Kpc3+ settings for APRSISCE


Robert D. York
 

What are suggested settings for kpc3+ for APRSISCE?


Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

The easiest way to interface with a KPC-3+ is to lock it into KISS mode via a terminal emulator and use a Simply(KISS) type port in APRSISCE/32.  Do NOT use a KISS port type or APRSISCE/32 will take the TNC out of KISS mode when the port is disabled or the client is closed.  The KISS type port is designed for Kenwood's original internal TNC in their APRS-capable radios.  (Yes, I know it is badly named).

See also: http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/tnc-kpc-3


Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 9:03 AM, Robert D. York wrote:
What are suggested settings for kpc3+ for APRSISCE?


Robert D. York
 

Thank you Sir!


On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 8:36 AM Lynn Deffenbaugh <kj4erj@...> wrote:

The easiest way to interface with a KPC-3+ is to lock it into KISS mode via a terminal emulator and use a Simply(KISS) type port in APRSISCE/32.  Do NOT use a KISS port type or APRSISCE/32 will take the TNC out of KISS mode when the port is disabled or the client is closed.  The KISS type port is designed for Kenwood's original internal TNC in their APRS-capable radios.  (Yes, I know it is badly named).

See also: http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/tnc-kpc-3


Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 9:03 AM, Robert D. York wrote:
What are suggested settings for kpc3+ for APRSISCE?


Gil
 

Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Robert D. York
 

Yes Sir, I set the "MON"to Off before exiting the Terminal Mode to KISS Mode as suggested by WB4APR.
We'll see what happens.

On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 12:30 PM Gil <gil.chapin@...> wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Robert D. York
 

IMPORTANT!! If you intend to leave the TNC attached to a computer, but will not be running an APRS or other terminal program on that computer, you must make sure that the INITKPC3.TNC and RESTORE.TNC files are modified to include "MON ON" and "MON OFF", respectively. And, before exiting from any terminal program, issue a "MON OFF" command.

In this particular circumstance, it is possible for the computer's serial port to tell the TNC to not send data. When the TNC's port buffer fills, the TNC may stop working. This problem has not been reported when the TNC is not plugged into a computer, or if the computer is actively listening to the TNC. In the absense of a connected computer, however, the TNC just sends the excess data off to the bit bucket. [Note: failure to provide a properly-sized bit bucket will require proper drainage, or sufficient airflow to allow for adequate bit evaporation]


On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 12:30 PM Gil <gil.chapin@...> wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

The issue with the KPC-3+ has nothing to do with the MON command, but everything to do with a firmware bug and handshaking signals.  Please read and understand:

http://blog.aprs.fi/2011/03/kantronics-kpc3-considered-harmful.html

And especially the comment that says:

I was working with Kantronics support on this issue and I seem to have solved it by shorting the RTS and CTS pins together within my serial cable. (PINS 4/5 on DB25 and PINS 7/8 on DB9) I simply ran a jumper between the two. This appears to be an issue with how the APRS software and/or the AX.25 stack controls the RTS pin and shorting the RTS and CTS together prevents the software from holding the RTS pin low. If the RTS pin is at low voltage the KPC3+ will start buffering and does not get caught back up. I have been running mine for several weeks without showing this behavior again. Before I made the change it would happen after about 12 hours.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 1:30 PM, Gil wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Robert D. York
 

Ok,


On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 1:13 PM Lynn Deffenbaugh <kj4erj@...> wrote:

The issue with the KPC-3+ has nothing to do with the MON command, but everything to do with a firmware bug and handshaking signals.  Please read and understand:

http://blog.aprs.fi/2011/03/kantronics-kpc3-considered-harmful.html

And especially the comment that says:

I was working with Kantronics support on this issue and I seem to have solved it by shorting the RTS and CTS pins together within my serial cable. (PINS 4/5 on DB25 and PINS 7/8 on DB9) I simply ran a jumper between the two. This appears to be an issue with how the APRS software and/or the AX.25 stack controls the RTS pin and shorting the RTS and CTS together prevents the software from holding the RTS pin low. If the RTS pin is at low voltage the KPC3+ will start buffering and does not get caught back up. I have been running mine for several weeks without showing this behavior again. Before I made the change it would happen after about 12 hours.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 1:30 PM, Gil wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Rob Giuliano
 

Those are the serial hardware control control pins, which is why I suggest using a fully populated RS232 cable - allow the TNC and PC to fully communicate.  Sorting those pins will just fool theeach component into thinking it us okay to continue the communication.


On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 16:50, Robert D. York
<kf4ffn@...> wrote:
Ok,

On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 1:13 PM Lynn Deffenbaugh <kj4erj@...> wrote:

The issue with the KPC-3+ has nothing to do with the MON command, but everything to do with a firmware bug and handshaking signals.  Please read and understand:

http://blog.aprs.fi/2011/03/kantronics-kpc3-considered-harmful.html

And especially the comment that says:

I was working with Kantronics support on this issue and I seem to have solved it by shorting the RTS and CTS pins together within my serial cable. (PINS 4/5 on DB25 and PINS 7/8 on DB9) I simply ran a jumper between the two. This appears to be an issue with how the APRS software and/or the AX.25 stack controls the RTS pin and shorting the RTS and CTS together prevents the software from holding the RTS pin low. If the RTS pin is at low voltage the KPC3+ will start buffering and does not get caught back up. I have been running mine for several weeks without showing this behavior again. Before I made the change it would happen after about 12 hours.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 1:30 PM, Gil wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI


Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

And that is, in fact, the desire.  There is no guarantee that the Windows end will properly assert the signals at the proper time.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 7:57 PM, Rob Giuliano via groups.io wrote:
Those are the serial hardware control control pins, which is why I suggest using a fully populated RS232 cable - allow the TNC and PC to fully communicate.  Sorting those pins will just fool theeach component into thinking it us okay to continue the communication.


On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 16:50, Robert D. York
Ok,

On Mon, Jun 14, 2021, 1:13 PM Lynn Deffenbaugh <kj4erj@...> wrote:

The issue with the KPC-3+ has nothing to do with the MON command, but everything to do with a firmware bug and handshaking signals.  Please read and understand:

http://blog.aprs.fi/2011/03/kantronics-kpc3-considered-harmful.html

And especially the comment that says:

I was working with Kantronics support on this issue and I seem to have solved it by shorting the RTS and CTS pins together within my serial cable. (PINS 4/5 on DB25 and PINS 7/8 on DB9) I simply ran a jumper between the two. This appears to be an issue with how the APRS software and/or the AX.25 stack controls the RTS pin and shorting the RTS and CTS together prevents the software from holding the RTS pin low. If the RTS pin is at low voltage the KPC3+ will start buffering and does not get caught back up. I have been running mine for several weeks without showing this behavior again. Before I made the change it would happen after about 12 hours.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


On 6/14/2021 1:30 PM, Gil wrote:
Please check your KPC3+ (or KPC3) once you've got it in operation.  I have seen those TNCs delay packets for a significant amount of time before digipeating them.  They are sometimes delayed so long that the system thinks they're new packets - and repositions my mobile station accordingly.  I've seen my mobile beacons regurgitated by KPC3 digipeaters many minutes (and miles) after they were sent.  On a recurring basis, it makes the track appear to be bouncing back and forth from where it most recently was (as digipeated by other digipeaters) to where it formerly was (at a former beacon location delayed by the KPC3) - many miles away (I think astronomers call it "retrograde motion" when they refer to the apparent observed motion of some planets).  I have a problem with a KPC3 digipeater doing that right now (I need to try to contact the owner again...).  I can see my beacons showing up from it 5 or more minutes after they were sent from my station at another location.  It won't be obvious for a fixed station, but it sure shows up for mobiles.

Please just check that your setup is not doing that.  Monitor it for a while once you've got it going.  This is apparently a known problem for some KPC3s.  Lynn can probably provide information regarding what to do about it.

Gil Chapin, WB2UTI