Date   
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Mike Short <ai4ns.mike@...>
 

Everything causes cancer in Kalifornia. Probably living there does too. 


--
Mike
AI4NS

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Dr. Flywheel
 

Good to be cautious and prudent to warn the public about real threats. However, crying wolf too many times annuls the good intentions. It is a situation very similar to marking all documents as "SECRET" just to see real secrets escaping into the public domain.

--Ron   N7FTZ

On Thu, Jan 10, 2019 at 5:54 PM Bob Lunsford via Groups.Io <nocrud222=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
RE: What, the warning that the state of California believes these will cause reproductive harm?






Re: Output Filter

 

Hi Richard,

There sure does seem to be a problem there.  I guess first thing I would do is put the current LPF design values into a program like Elsie and see if they give the expected curve.  Then you would know where the schematic values are correct or not.  If so, then the inductors should be wound at least according to the toroids.info calculator (which I've always found to be quite accurate).  The only warning would be if the cores used on these sets are kind of non-standard or something.  Of  course measuring is great if you have an accurate meter or a GDO.

73,


Mark.

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Bob Lunsford <nocrud222@...>
 

RE: What, the warning that the state of California believes these will cause reproductive harm?

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Bob Lunsford <nocrud222@...>
 

"As of August 2018 the State of California" ... has become even
more confused about such a simple term as "Relevancy."

Bob — KK5R

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 1/10/19, Carlos Puig <cpuig3141@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement
To: BITX20@groups.io
Date: Thursday, January 10, 2019, 6:54 PM


Apparently,
the
requirements for these warnings recently changed. 
Here is the
explanation from the MPJA web site, which now has
the Prop 65
warning on *every* single part they sell:



Carlos -
KJ6ST



On 1/10/2019
13:31, Bob Lunsford via
Groups.Io wrote:



That's
like the ceramic tubes used in one conduction cooled
amp by Heathkit that had a warning that said breathing the
dust from that ceramic tube was hazardous. This meant that
they did not recommend anyone use a grinder on them to
take them apart. Only a fool would do that, anyway.

Many of them were sold but I never heard of anyone being
assaulted by the dust.

California has people who sit up nights writing this stuff
up.
If it were a real unavoidable hazard, it would have been
pulled
off the market by the EPA. Still, good to know that there is
a
hazard with the relays. And I bet it is that something
inside
has been soldered. Also, I still use the old tin-lead solder
and
find myself worrying more about things.

Bob — KK5R

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 1/10/19, Christopher Miller <djmalak2k6@...>
wrote:

Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement
To: BITX20@groups.io
Date: Thursday, January 10, 2019, 2:32 PM

Lol! So dont break it
open and lick it? That probably means it contains lead. I
worked in a clean room that used an an acid that would
destroy bone but only after time passed. We had calcium
rich
jelly so you could get to the hospital in time. All that
means is don't be stupid when installing them.

Kf4ftr

Re: Using a HYCAS IF amp in the BITX receiver

Ashhar Farhan
 

scot,
as an aside, you mentioned using the feedback amps from the progressive receiver as drop in replacement. if you do have a spectrum analyzer handy, could you measure the transmit output, say on 28 mhz ssb? 
i was wondering this morning if they would offer substantially better spur reduction as their harmonic output would be lower.

On Fri, 11 Jan 2019, 04:46 Scott McDonald <ka9p@... wrote:
As you may have noticed, Farhan recommended on the HF Signals web site the use of the IF AGC system of Hayward and Damm, commonly known as a HYCAS, as a potential improvement for the uBITX.
 
Finally got around to trying this over the holidays in a uBITX receiver lash up, and was very happy with the results.  The HYCAS system works with a bit less gain up at 12 MHz, and I was seeing about -10 to +35 dB gain on the board with my particular build.  This is a fairly transformative modification.  I rarely found myself reaching for the volume or IF gain control in the three weeks I've been using it so far, and it sounds great.
 
I mention this only because Mike, G4JXX, mhadley157@..., has a limited number of boards (at $15 US plus postage) and kits left, so if you were inclined to experiment with this modification.  Mike told me he was thinking about having some more boards made if there was additional interest.  I've built 3, two at 9 MHz and the uBITX version at 12, and each one has fired up first time and performed well.
 
I have no connection to Mike other than as a satisfied customer, and had contacted Mike originally when Wes Hayward mentioned Mike as a potential source of a quality HYCAS board for another project I was working on.  So if you might be interested in trying this on the uBITX, you may want to reach out to Mike and check the status of his stuff while it's still available, or otherwise encourage his efforts.  Mike also had an ad in the back of the last issue of SPRAT with a bit more info.
 
And just a few other tracks in the sand for anyone else homebrewing uBITX hardware.
 
Kits and Parts offers very reasonable priced matched 12 MHz crystals that worked very well for the homebrew cw and ssb filters used for this experiment.  It may be unseemly not to buy 150 bulk crystals and sort them, but in the end, at a buck and a half a crystal, I got 2 nice filters for less than ordering a pile, and the filters turned out well.  Life is sometimes too short to match crystals, and 6 bucks in crystals for a 4 pole cw IF filter is another cost effective upgrade.
 
The WA8ISP and W0EB Raduino clones were both used in the radio, and both performed very well.
 
And if you are a Progressive Receiver fan, I tested the SBL-1 mixer/2N5109 post amps from Wes' original article as drop in replacements for the TIAS and homebrew mixers, as well as the product detector/ audio board.  They were, literally, drop-ins, and worked great.  The Progressive mixer/post amps have a few dB gain less than the TIAs if you leave the 6 dB pads in, but it was not an issue.
 
YMMV but just thought I'd pass it all along.

Happy building.
 
Scott KA9P

Re: Tracing receive signal for low signal

Dave Space
 

I did a few more tests -

Inputting at lower voltage at the antenna at 30mv @ 7.147MHZ I got about 14-16mv out at TP1.  Removing my jumper and injecting at the K1 side it was just slightly more at L4 maybe 15-18mv.  So the K3 relay doesn't seem to have a huge effect.

What is notable though is inputting at a lower voltage seems to have reduced the loading I think... seems like a bit less loss at low voltage than higher voltage.
(I have a sneaking suspicion injecting higher voltage due to all of the coupling crosstalk may turn on some transmit parts of the radio... no proof of that just a hypothesis... not sure even if that did happen what would the impact be.)  Or what else could cause less loss at lower voltage?  (Previously 700mv in producted only 95mv p-p at TP1)

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Jim Strohm
 

Sarma,

You may not be from around here.  California has that exact same warning atn every gas station AND every hot tub in the state.

I haven't been to California since 2003 but by now I think the warning may read: ''This whole darn state contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.  Go bck to where you came from."

Plus, they still search your car at the order for oranges from Arizona, apples from Washington, and peppers from New Mexico.  But not for non-citizens from other nations....

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Ted
 

What, the warning that the state of California believes these will cause reproductive harm?  

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Carlos Puig
 

Apparently, the requirements for these warnings recently changed.  Here is the explanation from the MPJA web site, which now has the Prop 65 warning on *every* single part they sell:

Carlos - KJ6ST

On 1/10/2019 13:31, Bob Lunsford via Groups.Io wrote:
That's like the ceramic tubes used in one conduction cooled 
amp by Heathkit that had a warning that said breathing the 
dust from that ceramic tube was hazardous. This meant that
they did not recommend anyone use a grinder on them to
take them apart. Only a fool would do that, anyway.

Many of them were sold but I never heard of anyone being
assaulted by the dust.

California has people who sit  up nights writing this stuff up.
If it were a real unavoidable hazard, it would have been pulled
off the market by the EPA. Still, good to know that there is a
hazard with the relays. And I bet it is that something inside 
has been soldered. Also, I still use the old tin-lead solder and
find myself worrying more about things. 

Bob — KK5R

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 1/10/19, Christopher Miller <djmalak2k6@...> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement
 To: BITX20@groups.io
 Date: Thursday, January 10, 2019, 2:32 PM
 
 Lol! So dont break it
 open and lick it? That probably means it contains lead. I
 worked in a clean room that used an an acid that would
 destroy bone but only after time passed. We had calcium rich
 jelly so you could get to the hospital in time. All that
 means is don't be stupid when installing them.
 
 Kf4ftr
 
 
 



Using a HYCAS IF amp in the BITX receiver

Scott McDonald
 

As you may have noticed, Farhan recommended on the HF Signals web site the use of the IF AGC system of Hayward and Damm, commonly known as a HYCAS, as a potential improvement for the uBITX.
 
Finally got around to trying this over the holidays in a uBITX receiver lash up, and was very happy with the results.  The HYCAS system works with a bit less gain up at 12 MHz, and I was seeing about -10 to +35 dB gain on the board with my particular build.  This is a fairly transformative modification.  I rarely found myself reaching for the volume or IF gain control in the three weeks I've been using it so far, and it sounds great.
 
I mention this only because Mike, G4JXX, mhadley157@..., has a limited number of boards (at $15 US plus postage) and kits left, so if you were inclined to experiment with this modification.  Mike told me he was thinking about having some more boards made if there was additional interest.  I've built 3, two at 9 MHz and the uBITX version at 12, and each one has fired up first time and performed well.
 
I have no connection to Mike other than as a satisfied customer, and had contacted Mike originally when Wes Hayward mentioned Mike as a potential source of a quality HYCAS board for another project I was working on.  So if you might be interested in trying this on the uBITX, you may want to reach out to Mike and check the status of his stuff while it's still available, or otherwise encourage his efforts.  Mike also had an ad in the back of the last issue of SPRAT with a bit more info.
 
And just a few other tracks in the sand for anyone else homebrewing uBITX hardware.
 
Kits and Parts offers very reasonable priced matched 12 MHz crystals that worked very well for the homebrew cw and ssb filters used for this experiment.  It may be unseemly not to buy 150 bulk crystals and sort them, but in the end, at a buck and a half a crystal, I got 2 nice filters for less than ordering a pile, and the filters turned out well.  Life is sometimes too short to match crystals, and 6 bucks in crystals for a 4 pole cw IF filter is another cost effective upgrade.
 
The WA8ISP and W0EB Raduino clones were both used in the radio, and both performed very well.
 
And if you are a Progressive Receiver fan, I tested the SBL-1 mixer/2N5109 post amps from Wes' original article as drop in replacements for the TIAS and homebrew mixers, as well as the product detector/ audio board.  They were, literally, drop-ins, and worked great.  The Progressive mixer/post amps have a few dB gain less than the TIAs if you leave the 6 dB pads in, but it was not an issue.
 
YMMV but just thought I'd pass it all along.

Happy building.
 
Scott KA9P

Re: Power Output measurement #ubitxcw

Tom, wb6b
 

That is an interesting chart.

Seems like 12 volts is marginal for these rigs; with surprising large power output variation for small changes in supply voltage. In past threads people have reported widely varying output power, rarely did they report the voltage they were running the rig on. I wonder what supply voltage was used for the original specified power output listed on the HF Signals site was. 

Here is a less scientific but similar thread on supply voltage vs power out:
https://groups.io/g/BITX20/topic/24718593#58028

Tom, wb6b

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Bob Lunsford <nocrud222@...>
 

That's like the ceramic tubes used in one conduction cooled
amp by Heathkit that had a warning that said breathing the
dust from that ceramic tube was hazardous. This meant that
they did not recommend anyone use a grinder on them to
take them apart. Only a fool would do that, anyway.

Many of them were sold but I never heard of anyone being
assaulted by the dust.

California has people who sit up nights writing this stuff up.
If it were a real unavoidable hazard, it would have been pulled
off the market by the EPA. Still, good to know that there is a
hazard with the relays. And I bet it is that something inside
has been soldered. Also, I still use the old tin-lead solder and
find myself worrying more about things.

Bob — KK5R

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 1/10/19, Christopher Miller <djmalak2k6@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement
To: BITX20@groups.io
Date: Thursday, January 10, 2019, 2:32 PM

Lol! So dont break it
open and lick it? That probably means it contains lead. I
worked in a clean room that used an an acid that would
destroy bone but only after time passed. We had calcium rich
jelly so you could get to the hospital in time. All that
means is don't be stupid when installing them.

Kf4ftr

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Jerry Gaffke
 

Half the stuff we buy anymore has a warning label like that.
Can't buy a screwdriver without a pamphlet written by some lawyer warning you to wear safety goggles

I spent most of the '70s using my mouth as a third hand to hold the solder.
Hasn't affected me one bit.
Though opinions may vary.

Even worse, the mercury I fiddled with as a kid, salvaged from thermometers.

Remains to be seen just how hilarious cow farts are.
Methane from livestock amounted to 119 million tons in 2011 globally:
  https://www.popsci.com/cow-farts-are-an-even-bigger-problem-than-we-thought#page-2
Roughly on par with methane bubbling out of the now melting arctic permafrost:  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arctic_methane_emissions
Methane in the atmosphere warms the earth about 86 times faster than the same amount of CO2:
  https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-bad-of-a-greenhouse-gas-is-methane/

Now we're totally off topic, my apologies.
I'll go check in with other forums for a few days till this dies down.

Jerry, KE7ER



On Thu, Jan 10, 2019 at 11:32 AM, Christopher Miller wrote:

So dont break it open and lick it? That probably means it contains lead.

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Clark Martin
 

I live in California and Proposition 65 warnings are everywhere.  They worded it so stringently that, I suspect, that many businesses put the sign up just in case.  It is a totally useless law.

I’m not saying these relays don’t have something hazardous in them but a lot of electronics does.  It does say they are RoHS compliant so it likely doesn’t have lead.

I’m surprised this site even lists it as they are a Florida company and aren’t constrained by California law.

Bottom line, don’t eat the relay and you should be good.


Clark Martin
KK6ISP

On Jan 10, 2019, at 10:18 AM, MVS Sarma <mvssarma@...> wrote:

Ted,
 did you watch the warning at the end
 here is it, i quote from that site.
"
MFG: AXICOM/TE
P/N: D2n V23105-A5403-A201
COIL: 12VDC/0.4W/360 ohm
CONTACT RATING: 3A@250VAC/220VDC
ACTION: DPDT
DIP Socket/PC Mount General purpose relay. uULc listed, RoHS compliant.
L: 3/4” W: 3/8” H: 7/16” WT: .005

California Proposition 65 Warning WARNING: This product contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm. For more information go to www.P65Warnings.ca.gov
(This item was manufactured prior to August 31st, 2018)


On Thu, Jan 10, 2019 at 11:25 PM Ted via Groups.Io <k3rta=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Just an FYI for people looking to swap out their relays - while they last: M.P. Jones & Accociates at  US$.79 each and they're the right part number, etc.


Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Vince Vielhaber
 

If you're referring to that California warning, this one of today's headlines should fully explain California and their warnings:

"California Decides to Regulate Cow Farts in Order to Fight Global Warming"

Vince - K8ZW.

On 01/10/2019 02:07 PM, MVS Sarma wrote:
Stock No: 32715 RL
Check under detailed Description- read Warning


On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 12:04 AM Truffies <truffies@...
<mailto:truffies@...>> wrote:

part number please


-----Original Message-----
From: "Ted via Groups.Io" __
Sent: Jan 10, 2019 12:54 PM
To: BITX20@groups.io <mailto:BITX20@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Just an FYI for people looking to swap out their relays - while
they last: M.P. Jones & Accociates
<https://www.mpja.com/01-10-19.asp?r=403733&s=9> at US$.79 each
and they're the right part number, etc. __

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Christopher Miller
 

Lol! So dont break it open and lick it? That probably means it contains lead. I worked in a clean room that used an an acid that would destroy bone but only after time passed. We had calcium rich jelly so you could get to the hospital in time. All that means is don't be stupid when installing them.

Kf4ftr

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

MVS Sarma
 

Stock No: 32715 RL
Check under detailed Description- read  Warning


On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 12:04 AM Truffies <truffies@...> wrote:
part number please


-----Original Message-----
From: "Ted via Groups.Io"
Sent: Jan 10, 2019 12:54 PM
To: BITX20@groups.io
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Just an FYI for people looking to swap out their relays - while they last: M.P. Jones & Accociates at  US$.79 each and they're the right part number, etc.

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Truffies
 

part number please


-----Original Message-----
From: "Ted via Groups.Io"
Sent: Jan 10, 2019 12:54 PM
To: BITX20@groups.io
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement

Just an FYI for people looking to swap out their relays - while they last: M.P. Jones & Accociates at  US$.79 each and they're the right part number, etc.

Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement

MVS Sarma
 

Ted,
 did you watch the warning at the end
 here is it, i quote from that site.
"
MFG: AXICOM/TE
P/N: D2n V23105-A5403-A201
COIL: 12VDC/0.4W/360 ohm
CONTACT RATING: 3A@250VAC/220VDC
ACTION: DPDT
DIP Socket/PC Mount General purpose relay. uULc listed, RoHS compliant.
L: 3/4” W: 3/8” H: 7/16” WT: .005

California Proposition 65 Warning WARNING: This product contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm. For more information go to www.P65Warnings.ca.gov
(This item was manufactured prior to August 31st, 2018)


On Thu, Jan 10, 2019 at 11:25 PM Ted via Groups.Io <k3rta=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Just an FYI for people looking to swap out their relays - while they last: M.P. Jones & Accociates at  US$.79 each and they're the right part number, etc.