Date   

Furthest (non-direct) Station (was: Beaconing the ISS)

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

I may have asked this before, but would it be better to have the generic ability to track Direct DX as well as absolute DX without having to specify explicit digipeats to ignore and mis-represent the DX (which is assumed to be direct)?

A dedicated satellite instance would be accumulating the furthest station heard, regardless of any hops.

A terrestrial instance would be accumulating both the current (direct) DX as well as the new furthest station heard, along with it's path, which might be quite informative for those that are interested.

And yes, the implication is that there would be a new capability in the Configure / Status / Status Report area to select either the DX or furthest station for inclusion in the status report.

Unless I hear otherwise, the proposed new furthest station will not trigger a special DX-formatted (non-APRS) packet, but will only be transmittable via the Status Report. I also think I'll add a query similar to ?DX to remotely query an station for this information.

Any suggestion on what to call this new thing? DX implies direct reception. FX for Furthest eXtension? FR for Furthest Reception (but that sounds direct)? FS for Furthest Station?

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

On 10/31/2012 11:27 AM, mm1ptt wrote:
Can I take this opportunity to remind about the feature request to ignore RS0ISS* in the path when calculating the best DX.

When you have an instance of APRSIS32 solely for satellite work then all the received packets will be via the satellite. So the DX status are empty because no stations are heard direct.

As I run an RX iGate for the ISS the status beacon can be seen on APRS-IS. I would like the status beacon to show the best DX via the ISS for the current or previous pass.

To do this the program would need to consider a path of 1 hop with either RS0ISS* , W3AD0-1 , ARISS or FAST1 as direct.

Chris, MM1PTT

--- In aprsisce@..., "kc2nyu" <eckerpw@...> wrote:
Got interested in ISS the past few days and decided to see if I could "Beacon" the ISS or have my signal received and digipeated. I am using a roof top dual band vertical at about 35ft, an FT 7800 dual band radio, Argent T2 and APRSIS Dev ver last updated 10/6/2012. A few minutes before the start of ISS pass at my QTH, tuned radio to the ISS packet freq and 145.825. Then got about 8 min of packet bursts and received a number of stations from the ISS Digi which were Igated at my station. Scanning the messages log, it appears my msg was ACk, but not sure.

My question is - can I and if so, what steps do I take within APRSIS to beacon or send my call, position etc to the ISS??

Tnx and 73 Paul kc2nyu


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...>
 

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 8:44 AM, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) <kj4erj@...> wrote:
What changes as you change the Forecast Error is where the red dot will
appear within that circle.  If the magnitude of the error between the
forecast position and your actual position is 1/10 miles and the
Forecast Error is 1/10 mile, the red dot will be at the circle.  If you
change the Forecast Error to 2/10 mile, then the Red dot will be half
way between the center and the edge of the circle.

More, ah-ha!

It's starting to sink in. And, I didn't have to take my shoes off once.

Bob...


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...>
 

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 8:38 AM, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) <kj4erj@...> wrote:
I said that the red dot shows the magnitude and direction of the
difference between where you are and where an observer would think you
are scaled such that the Forecast Error value is the radius (in pixels,
not miles) of the circle.

This is huge, Lynn. I've seen explanations before that imply that the red dot is a projection of where the program thinks you should be based on last reported position, speed, and direction. But, what you are saying here is the forehead-slapping moment. The red dot is the vector _difference_ between where you actually are (based on GPS input) and where the program thinks you should be.

Ah-ha!

Bob...

P.S. Anybody remember the old Night Court sit-com? The Bull Shannon character did the best forehead slaps I've ever seen.


Re: Beaconing the ISS

Chris Morrison
 

Can I take this opportunity to remind about the feature request to ignore RS0ISS* in the path when calculating the best DX.

When you have an instance of APRSIS32 solely for satellite work then all the received packets will be via the satellite. So the DX status are empty because no stations are heard direct.

As I run an RX iGate for the ISS the status beacon can be seen on APRS-IS. I would like the status beacon to show the best DX via the ISS for the current or previous pass.

To do this the program would need to consider a path of 1 hop with either RS0ISS* , W3AD0-1 , ARISS or FAST1 as direct.

Chris, MM1PTT

--- In aprsisce@..., "kc2nyu" <eckerpw@...> wrote:

Got interested in ISS the past few days and decided to see if I could "Beacon" the ISS or have my signal received and digipeated. I am using a roof top dual band vertical at about 35ft, an FT 7800 dual band radio, Argent T2 and APRSIS Dev ver last updated 10/6/2012. A few minutes before the start of ISS pass at my QTH, tuned radio to the ISS packet freq and 145.825. Then got about 8 min of packet bursts and received a number of stations from the ISS Digi which were Igated at my station. Scanning the messages log, it appears my msg was ACk, but not sure.

My question is - can I and if so, what steps do I take within APRSIS to beacon or send my call, position etc to the ISS??

Tnx and 73 Paul kc2nyu


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

g6enu <g6enu@...>
 

Aha! That's what I was missing - the circle is being "borrowed on a different scale" for the red dot processing.

You have also explained to me something I (as a non-American, non-Navy non-Pilot) kept hearing and not understanding when watching episodes of JAG - the interchange "I have the ball", "Roger ball" between pilot and deck ops.

--- In aprsisce@..., "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...> wrote:

The center of the circle depends on what you have selected. In the
"normal" mode, it is "Centered on ME" and therefore is your current
position, but only the GPS position if you have the GPS enabled.
Otherwise, you may have panned around and ME is somewhere else, but the
center of the circle has nothing to do with the behavior of the red dot
because the red dot isn't showing a location on the map, but an
error/difference vector.

Think of the "ball" in an aircraft carrier landing. It doesn't where
the glide path is nor where the airplane is, but where the airplane is
relative to the flight path. High and right, low and left, dead center
on. (I may have this wrong because I'm not a navy pilot, but I think
that's how it works). The red dot is the same, it doesn't show where an
observer would think you are, but how far off that observer would be
from where you really are.

But the difference in what you said and what I said is that you said
that the red dot shows where an outside observer would think you are.
If it did that, and you're zoomed out to say about a 5 mile circle
radius, the red dot won't even come out from underneath ME's station symbol.

I said that the red dot shows the magnitude and direction of the
difference between where you are and where an observer would think you
are scaled such that the Forecast Error value is the radius (in pixels,
not miles) of the circle. So that even with a 5 mile zoom radius and a
1/10 mile Forecast Error, the red dot will move out across the map
showing the difference on a completely different (Forecast Error vs zoom
scale) scale.

The difference is between the red dot showing a position vs the red dot
showing an difference/error vector.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Put a different way, your original equation for the red dot's
"instantaneous calculated position" is correct as the position that an
outside observer would think you are at, but the red dot itself is the
difference between that and reality scaled such that the Forecast Error
value represents the full circle radius.

On 10/31/2012 6:10 AM, g6enu wrote:
Question. Is the centre of the circle the last beaconed position or the current GPS position? Because if it's the latter, then the only difference between what I said and what you said (assuming the scales of the map and the vector are the same) is how you are describing things, not what things actually are. (And I should know, because I spent quite a bit of time studying vector arithmetic during my math degree.)



--- In aprsisce@..., "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@> wrote:
No, the red dot does NOT indicate the calculated, forecasted, projected
position! If I did that, the scaling gets all funky. Been there, did
that, and it really didn't help except at really close in zooms.
Although I guess I could put a pink dot there and add even more to the
confusion?

The red dot, relative to the scale circle on the screen, represents the
DIFFERENCE (or Error) between the calculated, forecasted, projected
position and your actual current position as a vector (magnitude and
direction).

If the red dot is moving out in front of you, then the outside world
thinks you're further along than you actually are. You must have slowed
down.

If the red dot is lagging behind you, then the outside world thinks
you're not as far along as you actually are. You must have sped up.

If the red dot is to your left, then you must have turned right but the
world thinks you're left of where you actually are.

And vice versa.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Can you tell that Florida roads go at 90 degree angles, N, S, E, W?

On 10/30/2012 8:49 PM, g6enu wrote:

The red dot is continuously updating. Its instantaneous calculated position is given by

<Position of last beacon> + <time since last beacon> * <velocity at last beacon>

Your locally-held GPS position is also updating semi-continuously, and almost certainly much more often than you are beaconing.

If the calculated instantaneous red dot position differs from the locally-held GPS position by more than a threshold amount (the exact details of which someone more knowledgeable than I can explain) a beacon is forced even if it is not due on a pure time interval basis.

(Note that this explanation is somewhat simplified, to match the brain and knowledge of the person posting it.)


--- In aprsisce@..., Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@> wrote:
At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.

Bob...

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links





------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: Beaconing the ISS

sbd sbd
 

The dish is primary 96 symbol and preferred SSID is -6 for satellite work, but that optional really

 

Steve Daniels

G6UIM

Torbay Freecycle Moderator http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle

APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com

 


From: aprsisce@... [mailto:aprsisce@...] On Behalf Of Adam Mahnke
Sent: 31 October 2012 11:34
To: aprsisce@...
Subject: RE: [aprsisce] Re: Beaconing the ISS

 

 

IIRC you use the satellite dish icon as well, got that all up and running?

Adam
KC2ANT

-----Original Message-----

From: w7boz
Sent: 31 Oct 2012 11:32:13 GMT
To: aprsisce@...
Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Beaconing the ISS

 

Same here. I run a different Aprsisce for ISS and other Satellitte coms. I actually prefer to do it this way.

Kevin
W7BOZ

--- In aprsisce@..., Adam Mahnke wrote:
>
> That's what I did for my D710 for packet mode vs APRS mode, they share the same map directories and NWS files, but the .exe and .xml files are separate.
>
> Adam
> KC2ANT
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
> Sent: 30 Oct 2012 12:04:04 GMT
> To: aprsisce@...
> Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS
>
> Profile switching is not near the top of my list.
>
> If you want substantially different behaviors out of APRSISCE/32 (to
> work the ISS, for instance), then make a new directory, copy the .EXE
> (or set up a shortcut), and configure the new instance. It's not that
> hard, especially in comparison to the complexity (and confusion) that I
> foresee in the profile switching (like what settings are shared and
> which are changed).
>
> Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
>
> On 10/30/2012 12:41 AM, Greg Dolkas wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi Lynn,
> >
> > This was a good reminder... I occasionally flip my radio to the ISS
> > frequency, but without changing all the bazillion options to properly
> > operate through Satellites. I believe you have a profile switch of
> > sorts on your to-do list, right? Before I invest time and space (no
> > pun intended) in cloning my APRSIS/32 instance (per the instructions
> > on the Wiki), how close to the top of your queue is the enhancement
> > for a Terrestrial / Space (or whatever profiles) configuration option?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Greg KO6TH
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Steve Daniels
> > > > > wrote:
> >
> > You could start by following this WIKI entry it probably answers
> > most of your questions, I will edit out the FAST references as
> > those sats no longer function that I am aware of
> >
> > http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/doc:satelliteops
> >
> > Steve Daniels
> >
> > G6UIM
> >
> > TorbayFreecycle Moderator
> > http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle
> > <http://http:/uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle>
> >
> > APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > *From:*aprsisce@... <mailto:aprsisce@...>
> > [mailto:aprsisce@...
> > aprsisce@...>] *On Behalf Of *kc2nyu
> > *Sent:* 29 October 2012 18:48
> > *To:* aprsisce@... aprsisce@...>
> > *Subject:* [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS
> >
> > Got interested in ISS the past few days and decided to see if I
> > could "Beacon" the ISS or have my signal received and digipeated.
> > I am using a roof top dual band vertical at about 35ft, an FT 7800
> > dual band radio, Argent T2 and APRSIS Dev ver last updated
> > 10/6/2012. A few minutes before the start of ISS pass at my QTH,
> > tuned radio to the ISS packet freq and 145.825. Then got about 8
> > min of packet bursts and received a number of stations from the
> > ISS Digi which were Igated at my station. Scanning the messages
> > log, it appears my msg was ACk, but not sure.
> >
> > My question is - can I and if so, what steps do I take within
> > APRSIS to beacon or send my call, position etc to the ISS??
> >
> > Tnx and 73 Paul kc2nyu
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>


unsubscribing

sbd sbd
 

A couple of people have queried the fact that they are still receiving emails after unsubscribing.

This Is down to yahoo being very slow at processing unsubscriptions, up to a couple of days, your account gets disabled from a moderation point of view straight away.

But unfortunately the emails will still arrive for a couple of days.

 

I suggest if you wish to unsubscribe, to go into your account  and select no emails for the group, which should happen instantly, barring perhaps whats in the queue. Then unsubscribe

It will still take a couple of days for your account to fully clear from the group, but hopefully you won’t get emails whilst it happens.

 

There really is nothing the moderation team can do about it, short of complaining to yahoo, and I know what the response to that will beJ

 

Steve Daniels

G6UIM

Torbay Freecycle Moderator http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle

APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com._,___


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Fred Hillhouse
 

"The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings while mobile. And,
it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile without an Internet
connection."

Gaaack! You not supposed to use this mobile! Just what were you thinking?!
Just kidding! For some reason I was struck with a brief moment of sanity!
Er, um, insanity!

Watch out for gremlins, spooks and the like!

Best regards,
Fred, N7FMH


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

On 10/31/2012 6:02 AM, Bob Burns W9RXR wrote:
At 08:59 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

I will digest the rest of your reply later today, but one comment you
made really has me confused.

Configure / Screen / Circle which puts the range circle on the screen.
This same circle is scaled to the Forecast Error for the purposes of
the red dot indicating the error between a forecast (prediction)
based on your last transmitted information and the reality as known
from your local GPS.
Which implies that as you change the Forecast Error setting, this
circle should change. But it doesn't. The only circle I see is the
one which extends from top to bottom of the screen which I thought
indicated the scale of the map. How can this circle also indicate the
Forecast Error?
No, the circle goes along with the scale of the map as you zoom in and out. The scale value just below the +/- zoom indicator is the scale of the radius of the circle. The circle itself is always sized to the max that will fit within the smallest of your window dimensions.

What changes as you change the Forecast Error is where the red dot will appear within that circle. If the magnitude of the error between the forecast position and your actual position is 1/10 miles and the Forecast Error is 1/10 mile, the red dot will be at the circle. If you change the Forecast Error to 2/10 mile, then the Red dot will be half way between the center and the edge of the circle.

I "borrow" the circle as the visual indicator of the configured limit of the Forecast Error and scale the location of the red dot against that configured value such that when the red dot hits the circle the Forecast Error has been reached.

The math behind it isn't really important, IMHO. The fact is that the Red Dot gives you a visual representation, when compared to the circle, of how far away from your current position an outside observer would be estimating with respect to the maximum that you want them to be in error (the configured Forecast Error value).

Again, the short answer, when the red dot hits the circle, the Forecast Error has been reached.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

The center of the circle depends on what you have selected. In the "normal" mode, it is "Centered on ME" and therefore is your current position, but only the GPS position if you have the GPS enabled. Otherwise, you may have panned around and ME is somewhere else, but the center of the circle has nothing to do with the behavior of the red dot because the red dot isn't showing a location on the map, but an error/difference vector.

Think of the "ball" in an aircraft carrier landing. It doesn't where the glide path is nor where the airplane is, but where the airplane is relative to the flight path. High and right, low and left, dead center on. (I may have this wrong because I'm not a navy pilot, but I think that's how it works). The red dot is the same, it doesn't show where an observer would think you are, but how far off that observer would be from where you really are.

But the difference in what you said and what I said is that you said that the red dot shows where an outside observer would think you are. If it did that, and you're zoomed out to say about a 5 mile circle radius, the red dot won't even come out from underneath ME's station symbol.

I said that the red dot shows the magnitude and direction of the difference between where you are and where an observer would think you are scaled such that the Forecast Error value is the radius (in pixels, not miles) of the circle. So that even with a 5 mile zoom radius and a 1/10 mile Forecast Error, the red dot will move out across the map showing the difference on a completely different (Forecast Error vs zoom scale) scale.

The difference is between the red dot showing a position vs the red dot showing an difference/error vector.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Put a different way, your original equation for the red dot's "instantaneous calculated position" is correct as the position that an outside observer would think you are at, but the red dot itself is the difference between that and reality scaled such that the Forecast Error value represents the full circle radius.

On 10/31/2012 6:10 AM, g6enu wrote:
Question. Is the centre of the circle the last beaconed position or the current GPS position? Because if it's the latter, then the only difference between what I said and what you said (assuming the scales of the map and the vector are the same) is how you are describing things, not what things actually are. (And I should know, because I spent quite a bit of time studying vector arithmetic during my math degree.)



--- In aprsisce@..., "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...> wrote:
No, the red dot does NOT indicate the calculated, forecasted, projected
position! If I did that, the scaling gets all funky. Been there, did
that, and it really didn't help except at really close in zooms.
Although I guess I could put a pink dot there and add even more to the
confusion?

The red dot, relative to the scale circle on the screen, represents the
DIFFERENCE (or Error) between the calculated, forecasted, projected
position and your actual current position as a vector (magnitude and
direction).

If the red dot is moving out in front of you, then the outside world
thinks you're further along than you actually are. You must have slowed
down.

If the red dot is lagging behind you, then the outside world thinks
you're not as far along as you actually are. You must have sped up.

If the red dot is to your left, then you must have turned right but the
world thinks you're left of where you actually are.

And vice versa.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Can you tell that Florida roads go at 90 degree angles, N, S, E, W?

On 10/30/2012 8:49 PM, g6enu wrote:

The red dot is continuously updating. Its instantaneous calculated position is given by

<Position of last beacon> + <time since last beacon> * <velocity at last beacon>

Your locally-held GPS position is also updating semi-continuously, and almost certainly much more often than you are beaconing.

If the calculated instantaneous red dot position differs from the locally-held GPS position by more than a threshold amount (the exact details of which someone more knowledgeable than I can explain) a beacon is forced even if it is not due on a pure time interval basis.

(Note that this explanation is somewhat simplified, to match the brain and knowledge of the person posting it.)


--- In aprsisce@..., Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@> wrote:
At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.

Bob...

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links





------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: Beaconing the ISS

Adam Mahnke <kc2ant@...>
 

IIRC you use the satellite dish icon as well, got that all up and running?

Adam
KC2ANT

-----Original Message-----

From: w7boz
Sent: 31 Oct 2012 11:32:13 GMT
To: aprsisce@...
Subject: [aprsisce] Re: Beaconing the ISS

 

Same here. I run a different Aprsisce for ISS and other Satellitte coms. I actually prefer to do it this way.

Kevin
W7BOZ

--- In aprsisce@..., Adam Mahnke wrote:
>
> That's what I did for my D710 for packet mode vs APRS mode, they share the same map directories and NWS files, but the .exe and .xml files are separate.
>
> Adam
> KC2ANT
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
> Sent: 30 Oct 2012 12:04:04 GMT
> To: aprsisce@...
> Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS
>
> Profile switching is not near the top of my list.
>
> If you want substantially different behaviors out of APRSISCE/32 (to
> work the ISS, for instance), then make a new directory, copy the .EXE
> (or set up a shortcut), and configure the new instance. It's not that
> hard, especially in comparison to the complexity (and confusion) that I
> foresee in the profile switching (like what settings are shared and
> which are changed).
>
> Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
>
> On 10/30/2012 12:41 AM, Greg Dolkas wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi Lynn,
> >
> > This was a good reminder... I occasionally flip my radio to the ISS
> > frequency, but without changing all the bazillion options to properly
> > operate through Satellites. I believe you have a profile switch of
> > sorts on your to-do list, right? Before I invest time and space (no
> > pun intended) in cloning my APRSIS/32 instance (per the instructions
> > on the Wiki), how close to the top of your queue is the enhancement
> > for a Terrestrial / Space (or whatever profiles) configuration option?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Greg KO6TH
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Steve Daniels
> > > > > wrote:
> >
> > You could start by following this WIKI entry it probably answers
> > most of your questions, I will edit out the FAST references as
> > those sats no longer function that I am aware of
> >
> > http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/doc:satelliteops
> >
> > Steve Daniels
> >
> > G6UIM
> >
> > TorbayFreecycle Moderator
> > http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle
> > <http://http:/uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle>
> >
> > APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > *From:*aprsisce@... aprsisce@...>
> > [mailto:aprsisce@...
> > aprsisce@...>] *On Behalf Of *kc2nyu
> > *Sent:* 29 October 2012 18:48
> > *To:* aprsisce@... aprsisce@...>
> > *Subject:* [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS
> >
> > Got interested in ISS the past few days and decided to see if I
> > could "Beacon" the ISS or have my signal received and digipeated.
> > I am using a roof top dual band vertical at about 35ft, an FT 7800
> > dual band radio, Argent T2 and APRSIS Dev ver last updated
> > 10/6/2012. A few minutes before the start of ISS pass at my QTH,
> > tuned radio to the ISS packet freq and 145.825. Then got about 8
> > min of packet bursts and received a number of stations from the
> > ISS Digi which were Igated at my station. Scanning the messages
> > log, it appears my msg was ACk, but not sure.
> >
> > My question is - can I and if so, what steps do I take within
> > APRSIS to beacon or send my call, position etc to the ISS??
> >
> > Tnx and 73 Paul kc2nyu
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>


Re: Beaconing the ISS

w7boz
 

Same here. I run a different Aprsisce for ISS and other Satellitte coms. I actually prefer to do it this way.

Kevin
W7BOZ

--- In aprsisce@..., Adam Mahnke <kc2ant@...> wrote:

That's what I did for my D710 for packet mode vs APRS mode, they share the same map directories and NWS files, but the .exe and .xml files are separate.

Adam
KC2ANT

-----Original Message-----

From: Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)
Sent: 30 Oct 2012 12:04:04 GMT
To: aprsisce@...
Subject: Re: [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS

Profile switching is not near the top of my list.

If you want substantially different behaviors out of APRSISCE/32 (to
work the ISS, for instance), then make a new directory, copy the .EXE
(or set up a shortcut), and configure the new instance. It's not that
hard, especially in comparison to the complexity (and confusion) that I
foresee in the profile switching (like what settings are shared and
which are changed).

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

On 10/30/2012 12:41 AM, Greg Dolkas wrote:


Hi Lynn,

This was a good reminder... I occasionally flip my radio to the ISS
frequency, but without changing all the bazillion options to properly
operate through Satellites. I believe you have a profile switch of
sorts on your to-do list, right? Before I invest time and space (no
pun intended) in cloning my APRSIS/32 instance (per the instructions
on the Wiki), how close to the top of your queue is the enhancement
for a Terrestrial / Space (or whatever profiles) configuration option?

Thanks,

Greg KO6TH


On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Steve Daniels
<steve@...
<mailto:steve@...>> wrote:

You could start by following this WIKI entry it probably answers
most of your questions, I will edit out the FAST references as
those sats no longer function that I am aware of

http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/doc:satelliteops

Steve Daniels

G6UIM

TorbayFreecycle Moderator
http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle
<http://http:/uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle>

APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*From:*aprsisce@... <mailto:aprsisce@...>
[mailto:aprsisce@...
<mailto:aprsisce@...>] *On Behalf Of *kc2nyu
*Sent:* 29 October 2012 18:48
*To:* aprsisce@... <mailto:aprsisce@...>
*Subject:* [aprsisce] Beaconing the ISS

Got interested in ISS the past few days and decided to see if I
could "Beacon" the ISS or have my signal received and digipeated.
I am using a roof top dual band vertical at about 35ft, an FT 7800
dual band radio, Argent T2 and APRSIS Dev ver last updated
10/6/2012. A few minutes before the start of ISS pass at my QTH,
tuned radio to the ISS packet freq and 145.825. Then got about 8
min of packet bursts and received a number of stations from the
ISS Digi which were Igated at my station. Scanning the messages
log, it appears my msg was ACk, but not sure.

My question is - can I and if so, what steps do I take within
APRSIS to beacon or send my call, position etc to the ISS??

Tnx and 73 Paul kc2nyu





Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

g6enu <g6enu@...>
 

Question. Is the centre of the circle the last beaconed position or the current GPS position? Because if it's the latter, then the only difference between what I said and what you said (assuming the scales of the map and the vector are the same) is how you are describing things, not what things actually are. (And I should know, because I spent quite a bit of time studying vector arithmetic during my math degree.)

--- In aprsisce@..., "Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <kj4erj@...> wrote:

No, the red dot does NOT indicate the calculated, forecasted, projected
position! If I did that, the scaling gets all funky. Been there, did
that, and it really didn't help except at really close in zooms.
Although I guess I could put a pink dot there and add even more to the
confusion?

The red dot, relative to the scale circle on the screen, represents the
DIFFERENCE (or Error) between the calculated, forecasted, projected
position and your actual current position as a vector (magnitude and
direction).

If the red dot is moving out in front of you, then the outside world
thinks you're further along than you actually are. You must have slowed
down.

If the red dot is lagging behind you, then the outside world thinks
you're not as far along as you actually are. You must have sped up.

If the red dot is to your left, then you must have turned right but the
world thinks you're left of where you actually are.

And vice versa.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Can you tell that Florida roads go at 90 degree angles, N, S, E, W?

On 10/30/2012 8:49 PM, g6enu wrote:


The red dot is continuously updating. Its instantaneous calculated position is given by

<Position of last beacon> + <time since last beacon> * <velocity at last beacon>

Your locally-held GPS position is also updating semi-continuously, and almost certainly much more often than you are beaconing.

If the calculated instantaneous red dot position differs from the locally-held GPS position by more than a threshold amount (the exact details of which someone more knowledgeable than I can explain) a beacon is forced even if it is not due on a pure time interval basis.

(Note that this explanation is somewhat simplified, to match the brain and knowledge of the person posting it.)


--- In aprsisce@..., Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@> wrote:
At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.

Bob...


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...>
 

At 08:59 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

I will digest the rest of your reply later today, but one comment you made really has me confused.

Configure / Screen / Circle which puts the range circle on the screen.
This same circle is scaled to the Forecast Error for the purposes of the red dot indicating the error between a forecast (prediction) based on your last transmitted information and the reality as known from your local GPS.
Which implies that as you change the Forecast Error setting, this circle should change. But it doesn't. The only circle I see is the one which extends from top to bottom of the screen which I thought indicated the scale of the map. How can this circle also indicate the Forecast Error?

Bob...


Re: Using AGW

Tom, ve7did
 

Thanks Steve & Lynn

Got it working after fiddling with AGW

Propagation Knows No Boundaries
73 de Tom, ve7did



Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

All of the radio interface is handled by TNCs or AGW. APRSISCE/32 doesn't do any direct radio interfaces and therefore has no need for PTT control. If you're using a COM port for PTT, then you need to configure that in AGW and do NOT specify it anywhere in APRSISCE/32.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

On 10/30/2012 4:07 PM, ve7did wrote:

Is PTT for the radio still using the com port? I have tried that
function with no luck.

Propagation Knows No Boundaries
73 de Tom, ve7did



Steve Daniels wrote:

Works fine for me.

Create a New port select AGW as the type give it a name. then select
TCP/IP port on the next screen enter either localhost or 127.0.0.1 and
set the port to 8000.

That should be all you need to do to connect to AGW


Steve Daniels

G6UIM

Torbay Freecycle Moderator
http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle
<http://http:/uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle>

APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com


------------------------------------------------------------------------

*From:* aprsisce@... [mailto:aprsisce@...] *On
Behalf Of *ve7did
*Sent:* 30 October 2012 19:37
*To:* aprsisce@...
*Subject:* [aprsisce] Using AGW



I have been trying to interface AGWPE or PRO to aprsis32. Does this
work? I have been using AGW interface to other program such as Winpack,
Outpost, Paclink etc and they work fine.

Can I use the same hardware configuration to operate aprsis32? ie com
port PTT
Kinda looks like it is only network friendly.

Or am I missing the boat or something...

--
Propagation Knows No Boundaries
73 de Tom, ve7did




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links






------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links





Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

No, the red dot does NOT indicate the calculated, forecasted, projected position! If I did that, the scaling gets all funky. Been there, did that, and it really didn't help except at really close in zooms. Although I guess I could put a pink dot there and add even more to the confusion?

The red dot, relative to the scale circle on the screen, represents the DIFFERENCE (or Error) between the calculated, forecasted, projected position and your actual current position as a vector (magnitude and direction).

If the red dot is moving out in front of you, then the outside world thinks you're further along than you actually are. You must have slowed down.

If the red dot is lagging behind you, then the outside world thinks you're not as far along as you actually are. You must have sped up.

If the red dot is to your left, then you must have turned right but the world thinks you're left of where you actually are.

And vice versa.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

PS. Can you tell that Florida roads go at 90 degree angles, N, S, E, W?

On 10/30/2012 8:49 PM, g6enu wrote:


The red dot is continuously updating. Its instantaneous calculated position is given by

<Position of last beacon> + <time since last beacon> * <velocity at last beacon>

Your locally-held GPS position is also updating semi-continuously, and almost certainly much more often than you are beaconing.

If the calculated instantaneous red dot position differs from the locally-held GPS position by more than a threshold amount (the exact details of which someone more knowledgeable than I can explain) a beacon is forced even if it is not due on a pure time interval basis.

(Note that this explanation is somewhat simplified, to match the brain and knowledge of the person posting it.)


--- In aprsisce@..., Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...> wrote:
At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.

Bob...


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

Simple answer: When the red dot hits the circle, a beacon is sent. This is an indicator of the Forecast Error feature of GeniusBeaconing.

On 10/30/2012 8:23 PM, Bob Burns W9RXR wrote:
At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.
Typo: he meant to say pull off your SOCKS Bob...

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?
Yes.

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.
The prediction is moving, yes. Every time APRSISCE/32 beacons, it makes a note of the location, time, speed, and heading. Every second after that, it predicts where an outside observer would think you are based on that information. It compares that predicted point (which moves every second) with your actual position from the GPS. The difference between those two is a distance and a bearing. If the distance is greater than the Forecast Error, then a new beacon is sent because the outside world thinks you're not close enough to where you really are.

The distance is also scaled such that the Configure / Screen / Circle (the screen scale circle) is equal to the Forecast Error setting. The red dot is drawn at this scaled distance between the center and the circle in the direction of the error bearing.

So, if you beaconed 60mph due North and subsequently slowed down, you can expect to see the red dot move towards the top until it hits the circle at which point a new beacon triggered by the Forecast Error will tell the world that you've slowed down.

If you beaconed 30mph due North and subsequently speed up, you can expect the red dot to move towards the bottom of the circle until it hits which triggers a beacon to tell the world that you're going faster.

Turns are interesting because if you turn right, the world thinks you're still going straight ahead so the red dot will move LEFT until it hits the circle. It goes this direction because the world thinks you're left of where you really are until your next beacon tells them your new heading.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?
Configure / Screen / Circle which puts the range circle on the screen. This same circle is scaled to the Forecast Error for the purposes of the red dot indicating the error between a forecast (prediction) based on your last transmitted information and the reality as known from your local GPS.

At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.
You can even see the effect walking down the road. Walk at a steady slow pace and hit Transmit. Then pick up speed and you'll see the red dot begin to go towards the bottom of the screen. My neighbors must have thought I was going crazy the few nights that I was out there jogging and crawling alternately down the street...

Or just get someone else to drive!

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32



Bob...



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

g6enu <g6enu@...>
 

The red dot is continuously updating. Its instantaneous calculated position is given by

<Position of last beacon> + <time since last beacon> * <velocity at last beacon>

Your locally-held GPS position is also updating semi-continuously, and almost certainly much more often than you are beaconing.

If the calculated instantaneous red dot position differs from the locally-held GPS position by more than a threshold amount (the exact details of which someone more knowledgeable than I can explain) a beacon is forced even if it is not due on a pure time interval basis.

(Note that this explanation is somewhat simplified, to match the brain and knowledge of the person posting it.)

--- In aprsisce@..., Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...> wrote:

At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last
reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds
the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let
people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the
GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm
driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I
understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no
longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the
forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but
the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet".
That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next
beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and
direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this
threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the
prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch
what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings
while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile
without an Internet connection.

Bob...


Re: GeniusBeaconing Forecast Error

Bob Burns W9RXR <w9rxr_@...>
 

At 08:35 PM 10/29/2012, James Ewen wrote:

Sit down on the couch and pull off your sick Bob.
Sick? Now, I really confused.

However, the program is forecasting your location due to the last reported speed and direction. Once that prediction forecast exceeds the threshold, the program will fire off a position report to let people know that you have stopped.
This threshold you refer to is the Forecast Error setting in the GeniusBeaconing window?

Here's what I don't understand about what you just said. If I'm driving down the road at 60 mph and sending a beacon every mile, I understand that I'm beaconing every 60 seconds. If I stop, then I no longer accumulate distance. Sixty seconds after my last beacon, the forecast error part of GeniusBeaconing thinks I should beacon, but the distance calculator says "no, you haven't gone far enough yet". That leads me to believe that the forecast error calculates the next beacon as a single fixed location based on my last speed and direction. How, can that prediction keep moving to exceed this threshold? This is my mental hang-up with this concept. I think the prediction is a fixed point, but you're telling me that it's moving.

Turn on the meatball and the circle on the map display, and watch what happens!
I know how to turn on the red dot, but what circle are you referring to?


At 12:24 PM 10/30/2012, Lynn W Deffenbaugh (Mr) wrote:

It's only interesting while mobile with a true GPS feed, though.
Agreed. The downside is that it's hard to play with the settings while mobile. And, it's even harder to look at the Wiki while mobile without an Internet connection.

Bob...


Re: Using AGW

Lynn Deffenbaugh
 

All of the radio interface is handled by TNCs or AGW. APRSISCE/32 doesn't do any direct radio interfaces and therefore has no need for PTT control. If you're using a COM port for PTT, then you need to configure that in AGW and do NOT specify it anywhere in APRSISCE/32.

Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

On 10/30/2012 4:07 PM, ve7did wrote:
Is PTT for the radio still using the com port? I have tried that
function with no luck.

Propagation Knows No Boundaries
73 de Tom, ve7did



Steve Daniels wrote:

Works fine for me.

Create a New port select AGW as the type give it a name. then select
TCP/IP port on the next screen enter either localhost or 127.0.0.1 and
set the port to 8000.

That should be all you need to do to connect to AGW


Steve Daniels

G6UIM

Torbay Freecycle Moderator
http://http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle
<http://http:/uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/torbay_freecycle>

APRSISCE/32 Beta tester and WIKI editor http://aprsisce.wikidot.com


------------------------------------------------------------------------

*From:* aprsisce@... [mailto:aprsisce@...] *On
Behalf Of *ve7did
*Sent:* 30 October 2012 19:37
*To:* aprsisce@...
*Subject:* [aprsisce] Using AGW



I have been trying to interface AGWPE or PRO to aprsis32. Does this
work? I have been using AGW interface to other program such as Winpack,
Outpost, Paclink etc and they work fine.

Can I use the same hardware configuration to operate aprsis32? ie com
port PTT
Kinda looks like it is only network friendly.

Or am I missing the boat or something...

--
Propagation Knows No Boundaries
73 de Tom, ve7did



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



15741 - 15760 of 36395