When parents disagree #spousePartner


jain.gunvant@...
 

[I'm experimenting with changing a topic, and adding a tag.  This first came from my question about topics, but there is a topic within it!  --SANDRA]
_____from here down is the e-mail from Gunvant Jain <jain.gunvant@...___________
 
around 2011, I’ve just started my career into education- as a Teach for India Fellow. 
 
I was super excited into learning insights in education, through field experts.
 
Later I’ve joined corporate and eventually the fire In education related learning died. And I’ve become engineer again !
 
I was blessed with daughter 3 years ago and I was looking for this group activities again. 
Seems reactivation if the group is like god sent. 
 
Let’s start with the topic woth the one I’m currently facing. 
 
Me and my wife have different value systems for upbringing, she’s a homemaker more into formal schooling and seeing her child competitive, and better off than the peers, what should be my value system to provide to my daughter. Considering one of the partner is not invested in unschooling !
 
Thanks 

On Wed, 13 Nov 2019 at 3:58 AM, Cécile Meyer-ritter via Groups.Io <cmeyerritter=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
 
 
Right now, I am using my iPhone and email like Pam and it works really well for me too.
 
I don't know how other phones would reac but I would say it could be worth it to invite people from Radical Unschooling Info.
 
Cecile 

On 12 Nov 2019, at 18:40, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

How is this one from phones, though?  

Could people chime in on how you're reading this (at the site?  e-mail on a computer?  e-mail elsewhere?  site elsewhere?

I've used e-mail on my laptop and the groups.io site directly, from the laptop.

Please advise, those of you who are only using phones.  Is it worth inviting the Radical Unschooling Info folks?

Thanks,

Sandra

 

 

--
Regards
Gunvant Jain
 
"Ek shikshak kabhi sadharan nahi hota" - Chanakya
 


 

Changing the subject line does seem to have begun a new topic.  Good.

THERE IS A PROBLEM when one parent is adamant about unschooling, or even just very enamored of unschooling, and other parent is not.  Even in ideal circumstances otherwise, it robs the child of some of the peace of the home.  In a worse case, it can lead to divorce, and then there's no unschooling at all.

Until there are things the other parent CAN see, don't press.  Keep the idea open.  Sometimes it takes a year or two of school for the child to discover and communicate the problems with school.

If the reluctant parent knows that there is an option, all of her thoughts will be different.  If it's a calm option, she will more easily consider it than if the situation is set up so that if she were to say "Maybe we *should* consider pulling her out of school" that she would lose, and the dad would win.  

Trapping another parent so that there is only one right answer ends up being a very bad example of partnership, and of learning. :-)

 

If, ultimately, no homeschooling happens, it doesn't mean that the school experience might not be better, having one parent who sees learning everywhere, and another parent who prefers competitive school life, but also knows for sure that there are alternative ways of living.

 

Sandra


 

A new tangent, from the original:

-=-Me and my wife have different value systems for upbringing, she’s a

homemaker more into formal schooling and seeing her child competitive, and
better off than the peers, what should be my value system to provide to my
daughter. Considering one of the partner is not invested in unschooling !-=-

"What should be my value system..."

Think "OUR value system," if you want to start investing now, in a long marriage and a happy child.

India didn't have the divorce craze the U.S. and some other places had, in the 1970's and 80s.  India's divorce contagion started maybe ten years ago. PLEASE avoid that.  Forget homeschooling of ANY kind if it's going to make you or your wife or your child unhappy.  It's not worth it.

http://sandradodd.com/divorce.html

http://sandradodd.com/separation.html

There are other links from those to help strengthen marriages.

The more your wife loves you and feels grateful to you, the better your chance of persuading her of something weird, like unschooling. :-)

We all know how much damage an embarrassed or furious spouse can do.  Choose your paths very early so you can avoid those cliffs.

 

Sandra


 

Third-direction tangent:   India

I'm assuming because of the sigline quote that Gunvant Jain is in India.  This comes with a couple of situations most other English-speaking places don't have in common with them.  One is the lack of compulsory attendance laws.  India doesn't have them.  It's not the state that requires school, it's the grandparents. :-)  The other is arranged marriages.  Even if the marriage in this particular scenario was a love match between friends, there are some realities to consider.  

The mom was described as "a homemaker."  I met lots of homemakers in India, with Master's Degrees.  To marry an engineer (or likely future engineer), a women might need some good test scores and education of her own.  (If this doesn't apply, that's okay; it applies to other readers now or in the future.)   IF (just if) the mom only has a high school education or so, she might be feeling that it's her duty to do better (or as well as possible) for her own daughter, so that she can marry whatever the equivalent of "engineer" might be in 20 or 25 more years. :-)

I was interviewed by a blog for moms, in India, in 2012, and here's part of that:

Rashmie Jaaju, the interviewer:

Talking about relationships, I want to ask something that’s unique to India. As you know, the family system in India is very close-knit. Often married sons live with their parents and family decisions are taken jointly. Even if  they may not be living together, married children discuss situations, seek their input and like to take parents into confidence. It can never be like “these are our children and we’re not answerable to anyone”. Especially when it comes to kids, grandparents like to know – all with good intention. Do you have any advice to make unschooling work in such circumstances?

Sandra: In any situation where changes might be made to a family’s traditions or expectations, those involved will need to agree, or at least agree to see how it goes. If there are more than two adults involved, that will make it more difficult. It might make it impossible. Unschooling isn’t a magic ticket to bypass laws or traditions, and tradition is MUCH stronger than law. A law can be changed more easily than grandmothers’ opinions can be changed.

Creativity and compassion on the part of the middle generation is crucial.

One grandmother (in India) was exasperated when her granddaughter, who was two, kept playing with the *Navratri dolls. I wrote to her mom, “Can she have her own area with her own separate dolls? Like a practice place, a pretend one? Or can you play that between times, off season? (Like hiding Easter eggs when it’s not even near Easter at all.)”  I also suggested that the mom play through the whole nine nights with the little girl’s dolls, rather than wait a day for the next puja. The little girl was curious, and wanted to learn, and at her age learning involves touching things. But her grandmother had the right to have her things left alone, too. They worked it out.

Unschooling won’t work in every family. There is no culture anywhere in which any individual can decide unilaterally to do this without regard to what others around think of it.

There is new book by a Canadian unschooler named Pam Laricchia, available in eBook format.  It’s a clear and compelling summary of principles that make unschooling work, and it might help clarify the idea for grandparents.

http://www.mommy-labs.com/inspiring-interviews/homeschooling-inspiring-interviews/interview-with-sandra-dodd-unschooling-homeschooling-india/

The quote is from that link above, but here's part two of that interview:

http://www.mommy-labs.com/holistic_living/sandra-dodd-interview-how-do-unschoolers-cope-with-college-questions-on-learning-without-school-living-joyfully/

Way too much reading to do all of a sudden, but maybe take a week. :-)  Reading quickly, through ideas like those, won't help.

Sandra

 

 

 


Gunvant Jain <jain.gunvant@...>
 

Thanks Sandra,

This has already been in place, family happiness first. Education will fall in place if we have happy family culture.

On Thu, 14 Nov 2019 at 1:33 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

A new tangent, from the original:

-=-Me and my wife have different value systems for upbringing, she’s a

homemaker more into formal schooling and seeing her child competitive, and
better off than the peers, what should be my value system to provide to my
daughter. Considering one of the partner is not invested in unschooling !-=-

"What should be my value system..."

Think "OUR value system," if you want to start investing now, in a long marriage and a happy child.

India didn't have the divorce craze the U.S. and some other places had, in the 1970's and 80s.  India's divorce contagion started maybe ten years ago. PLEASE avoid that.  Forget homeschooling of ANY kind if it's going to make you or your wife or your child unhappy.  It's not worth it.

http://sandradodd.com/divorce.html

http://sandradodd.com/separation.html

There are other links from those to help strengthen marriages.

The more your wife loves you and feels grateful to you, the better your chance of persuading her of something weird, like unschooling. :-)

We all know how much damage an embarrassed or furious spouse can do.  Choose your paths very early so you can avoid those cliffs.

 

Sandra

--
Regards
Gunvant Jain

"Ek shikshak kabhi sadharan nahi hota" - Chanakya


 

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 12:30 PM, Gunvant Jain wrote:
This has already been in place, family happiness first. Education will fall in place if we have happy family culture."

"Education" will trip you up.

Education will not fall into place.  Learning might!  If you prepare for a life of learning, and nurture a space for learning, you, your wife, your child(ren) will learn.  If it's fun, and no one is keeping score, and you all relax, learning will be all around you.  

 

Enough learning will seem like "an education," but be sure, if you want unschooling to work well, that you untangle the differences.

Similar to the reason that "teaching" should be set aside so that learning can thrive, "education" is the wrong direction from unschooling.

The problem with "education"

http://sandradodd.com/education.html

 Getting Warm  Warmth and Choices  http://sandradodd.com/gettingwarm.html 

 

Sandra