ok thank you!
> >
> > would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to transmit
> > with the vhf radio when you want it too?
> >
> > ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a sign
> > of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by this.. very
> > thankfully about these kind of knowledge!
> >
> > when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by wire
> > up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without extra ground
> > cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves, how i should i
> > understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says the things that
> > makes me crazy.. there is written when use metal case then jack
> > sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire isn't need any more and
> > use thick black ground wire and and and..then big written 'be aware
> > of ground loops'...
> >
> > this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make your
> > project by this, by the using of or not using these whole points
> > sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only front is
> > metal ?
> >
> > hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..
> > https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.
> > png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0
> >
> >
> >
> > G
> > M
> > T
> >
> >
> > English German
> >
> > English German
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Text-to-speech function is limited to 200 characters
> >
> >
> > Options : History : Feedback : Donate
> > <https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=GD9D8CPW8HFA2>
> > Close
> > 
>
>
>
>




Tim Gorman
 

Yep! That's the whole point of a single point ground! Run the negative
lead from the radio to the battery!

tim ab0wr

On Fri, 7 Sep 2018 12:44:35 -0700
"iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> wrote:

Ok Tim, in that case the chassis of your rig is not connected to the
chassis of the car. If bonded to the chassis of the rig and the
negative of the battery one would create a ground loop. I think you
connected directly the chassis of your radio to the negative of your
battery with a wire of at least the same size of the 'red' cable.

Il 07/set/2018 20:49, "Tim Gorman" <tgorman2@...> ha scritto:

Respectfully, having fought noise problems in several different cars
and trucks, dependence on the dash to provide a ground or even
depending on the floor pan of the vehicle is a good way to introduce
noise into the rig. Not all body parts are properly connected
together and then connected to the battery and physical stress
during car movement can cause noise generation because of high
resistance grounds. Similar to single point grounds in places like
telephone switches or power substations, a negative lead from the
radio directly to the battery has always worked best for me.

tim ab0wr

On Fri, 7 Sep 2018 09:40:13 -0700
"iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> wrote:

Ok. Think to an audio amplifier in a car. Often you need just the
red wire to turn it on. When the metal case of the amplifier is
connected to the chassis of the car which in turn is connected to
the negative of the battery (please correct me if I am wrong, I
think it is correct). If you add another ground wire (the black
in our example) is a nuisance that may make a ground loop. The
same applies in the uBitx, if the case is all metal some wires
are nuisances that may lead to ground loop issues.

when use metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an
yellow wire isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire
and and and..then big written 'be aware of ground loop

Il 07/set/2018 17:50, "iz oos" <and2oosiz2@...> ha scritto:

Not in Germany but not that far away, I have qsos on VHF with
German stations only during contests with big big stations like
DR9A... I mostly use qrp and minimal equipment on higher bands as
well. Not every time an increase of noise level is due to ground
loops. But it happened to me I solved noise issue using for
instance isolating audio transformers between the rig and
external accessories and especially PC soundcards. My case is all
metal except for the front and the back panels so it is surely
different from yours. I didn't notice annoying noise that could
be due to ground loops. All installations are different. Ground
loops may become a problem when too many things are connected
together and are not bond together to a common ground point. I am
not an expert on this, read the ARRL or equivalent handbooks that
treat this topic.

Il 07/set/2018 16:36, "sdr freak" <@DO6FAB> ha
scritto:
ok thank you!

would you life in germany, too? if yes, we should try to
transmit with the vhf radio when you want it too?

ok by the way, in your post you mean the increased noise is a
sign of ground loops.. ok something new i have learned by
this.. very thankfully about these kind of knowledge!

when the ground loops you say, isn't the problem in ubitx by
wire up the v1.9 shematic in a metal/aluminum case without
extra ground cable to the case and less cable for the sleeves,
how i should i understand the words in shematic v1.9 which says
the things that makes me crazy.. there is written when use
metal case then jack sleeves have ground at case an yellow wire
isn't need any more and use thick black ground wire and and
and..then big written 'be aware of ground loops'...

this is the problem i doesn't understand and how have you make
your project by this, by the using of or not using these whole
points sayes in shematic v1.9? you dont have a metal box only
front is metal ?

hm here again the shematic v1.9 which i have to understand..
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/photo/49276/0/uBITX_wireup_v1.9.
png?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0



G
M
T


English German

English German









Text-to-speech function is limited to 200 characters


Options : History : Feedback : Donate
<https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&
hosted_button_id=GD9D8CPW8HFA2>
Close