Names Matter


David Markham
 

Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Merilee Olson
 

No, I don’t think treason is too strong a word to be applied to Trump et al😖

On Mon, Jul 5, 2021 at 5:29 PM David Markham <davidgmarkham@...> wrote:
Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Michele
 

Agreed 





-------- Original message --------
From: Merilee Olson <merilee.olson@...>
Date: 7/5/21 2:45 PM (GMT-08:00)
To: AllNonfiction@groups.io
Subject: Re: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

No, I don’t think treason is too strong a word to be applied to Trump et al😖

On Mon, Jul 5, 2021 at 5:29 PM David Markham <davidgmarkham@...> wrote:
Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Jeffrey Taylor
 

It's a very appropriate word to apply to our Demented ex-president.

Lock his up!

On Monday, July 5, 2021, 05:29:24 PM EDT, David Markham <davidgmarkham@...> wrote:


Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Becky Lindroos
 

No, it’s not to strong a word. It’s the right word. It just makes me angry and really sad.

Becky

On Jul 5, 2021, at 4:45 PM, Merilee Olson <merilee.olson@gmail.com> wrote:

No, I don’t think treason is too strong a word to be applied to Trump et al😖

On Mon, Jul 5, 2021 at 5:29 PM David Markham <davidgmarkham@gmail.com> wrote:
<Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg>

Names matter

No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it.

The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.

Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.

The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”

Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?





johannakurz
 

I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.

I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.

Johanna



Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


-------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@...>
Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Becky Lindroos
 

There are many (!) good books about the Civil War but I think the best ones are all really long - like James McPherson’s “Battle Cry of Freedom.” It’s probably still the best though for overall coverage. "The Fiery Trial" is about Lincoln. "The Killer Angels" (fictionalized) is Gettysburg. "Confederate Reckoning" assumes the reader is already kind of knowledgeable about the basics.
Shelby Foot’s "Civil War" is 3 or 4 volumes long. Bruce Catton’s book is kind of dated.

Civil War history is constantly being reworked - the newest (to me) is the emphasis on the world-wide impact. This is mostly economics stuff. It’s kind of interesting to note that both Grant and Lee were trained at West Point as were most of the generals of both sides. Not only that but they fought on the same side in the Mexican War of 1846. These guys knew each other’s strengths and weaknesses. I don’t think the skill level of the individual Generals was the biggest factor in the war. Both were going to make mistakes. Lee’s biggest was at Gettysburg and that was bad timing for a mistake of that magnitude. And that’s where the fact of West Point training makes a difference because I think that helped Grant correctly guess what Lee was going to do.

Becky

On Jul 6, 2021, at 7:45 AM, johannakurz <johannakurz@t-online.de> wrote:

I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.

I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.

Johanna



Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


-------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@gmail.com>
Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

<Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg>

Names matter

No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it.

The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.

Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.

The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”

Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Jeffrey Taylor
 

There are tones of good ones.  In my opinion the absolute best is the eight volume set produced by Allen Nevins but that may be more than you might care for.  Oxford Press published Battle Cry of Freedom by James McPherson which is rock solid and widely available. There are probably used copies in many used book stores.  It runs to 900 pages.  There are shorter pocket books but I don't think they are much worth the effort.  

Battles and Leaders of the Civil War runs to four volumes.  But any one volume is pure fun reading.  It is a collection of articles that were written, mostly by participants on both sides, published in the "Century Magazine" during 1880's.  I think it is considered primary source material.  

 

On Tuesday, July 6, 2021, 08:45:57 AM EDT, johannakurz <johannakurz@...> wrote:


I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.

I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.

Johanna



Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


-------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@...>
Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg


Names matter


No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 


The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.


Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 


Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.


The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”


Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Jeffrey Taylor
 

John Waugh's Class of 1846 covers one graduating class of West Point which included Jackson, McClellan, A. P, Hill, Georg Pickett.  Rather narrow focus but vastly detailed.  

On Tuesday, July 6, 2021, 11:26:49 AM EDT, Becky Lindroos <bekah0176@...> wrote:


There are many (!) good books about the Civil War but I think the best ones are all really long - like James McPherson’s “Battle Cry of Freedom.”  It’s probably still the best though for overall coverage. "The Fiery Trial" is about Lincoln.  "The Killer Angels" (fictionalized) is Gettysburg. "Confederate Reckoning" assumes the reader is already kind of knowledgeable about the basics.
Shelby Foot’s "Civil War" is 3 or 4 volumes long. Bruce Catton’s book is kind of dated.

Civil War history is constantly being reworked - the newest (to me) is the emphasis on the world-wide impact. This is mostly economics stuff.  It’s kind of interesting to note that both Grant and Lee were trained at West Point as were most of the generals of both sides.  Not only that but they fought on the same side in the Mexican War of 1846.  These guys knew each other’s strengths and weaknesses.  I don’t think the skill level of the individual Generals was the biggest factor in the war. Both were going to make mistakes. Lee’s biggest was at Gettysburg and that was bad timing for a mistake of that magnitude.  And that’s where the fact of West Point training makes a difference because I think that helped Grant correctly guess what Lee was going to do.

Becky

> On Jul 6, 2021, at 7:45 AM, johannakurz <johannakurz@...> wrote:
>
> I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.
>
> I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.
>
> Johanna
>
>
>
> Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet
>
>
> -------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
> Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@...>
> Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
> An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
> Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter
>
> <Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg>
>
> Names matter
>
> No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it.
>
> The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.
>
> Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
>
> Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.
>
> The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”
>
> Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?
>
>
>







Becky Lindroos
 

California had troops on both sides, too. A bunch of them for the North (of course) but our whole southern half was Confederate (we should have been two states?). So there were at least a couple of military groups who said they were Confederates and took off for the battles.

Many California Confederates wanted to send some gold to Richmond to help with the war effort. It didn’t get done.

In Tulare County things were odd. They were mostly Confederate-sympathizing cowboys but they wanted to stay in the Union. The few Yankees around would get drunk and be rowdy and there were some incidents. To decide if Visalia was going to be North or South they had a mini-war on Main Street. No one remembers who won but everyone was okay with the result.

And about slavery - Southern California was fine with slavery but it was banned becuae the Northerners had more population. Early on some Southern planters brought slaves out with them to do farming in Southern California. They were now freed. Mostly the citizens of the state didn’t want any Blacks at all because they would work for cheaper no matter if they were slaves or employees or even self-employed. So they tried to get all Blacks banned - that didn’t work.

Becky

On Jul 6, 2021, at 10:48 AM, Jeffrey Taylor via groups.io <jatta97=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

There are tones of good ones. In my opinion the absolute best is the eight volume set produced by Allen Nevins but that may be more than you might care for. Oxford Press published Battle Cry of Freedom by James McPherson which is rock solid and widely available. There are probably used copies in many used book stores. It runs to 900 pages. There are shorter pocket books but I don't think they are much worth the effort.

Battles and Leaders of the Civil War runs to four volumes. But any one volume is pure fun reading. It is a collection of articles that were written, mostly by participants on both sides, published in the "Century Magazine" during 1880's. I think it is considered primary source material.



On Tuesday, July 6, 2021, 08:45:57 AM EDT, johannakurz <johannakurz@t-online.de> wrote:


I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.

I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.

Johanna



Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


-------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@gmail.com>
Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter



Names matter

No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it.

The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.

Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.

The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”

Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?



Becky Lindroos
 

Oh my goodness - what a thing to research!  

And to the point of our book (read to the end of the little paragraph): 
Modern War Institute
WHAT SHOULD WEST POINT DO ABOUT ITS ROBERT E. LEE PROBLEM?
Jimmy Byrn and Gabe Royal | 06.22.20 

In spite of the sight of the Stars and Bars flying from the radio masts of occasional automobiles coming out of Dixie, few fair-minded men can feel today that the issues which divided the North and South in 1861 have any real meaning to our present generation.
Those were the words spoken by famous World War II general Maxwell Taylor in 1952, at the dedication of Gen. Robert E. Lee’s portrait in the West Point library. 

Becky 

On Jul 6, 2021, at 10:53 AM, Jeffrey Taylor via groups.io <jatta97@...> wrote:

John Waugh's Class of 1846 covers one graduating class of West Point which included Jackson, McClellan, A. P, Hill, Georg Pickett.  Rather narrow focus but vastly detailed.  

On Tuesday, July 6, 2021, 11:26:49 AM EDT, Becky Lindroos <bekah0176@...> wrote:


There are many (!) good books about the Civil War but I think the best ones are all really long - like James McPherson’s “Battle Cry of Freedom.”  It’s probably still the best though for overall coverage. "The Fiery Trial" is about Lincoln.  "The Killer Angels" (fictionalized) is Gettysburg. "Confederate Reckoning" assumes the reader is already kind of knowledgeable about the basics. 
Shelby Foot’s "Civil War" is 3 or 4 volumes long. Bruce Catton’s book is kind of dated. 

Civil War history is constantly being reworked - the newest (to me) is the emphasis on the world-wide impact. This is mostly economics stuff.  It’s kind of interesting to note that both Grant and Lee were trained at West Point as were most of the generals of both sides.  Not only that but they fought on the same side in the Mexican War of 1846.  These guys knew each other’s strengths and weaknesses.  I don’t think the skill level of the individual Generals was the biggest factor in the war. Both were going to make mistakes. Lee’s biggest was at Gettysburg and that was bad timing for a mistake of that magnitude.  And that’s where the fact of West Point training makes a difference because I think that helped Grant correctly guess what Lee was going to do.

Becky 

> On Jul 6, 2021, at 7:45 AM, johannakurz <johannakurz@...> wrote:

> I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.

> I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.

> Johanna



> Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


> -------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
> Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@...>
> Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
> An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
> Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

> <Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg>

> Names matter

> No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it. 

> The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.

> Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 

> Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.

> The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”

> Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?










johannakurz
 

Thank you Becky....I even have The Killer Angels. My friend who is married to a service man brought me many books when she moved to the United States. Maybe I look a little bit closer what is among them.

Johanna



Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet


-------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
Von: Becky Lindroos <bekah0176@...>
Datum: 06.07.21 17:26 (GMT+01:00)
An: AllNonfiction@groups.io
Betreff: Re: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter

There are many (!) good books about the Civil War but I think the best ones are all really long - like James McPherson’s “Battle Cry of Freedom.”  It’s probably still the best though for overall coverage. "The Fiery Trial" is about Lincoln.  "The Killer Angels" (fictionalized) is Gettysburg. "Confederate Reckoning" assumes the reader is already kind of knowledgeable about the basics.
Shelby Foot’s "Civil War" is 3 or 4 volumes long. Bruce Catton’s book is kind of dated.

Civil War history is constantly being reworked - the newest (to me) is the emphasis on the world-wide impact. This is mostly economics stuff.  It’s kind of interesting to note that both Grant and Lee were trained at West Point as were most of the generals of both sides.  Not only that but they fought on the same side in the Mexican War of 1846.  These guys knew each other’s strengths and weaknesses.  I don’t think the skill level of the individual Generals was the biggest factor in the war. Both were going to make mistakes. Lee’s biggest was at Gettysburg and that was bad timing for a mistake of that magnitude.  And that’s where the fact of West Point training makes a difference because I think that helped Grant correctly guess what Lee was going to do.

Becky

> On Jul 6, 2021, at 7:45 AM, johannakurz <johannakurz@...> wrote:
>
> I saw an interview with him led by General Petraeus and he always said that it was nut the Union, it was the United States Army...and both said that Grant was better than Lee. Lee lost.
>
> I have never read anything about the Civil War...except what I found in history books in college...the requirements....can anyone recommend a good book which is more or less based on the truth. Most books worship one or the other.
>
> Johanna
>
>
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> Von meinem/meiner Galaxy gesendet
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> -------- Ursprüngliche Nachricht --------
> Von: David Markham <davidgmarkham@...>
> Datum: 05.07.21 23:29 (GMT+01:00)
> An: All nonfiction <AllNonfiction@groups.io>
> Betreff: [AllNonfiction] Names Matter
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> <Dare-To-Call-It-Treason-button-175.jpg>
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> Names matter
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> No, the boys in blue fought in the U.S. Army for the United States of America. The names we use matter. By saying Union and Confederate, Blue and Gray, North and South, we lose the fundamental difference between the two sides. The United States fought against a rebel force that would not accept the results of a democratic election and chose armed rebellion. At Fort Sumter, South Carolina, and a dozen other U.S. Army posts, the secessionists fired on U.S. property and then seized it.
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> The southern slaveholders were not fighting some foreign or lost-to-history army called the Union. The Confederacy fought the United States of America, the country I spent a career defending. I will call those men who fought to save their country and, by 1863, end the scourge of race-based slavery by their proper name—U.S. Army soldiers.
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> Seidule, Ty. Robert E. Lee and Me (p. 22). St. Martin's Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
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> Seidule makes an excellent point. The confederates of the South declared war on the United States of America because they chose not to follow democratic rule. The same thing has happened in 2021.
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> The “Big Lie” has been promulgated by Donald Trump and his followers and it should be named what it is “treason.”
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> Do you believe “treason is too strong a word” for people who work to set aside a democratic election in 2020-2021?
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